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I think anyone would be mad with a role that is setup to be lynched (no offense SOV), and then the person you are paired with goes all in to get them lynched by saying they are a wolf.

I'm done, but if you want to keep going, I'll be your huckleberry (wolfspeaker).
 
DocEspana said:
Just didnt realize when deadline was. And, sadly, we have no proof youre not a wolf *this time*
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We have proof that he wasn't a wolf when you got him lynched. Direct evidence from Escalla from the mouth of the mod (which she could be entirely fabricating, to which i would tip my hat to her because she is very believable in my PM's with her), that there is the group of wolves and the various NON-WOLF groups, which the criminals fall into. We don't know the significance of the non-wolf groups, and how they interact and align with each other, and we have nonspecific, conjectured evidence (ie, we are trying to read into things SOV said when rejecting our inquires to him) that those criminals aren't being fully forthcoming with the details of their grouping, but it still seems as nothing more than a distraction at this point in time
 
Chillbo Baggins said:
@StartingoverVet based on a photo that just popped into my news feed, it looks like those bestiality rumors about @LetItSnow are true.
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Lol. That animal was staggering a bit after anesthesia. I was sitting on the floor. It came up and literally face-planted into my lap and then decided to go to sleep. It was amusing.

thedrjojo said:
I believe more likely chaos than anything else... There is evidence they aren't wolves
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Criminals are not chaos. At least, not all of them. Fo' sho. There may be criminal wolves. There are definitely criminal villagers. Is that clear enough for everyone?
 
thedrjojo said:
We have proof that he wasn't a wolf when you got him lynched. Direct evidence from Escalla from the mouth of the mod (which she could be entirely fabricating, to which i would tip my hat to her because she is very believable in my PM's with her), that there is the group of wolves and the various NON-WOLF groups, which the criminals fall into. We don't know the significance of the non-wolf groups, and how they interact and align with each other, and we have nonspecific, conjectured evidence (ie, we are trying to read into things SOV said when rejecting our inquires to him) that those criminals aren't being fully forthcoming with the details of their grouping, but it still seems as nothing more than a distraction at this point in time
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We don't have any proof he wasn't a wolf when he was lynched. We have escalla's word of mouth (which I do believe. But lets be more careful with how we throw around the word proof). And we *really* dont have any proof that he cant be a wolf post-resurrection. But thats the problem with evey person post-resurrection. Its not specific to him. I was just tweaking him a bit with an aside that, all the nonsense in round one aside, we have no evidence that all the stuff he says about round 1 matters at all for his resurrection.

Now, outside of teasing him, I'm not doing anything except just 'saying' all of this. I want to win, I dont want to torture the poor guy for no reason. He doesnt need to die again ASAP, or anything like that. We know now that 'failing the city' is not the be-all end-all. But the last criminal killed was directly adversarial to a villager win and the write up for FFM's guy wasnt all that redeeming either, if we all remember. He just wasnt red. Its something to keep in mind as the game continues. Criminals may not be the wolves (at the moment) but no one should feel comfortable with what we have seen from them so far. But sometimes uncomfortable is what we have to accept to get to the wolves.
 
The moral of the story is criminals are sketchy, but not wolfy. Keep an eye on them.

Now back to the issue at hand: what do we think of Samoa's defense?

I read through her (supposed) character's wiki entry, and it seems like he's an overall good guy, but he's made some bad choices. Probably an ambiguous villager, at best.
 
Chillbo Baggins said:
The moral of the story is criminals are sketchy, but not wolfy. Keep an eye on them.

Now back to the issue at hand: what do we think of Samoa's defense?

I read through her (supposed) character's wiki entry, and it seems like he's an overall good guy, but he's made some bad choices. Probably an ambiguous villager, at best.
Click to expand...

I don't think the issue is that Sao Fei is a bad guy. But if she is being truthful about Sao Fei, which it seems to make sense given her reason for recruitment, he would very likely be of a neutral alignment and have a separate agenda/condition.

There's also the question of whether those recruited to Sao Fei's cause are returned back to their original status once he's gone.

But the reason I'm keeping my vote anyway, is because recruiting likely is conversion and therefore taking away from villager numbers, which is not helping our cause. So that's where my vote is staying unless someone has a good lead on a wolf.
 
For those that asked, yes it made sense for it to have been a failed conversion besides not being a criminal. However it wasn't phrased that way so I am not sure of course. Just seems sketchy.
 
dpmd said:
For those that asked, yes it made sense for it to have been a failed conversion besides not being a criminal. However it wasn't phrased that way so I am not sure of course. Just seems sketchy.
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I don't think it makes sense for Sao Fei to only be able to recruit criminals. Just putting that out there.

So I'm still curious.
 
I don't buy that we have to lynch possible convertibles. It seems that we'd be better off lynching bona fide, killing wolves. Further, I think you're (Escalla) adding to the confusion and paranoia by setting up supposed win conditions for each player. By that reasoning, you would have your own win condition because of the evil bitch you are (Moira Queen).
 
ddstothecor said:
I don't buy that we have to lynch possible convertibles. It seems that we'd be better off lynching bona fide, killing wolves. Further, I think you're (Escalla) adding to the confusion and paranoia by setting up supposed win conditions for each player. By that reasoning, you would have your own win condition because of the evil bitch you are (Moira Queen).
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😕

I've commented on one person that likely has a win condition. Sao Fei. I'm not the only one that thinks this (Dwin has also seen the show and agrees with this assessment as far as I can tell).

Please feel free to point out the others.
 
Escalla said:
But the reason I'm keeping my vote anyway, is because recruiting likely is conversion and therefore taking away from villager numbers, which is not helping our cause.
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I'm calling bullsht on this. You told us yourself that there are wolves and non-wolves...so how is recruitment by a particular non-wolf player (by your own assessment) going to "take away from our numbers" (presumably non-wolf numbers)?

And how do you figure including yourself in the "villager" category? There's no way, even if not a wolf, you're a plain ol' villager.
 
Lynch Vote Tally:

Devyn 3 (Carbon, DocE, DDS)
Chillbo 1 (TRH)
Phil 1 (Nyanko)
FFM 0
Samoa 9 (Escalla, DPMD, kaydubs, devyn,, Dwin,cyndia,, chillbo, SnS)
Nyanko 1 (DVMD)

Uncast votes: 7

Waffle-o-meter: 5 (this group has not been a big fan of waffles so far).

Lynch Deadline: 7:40pm
 
Escalla said:
😕

I've commented on one person that likely has a win condition. Sao Fei. I'm not the only one that thinks this (Dwin has also seen the show and agrees with this assessment as far as I can tell).

Please feel free to point out the others.
Click to expand...

I do. And another thing that is clear is dds clearly has no knowledge of the source material, which is fine, but you really need to stop painting Moira as evil. You can think that all you want, won't make it true, SHE IS NOT EVIL IN THE SHOW. Yes, in the beginning of the series they began to paint her that way (this is a drama series), but by the end she was firmly against Malcolm and his ilk.
 
that redhead said:
I'm calling bullsht on this. You told us yourself that there are wolves and non-wolves...so how is recruitment by a particular non-wolf player (by your own assessment) going to "take away from our numbers" (presumably non-wolf numbers)?

And how do you figure including yourself in the "villager" category? There's no way, even if not a wolf, you're a plain ol' villager.
Click to expand...

omg TRH.

We know of the NON-WOLF groups. Last time I checked, that included neutrals and as far as I know neutral != villager. Is that not correct?

If Samoa is recruiting people to "join her team", I think it's conversion. I stated my opinion as such. If you're converted to neutral, you're no longer villager and thus taking away from the villager numbers.

If you want to argue about whether regular villagers and ambiguous villagers are the same or not, fine. But that is a separate argument.
 
wow...a lot to wade through today. lynch Samoa
 
that redhead said:
I'm calling bullsht on this. You told us yourself that there are wolves and non-wolves...so how is recruitment by a particular non-wolf player (by your own assessment) going to "take away from our numbers" (presumably non-wolf numbers)?

And how do you figure including yourself in the "villager" category? There's no way, even if not a wolf, you're a plain ol' villager.
Click to expand...
Escalla = ambiguous villager, which seems to be collaborated by someone else and the mod...
 
Escalla said:
omg TRH.

We know of the NON-WOLF groups. Last time I checked, that included neutrals and as far as I know neutral != villager. Is that not correct?

If Samoa is recruiting people to "join her team", I think it's conversion. I stated my opinion as such. If you're converted to neutral, you're no longer villager and thus taking away from the villager numbers.

If you want to argue about whether regular villagers and ambiguous villagers are the same or not, fine. But that is a separate argument.
Click to expand...

omg Escalla.

"As far as [you] know" counts for very little in an SOV game. Neutrals could count for villager numbers. They could have a win condition. They could count for neither. They could be recruiting their own army. No one knows. In that same vein, it seems very strange and out of character for SOV to tell someone like dpmd that she was a failed recruitment of a specific player. Seems far too easy.

And, of course, we don't know that Samoa is neutral. I don't like the recruitment thing much either to be honest, but to start trumpeting that Samoa is this terrible corruptive force to the villagers when her character seems like a lot more benign than your own is a bit steep to me.
 
that redhead said:
omg Escalla.

"As far as [you] know" counts for very little in an SOV game. Neutrals could count for villager numbers. They could have a win condition. They could count for neither. They could be recruiting their own army. No one knows. In that same vein, it seems very strange and out of character for SOV to tell someone like dpmd that she was a failed recruitment of a specific player. Seems far too easy.

And, of course, we don't know that Samoa is neutral. I don't like the recruitment thing much either to be honest, but to start trumpeting that Samoa is this terrible corruptive force to the villagers when her character seems like a lot more benign than your own is a bit steep to me.
Click to expand...

Did I claim any where in this thread that what I said was fact? No. I explained why I was keeping my vote when Chillbo asked for opinions on Samoa's defense. It was not "trumpeting that Samoa is this terrible corruptive force."

I have not seen a neutral player count for villager numbers in any game that I have played and that is the basis for my theory. No, I don't know for sure one way or the other, but I'm not an affiliation seer or have access to one, so basing votes on how I feel the character would align is all I can do. If you feel like Sao Fei is something else, then feel free to make that argument.

You and everyone else can agree or disagree, I don't care. It is an opinion. I'm not forcing anyone to do anything.
 
Escalla said:
If you want to argue about whether regular villagers and ambiguous villagers are the same or not, fine. But that is a separate argument.
Click to expand...

You are in a different group then the "villagers", so not sure why you are considering yourself a villager number, but not willing to consider the other non-wolf groups villager numbers.... seems a bit like faulty logic to me


Escalla said:
I have not seen a neutral player count for villager numbers in any game that I have played and that is the basis for my theory.
Click to expand...

I believe there has been one or two games that I have played where neutrals did count for villager numbers... just food for thought

not sure what to think of Samoa's character... I need to read more up on it as I do not know the show and just got back home

I think it is plausible that in this game all of the non-wolf groups count for villager numbers and then there is one chaos character... it would not make sense to have multiple people with win conditions
 
Escalla said:
Did I claim any where in this thread that what I said was fact? No. I explained why I was keeping my vote when Chillbo asked for opinions on Samoa's defense. It was not "trumpeting that Samoa is this terrible corruptive force."

I have not seen a neutral player count for villager numbers in any game that I have played and that is the basis for my theory. No, I don't know for sure one way or the other, but I'm not an affiliation seer or have access to one, so basing votes on how I feel the character would align is all I can do. If you feel like Sao Fei is something else, then feel free to make that argument.

You and everyone else can agree or disagree, I don't care. It is an opinion. I'm not forcing anyone to do anything.
Click to expand...

True fact: I just wanted to use the word "trumpeting".
 
Regardless of whether or not Samoa counts for villager numbers, she has still admitted to having an agenda (saving her character's daughter). That coupled with us knowing she can attempt recruitment must indicate some sort of win condition.. if anything, I could potentially see her role as a chaos character (in the show he screws oliver and his friends over a few times, as well as helps them), or else she is flat out lying about why she is recruiting and is actually a wolf. Either way, I think she's detrimental to the villagers, and this lynch is the way to go.
 
devyn said:
You are in a different group then the "villagers", so not sure why you are considering yourself a villager number, but not willing to consider the other non-wolf groups villager numbers.... seems a bit like faulty logic to me
Click to expand...

Yes, I consider myself a villager number because my role says "ambiguous villager". Criminals have been up for debate, but I haven't stated that they don't count as villagers. I've only expressed thoughts on recruitment, not separate win condition (non-villager), so I'm not the one to be arguing with in regards to that.

There are a lot of people with a lot of different opinions.

devyn said:
I believe there has been one or two games that I have played where neutrals did count for villager numbers... just food for thought

not sure what to think of Samoa's character... I need to read more up on it as I do not know the show and just got back home

I think it is plausible that in this game all of the non-wolf groups count for villager numbers and then there is one chaos character... it would not make sense to have multiple people with win conditions
Click to expand...

Ok, good to know. I haven't played as many games, so I appreciate your input.

I've stated that Sao Fei likely has a separate win condition given that he recruits to a cause that is separate from Starling City. That is one person. I'm not arguing that there are multiple groups with different win conditions. I'm not sure if you're replying to me with that or just stating that in general.
 
Can we perhaps not fetishize so much about *what* the groups could be, and just get on board with flat out xenophobia being an aspect of a game wit confusing group categories. If youre not a through and through good guy, you will get this criticism thrown at you eventually. Probably by me. Grow a thick skin and realize its a part of this game's design. Also realize that eventually the group as a whole is just gonna have to say 'if its different, kill it'. Thats just being honest. Unless we can actually figure out the intricacies, thats going to happen eventually. Make yourself useful before then and the urge to kill subsides. Complain about "you all just dont get us" make me, and perhaps others, want to kill everyone who wines about their role like the emo teen they sound like.

I sort of wish I was deadshot right now and could just thin he roster by a few. Not because I dislike anyone, but because killing a rew random people would do TONS toward understanding the game. We learn from death. Its the nature of the game. Sucks if youre the subject of study, awesome if youre still alive and making sure we are learning from the deaths.
 
DocEspana said:
Can we perhaps not fetishize so much about *what* the groups could be, and just get on board with flat out xenophobia being an aspect of a game wit confusing group categories. If youre not a through and through good guy, you will get this criticism thrown at you eventually. Probably by me. Grow a thick skin and realize its a part of this game's design. Also realize that eventually the group as a whole is just gonna have to say 'if its different, kill it'. Thats just being honest. Unless we can actually figure out the intricacies, thats going to happen eventually. Make yourself useful before then and the urge to kill subsides. Complain about "you all just dont get us" make me, and perhaps others, want to kill everyone who wines about their role like the emo teen they sound like.

I sort of wish I was deadshot right now and could just thin he roster by a few. Not because I dislike anyone, but because killing a rew random people would do TONS toward understanding the game. We learn from death. Its the nature of the game. Sucks if youre the subject of study, awesome if youre still alive and making sure we are learning from the deaths.
Click to expand...

Unfortunately, it appears as though death doesn't solve much other than role and colour. Colour isn't going to be any sort of surprise now. We don't know if official alignment will be solved...it wasn't in the case of the criminal group.
 
StartingoverVet said:
I STRONGLY URGE YOU TO USE CONTINGENCIES IF YOU WILL BE BUSY. You can always change them if you are around and events change. Your PM-ing continues to be sporadic. Mods are disappointed.
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*********************
Oooooh. Don't make them bring me in!
:claps:

As for todays posts:

:corny:
Well done SOV/Dyachei. I'm loving all of the back and forth in here!

🤣
*******************
 
Lynch Vote Tally:

Devyn 3 (Carbon, DocE, DDS)
Chillbo 0 ()
Phil 1 (Nyanko)
FFM 0
Samoa 10 (Escalla, DPMD, kaydubs, devyn,, Dwin,cyndia,, chillbo, SnS, Phil, TRH)
Nyanko 1 (DVMD)

Uncast votes: 6

Waffle-o-meter: 6 (this group has not been a big fan of waffles so far).

Lynch Deadline: 7:40pm
 
For the first time a bandwagon forms among the citizens. Samoa has been accused of "recruiting". Nolo contendere she pleads. I have been recruiting, but I am good bad-ass. I just want to save my spawn, like a good parent. Throwing herself on the mercy of her fellow villagers falls on deaf ears. They are convinced that she must be the evil they are looking for, mostly because they haven't really found any evil, aren't really sure what exactly evil looks like, but, boy, are they are good at making accusations.

So the mob grabs Samoa and drags her to the execution spot in the center of town. "Wait, wait," Samoa screams, causing everyone to halt and hear why she is so worked up. "This not going to work! This is not what I want, and I will not allow it to continue. You must let me go. You cannot continue to go around lynching innocent people. ".
There is a bit of grumbling, and a lot of eyes being averted. The mob is awfully fickle, and start second-guessing their decision. They still don't really seem to have gotten the spirit of the bloodthirst that will be required to clean their city. Hells, except for that massacre at the start of the game, and the loss of Lissarae, no one is really getting killed. They think, maybe, she is right. Maybe they should let her go.

People start slowly walking away, when one particular villager (no names) yells. "NO, I WANT BLOOD. EVERYONE COME BACK. We won't learn anything until we kill more people. Kill. Kill. Kill. " Everyone is shocked by this outburst. They are all wondering the same thing, "No one really listens to this guy, or believes that he means what he is saying, do they". Unfortunately, he continues to make a scene, grabbing everyone and dragging them back to the center square while simultaneously calling out for the Arrow to come. Eventually, the Arrow does suddenly appear and starts to console him. "No worries son, I will kill whomever you want, where is this Samoa character? I am willing to help you clean up this city!". No one really wants to argue with this crazy Arrow dude, so they all look around, but Samoa has walked away quite calmly leaving the crowd behind her; the last citizens who she passed by distinctly heard her say "and they will NEVER be able to kill me like this anyway".

You have failed to deliver up Samoa for lynch. She is too much of a slippery bad-ass for that.

PM DEADLINE WILL BE 6am; Normal Lynch deadline at 7:45pm.

I STRONGLY URGE YOU TO USE CONTINGENCIES IF YOU WILL BE BUSY. You can always change them if you are around and events change.

Here is the list of Citizens of Starling City and their addresses:
There are STILL 21 players in the game….

1- The Queen family home - BURNED TO THE GROUND

2- Queen Consolidated
@thedrjojo and @Escalla - mayor

3- Starling City Police Station
@dpmd and @devyn

4- Merlyn Global
@Chillbo Baggins and @Dwindlin

5- Lian Yu
@DVMDream and @that redhead

6- Verdant (night club)
@Philliab and @shortnsweet

7- The Glades
@nyanko and Flim Flam Man, William Tockman, Criminal

8- The CNRI (legal aid)
@Lupin21 and @kaydubs and @DocEspana

9- Arrowcave
@Carbon and @MediCane2006

10- Abandoned clock tower
@Cyndia and @LetItSnow

11- Laurel’s apartment
@Samoa and @ddstothecor

SDN Mortuary
Lissarae06, Ted Gaynor, Criminal

Reminder: Links to all votes and write-ups are on post #1.

A note on the use of pronouns: I generally (but not always) use the pronouns of characters, not players in my write-ups unless the player's name has been revealed. Don't read too much into it in either direction.
 
devyn said:
yes she did... she said she could avoid lynch
Click to expand...
I don't think she did. She said she was a hard kill for villagers and wolves. She didn't mention lynch avoidance and even made it seem like she wanted us to lynch her to let her get on with her busy schedule.
Samoa said:
Ugh. I am Yao Fei, and I am looking for people to help me rescue my daughter.

For those that don't know, there are two concurrent threads in the show: event son the island and events in Starling City. I am Oliver's mentor on the island.

I am pretty much a badass, and hard to kill both for wolves and villagers.

I also don't have time to defend against lunch bandwagons, so this is all I have time to say. My job is hectic during the week and I'm always either driving or rounding. (And yesterday I got caught up in a BSG marathon and completely forgot to vote). So lynch me if you want, you'd probably be doing me a favor.
Click to expand...
 
Lupin21 said:
I don't think she did. She said she was a hard kill for villagers and wolves. She didn't mention lynch avoidance and even made it seem like she wanted us to lynch her to let her get on with her busy schedule.
Click to expand...

yeah but the line "I am pretty much a badass, and hard to kill both for wolves and villagers." makes me think lynch avoidance....
 
I have an idea:

9724-kill-everyone-sky-cloud.png


yup this is pretty much where I'm at right now as far as suspicions. :laugh:
 
devyn said:
yeah but when someone says that - I automatically think they are FOS.....

it is like when someone lynches themselves....
Click to expand...
Correct. Which is why she is more suspicious now. It is usually a nogoodnik that doesn't fess up or does something like lynch themselves. I like Yao Fei despite his issues, so hopefully there are some redeeming qualities somewhere in there.
 
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