Ask the Program Coordinator!

[AdmiralChz]

I've worn jeans and a fitted OCBD shirt with oxfords or boots to every single social and have been the best dressed by far,

Yeah... don’t do this. Pre-interview socials aren’t the time to flex your mainstream/counter culture fashion muscle - save that for when you get in. Keep it business casual.

---

Members don't see this ad.

 

[rokshana]

Yeah... don’t do this. Pre-interview socials aren’t the time to flex your mainstream/counter culture fashion muscle - save that for when you get in. Keep it business casual.

yeah...some people think that the pre interview dinner is a social occasion...its not.

 

[parcus]

Are surgery prelims viewed as a red flag? I have been reading about them and it's pretty depressing; I am not sure if that is just from the point of view of surgery programs though. People say all the "scut work" is bad, but the "scut work" sounds like what people would be doing in a medicine prelim anyways (am I wrong about this?). It is a shame, since I thought a surgery prelim would be really interesting for me, guess I might rank med prelims above surgery prelims if they have such a bad rep that they would make my app look bad next year.

 

[rokshana]

Are surgery prelims viewed as a red flag? I have been reading about them and it's pretty depressing; I am not sure if that is just from the point of view of surgery programs though. People say all the "scut work" is bad, but the "scut work" sounds like what people would be doing in a medicine prelim anyways (am I wrong about this?). It is a shame, since I thought a surgery prelim would be really interesting for me, guess I might rank med prelims above surgery prelims if they have such a bad rep that they would make my app look bad next year.

depends on why you are doing a prelim...you need a prelim for an advanced position? surgical prelim will satisfy practically every advanced specialty needing a prelim year with the exception of neurology (they require and IM prelim or TY that has 6 + months of IM). IF you are going into anesthesia or radiology , a surgical prelim might be helpful, but in general a IM prelim or TY is easier in time and work in comparison to a surgical prelim.

if you are doing a prelim GS spot in hopes of getting a cat GS spot the following year (or its back up for this), well, i guess there isn't another option, though how often this converts is not clear (AMG, probably...IMG, not so much).

if you are doing it in hopes of just getting SOMEthing...well there are more prelim GS spots that go unfilled than either IM or TY, so it probably make sense to have some IV t have on your ROL, but since they are more plentiful in SOAP (though this is a relative thing....as the years have gone by, even the number of unfilled spots are decreasing) it would be better to concentrate on getting IM or TY spots.

 

[parcus]

depends on why you are doing a prelim...you need a prelim for an advanced position? surgical prelim will satisfy practically every advanced specialty needing a prelim year with the exception of neurology (they require and IM prelim or TY that has 6 + months of IM). IF you are going into anesthesia or radiology , a surgical prelim might be helpful, but in general a IM prelim or TY is easier in time and work in comparison to a surgical prelim.

if you are doing a prelim GS spot in hopes of getting a cat GS spot the following year (or its back up for this), well, i guess there isn't another option, though how often this converts is not clear (AMG, probably...IMG, not so much).

if you are doing it in hopes of just getting SOMEthing...well there are more prelim GS spots that go unfilled than either IM or TY, so it probably make sense to have some IV t have on your ROL, but since they are more plentiful in SOAP (though this is a relative thing....as the years have gone by, even the number of unfilled spots are decreasing) it would be better to concentrate on getting IM or TY spots.

I am applying for anesthesia. I was thinking about a worst case scenario if I don’t match into an advanced or categorical program. I guess I’ll just hope for the best and rank prelims programs acording to my gut feelings.

 

[Postictal Raiden]

Not sure if has been asked here, but how important is it to send "thank you" emails to interviewers?

 

[rokshana]

Not sure if has been asked here, but how important is it to send "thank you" emails to interviewers?

Love Letters Mandatory in 2017

 

[PDTY]

Not sure if has been asked here, but how important is it to send "thank you" emails to interviewers?

Courteous, polite, and shows a level of intent. I hear that some PD's don't want them and that they'll tell people not to do it. If a program does not specifically state it, I would recommend it.

It's 3 minutes, $1 in card stock and stamp, and a trip to the post office. The benefit can help. The down side is... $1 and 3 minutes lost.

It's very "millennial" to not write, it seems.

Email vs mail thank you: doesn't matter to this PD. YMMV

 

[pedspedspeds18]

If I have a particularly subspecialty in mind, such as endo, would it be alright to ask for a "second look" but request to spend the day with the service of interest? I am torn between 2 programs at the moment and one is generally more appealing outside of not being as robust in my specialty choice but I'm wondering if my impression is accurate. Thanks!

 

[gutonc]

If I have a particularly subspecialty in mind, such as endo, would it be alright to ask for a "second look" but request to spend the day with the service of interest? I am torn between 2 programs at the moment and one is generally more appealing outside of not being as robust in my specialty choice but I'm wondering if my impression is accurate. Thanks!

I wouldn't ask to spend the whole day with them, but it's totally OK to ask to round with the consult team, or spend an hour or 2 in clinic.

 

[valid username]

Okay program directors if you have two student from the same school on the same day, and you ask the students about the others, what are you expecting to hear?

This happened to me yesterday. The interviewer asked me something about him. I don't quite remember exactly what. I told her I think he is an amazing person. (Seriously, he really is. His background makes him even more remarkable than he already is. I didn't go that far in my answer of course, just trying to convey that I was quite serious in my answer.)

She seemed very surprised but not at all unhappy. Her body language was definitely positive. She was smiling and she turned to me and said that this really doesn't happen. "When I ask students about other students they know they don't ever both tell me how fantastic the other is and then volunteer positive aspects of the other." Confused look. Awkward silence...

Don't get me wrong. It's not that I'm thinking this bothered her, clearly it did not. However, what was she expecting? She asked!

 

[tellme_areyoufree]

Okay program directors if you have two student from the same school on the same day, and you ask the students about the others, what are you expecting to hear?

This happened to me yesterday. The interviewer asked me something about him. I don't quite remember exactly what. I told her I think he is an amazing person. (Seriously, he really is. His background makes him even more remarkable than he already is. I didn't go that far in my answer of course, just trying to convey that I was quite serious in my answer.)

She seemed very surprised but not at all unhappy. Her body language was definitely positive. She was smiling and she turned to me and said that this really doesn't happen. "When I ask students about other students they know they don't ever both tell me how fantastic the other is and then volunteer positive aspects of the other." Confused look. Awkward silence...

Don't get me wrong. It's not that I'm thinking this bothered her, clearly it did not. However, what was she expecting? She asked!

It sounds like she was pleasantly surprised by a show of decency and graciousness in what is often a competitive/cutthroat situation.

 

[NotAProgDirector]

It's a ridic question.

 

[parcus]

Should I always at least mention this during interviews: (for anything but path or radiology) "I like people" or something along the lines? I find it to be super cliche and generic, but maybe it is one of those things interviewers always look for anyways. I have been told I should say that so many times.

 

[neoexile]

One question. I apologize if this may sound like a stupid question but how does the program look upon people who are late for the interview? I've had 2 interviews thus far, and there were times where other candidates were 30-50 minutes late.

 

[gutonc]

One question. I apologize if this may sound like a stupid question but how does the program look upon people who are late for the interview? I've had 2 interviews thus far, and there were times where other candidates were 30-50 minutes late.

Very, very, very (I'm going to stop pasting "very" here, but assume I was willing to do another few hundred/thousand times) poorly.

If you can't be bothered to show up on time on Day -1, the likelihood of you being able to do so 300 days a year for the next 3-7 years is pretty low.

Obviously, s*** happens sometimes. But this is what being an adult is all about, planning ahead and dealing with contingencies.

 

[Psych_hopeful]

Asking for some of my IMG friends. Are programs still sending invites right now?

A lot of my friends still have no interviews still and I'm wondering what they can do.

 

[Shazam243]

How do PD's or interviewers view applicants who are nervous during the interview?
It's more than likely there's some unconscious opinion being formed, but is it also overtly viewed as poorer candidate?

 

[mvenus929]

How do PD's or interviewers view applicants who are nervous during the interview?
It's more than likely there's some unconscious opinion being formed, but is it also overtly viewed as poorer candidate?

Standard nerves, no big deal. Everyone is nervous when trying to make a good impression. Nerves so severe that you can’t function—another story.

 

[rokshana]

Asking for some of my IMG friends. Are programs still sending invites right now?

A lot of my friends still have no interviews still and I'm wondering what they can do.

They need to start being proactive and not just sit waiting for interviews to come to them.

 

[neoexile]

Very, very, very (I'm going to stop pasting "very" here, but assume I was willing to do another few hundred/thousand times) poorly.

If you can't be bothered to show up on time on Day -1, the likelihood of you being able to do so 300 days a year for the next 3-7 years is pretty low.

Obviously, s*** happens sometimes. But this is what being an adult is all about, planning ahead and dealing with contingencies.

So they are gone. O_O

I swear they probably would have been ranked higher than me. But 10 years of effort gone to waste. >_________>;;;

Damn. And the program acted like nothing happened when she came in.

 

[PDTY]

Standard nerves, no big deal. Everyone is nervous when trying to make a good impression. Nerves so severe that you can’t function—another story.

It's also our job to try to put the candidate at some ease to get them comfortable so they can present their true self.

They need to start being proactive and not just sit waiting for interviews to come to them.

But I'd caution that emailing PD's and coordinators isn't going to do too much. The application has already (likely) been reviewed, and we're used to receiving tons of "I have a lot of interest in your program" emails. If a faculty member or some other connection can make a call, it holds more weight at this point.

One question. I apologize if this may sound like a stupid question but how does the program look upon people who are late for the interview? I've had 2 interviews thus far, and there were times where other candidates were 30-50 minutes late.

Ridiculous and if it's for a small group interview (ie not a 20 person pool per session), it could be The End. Early is on time, on time is late. Yes, the major crash on interstate 50 held up 4 people in the group who all drove in from that direction. You can't control that. But, the last person who arrives is... last. And in the words of Ricky Bobby...

Should I always at least mention this during interviews: (for anything but path or radiology) "I like people" or something along the lines? I find it to be super cliche and generic, but maybe it is one of those things interviewers always look for anyways. I have been told I should say that so many times.

No. Plus if you say something more than once then it is either scripted and/or forced. Don't say the same thing everyone else says. Put something out there with more power or discussion. "Team player, I like people, hard worker." Vanilla.

 

[Shazam243]

Standard nerves, no big deal. Everyone is nervous when trying to make a good impression. Nerves so severe that you can’t function—another story.

Thanks!

 

[valid username]

Damn. And the program acted like nothing happened when she came in.

"Acted" is the key word. As unprofessional as it is to walk in late, it is even more unprofessional for someone from the program to give any indication at all that the candidate is screwed.

 

[neoexile]

"Acted" is the key word. As unprofessional as it is to walk in late, it is even more unprofessional for someone from the program to give any indication at all that the candidate is screwed.

So any attempt to gauge how well you are doing on the interview by the expressions or affect of the house staff, residents and attendings is pretty much a lost cause. Wow.......

Feelsbad. I really would like some sort of tool to figure out how you are doing on the interview. It seems like no one really knows how well they are doing.

 

[PDTY]

So any attempt to gauge how well you are doing on the interview by the expressions or affect of the house staff, residents and attendings is pretty much a lost cause. Wow.......

Feelsbad. I really would like some sort of tool to figure out how you are doing on the interview. It seems like no one really knows how well they are doing.

This isn't a test. There is no answer key. There is no tool except for gestalt and body language. I guess the only tool would be dependent on your native EQ/EI.

 

[neoexile]

This isn't a test. There is no answer key. There is no tool except for gestalt and body language. I guess the only tool would be dependent on your native EQ/EI.

In many ways it is a test though. Certainly not a test of knowledge or skills, but a test on whether the team likes you or not. And the wrong responses/questions or disinterest in the program will get you ranked to a point where you wont match or else not at all.

So far I'm just use context, general rules and practice to perform on the interview. I'm never sure how well I'm doing at all.

 

[rokshana]

So any attempt to gauge how well you are doing on the interview by the expressions or affect of the house staff, residents and attendings is pretty much a lost cause. Wow.......

Feelsbad. I really would like some sort of tool to figure out how you are doing on the interview. It seems like no one really knows how well they are doing.

It's called match day...

 

[neoexile]

It's called match day...

Would like to know how to steer the ship in the right direction during the interview. Not after it's all in flames and my ship is gone.

 

[rokshana]

Would like to know how to steer the ship in the right direction during the interview. Not after it's all in flames and my ship is gone.

It really isn't rocket science...be on time, dress appropriately, be nice and polite and be yourself.
Most interviews are conversational and they have made the decision they you meet the requirements for the position at their program and they just want to see if you "fit".

 

[alkylate]

So I'm studying for step 2 CK and CS and was wondering if it would be Ok to take CK mid-January? I'm taking CS mid-December because I know it takes time for results to come back and you want to get them in time before rank lists are done but if I take it mid-January the results should come back by mid-February. Should I be Ok?
Thanks in advance

 

[rokshana]

So I'm studying for step 2 CK and CS and was wondering if it would be Ok to take CK mid-January? I'm taking CS mid-December because I know it takes time for results to come back and you want to get them in time before rank lists are done but if I take it mid-January the results should come back by mid-February. Should I be Ok?
Thanks in advance

see that you are a US student...unless a program states that they want those scores prior to rank, it shouldn't make much difference for you.

 

[AlexMack12]

I was placed on the waitlist for a program I'm very interested in interviewing at on 11/13. Is it ever appropriate at any point (like perhaps at the one-month mark) to politely ask about status/send a letter of interest/etc to reinforce how much I'm interested in the possibility of interviewing? I've never contacted them at all at any point in the interview season (other than to reply to their waitlist e-mail in which they simply asked us to respond if we wanted to still be considered, which I stated simply that I was very interested in their program and grateful for the potential to still receive an interview).

I also sent one LOI to a program back in October (only LOI I ever sent) and never received a response of any kind from them. Would it be appropriate in the next month to politely inquire about the status of my application (no LOI or anything else, just simply ask about status). I'm thinking I shouldn't do this since I've already emailed them once before, but I thought I just might ask here anyway. I e-mailed the PC, not the PD, and would do the same if it's appropriate to contact them again.

Thank you everyone for your advice and guidance; it's much appreciated.

 

[mcl]

I was placed on the waitlist for a program I'm very interested in interviewing at on 11/13. Is it ever appropriate at any point (like perhaps at the one-month mark) to politely ask about status/send a letter of interest/etc to reinforce how much I'm interested in the possibility of interviewing? I've never contacted them at all at any point in the interview season (other than to reply to their waitlist e-mail in which they simply asked us to respond if we wanted to still be considered, which I stated simply that I was very interested in their program and grateful for the potential to still receive an interview).

I also sent one LOI to a program back in October (only LOI I ever sent) and never received a response of any kind from them. Would it be appropriate in the next month to politely inquire about the status of my application (no LOI or anything else, just simply ask about status). I'm thinking I shouldn't do this since I've already emailed them once before, but I thought I just might ask here anyway. I e-mailed the PC, not the PD, and would do the same if it's appropriate to contact them again.

Thank you everyone for your advice and guidance; it's much appreciated.

I think it's OK to contact the program since you are on their wait list. It would give you some peace of mind, and let the program know you are still interested, so if a last minute cancellation occurs you'll be uppermost on their minds as a likely fill in.

 

[valid username]

So any attempt to gauge how well you are doing on the interview by the expressions or affect of the house staff, residents and attendings is pretty much a lost cause. Wow.......

Feelsbad. I really would like some sort of tool to figure out how you are doing on the interview. It seems like no one really knows how well they are doing.

I never said that at all. I said it is unprofessional to respond negatively toward an applicant in front of other applicants.

Also, I found out yesterday that there are sometimes reasons to be late. One interviewer (program director) kept me late. He let the next interviewer know. In this case I would not expect it to reflect poorly on the candidate.

Bottom line: worry about your interviews. Do not worry about anyone else's.

 

[valid username]

PDs: how often do you do things like:

give an applicant your cell number & send love letter day after interview?

I am asking because:
-I am a US-IMG
-I did not apply broadly (but was realistic where I did apply)
-The above happened at a program that I LOVED. I have some very specific (and uncommon) work experience relevant to a relatively new grant funded program there. The PD asked if I would be interested in working on that project (and yes I am ecstatic/over-the-moon/thrilled to join two of my greatest passions!)
-Perhaps most importantly, I also have a chance to go outside-of-match to a program that has earned a poor reputation. I am a very hard worker and I will do a good job no matter where I am, but there is no denying the quality of these two programs is worlds apart.

This decision is painfully difficult because I feel so selfish for considering taking a chance and hoping I match at a good program. I am not an AMG. All 4 of my NRMP interviews are at places that take some (but very few) IMGs. I have a family to support. Can I really allow my ego to risk my ability to support my children?

Anyway, so that's why I am asking. Do you do things like the above with applicants that go far down your rank list? Again, I am not an AMG. So my assumption is I am pretty far down the list. And now I am confused (and yes, neurotic.)

 

[rokshana]

Not a PD but ...

The pre match place isn't one of the 4 is it since AMGs can't take pre matches?

It's a risk of course with only 4 on your ROL but in turn it is unusual to have a PD call and give you his cell...
It is not automatic that just because you are an IMG that you are below all the AMGs that they interviewed.

 

[valid username]

Not a PD but ...

The pre match place isn't one of the 4 is it since AMGs can't take pre matches?

It's a risk of course with only 4 on your ROL but in turn it is unusual to have a PD call and give you his cell...
It is not automatic that just because you are an IMG that you are below all the AMGs that they interviewed.

That is correct, at this point there are only 4 on my ROL. I could end up with more (waitlists) but right now that is all I have.

I was not counting the other program in my numbers since it can't be part of a ROL.

A trusted adviser told me "don't do it!!!" about the non-match program, and I haven't even told her how well the interviews have gone.

So, bottom line: it's not routine to do the cell number/love-letter combo. Thank you.

 

[Psych_hopeful]

I never said that at all. I said it is unprofessional to respond negatively toward an applicant in front of other applicants.

Also, I found out yesterday that there are sometimes reasons to be late. One interviewer (program director) kept me late. He let the next interviewer know. In this case I would not expect it to reflect poorly on the candidate.

Bottom line: worry about your interviews. Do not worry about anyone else's.

I think he was referring to being late for the starting time for the day. Not being late for the interviews themselves

 

[Shazam243]

2 questions:
Is it okay to add a resident you met at the dinner on facebook?

When do programs usually make or submit their rank lists?

 

[mvenus929]

2 questions:
Is it okay to add a resident you met at the dinner on facebook?

When do programs usually make or submit their rank lists?

1. I wouldn’t. But I didn’t click with any of the applicants enough to want to keep up with them. Maybe if you did an away rotation there...

2. Sometime after they finish interviews. Usually Jan or early Feb.

 

[wallebergsyndrome]

Hey everyone just a question should we email everyone we had an interview with during the end of the interview season to let them know that we are interested in the program or this looks unprofessional ?

 

[Wilderness_gal]

Hey everyone just a question should we email everyone we had an interview with during the end of the interview season to let them know that we are interested in the program or this looks unprofessional ?

A single e-mail to the entire group of interviewers or an e-mail to the Program Director only is more than sufficient. Some programs actively discourage communication post-interview and will usually tell you that. But if they don’t discourage it, it’s wise to send an e-mail. It’s a tough spot for applicants but programs can perceive it as unprofessional if you don’t send a quick thank you as faculty and residents carve out a lot of time during the season to meet with applicants.

 

[wallebergsyndrome]

A single e-mail to the entire group of interviewers or an e-mail to the Program Director only is more than sufficient. Some programs actively discourage communication post-interview and will usually tell you that. But if they don’t discourage it, it’s wise to send an e-mail. It’s a tough spot for applicants but programs can perceive it as unprofessional if you don’t send a quick thank you as faculty and residents carve out a lot of time during the season to meet with applicants.

thanks a lot. I usually email thank you one day after my interview. But my question was an email sent towards the end of interview season stating my interest in the program. Will this email be unprofessional?

 

[Wilderness_gal]

thanks a lot. I usually email thank you one day after my interview. But my question was an email sent towards the end of interview season stating my interest in the program. Will this email be unprofessional?

That is an extremely common occurrence and no, it’s not viewed as unprofessional. It’s your last chance before rank list to get your name in the minds of the rank committeee, so especially if you interviewed early in the season, it can be helpful as a reminder.

 

[wallebergsyndrome]

That is an extremely common occurrence and no, it’s not viewed as unprofessional. It’s your last chance before rank list to get your name in the minds of the rank committeee, so especially if you interviewed early in the season, it can be helpful as a reminder.

thanks a lot

 

[PDTY]

That is an extremely common occurrence and no, it’s not viewed as unprofessional. It’s your last chance before rank list to get your name in the minds of the rank committeee, so especially if you interviewed early in the season, it can be helpful as a reminder.

That being said, make it a real email. If you REALLY want to go to the program, send them a hand written letter. IMO it holds a lot more sincerity and weight. I get enough,
"Dear Program Director:
blah blah blah, your program at <name> has a lot of qualities. blah blah"

I (we) can see right through it. Particularly when I can tell that they cut and paste the program's name off ERAS or NRMP

 

[wallebergsyndrome]

That being said, make it a real email. If you REALLY want to go to the program, send them a hand written letter. IMO it holds a lot more sincerity and weight. I get enough,
"Dear Program Director:
blah blah blah, your program at <name> has a lot of qualities. blah blah"

I (we) can see right through it. Particularly when I can tell that they cut and paste the program's name off ERAS or NRMP

are you sure that if I send the program hand written letter it won't look unprofessional?

 

[PDTY]

are you sure that if I send the program hand written letter it won't look unprofessional?

Not unless you make it look unprofessional. Hand written stuff is traditional and formal imo.

 

[wallebergsyndrome]

Not unless you make it look unprofessional. Hand written stuff is traditional and formal imo.

thanks a lot. will do this.since feb 21 is the last day for NRMP deadline should I mail the programs I like by Jan end or by feb 3rd week?