Baller hospitalists...

This forum made possible through the generous support of SDN members, donors, and sponsors. Thank you.
No. I’m not 60, I’m 30 and looking for highest growth possible. Vanguard won’t ever let you retire in several years- only through decades
Hahaha...

Members don't see this ad.
 
I found a dollar on the sidewalk yesterday?
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 user
Members don't see this ad :)
No. I’m not 60, I’m 30 and looking for highest growth possible. Vanguard won’t ever let you retire in several years- only through decades

While I too am in active day trader / swing trader and long term investor.
I've always believed that the power of compounding continues to be underappreciated.
I am 31 years old. I've been putting $1000 month into split between VTSAX and VTI since I was moonlighting as a resident 4 years ago. This should yield roughly $1.3 million by the time I retire. Press couple buttons monthly, no thinking, no stress. Much easier than looking up individual stocks. Easy way to have nice lump at retirement.

I'm not looking to retire in my 40s. I love being a hospitalist and my goal is to be part time in my mid 40s and spend the majority of my time with the family and traveling and trading as primary source of income. Though I doubt that's realistic, but the flash crash of the stock market this year gave me the portfolio boost and trading experience to start the process to financial freedom.

Good luck to all investing physicians! Take control of your financial goals!
 
  • Like
Reactions: 5 users
While I too am in active day trader / swing trader and long term investor.
I've always believed that the power of compounding continues to be underappreciated.
I am 31 years old. I've been putting $1000 month into split between VTSAX and VTI since I was moonlighting as a resident 4 years ago. This should yield roughly $1.3 million by the time I retire. Press couple buttons monthly, no thinking, no stress. Much easier than looking up individual stocks. Easy way to have nice lump at retirement.

I'm not looking to retire in my 40s. I love being a hospitalist and my goal is to be part time in my mid 40s and spend the majority of my time with the family and traveling and trading as primary source of income. Though I doubt that's realistic, but the flash crash of the stock market this year gave me the portfolio boost and trading experience to start the process to financial freedom.

Good luck to all investing physicians! Take control of your financial goals!

Out of curiosity, why investing in the same funds?

Why not VOOG and VGT? You don't believe in the big tech/growth company or you are playing it safe!
 
Out of curiosity, why investing in the same funds?

Why not VOOG and VGT? You don't believe in the big tech/growth company or you are playing it safe!

You hit the nail on the head! Just safe long term plays.

Majority of my portfolio is growth/tech stocks and high risk day trading and swings already. Just wanted safe play. I have often thought this was too conservative of an approach. but figured I needed to just provide a little balance my otherwise very aggressive investing strategy.
 
You hit the nail on the head! Just safe long term plays.

Majority of my portfolio is growth/tech stocks and high risk day trading and swings already. Just wanted safe play. I have often thought this was too conservative of an approach. but figured I needed to just provide a little balance my otherwise very aggressive investing strategy.
I see... I am going BIG with VGT/VOOG/VOOG... Even my 401k allocations are large cap and S&P 500 with plan to be conservative after 15 yrs
 
Our guys make 400k+ on a busy but pretty routine schedule.

I bet with admin Plus nursing home gigs on the side one or more is hitting 500k

key is to get a couple admin roles or medical director roles especially if you can swing it at multiple rehab/nursing homes.. then do some extra rounding there. Can add up.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 users
What about rounding at two different hospitals?
 
A lot of my colleagues I know routinely hit >400k if not > 500k. Some have hit waaaay beyond that. It's a matter of opportunity and how much you want to work.

I know one who had a dream of owning a lot of land, they worked almost 24/7. Depending on the gigs you work that is totally feasible (insane but feasible). My most of my income comes from working more days than minimum and profit sharing.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 users
I never made less than 550k as Hospitalist after residency as I just kept the tempo of work from residency. Cut the $500k ~30% due to Fed taxes if you are W2 to get real take home amount. $500k is approx $340k after taxes- that always hurts but if you independent contractor (IC) gig then a good accountant can help you with deductions & mayby you’ll gross closer to $400 as IC. (I’m in a no state income tax state) . If you open a SEP account you can see approx $450k as you can contribute up to 57,000! a year. This is allowed after you have been a LLC for 3 years (as I have been told by my accountant). I was an LLC for my first IC contract, then 2nd year you can apply to be a LLC- S corp (cause it saves 15% taxes).

If you 7on/7off you gotta work Locum in time off or second job per diem (I preferred just admitting in time off). Lots of Hospitalist making $2100-2400/day with locum now.

I also did a hybrid ER/Hospitalist job; now full time ER & per diem Hospitalist in high season. I made enough in 3 years after residency to pay off my home & saved up enough money to start my own business 2 years later (My other retirement plan ). I do love working though as most of you hard working docs. If you enjoy what you’re doing its not hard.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 8 users
I never made less than 550k as Hospitalist after residency as I just kept the tempo of work from residency. Cut the $500k ~30% due to Fed taxes if you are W2 to get real take home amount. $500k is approx $340k after taxes- that always hurts but if you independent contractor (IC) gig then a good accountant can help you with deductions & mayby you’ll gross closer to $400 as IC. (I’m in a no state income tax state) . If you open a SEP account you can see approx $450k as you can contribute up to 57,000! a year. This is allowed after you have been a LLC for 3 years (as I have been told by my accountant). I was an LLC for my first IC contract, then 2nd year you can apply to be a LLC- S corp (cause it saves 15% taxes).

If you 7on/7off you gotta work Locum in time off or second job per diem (I preferred just admitting in time off). Lots of Hospitalist making $2100-2400/day with locum now.

I also did a hybrid ER/Hospitalist job; now full time ER & per diem Hospitalist in high season. I made enough in 3 years after residency to pay off my home & saved up enough money to start my own business 2 years later (My other retirement plan ). I do love working though as most of you hard working docs. If you enjoy what you’re doing its not hard.

Love this post. I'm slated with extra work to make about 400K this year. The key for me has not been to work like crazy all the time. The key is to find a job you actually like. For me, that's nights, and I don't have to work double time to double my income because of my side gigs. Also taking every paid opportunity my employer is offering ($150/hr for covid related study and research? Sign me up!).
 
  • Like
Reactions: 6 users
I have >200% returns in my tax deferred accounts. I only started active trade less than a year ago (see my roth ira for example

And how can I possibly trade with margin, let alone options in a 401k, HSA account? Can’t do it in my IRA either.

My gains were not accrued via options gambling.





Nice going. I'm in my 30s myself. Fortunately enough to book about $150K in profit in my Roth accounts, and am up about another $160K unbooked profit in my ETH position for this year.

Feel free to PM if you want to talk about finance, and bounce ideas off each other. I personally don't use margin trading, and just accumulate long term position over the span of about 12-18 months before my position finally flourishes and bears fruits.

Love to know more savvy financial docs out there.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 user
Members don't see this ad :)
Nice going. I'm in my 30s myself. Fortunately enough to book about $150K in profit in my Roth accounts, and am up about another $160K unbooked profit in my ETH position for this year.

Feel free to PM if you want to talk about finance, and bounce ideas off each other. I personally don't use margin trading, and just accumulate long term position over the span of about 12-18 months before my position finally flourishes and bears fruits.

Love to know more savvy financial docs out there.

What kind of fruits do your positions grow? Apples? Cherries? Guava?
 
Nice going. I'm in my 30s myself. Fortunately enough to book about $150K in profit in my Roth accounts, and am up about another $160K unbooked profit in my ETH position for this year.

Feel free to PM if you want to talk about finance, and bounce ideas off each other. I personally don't use margin trading, and just accumulate long term position over the span of about 12-18 months before my position finally flourishes and bears fruits.

Love to know more savvy financial docs out there.

Nice gains!

What did you trade or invest for the 150k roth profits?

Current stock positions?

My top 3 holdings are currently ETSY, GRWG, SE
 
$GRWG is a beast. I got in last Friday and bought bigly with my ROTH IRA. Will be 10x bagger in few years.
 
$GRWG is a beast. I got in last Friday and bought bigly with my ROTH IRA. Will be 10x bagger in few years.

I'm already up way over +100K on it! (screencap was taken when price at 17.84, right now afterhours is at 18.59)
 
I have >200% returns in my tax deferred accounts. I only started active trade less than a year ago (see my roth ira for example

And how can I possibly trade with margin, let alone options in a 401k, HSA account? Can’t do it in my IRA either.

My gains were not accrued via options gambling.





Damn you hospitalists are baller$$! Good work!
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 users
Damn you hospitalists are baller$$! Good work!

Smashed past 800k barrier in my taxable account today



net worth now above 1.4 million...absolutely nuts that i was at 200k worth only a year ago, and -340k at three years ago when i finished residency!
 
  • Like
Reactions: 3 users
nice work! How did you pay off your loans so fast. Insane
Smashed past 800k barrier in my taxable account today



net worth now above 1.4 million...absolutely nuts that i was at 200k worth only a year ago, and -340k at three years ago when i finished residency!
 
nice work! How did you pay off your loans so fast. Insane

1. Be a nocturnist. You get more pay per hour.

2. Don't do fellowship, that's a huge opportunity cost (if your goal is to retire early)

3. Lots of moonlighting. I think I've worked 50ish hours a week on average since graduating residency. Sounds like a lot? sure. But guess WHAT, your classmates who went into surgery, they're STILL in their 5 or 7 year residency +/- fellowships, working 100 hours a week on average, making 50K a year, and letting their student loans accrue more interest.

4. Find a hospital system that pays well. I believe your overall total pay should come out to at least an average of 175/hr to make this worthwhile (55 hours x 52 weeks x $175/hour = $500500 a year. Doesn't that sound better than making 50K a year working 100 hours as a surgical resident??)

5. Keep expenses down, try to live like a resident. Taxes will destroy a lot of your pay!

6. Max out all your tax deferred accounts available to you (401K, IRA, HSA, 457B, 403B, etc). This is worthwhile despite prolonging your time to student loan pay off, especially if your employer does matching contributions

7. Immediately refinance your loans to low interest consolidation. I did this with SoFi; interest rate fell from the federal 6% or so, to 3% with SoFi.

With all the above, I was able to eliminate our (wife plus mine) 340K student loans in just 21 months. (Wife still in training, so she was making only 60K at the time) And don't forget, still managed to accrue +100K of retirement funds within that 21 month time, from maxing the tax deferred accounts.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: 9 users
I love hearing success stories like this... really impressive and props! What’s your target for retirement? 15M?

1. Be a nocturnist. You get more pay per hour.

2. Don't do fellowship, that's a huge opportunity cost (if your goal is to retire early)

3. Lots of moonlighting. I think I've worked 50ish hours a week on average since graduating residency. Sounds like a lot? sure. But guess WHAT, your classmates who went into surgery, they're STILL in their 5 or 7 year residency +/- fellowships, working 100 hours a week on average, making 50K a year, and letting their student loans accrue more interest.

4. Find a hospital system that pays well. I believe your overall total pay should come out to at least an average of 175/hr to make this worthwhile (55 hours x 52 weeks x $175/hour = $500500 a year. Doesn't that sound better than making 50K a year working 100 hours as a surgical resident??)

5. Keep expenses down, try to live like a resident. Taxes will destroy a lot of your pay!

6. Max out all your tax deferred accounts available to you (401K, IRA, HSA, 457B, 403B, etc). This is worthwhile despite prolonging your time to student loan pay off, especially if your employer does matching contributions

7. Immediately refinance your loans to low interest consolidation. I did this with SoFi; interest rate fell from the federal 6% or so, to 3% with SoFi.

With all the above, I was able to eliminate our (wife plus mine) 340K student loans in just 21 months. And accrue 100K of retirement funds by that time from maxing the tax deferred accounts.
 
1. Be a nocturnist. You get more pay per hour.

2. Don't do fellowship, that's a huge opportunity cost (if your goal is to retire early)

3. Lots of moonlighting. I think I've worked 50ish hours a week on average since graduating residency. Sounds like a lot? sure. But guess WHAT, your classmates who went into surgery, they're STILL in their 5 or 7 year residency +/- fellowships, working 100 hours a week on average, making 50K a year, and letting their student loans accrue more interest.

4. Find a hospital system that pays well. I believe your overall total pay should come out to at least an average of 175/hr to make this worthwhile (55 hours x 52 weeks x $175/hour = $500500 a year. Doesn't that sound better than making 50K a year working 100 hours as a surgical resident??)

5. Keep expenses down, try to live like a resident. Taxes will destroy a lot of your pay!

6. Max out all your tax deferred accounts available to you (401K, IRA, HSA, 457B, 403B, etc). This is worthwhile despite prolonging your time to student loan pay off, especially if your employer does matching contributions

7. Immediately refinance your loans to low interest consolidation. I did this with SoFi; interest rate fell from the federal 6% or so, to 3% with SoFi.

With all the above, I was able to eliminate our (wife plus mine) 340K student loans in just 21 months. (Wife still in training, so she was making only 60K at the time) And don't forget, still managed to accrue +100K of retirement funds within that 21 month time, from maxing the tax deferred accounts.

Awesome post. It's what I'm modeling my initial career off of; fortunately, my moonlighting gigs all pay $180/hr, so I'm happy that I'm hitting this arbitrary metric. That being said, I live in a high cost of living area, so my money doesn't go quite as far.

I will add that if you're really good with money and investing, for some (I've read your story and I understand why you did it the way you did it. It makes sense), it makes more sense to defer paying off loans and just let the money grow, particularly if you're on a income based repayment plan.

My personal plan is sort of a hybrid. I'll pay my income based repayment amount until I'm forced to pay the $3000/month for an effective 10 year repayment plan, and then I will likely sell a lot of my investments to pay off my loans at that time to avoid actively paying the interest on my loans. It will mean that I will end up paying out more money than you, but I'm hoping my investments make that amount inconsequential.

If you do it my way, though, make sure you save up some money to pay off your capital gains taxes when you sell your investments.

On the other hand, if you simply continue making income based repayments or do it @wamcp 's way and pay off your loans quickly and thus don't sell your investments, you won't have to worry about capital gains taxes at all. Different strokes, neither necessarily better than the other. The feeling of being debt free is going to be amazing.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 user
Awesome post. It's what I'm modeling my initial career off of; fortunately, my moonlighting gigs all pay $180/hr, so I'm happy that I'm hitting this arbitrary metric. That being said, I live in a high cost of living area, so my money doesn't go quite as far.

I will add that if you're really good with money and investing, for some (I've read your story and I understand why you did it the way you did it. It makes sense), it makes more sense to defer paying off loans and just let the money grow, particularly if you're on a income based repayment plan.

My personal plan is sort of a hybrid. I'll pay my income based repayment amount until I'm forced to pay the $3000/month for an effective 10 year repayment plan, and then I will likely sell a lot of my investments to pay off my loans at that time to avoid actively paying the interest on my loans. It will mean that I will end up paying out more money than you, but I'm hoping my investments make that amount inconsequential.

If you do it my way, though, make sure you save up some money to pay off your capital gains taxes when you sell your investments.

On the other hand, if you simply continue making income based repayments or do it @wamcp 's way and pay off your loans quickly and thus don't sell your investments, you won't have to worry about capital gains taxes at all. Different strokes, neither necessarily better than the other. The feeling of being debt free is going to be amazing.

I feel ya. I went the route of paying off loans ASAP (150K when I graduated medical school) that took me 3.5 years to pay off on a fellow's salary (I moonlit for days). In retrospect, it would have been nice to put in 10K into BTC when it was 250 bucks :)

Now that I am debt free, I don't want to take on any more debt. I wake up in the morning with no worries. It's incredible. There's something to be said about not owing anyone anything.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 2 users
I feel ya. I went the route of paying off loans ASAP (150K when I graduated medical school) that took me 3.5 years to pay off on a fellow's salary (I moonlit for days). In retrospect, it would have been nice to put in 10K into BTC when it was 250 bucks :)

Now that I am debt free, I don't want to take on any more debt. I wake up in the morning with no worries. It's incredible. There's something to be said about not owing anyone anything.

I’m excited to experience it!
 
Smashed past 800k barrier in my taxable account today



net worth now above 1.4 million...absolutely nuts that i was at 200k worth only a year ago, and -340k at three years ago when i finished residency!

What's your annual salary? I am assuming you make over 500k/yr...
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 user
Nice gains!

What did you trade or invest for the 150k roth profits?

Current stock positions?

My top 3 holdings are currently ETSY, GRWG, SE

Built a WPM position in my Roth 18 months ago at ~21 and sold around 42 in May of this year for 100% gain.

Two biggest positions are LYFT and ETH.

I booked some long term capital gain profit for ETH for about $140K last month and rebuy more shares at lower price in a correction.

Have to lock in that cheap Trump long term capital gain tax while I’m able to do that.

This year booked investment profit so far is about $280K. Could be well over 1 mil depending on performance of ETH and Lyft from here.
 
What's your annual salary? I am assuming you make over 500k/yr...

If i continue moonlighting ~20 shifts a month for the remainder of this year i will probably hit 600k.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 users
2. Don't do fellowship, that's a huge opportunity cost (if your goal is to retire early)

Damn, mistake #1 for me. Can't wait to pay off all my loans.
I love my job, though.
 
If i continue moonlighting ~20 shifts a month for the remainder of this year i will probably hit 600k.
How much do you get working extra shifts (12 hrs)? What's your base salary?
 
How much do you get working extra shifts (12 hrs)? What's your base salary?

Base comes out to about 2000 per 12 hr night shift

moonlighting is 200-300 per hour depending on the hospital and urgency of need; for 8 hour admitting shift or 12 hr overnight shifts

I don’t expect this to continue much further in the future thanks to the pandemic though. Job market in my area is quickly saturating with new hires- lots of new grads scrambling for hospitalist jobs and thus fewer open extra shifts are available since july
 
Base comes out to about 2000 per 12 hr night shift

moonlighting is 200-300 per hour depending on the hospital and urgency of need; for 8 hour admitting shift or 12 hr overnight shifts

I don’t expect this to continue much further in the future thanks to the pandemic though. Job market in my area is quickly saturating with new hires- lots of new grads scrambling for hospitalist jobs and thus fewer open extra shifts are available since july

These are great rate! There is really money to be made in medicine if one can work ~60 hrs... But the downside is that you won't have time to enjoy that $$$.

How many years have u been an attending?
 
These are great rate! There is really money to be made in medicine if one can work ~60 hrs... But the downside is that you won't have time to enjoy that $$$.

How many years have u been an attending?

yes 50-60 hr avg work weeks is unsustainable in the long run for most people just look at them surgeons. I have been an attending for 3.25 years, I am so far pretending like I am in a fellowship except i’m getting paid big bucks to do it!

I’m lucky and happyI did what I did, over the 3 .25 years I have raked in about 1.6 million in w2 earnings and employer retirement contributions. Combined with about 1.4 million in investment gains over the same period and 200k from my spouse’s fellowship/residency salary.

After taxes that has paid off 340K in student loans, 100k/ yr spending, and 1 million positive net worth Including a now nearly paid off house...we feel financially very secure for life. I might stop moonlighting altogether and just wait for my investments to compound for few more years then retire.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 6 users
yes 50-60 hr avg work weeks is unsustainable in the long run for most people just look at them surgeons. I have been an attending for 3.25 years, I am so far pretending like I am in a fellowship except i’m getting paid big bucks to do it!

I’m lucky and happyI did what I did, over the 3 .25 years I have raked in about 1.6 million in w2 earnings and employer retirement contributions. Combined with about 1.4 million in investment gains over the same period and 200k from my spouse’s fellowship/residency salary.

After taxes that has paid off 340K in student loans, 100k/ yr spending, and 1 million positive net worth Including a now nearly paid off house...we feel financially very secure for life. I might stop moonlighting altogether and just wait for my investments to compound for few more years then retire.
Actually 45-50 hrs/wk is sustainable... Most people work these hours for years, but 60+ hrs is when I think one's quality of life start to be affected.

It's remarkable that you are able to achieve all that in less than 4 yrs... If you keep working at this pace for another 3-4 yrs, you can can say adios to the rat race with a net worth over 3+ mil...
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 user
Actually 45-50 hrs/wk is sustainable... Most people work these hours for years, but 60+ hrs is when I think one's quality of life start to be affected.

It's remarkable that you are able to achieve all that in less than 4 yrs... If you keep working at this pace for another 3-4 yrs, you can can say adios to the rat race with a net worth over 3+ mil...

For sure, 3 more years of ~20 shifts a month will guarantee 3+ mil if not far more from other investing/trading.
But with our kid approaching 2 yr of age and forming more concrete memories, I want to be there with my family. I don't think I would have worked this many extra shifts if we had our child earlier, like during residency. Time is our most limited resource, though I'm happy I traded it the past 3 yrs for financial security as it'll save magnitudes more time in the future when I retire early
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 users
Any hospitalist here making >500k/yr. Can you share how you are able to double the average salary (# of hours per wk, $/hr, RVU or incentive bonus, etc...).

i know a pcp who makes 2mil/annual, no joke
if i were you, i would not focus on rvu, hospitals will scam doctors on that all the time, try to find a decent gig with a good base pay and then do other stuff
its about about how one positions oneself,
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 user
i know a pcp who makes 2mil/annual, no joke
if i were you, i would not focus on rvu, hospitals will scam doctors on that all the time, try to find a decent gig with a good base pay and then do other stuff
its about about how one positions oneself,

What are they doing to make 2 million a year?
 
What are they doing to make 2 million a year?

1604891374012.png
 
  • Like
Reactions: 4 users
Smashed past 800k barrier in my taxable account today



net worth now above 1.4 million...absolutely nuts that i was at 200k worth only a year ago, and -340k at three years ago when i finished residency!


wait sorry how did you make 1.2 million net in 1 year?
 
wait sorry how did you make 1.2 million net in 1 year?

at that time, year over year, I hauled in

~550k W2 income
~600k short term cap gains
 
  • Like
Reactions: 4 users
Related to the title of this thread - how much can you expect to make as a locums nocturnist at a hospital that is having a COVID surge? Assume no procedures, no ICU, no codes/rapids. Location - Northeast. They expect about 15 admissions/night and floor calls. I know in March, April hospitals were paying big money for COVID coverage, but has that changed now?
 
Related to the title of this thread - how much can you expect to make as a locums nocturnist at a hospital that is having a COVID surge? Assume no procedures, no ICU, no codes/rapids. Location - Northeast. They expect about 15 admissions/night and floor calls. I know in March, April hospitals were paying big money for COVID coverage, but has that changed now?

I don't know, man. How much can you negotiate?
 
Related to the title of this thread - how much can you expect to make as a locums nocturnist at a hospital that is having a COVID surge? Assume no procedures, no ICU, no codes/rapids. Location - Northeast. They expect about 15 admissions/night and floor calls. I know in March, April hospitals were paying big money for COVID coverage, but has that changed now?

I got that Covid-19 email offer the other day... Take it for what you will.


Pay $250 per hour for 40 hours 1.5 for any hours over 40
- $61.00 per day per diem and 80 hours quarantine pay after the assignment
completed
- Start ASAP
- Emergency Credentialing
- These are transitional COVID19 patients

Best,
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: 1 users
I got that Covid-19 email offer the other day... Take it for what you will.


Pay $250 per hour for 40 hours 1.5 for any hours over 40
- $61.00 per day per diem and 80 hours quarantine pay after the assignment
completed
- Start ASAP
- Emergency Credentialing
- These are transitional COVID19 patients

Best,

Rate seems fair for 15 admits a night if truly no icu, no procedures.
 
I got that Covid-19 email offer the other day... Take it for what you will.


Pay $250 per hour for 40 hours 1.5 for any hours over 40
- $61.00 per day per diem and 80 hours quarantine pay after the assignment
completed
- Start ASAP
- Emergency Credentialing
- These are transitional COVID19 patients

Best,

haha, forward me that contact. Maybe I'll do it for that rate.
 
not likely the NE...maybe wisconsin?

I guess it depends how this is interpreted?

one week of 7 nights, 12 hours each night:
$250 x 40 hours + 1.5 x 250 x 44 hours + $61 x 7 days + $250 x 80 quarantine hours = $46,927, comes out to $558.65/hour worked

Is that right??

If so, that is actually insanely high rate that will make any other specialty jealous
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 user
Top