BOWWLING TOURNAMENT GAME THREAD

[Animal Midwife]

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Upon scrolling back up it does seem to be puppy who said it.

 

[justafluff]

And honestly I went for Meats because I wolf read them and not everyone else did so I figured we had a chance at getting two wolves this cycle. I was worried if I shot Mel and they flipped wolf that we wouldn't agree on the next person to yeet and might accidentally yeet a villager. That of course no longer matters since I was the one who killed a villager 🙃

@Animal Midwife

 

[Lawpy]

i was debating on sharing this with the shot but **** it the wolves didn’t kill genny so they already know.
I had a vig shot. I shot genny.
That shot was not me.

Okay then, I really hope you're not both wolves. I killed Meats with my only vigilante shot. I've had both Mel and Meats deep in my POE. I was debating on shooting Mel, but since they have the majority of votes I decided to go for Meats. Clearly, it was a mistake and I'm regretting it. I was pretty certain they would flip wolf and now that they're not, I really need to evaluate my reads.
Really suspicious of Zenge and little sus of Sporty currently.

Hmm 🤔

 

[Lawpy]

Is puppy trying to make her grandmanator proud? 🤔

 

[Animal Midwife]

I'm still reading puppy as village for her previous comments.

 

[Lawpy]

I'm still reading puppy as village for her previous comments.

Who is puppy’s grandmanator?

 

[samac]

And since I’m getting paranoid with how things are going down we’re going to search AM:

I got the first crossvoting, then her saying you have more of an attitude when wolfing, then you disagreeing, but the disagreement after that and what your post to Pippy has to do with it lost me.

I see you and AM have met now

Meaning your whip and eyebrows are strategic interrogation/intimidation

And you’re saying this is an analogous situation here with genny saying you’re wrong about your spice level being nai?

The first part I struggle to understand. If genny’s a villager and doesn’t know your affiliation, why should she trust that you’re accurately representing your village meta? The second part I can see your perspective of why it reminded you of arguing with wolf Pippy, but I agree with what others have said about what wolf!Pippy does not being relevant to what wolf!genny would do, since I don’t see an inherent wolf motivation to her saying she had a longer misread streak.

Tbf, if you asked me how I was reading everyone in a given game I would have no answer for you.

Hm?

Ignore if this is answered in pages I haven’t read, but why meats so low and fluff so high?

I’m not reading AM as wolfy this game, but for future reference (including this game if you do later hear her howling): don’t give in to AM powerwolfing. GGoats, Donuts, and Criminal Minds she forced her way into the village bloc, then was impossible to yeet once someone figured it out while the rest of village was drinking the kool-aid. Reverse the curse, do what we could not.

Which efforts?

I don’t even know what this means. If you mean that I have conflicted thoughts on many players, then, well, yeah. I can see why it might look like hedging, but I try to continually reevaluate my position on players and not get too stuck in any one tunnel. I don’t know what to make of the tmi-seeming last sentence here. I feel like you’re a good enough wolf not to slip like that, but I don’t understand the confidence that my reads would lead to misyeets.

Well I’m not pushing fluff or violet.

Wolfy to neutral:
sporty, april
Octo
yk
fluff
Village lean: violet, psv, Zenge, Mel, alley
Village: samac, puppy, AM, meats, Lawpy

No, I plan to reevaluate once there’s a flip. This is based on individuals, not pack analysis.

Sporty/fluff off the top of my head, and I thought yk was pushing Sporty hard but when I looked for the post I had VV confused with yk

I also missed one zenge because I suck at this.

Neutral thus far. His content has felt genuine but I haven’t gotten any solid village pings.

 

[samac]

Who is puppy’s grandmanator?

No one that relates to this god damn game.

 

[Animal Midwife]

Who is puppy’s grandmanator?

Stagg. He fails to use his actions all the time though so I'm slightly confused by the reference.

 

[samac]

Are you trying to make a point Samac?

Zenge, why has Visc interacted so little with you on thread?

 

[Lawpy]

Stagg. He fails to use his actions all the time though so I'm slightly confused by the reference.

What if i tell you that puppy could be deepwolfing here and making Staggs proud? 🤔

 

[samac]

What if i tell you that puppy could be deepwolfing here and making Staggs proud? 🤔

I will consider this only if it gets to that point.
I’m also considering cubs is a whacky mother****er that put 2 vigs in the game for a little bit of spice.

 

[Lawpy]

I will consider this only if it gets to that point.
I’m also considering cubs is a whacky mother****er that put 2 vigs in the game for a little bit of spice.

I ask this because i don’t think there are 2 village vigs here, and puppy intentionally daykilled meaty for the village cred on top of that deep bus on vissy.

 

[Animal Midwife]

What if i tell you that puppy could be deepwolfing here and making Staggs proud? 🤔

What evidence do you have outside of her voting Vis first?

 

[Lawpy]

What evidence do you have outside of her voting Vis first?

Her targeted attacks on fluffy since D1 is a major reason. I think fluffy was being assailed by a coordinated wolf strategy.

 

[Lawpy]

FINAL Frame 1 Official Voting Tally

Dubbie () -
AM () -
True () -
Mel (1) - Zenge
Bluey (4) - Lawpy, Dubz, samac, kal
genny (1) - AM
Zuriburi () -
Samac (1) - Sporty
Puppy (1) - violet
Octopus (-) -
Fluff (2) - alley, puppy
Violet (1) - April
Lawpy (1) - Oxygen
Ivy (1) - genny
Vis (3)- zuri, True, Blue
April (2) - Meats, Mel
Zenge () -
kal (4) - shelty, fluff, Vis, octopus

TIED: @youngkal and @bluestoat

22/23, a single vote was missing
@IvyMoose

DAY CLOSED!


View attachment 348682

Frame 2 Official *FINAL* Voting Tally (as of post 2324- when I closed vote)

Vis (1) - Octo
Meats (1) - AM
Violet (1) - Lawpy
OctoDoc (1) - blue
zuri () -
Sporty (2) - Mel, True
Oxygen ()
Ivy (7) - April, ykal, violet, jfluff, Vis, zuri, vmh
Fluff (5) - Sporty, Zenge, potentialshelter, alley, puppydr
April ()

Leading: *freeshrugs*

Ineligible: samac

18/20
missing:
@IvyMoose @WorthlessOxygen

Day close:10PM EST/9PM CST/7PM FANTASYLAND

Requoting for reference

 

[Zenge142]

Zenge, why has Visc interacted so little with you on thread?

Because thread interactions are an absurd analysis tool.

I’m betting I’ve interacted even less than Puppy, and given their spot on the vis wagon, I’m pretty sure they’re village. And I know I’m village.

So this argument that “we didn’t interact enough to cross the v/w threshold, and thus we must be w/w” is a facile argument.

 

[Lawpy]

I feel like after the vmh flip I definitely have wolves hiding in my village reads and I really don't like that

Deepwolfing is in play. Sad to see this becoming a more common thing since the noob game

 

[supershorty]

This definitely looks like an HZD!shorty-type move

For the unfamiliar, this basically looks like a wolf pretending to be a village vig

********************
Quit libeling me, I was not a wolf, I was a 3P.
********************

 

[Animal Midwife]

Did you enjoy dinner, @Zenge142?

 

[Lawpy]

********************
Quit libeling me, I was not a wolf, I was a 3P.
********************

Lone wolves are still wolves 😡😡

 

[samac]

Since she’s my vig twin let’s search puppy

Hwhat

Oh god are we

I don’t see the wolf reasons for doing this, though. It would be very easy to say that she felt there was resistance or that she felt good about the reasons others were voting me or something if wolf!stoat needed to make up a reason to vote me. The apparent inconsistency certainly pinged me but on reflection, since it was in the same post so it’s like she said it and forgot (indicatong fake wolfhunting), I don’t think I see it as wolfy. I’m curious as to @bluestoat’s reasoning, though (sorry if I missed it)

For clarification, I generally do post by post analysis as I get confused and lose my spot if I try to jump around or wait to reply until I’m caught up. Arguments for VV over the past couple days before she came to defend just inspired a big shrug from me. I didn’t really sgree with them but I didn’t find them particularly wolfy, so had no reason to comment on them.

Either you misread or I didn’t communicate clearly, but I was between voting fluff and voting Ivy independent of the votecount, not trying to save fluff.

Wolfy to neutral:
sporty, april
Octo
yk
fluff
Village lean: violet, psv, Zenge, Mel, alley
Village: samac, puppy, AM, meats, Lawpy

I also missed one of AM’s cause I have a trend

Have you seen other evidence of it? I got the initial “this is a weird thing to focus on and declare Definitely Wolfy” feeling from her interaction with genny, but when I and others engaged her about it she responded in a way I felt good about, and since then I’ve seen her continually reconsidering, looking at multiple sides, and holding her cards to her chest but sharing when needed in a way that I associate with villagewife

 

[Animal Midwife]

Lone wolves are still wolves 😡😡

Lone wolf is as vague as alpha wolf. For mechanical purposes, she was a nerfed serial killer.

 

[Zenge142]

Did you enjoy dinner, @Zenge142?

Am currently enjoying it

 

[samac]

Because thread interactions are an absurd analysis tool.

I’m betting I’ve interacted even less than Puppy, and given their spot on the vis wagon, I’m pretty sure they’re village. And I know I’m village.

So this argument that “we didn’t interact enough to cross the v/w threshold, and thus we must be w/w” is a facile argument.

You know on thread interactions are how I caught your packmates in MHA right?
I have an important question for you.
Zenge, are you a wolf?

 

[Lawpy]

Lone wolf is as vague as alpha wolf. For mechanical purposes, she was a nerfed serial killer.

Lone wolves are not serial killers even though they function similarly as one though. I remember discussing this extensively with WZ a while ago. Lone wolves are more functionally closer to wolves despite not being part of the pack

That said, lone wolves could definitely be a thing in this game and something to keep in mind for sure

 

[Lawpy]

What this means is i don’t think puppy is village but she shouldn’t necessarily be grouped together with the Mels/alleys/Zenges pack

 

[samac]

Lone wolves are not serial killers even though they function similarly as one though. I remember discussing this extensively with WZ a while ago. Lone wolves are more functionally closer to wolves despite not being part of the pack

That said, lone wolves could definitely be a thing in this game and something to keep in mind for sure

I don’t think lone wolves are likely given the only 2 extra kills have been claimed. There’s not been a double kill every night or an every other day type of scenerio. Before we go down this rabbit hole let’s see if we can take out a coherent pack first because this can be a new misyeet rabbit hole for wolves to use.

 

[Animal Midwife]

Lone wolves are not serial killers even though they function similarly as one though. I remember discussing this extensively with WZ a while ago. Lone wolves are more functionally closer to wolves despite not being part of the pack

That said, lone wolves could definitely be a thing in this game and something to keep in mind for sure

You're thinking of lost wolves (which SDN sometimes mixes up the meaning between the two). Lone wolves have had numerous different wincons over the years ranging from inclusive to exclusive.

 

[puppydogtor]

I don't even know how to defend deepwolfing, but I'm not a wolf. I'm a Turkey. I'm pretty sure there must be a Double role somewhere here too (please don't reveal if you don't have to), but if you are the Double then you should understand that there is a villager Turkey role.
A turkey = three strikes. When I got my role PM I was told I was a vigilante, but that I would have to wait for three strikes to make my shot. I didn't know what that meant until after N1 when I saw someone had a role name as a Strike. That's why when Violet role revealed as being a duplicate Strike I knew she must've been telling the truth because I knew there had to be at least three strikes. Stoat was killed last night and was the third strike. That's why I was able to take my shot today

 

[Lawpy]

You're thinking of lost wolves (which SDN sometimes mixes up the meaning between the two). Lone wolves have had numerous different wincons over the years ranging from inclusive to exclusive.

No, lost wolves can be counted as part of the wolfpack despite not being part of them. Lone wolves are basically like a separate antivillage faction altogether but closer in features to wolves than serial killers.

I know SDN isn’t consistent with their terminologies but the point of this discussion to avoid getting lost in the semantics is if we aren’t considering deepwolfing as a possibility, we should consider an antivillage player in play.

 

[samac]

I don't even know how to defend deepwolfing, but I'm not a wolf. I'm a Turkey. I'm pretty sure there must be a Double role somewhere here too (please don't reveal if you don't have to), but if you are the Double then you should understand that there is a villager Turkey role.
A turkey = three strikes. When I got my role PM I was told I was a vigilante, but that I would have to wait for three strikes to make my shot. I didn't know what that meant until after N1 when I saw someone had a role name as a Strike. That's why when Violet role revealed as being a duplicate Strike I knew she must've been telling the truth because I knew there had to be at least three strikes. Stoat was killed last night and was the third strike. That's why I was able to take my shot today

Interesting. I assumed we’d have the similar roles

 

[Lawpy]

I don’t think lone wolves are likely given the only 2 extra kills have been claimed. There’s not been a double kill every night or an every other day type of scenerio. Before we go down this rabbit hole let’s see if we can take out a coherent pack first because this can be a new misyeet rabbit hole for wolves to use.

This is why i’m prioritizing Mels/alleys/zenges first while making it clear that i don’t think puppy is village

 

[SportPonies]

I don't even know how to defend deepwolfing, but I'm not a wolf. I'm a Turkey. I'm pretty sure there must be a Double role somewhere here too (please don't reveal if you don't have to), but if you are the Double then you should understand that there is a villager Turkey role.
A turkey = three strikes. When I got my role PM I was told I was a vigilante, but that I would have to wait for three strikes to make my shot. I didn't know what that meant until after N1 when I saw someone had a role name as a Strike. That's why when Violet role revealed as being a duplicate Strike I knew she must've been telling the truth because I knew there had to be at least three strikes. Stoat was killed last night and was the third strike. That's why I was able to take my shot today

This feels over-explainy tbh. And idk how to feel about that since I had you pretty solidly village.

And knowing what I know about *things*, I can’t decide if this makes you more or less village.

 

[Animal Midwife]

No, lost wolves can be counted as part of the wolfpack despite not being part of them. Lone wolves are basically like a separate antivillage faction altogether but closer in features to wolves than serial killers.

I know SDN isn’t consistent with their terminologies but the point of this discussion to avoid getting lost in the semantics is if we aren’t considering deepwolfing as a possibility, we should consider an antivillage player in play.

Well, whatever you want to call them, if they don't know the pack, it can't be considered deepwolfing.

 

[Lawpy]

Well, whatever you want to call them, if they don't know the pack, it can't be considered deepwolfing.

For shorty? I don’t think that was ever the question

For puppy? Everything should be considered, whether deepwolfing or lone wolfing or antivillage 3P faction etc etc.

 

[justafluff]

I ask this because i don’t think there are 2 village vigs here, and puppy intentionally daykilled meaty for the village cred on top of that deep bus on vissy.

But if puppy was a wolf, why not let us misyeet meats? Meats was in so many POEs cause Mel and Vis village read her so hard.

 

[SportPonies]

@puppydogtor why Vmh?

 

[samac]

@puppydogtor why Vmh?

I think she explained that earlier

 

[Animal Midwife]

For shorty? I don’t think that was ever the question

For puppy? Everything should be considered, whether deepwolfing or lone wolfing or antivillage 3P faction etc etc.

Don't think about it to the point where you lock yourself out of any village analysis.

 

[samac]

I'm suspicious of Zenge because I feel like his reads are similar to mine and others I have in my village category yet I honestly barely notice him in the thread other than reacting to posts lol. Gives me an impression that he's just coasting through for the most part.
Some of Sporty's questions/comments don't come across as villager to me. I was pinged again today by the way they just asked "Who did this?" to my vigilante shot.

And honestly I went for Meats because I wolf read them and not everyone else did so I figured we had a chance at getting two wolves this cycle. I was worried if I shot Mel and they flipped wolf that we wouldn't agree on the next person to yeet and might accidentally yeet a villager. That of course no longer matters since I was the one who killed a villager 🙃

@SportPonies

 

[Melchizedek]

But if puppy was a wolf, why not let us misyeet meats? Meats was in so many POEs cause Mel and Vis village read her so hard.

I really don’t appreciate you talking about me as if I’m dead and confirmed wolf. Stop using wolf!mel to justify a read. It’s wrong.

 

[SportPonies]

@SportPonies

Ah see my eyes glazed over with the long paragraphs while I was at work

 

[Lawpy]

But if puppy was a wolf, why not let us misyeet meats? Meats was in so many POEs cause Mel and Vis village read her so hard.

To get village cred? Wolves and antivillage factions want to be village read too so they can sabotage the village bloc and win.

 

[samac]

This is why i’m prioritizing Mels/alleys/zenges first while making it clear that i don’t think puppy is village

You think the pack is entirely vets?

 

[SportPonies]

You think the pack is entirely vets?

I don’t see why that’s any more or less likely than a mixed pack.

 

[puppydogtor]

To get village cred? Wolves and antivillage factions want to be village read too so they can sabotage the village bloc and win.

Up until this point, I didn't need any village cred. A lot of people had me as a village read so I was doing just fine. I owned up to the vigilante role because people said it would help village and that's what I'm trying to do

 

[Lawpy]

Don't think about it to the point where you lock yourself out of any village analysis.

I made my views pretty clear and repeatedly prioritizing Mels/alleys/Zenges first. But i want to make it clear to consider all possibilities because village has been blindsided and burned before. meaty’s village flip is pretty jarring so we need to start considering things more seriously

 

[SportPonies]

I’m erring on the side of believing puppy is village. I had her village up until now and her recent posts sound villagey.

 

[WildZoo]

Ah see my eyes glazed over with the long paragraphs while I was at work

********
I TOLD YOU SHORT POSTS ARE BETTER

MIC DROP

DUBZ OUT
*********