Can good board scores make up for low clinical grades?

[frasierjohn20]

I'm a US citizen IMG currently attending medical school in Slovakia (my mother is from there). I was hoping to ask a question. Can a good USMLE score make up for low clinical grades. I plan on going into family medicine and I've mostly barely passed my clinical rotations. I did a one month outpatient visiting subelective in america where I got a low pass. I'm hoping to get 90+ on my USMLE. Would it make up for my bad clinical scores and get me a FM residency?

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[K31]

You'll be competing for those FM spots with IMGs who were top of their class at their school, excellent evaluations from multiple US rotations, and 240+ Step scores. The only thing you have going for you is that you don't need a visa.

ETA: According to this, a 2-digit score (which nobody except IMGs pays attention to) equates to a 3-digit score of 213. The average for Step 1 is around 220.

 

[Phenytoin]

IMO depends on where these rotations come from but if you are barely passing US rotations then a high step 1 will not overcome it. Also, don't aim for a 2-digit score as nobody looks at it or even truly understand what it means.

 

[mmmcdowe]

Plus, they changed the relationship between the two and three digit score recently I believe. Op if you were a us mg the answer might be different, but chances are you will not be acing the usmle if you are barely passing. If you do, you will still struggle due to your img status and poor grades. So, yes it is still possible but I would strongly consider your other training and career options in your current area of residenc if things don't go well.

 

[fizzle]

You'll be competing for those FM spots with IMGs who were top of their class at their school, excellent evaluations from multiple US rotations, and 240+ Step scores. The only thing you have going for you is that you don't need a visa.

ETA: According to this, a 2-digit score (which nobody except IMGs pays attention to) equates to a 3-digit score of 213. The average for Step 1 is around 220.

Oh come on, this is bulls***. Sure, some applicants to FM will be IMGs with 240+, top of their class, and great clinical grades, but seriously? FM is nowhere near as difficult to get into as you make it sound, even for an IMG.

I'm not intending to knock on FM, but you're way exaggerating the competitiveness there.

 

[Dirt]

The simple answer is yes, a good board score can make up for sub-par clinical grades.

How good is good enough is a very different question.

 

[frasierjohn20]

Also, don't aim for a 2-digit score as nobody looks at it or even truly understand what it means.

Well I read somewhere that the average USMLE for IMGs going into family medicine was like 203 or something (213 for US seniors), so I was hoping for at least a 220 which I thought would perhaps put me at an advantage over the other IMGs (since FM has a high percentage of FMGs).

 

[MilkmanAl]

I'm not certain, but I'd be pretty darn confident that a 220 would land you a FM spot somewhere.

 

[frasierjohn20]

IMO depends on where these rotations come from but if you are barely passing US rotations then a high step 1 will not overcome it. Also, don't aim for a 2-digit score as nobody looks at it or even truly understand what it means.

Well I was thinking of a high step 1 and step 2. Would a high step 2 ck make up for low clinical grades?

 

[PSurg530]

Check out the NRMP charting outcomes:
http://www.nrmp.org/data/chartingoutcomes2011.pdf

For FM, out of 2246 independent applicants (DO, US independent, IMG/FMG), 1000 matched. Average Step 1 score was 204. I don't know how many of those people didn't match into FM because they matched into a different specialty. Also don't know what people's grades were.

Why do you have poor clinical grades? And with those, it's probably going to be hard to do well on Step 2 CK.

 

[KnuxNole]

I thought 4th years say that you need a month to study for step 2, and you can only use UWorld, etc. because you can take Step 2 without any rotations and such....


Unless I'm wrong, since it seems 4th years say they can do well on Step 2 regardless of clinical year experience >.>

Then again, the reason why they do that is because they worked hard during 3rd year, which would make more sense <.<

 

[Phenytoin]

Even a high Step 2 CK won't overcome consistently low clinical evals imo. I do think you can achieve your goal regardless but having low clinical grades is a red flag as they are the only way programs can indirectly assess your actual clinical ability on the floors (realizing they are very subjective but as I said consistently low grades show something is off).

 

[Law2Doc]

I'm not certain, but I'd be pretty darn confident that a 220 would land you a FM spot somewhere.

For a US senior, no question. For someone with an overseas education, having poor clinical evaluations in their few US rotations here is a huge red flag. PDs aren't going to create headaches for themselves just for a few more points on the Steps. OP had better apply broadly because he's going to get bumped out of contention by every high scoring IMG who doesn't have negative evaluations, visas notwithstanding.

 

[MilkmanAl]

No argument here. I'm just saying that he'll probably be able to match somewhere with a 220, despite the rest of his record. That somewhere may be, say, Pine Bluff, Arkansas, but it'll still be a job.

 

[abmd]

I have a pretty good step 1, high clinic evaluations but not so hot shelf scores. Do residency programs see the breakdown of clinical grades ie evaluations vs shelf scores.

 

[Top Gun]

I have a pretty good step 1, high clinic evaluations but not so hot shelf scores. Do residency programs see the breakdown of clinical grades ie evaluations vs shelf scores.

I doubt they'll see your shelf scores. Most likely they'll see the cumulative grade and also portions of your evaluations, as they're incorporated into the dean's letter.

To the OP, considering you're an IMG, even if you get great USMLE scores, poor clinical evals for clerkships that you did in the US are going to be a major red flag, even if you're only going for FP. I suggest that you find out what your weaknesses are, work hard to overcome them, do more externships in the US, and get great evals and LORs in said externships. I think this is your best chance for obtaining a residency in the US. And make sure you pass Step 2 CS the first time, so there will be less reason to doubt your clinical abilities.