• Funniest Story on the Job Contest Starts Now!

    Contest starts now and ends September 27th. Winner will receive a special user banner and $10 Amazon Gift card!

    JOIN NOW
  • Site Updates Coming Next Week

    Site updates are coming next week on Monday and Friday. Click the button below to learn more!

    LEARN MORE

Cause for Large Amount of Attrition in Psych Residency?

ace_inhibitor111

Full Member
7+ Year Member
Mar 10, 2012
641
1,015
226
Looking through the ACGME guidebook for the past few years, psychiatry surprisingly is on the top of the list for total number of residents leaving, almost 2x as much as Gen surg. For example, in 2019, 407/~1500 residents left, with nearly 300 transferring out when they are PGY3. What is happening in PGY3 of psych residency that is causing such a large amount of residents to abandon ship?
 

Attachments

  • 9B84B28E-9EE5-47E7-92F4-76E091B6061D.png
    9B84B28E-9EE5-47E7-92F4-76E091B6061D.png
    246.2 KB · Views: 88
About the Ads

loannightmares

New Member
Dec 17, 2019
8
11
36
  1. Resident [Any Field]
I’m pretty sure fast-tracking is unique to psychiatry, so they probably shouldn’t have included those individuals in the count if the goal is to look at actual attrition (leaving the specialty). Those individuals are continuing in psychiatry.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 4 users

asdf123g

Full Member
5+ Year Member
Dec 1, 2014
1,469
359
166
New York, New York
  1. Pre-Health (Field Undecided)
There are also quite a few transfers that happen to fill the voids left by fast trackers.
does this happen often? another thread I recall, a PD said they're hesitant to take anyone after PGY1 since they're unsure the quality of their training, especially the later in residency it is.
 

liquidshadow22

Junior Member
15+ Year Member
Jun 23, 2006
398
163
316
  1. Pre-Medical
does this happen often? another thread I recall, a PD said they're hesitant to take anyone after PGY1 since they're unsure the quality of their training, especially the later in residency it is.

Lol. NPs by the thousands practicing independently and PDs are worrying about advanced standing psych resident quality at the pgy 3 and 4 levels
 
  • Like
  • Haha
Reactions: 8 users

kaysisiel

Full Member
7+ Year Member
May 10, 2013
22
13
186
Coastal CA
does this happen often? another thread I recall, a PD said they're hesitant to take anyone after PGY1 since they're unsure the quality of their training, especially the later in residency it is.

It happens often enough to programs with small class sizes/call in PGY4/other responsibilities in PGY4. These programs tend to be community programs located in highly desirable areas like SF, NYC, LA, etc.
 

WuFlu

Membership Revoked
Removed
Mar 26, 2020
8
6
11
  1. Medical Student
Lol. NPs by the thousands practicing independently and PDs are worrying about advanced standing psych resident quality at the pgy 3 and 4 levels

PDs always want to make the low wage training as long as possible. That's why most PhD fields are saturated with trainees and endless post docing. Someone needs to be the free labor for the PDs.

Meanwhile,
 
  • Like
Reactions: 3 users
Aug 1, 2005
58,508
2,483
326
working on my tan......
  1. Attending Physician
From what I experienced, more folks are trying to transfer in than get out. What you see is switching over to child as everybody has mentioned. Take that year out and then you might get a better picture. My programs took a 3rd year and let's say they were not ideal. It's a hard deal. Because some programs that are smaller could really use the help of a replacement 4th year but then you got a year to get that person ready if they are not up to the par before you put your program's seal of approval on them and they represent your program for life.
 

Taddy Mason

30 Helens agree
5+ Year Member
Dec 23, 2015
975
1,983
176
Superjail
  1. Resident [Any Field]
Any explanation for the dismissal rate? I’m asking because I’m a paranoid intern lol.
I’m not sure what even remotely meaningful information you can attempt to extract from that data regarding dismissal rates, but as mentioned above the higher appearing number of individuals not completing residency for psych is largely influenced by people fast tracking. Looking just at those dismissed ~5% of psych residents didn’t complete residency due to being dismissed compared to ~12.5% across all specialties.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 users

WisNeuro

Board Certified Neuropsychologist
10+ Year Member
Feb 15, 2009
13,744
15,531
276
Somewhere
  1. Psychologist
PDs always want to make the low wage training as long as possible. That's why most PhD fields are saturated with trainees and endless post docing. Someone needs to be the free labor for the PDs.

Meanwhile,

Probably not most. Many of our departments, and other grad departments, lose money on grad students. Between a stipend, full tuition remission, insurance, etc, grad student's productivity is probably a fraction of what they cost. Same goes for our interns. Their clinical productivity doesn't even come close to helping us break even on them.
 
About the Ads
This thread is more than 1 year old.

Your message may be considered spam for the following reasons:

  1. Your new thread title is very short, and likely is unhelpful.
  2. Your reply is very short and likely does not add anything to the thread.
  3. Your reply is very long and likely does not add anything to the thread.
  4. It is very likely that it does not need any further discussion and thus bumping it serves no purpose.
  5. Your message is mostly quotes or spoilers.
  6. Your reply has occurred very quickly after a previous reply and likely does not add anything to the thread.
  7. This thread is locked.