Chances with a Ph.D. of getting into Med School?

[Bill Russell]

I would like to get an opinion on my chances of acceptance to med school. I have dual B.S. degrees in Biochemisty and Molecular Genetics from The Ohio State University. My overall GPA was 3.46 and my science GPA was 3.35. I also graduated with honors from having taken advanced and high level courses. I received a Ph.D. in Biochemistry from University of Wisconsin-Madison (graduate school GPA was 3.6). I have now completed a 3 year Postdoctoral Fellowship at Harvard University. I have authored or co-authored 11 manuscripts in the fields of cancer and immunology, of which I am first author on 8 of the papers, all with impact factor of 3-10. My MCAT score was 29. I have presented posters at several international conferences and have advised several med and graduate students. Thanks.

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[travelbug73]

I would like to get an opinion on my chances of acceptance to med school. I have dual B.S. degrees in Biochemisty and Molecular Genetics from The Ohio State University. My overall GPA was 3.46 and my science GPA was 3.35. I also graduated with honors from having taken advanced and high level courses. I received a Ph.D. in Biochemistry from University of Wisconsin-Madison (graduate school GPA was 3.6). I have now completed a 3 year Postdoctoral Fellowship at Harvard University. I have authored or co-authored 11 manuscripts in the fields of cancer and immunology, of which I am first author on 8 of the papers, all with impact factor of 3-10. My MCAT score was 29. I have presented posters at several international conferences and have advised several med and graduate students. Thanks.

You have decent grades (albeit on the lower side of the average) and an average MCAT score. Is your MCAT score balanced? If not, you might want to retake it (acc. to SDN, MCAT trumps GPA).
You seem to have excellent research experience, so no need to worry about that.
Since you did not mention it, I will assume that you do not have much, if any, shadowing and/or volunteering experience to prove to yourself and the admissions committees that you are sure you want to go down this path. If indeed you do not have clinical experience, please start immediately. Your local trauma or ER or NICU will be your best bets and it should not be very hard to find something in Boston. As far as shadowing goes, you might want to start with some of your MD contacts. You might also want to do some non-clinical volunteering, though I think clinical trumps non-clinical if you are strapped for time.
Also, start thinking about who to get recommendation letters (5-6) from. In general, you will need at least 2 from science professors. You can also start working on your personal statement.

 

[Bill Russell]

My MCAT scores were (Verbal = 11; Biological = 9; Physical = 9; writing = 99th percentile). I took the MCAT 9 years ago. My GPA may be on the low side because I double majored in two sciences and took the highest level calculus and engineering based courses at the university. In fact, half the class failed out of my organic chemistry classes and another half failed in my calculus classes. I got the highest grade in my calculus class and ended up getting a C+ in the course. In my organic chemistry classes, 300 people were in the class and only 8 got A's...I was one of them.

 

[GoSpursGo]

My MCAT scores were (Verbal = 11; Biological = 9; Physical = 9; writing = 99th percentile). I took the MCAT 9 years ago. My GPA may be on the low side because I double majored in two sciences and took the highest level calculus and engineering based courses at the university. In fact, half the class failed out of my organic chemistry classes and another half failed in my calculus classes. I got the highest grade in my calculus class and ended up getting a C+ in the course. In my organic chemistry classes, 300 people were in the class and only 8 got A's...I was one of them.

That's awesome... but how's an adcom ever going to know that? All they will see is 3.46, which is low in their estimations without the context.

Also, for an MCAT that was taken 9 years ago, you'll have to retake it; that score has expired at pretty much every school in the country.

I honestly have no clue how a med school would take into account your PhD, as this has to be a pretty unusual circumstance. All I can say is crush the MCAT when you retake it. Also I'd get in contact with a few adcoms and see what they say about your situation and your UG GPA; I think they are really the only ones who can tell you whether they would want you to bring it up at all given your unique situation.

In the meantime, definitely get involved with some clinical experience if you don't have it already.

 

[chutzpah]

I think you're forced to retake the MCAT. For most schools the MCAT score expires after 3 years or so.

I believe you have a great shot at some of the middle-tier research schools if you can make the case that you're pursuing an MD to supplement your PhD to aid in related research.

 

[Mobius1985]

Why go into medicine now? If you'd decided on this path before grad school, you could have gotten a free medical education in an MD/PhD combined program.

You are a super-star in the research arena, but currently not a great candidate for med school admission. Besides the subpar undergrad GPA (by which you'd primarily be judged), and an unusable MCAT score, you have not mentioned any of the expected clinical experiences over a long enough time-frame, for admissions committees to see a dedication to the idea of becoming a physician, and an understanding of what practice as a physician entails.

I agree with chutzpah that middle-selectivity schools would be your niche, provided you can relearn enough of the basic prerequisite material to get at least a another 29 on an MCAT retake (and I feel pain for you, just thinking of relearning that much physics). I am making an assumption that your amazing research credentials would trump the lower undergrad GPA. With any luck, some school might consider your improved graduate GPA, but there is no guarantee of that.

 

[WannaBePreMed]

I would like to get an opinion on my chances of acceptance to med school. I have dual B.S. degrees in Biochemisty and Molecular Genetics from The Ohio State University. My overall GPA was 3.46 and my science GPA was 3.35. I also graduated with honors from having taken advanced and high level courses. I received a Ph.D. in Biochemistry from University of Wisconsin-Madison (graduate school GPA was 3.6). I have now completed a 3 year Postdoctoral Fellowship at Harvard University. I have authored or co-authored 11 manuscripts in the fields of cancer and immunology, of which I am first author on 8 of the papers, all with impact factor of 3-10. My MCAT score was 29. I have presented posters at several international conferences and have advised several med and graduate students. Thanks.

Since your MCAT score expired 6 years ago you're going to have to take it again. I'm sure when your high scores come back you'll be a shoe in The fact that you have OODLES of research helps too

 

[Bill Russell]

Thanks all for your input. I will accept what you say as true, although something is bothering me about all of this. I just find it hard to comprehend how a GPA score could count for more than making it through the hardest degree program there is on the planet, Ph.D. in biochemistry. I mean if you can get through that after 6 years without killing yourself, then med school should be a piece of cake. When I was in grad school, I worked in the lab with 3 M.D./Ph.D. students. All 3 of them said the Ph.D. program was much tougher than the M.D. because for a Ph.D., you need to actually extend and stretch the field into the unknown and beyond whereas the M.D. mostly entails just memorization from books. Heck, the Ph.D.s write the books! The Ph.D.s who sit on the admissions committee for medical school must know and realize this. To me it's laughable that a GPA score would serve as more of a benchmark of capability than being at the forefront of a scientific discipline and publishing amongst the world's greatest scientists and physician scientists. Ok, just my two cents worth!

 

[Mobius1985]

Since you're right there at Harvard, why not make an appointment with a med school dean and discuss your situation. See what they say. If anyone can break the "general rule" Harvard can. I hear they don't require one to pass the USMLE cerifying exams like other med schools do. It never hurts to ask. And I agree that you are absolutely right. It's laughable that an undergrad GPA would serve as a benchmark for consideration in your situation.

You could call UW and Ohio State for opinions too, since you're "family".

 

[GoSpursGo]

Thanks all for your input. I will accept what you say as true, although something is bothering me about all of this. I just find it hard to comprehend how a GPA score could count for more than making it through the hardest degree program there is on the planet, Ph.D. in biochemistry. I mean if you can get through that after 6 years without killing yourself, then med school should be a piece of cake. When I was in grad school, I worked in the lab with 3 M.D./Ph.D. students. All 3 of them said the Ph.D. program was much tougher than the M.D. because for a Ph.D., you need to actually extend and stretch the field into the unknown and beyond whereas the M.D. mostly entails just memorization from books. Heck, the Ph.D.s write the books! The Ph.D.s who sit on the admissions committee for medical school must know and realize this. To me it's laughable that a GPA score would serve as more of a benchmark of capability than being at the forefront of a scientific discipline and publishing amongst the world's greatest scientists and physician scientists. Ok, just my two cents worth!

I would call the admissions offices of the schools that you intend to apply to and ask about how important your GPA really will be in the process. I know that GPA in most other advanced degrees (Masters, mostly) are given little consideration when placed next to undergrad. However, seeing a PhD apply for med school is much more uncommon, so I doubt that anyone here can accurately tell you what a med school is going to look at most heavily.

So, as I said, call the adcoms, see what they say.

EDIT: Ninja'd by Mobius

 

[aakp]

While this might be bringing back a dead thread, I disagree that most schools are going to weight your app primarily on your undergrad GPA. That's bogus. Since you're not below the cutoff where your app will be thrown out with some automated service, I'm sure most adcoms will be able to see past it.

A few suggestions / questions:

- make sure you blow the science sections out of the water when you retake the MCAT. Your background combine with relatively low science scores would seem a little odd to me if I was on an adcom.

- Why did you decide to do a postdoc before med school? You've obviously been thinking about med for a while since you've taken the MCAT, but why the change between grad school and now? Make sure you have a clear answer for this.

- Expanding on the last question, was your grad career successful, or did most of your first authors come from your postdoc? (Nice record, btw).

- Are you on good terms with your PI? Being that you're at Harvard, in the broader biomedical sciences, he might be able to pull a lot of weight.

I think that the important thing here to address is why you've decided to go back to med school now after being this far into your scientific training. You're qualified to be a prof at a med school, why do you want to be a student?

Anyhow... if you're still active on SDN send me a PM, I'm in a somewhat similar situation.