Closing of Walter Reed/AFIP?

[PathOne]

Just wondering when Walter Reed Army Medical Center and the Armed Forces Institute of Pathology will actually shut down? AFIP, of course, has to all intents and purposes already shut down, as virtually all of their top people has left (who can blame them?), but when will the nail actually shut the coffin shut?

---

Members don't see this ad.

 

[mitchconnie]

It depends on who you talk to, since concrete plans seem to be a closely guarded secret--or maybe no one knows what the hell is really going on. Word from the top initially was that WRAMC would be open for business and going strong right up until the 2011 BRAC deadline. Now they seem to be pushing harder for earlier integration/downsizing.

Word on the street is that there will be a large cut in military support staff over the next few months, which we have already partly seen. Rumor also has it that a large number of civilian contracts will be renegotiated over the next six months and a high percentage of these folks will be forced out. Of course, many of the talented civilians are already looking for new jobs, since the writing is on the wall, and they don’t want to deal with the uncertainty/instability.

I’m sure that there will be something around until 2011 (our brilliant leaders just started building a brand new multimillion dollar amputation center at WRAMC), but I foresee that it will become quite difficult to work at WRAMC within 24 months given the accelerating downward spiral.

 

[swampthing]

Just wondering when Walter Reed Army Medical Center and the Armed Forces Institute of Pathology will actually shut down? AFIP, of course, has to all intents and purposes already shut down, as virtually all of their top people has left (who can blame them?), but when will the nail actually shut the coffin shut?

Yes, it is truly sad that they will be closing these world-renown institutions. Both are large staples of U.S. military medicine which any physician would easily recognize and respect for their history and place in advancing medicine.

Although the original Walter Reed Army Medical Center will be closing down in Washington DC, it's name will live on. A new medical center in Bethesda, MD (7 miles from the old site) will be built in the coming years and it will be called Walter Reed National Military Medical Center. At this new medical center, there will be the integration of both Army and Navy medical staff.

As for AFIP, last year I heard that it may still live on. A few high ranking colonels (Army) and captains (Navy) suggested that USUHS (also in Bethesda, MD) may absorb AFIP's old duties and AFIP may resurrect itself from there. I truly hope AFIP will survive. In it's heyday, which wasn't too long ago, AFIP was considered one of the best pathology referral centers in the world. But we will see...Unfortunately, the military sometimes does things that just don't make sense to me.

 

[NavyFP]

Just wondering when Walter Reed Army Medical Center and the Armed Forces Institute of Pathology will actually shut down? AFIP, of course, has to all intents and purposes already shut down, as virtually all of their top people has left (who can blame them?), but when will the nail actually shut the coffin shut?

The functions of AFIP will continue. (we can't live without them) It will just be in a different form.

WRAMC and NNMC are combinig under a Navy commander. A new facility will be built at Fort Belvior that is being referred to as South Campus. The majority of WRAMC people will be going to that spot.

 

[PathOne]

Closing down a facility over a number of years seems insane. Anybody who can leave, will obviously do so. Everybody who can't, because they got nowhere to go, will stay...

As regards AFIP, the strength of the institution was, that it was such a large pathology-centered facility. Breaking it up and putting it in different locations is bound to affect the quality of their people, product and research. In years past, AFIP received tons of consults (probably more than anybody else), not only from the military, but from civilian institutions from around the world. If AFIP as an institution is gone, there'll be no way they'll get that back (then again, I'm sure they've already lost 90% of their non-military consults).

AFIP, Walter Reed & Bethesda Navy was once institutions at or near the top of anybody's list of the best medical institutions in the world. Now, two of them will be closed down, and the third is steadily declining, from what I can gather. Such a shame...

 

[Mirror Form]

Yes, it is truly sad that they will be closing these world-renown institutions. Both are large staples of U.S. military medicine which any physician would easily recognize and respect for their history and place in advancing medicine.

I don't argue with the very strong need for moving Walter Reed out of the district. The political requirement of hiring DC citizens is a disaster. Also, we already have a large military med cen right next to it that has the option of hiring maryland personel, and therefore not having to deal with a small applicant pool of lazy and incompetent idiots.

The problem is that instead of moving Walter Reed, they just gave the name to Navy and are closing it.

Although the original Walter Reed Army Medical Center will be closing down in Washington DC, it's name will live on. A new medical center in Bethesda, MD (7 miles from the old site) will be built in the coming years and it will be called Walter Reed National Military Medical Center. At this new medical center, there will be the integration of both Army and Navy medical staff.

Although there will be "some" integration of staff, the new "walter reed" will be a naval hospital under navy control.

 

[PathOne]

I don't argue with the very strong need for moving Walter Reed out of the district. The political requirement of hiring DC citizens is a disaster. Also, we already have a large military med cen right next to it that has the option of hiring maryland personel, and therefore not having to deal with a small applicant pool of lazy and incompetent idiots.

There's a REQUIREMENT to hire DC citizens ???

 

[MedicalCorpse]

I don't argue with the very strong need for moving Walter Reed out of the district. The political requirement of hiring DC citizens is a disaster. Also, we already have a large military med cen right next to it that has the option of hiring maryland personel, and therefore not having to deal with a small applicant pool of lazy and incompetent idiots.

As a nearly lifelong Maryland resident whose firstborn was delivered at WRAMC, this observation might appear to be racist. Sadly, I am not saying that the observation is untrue. I still remember, to this day, many run-ins with the civilian ladies in the Radiology Department at WRAMC, whose one and only orgasmic joy appeared to revolve around refusing the fawning requests of medical students for films critical to patient care. That was 1988. I don't think much has changed in this realm.

Nevertheless, the decision to close WRAMC is wrongheaded and purely political.

Quote from my book: A Fly in the Hand...: Uncensored Real Military Medical Quotes (Copyright (C) 2006-7, R. Carlton Jones, M.D., all rights reserved):
_______________________________________________________________________

17 May 2005: Everyone is in shock because Walter Reed is scheduled to be closed in the next BRAC (Base Realignment and Closure) iteration. Some people are in Denial, others in Anger...we know too much to try to Bargain with The Idiots On High...

The Walter Reed general surgery resident rotating at Andrews had the following reaction:

"They're not going to close Walter Reed. That’s the most ridiculous thing I ever heard."
--Capt. (Dr.) K., General Surgery Resident, 17 May 05 0800

I replied that someone was evidently still stuck at the D of DABDA.
_______________________________________________________________________

I'm in the OR talking to the surgeon over the drapes. This surgeon had had to transfer several extraordinarily sick patients from MGMC to WRAMC to save their lives during the past year. She evidently had gotten severely spoken to about her correct decisions by our vacuous hospital administrators, but had never received a career-ending LOR for attempting to save patients' lives, because...pause...she was a SURGEON, not an anesthesiologist. Anyway, given our mutual history of caring for very sick ICU patients who needed levels of care far above what our shriveled up "Medical Center" could provide, I asked her:

"So, now that they are closing Walter Reed, where are our sickest patients going to go?"

The OR scrub tech pipes up: "Heaven."

--
R

 

[MedicalCorpse]

There's a REQUIREMENT to hire DC citizens ???

Always has been.

--
R

 

[mitchconnie]

There seems to be a lot of public angst about the closure of the “historic Walter Reed.” But when I talk to the people who actually have to take care of the patients (i.e. the residents), no one is sad at all about the closure of Walter Reed. In fact, by the time surgical residents reach their chief year (PGY 6) they uniformly despise the institution. “It’s a good place to be from” they all say—a recognized name, but extremely frustrating to work there. As alluded to in the above posts, the support staff and bureaucracy are uniquely horrible and entrenched, even by military standards. In addition, the physical plant is deteriorating badly. My observation is that there is a largely incompetent staff supporting a lot of top-notch physicians and residents who burn out rapidly.

Will the Navy be better at running the hospital? Probably not, but it’s hard to see how it could be worse (unless the AF were running it).

The residents say that the Army could make a fortune by selling lottery tickets for the implosion of the hospital—the winner gets to push the plunger. I’d certainly be near the front of the line.

 

[orbitsurgMD]

I don't argue with the very strong need for moving Walter Reed out of the district. The political requirement of hiring DC citizens is a disaster. Also, we already have a large military med cen right next to it that has the option of hiring maryland personel, and therefore not having to deal with a small applicant pool of lazy and incompetent idiots.

Well, the people who got fired out of D.C. General had to go somewhere.

 

[Croooz]

There is not going to be any new building built. NNMC becomes NMMC. There will not be any demolition. The old WRAMC will go to the DC government. Supposedly the new NMMC will be run "jointly" by Army and Navy, with the CO alternating between the two services. I don't buy it. I believe it will become an Army dominated facility, much like military research is going.

 

[backrow]

Latest I heard was that the name would be Walter Reed National Medical Center. I was also under the impression that they would be adding square footage at NNMC to the radiology and emergency departments as well as adding an additional parking structure and maybe some additional square footage somewhere else.

I initially heard that Gen Farmer would be the initial commander of the facility, but lately I've been hearing that the current NNMC admiral would be the first commander.

The interesting part is going to be the additions at Ft. Belvoir. I can see that being a disaster if they try to have residents split time between the two hospitals, the commute would be terrible. I have a feeling in the end one set of residents will be at Bethesda and another will be at Ft. Belvoir.

All I know is I'm glad I didn't match at NNMC

 

[g293]

The interesting part is going to be the additions at Ft. Belvoir. I can see that being a disaster if they try to have residents split time between the two hospitals, the commute would be terrible. I have a feeling in the end one set of residents will be at Bethesda and another will be at Ft. Belvoir.

Or, think about us AF folk at MGMC. We are going down to a "super" clinic with outpatient surgery only. The AF leaderships keeps talking about how the other branches will bring their outpt surgery to MG and we may actually see an increase in workload. Yeah, people who live and work in Bethesda are going to fight rush hour to get down here to do their hernia surgery....

It's worse if you're a surgeon at MGMC. Where will you take you patients that require inpt stays? Will we have to see clinic at MG and round on patients in NNMC? The best theory I have heard from up high is that AF personnel may work at NNMC prior to their deployment to "get up to speed in a busy, fully function med center", deploy, and then return MG outpt clinic for some rest, then back up to Bethesda before deploying again

All I know is it's getting harder and harder to keep your surgical skills up in this environment, esp for AF personnel since our service is doing the F-22 rollover and abandoning inpatient medicine.

 

[Mirror Form]

There is not going to be any new building built. NNMC becomes NMMC. There will not be any demolition. The old WRAMC will go to the DC government.

That's partially incorrect, there will be an large extension added onto NNMC (and there will be a new hospital built at ft belvior, which is where a lot of the army will end up).

Supposedly the new NMMC will be run "jointly" by Army and Navy, with the CO alternating between the two services. I don't buy it. I believe it will become an Army dominated facility, much like military research is going.

That's what the original plan was, but it's completely changed. After air force nixed the idea of a joint medical branch, the new "walter reed" will be 100% under navy control. Navy is creating a new multistar admiral to run it. There will be some army physicians and personel there though.

 

[Mirror Form]

As a nearly lifelong Maryland resident whose firstborn was delivered at WRAMC, this observation might appear to be racist. Sadly, I am not saying that the observation is untrue. I still remember, to this day, many run-ins with the civilian ladies in the Radiology Department at WRAMC, whose one and only orgasmic joy appeared to revolve around refusing the fawning requests of medical students for films critical to patient care. That was 1988. I don't think much has changed in this realm.

I hope nobody misinterpreted my post as being racist.

 

[Croooz]

That's partially incorrect, there will be an large extension added onto NNMC (and there will be a new hospital built at ft belvior, which is where a lot of the army will end up).

Extension? Where? New parking structure? It took them....what?.....since the 1940's to pave the parking lot.

That's what the original plan was, but it's completely changed. After air force nixed the idea of a joint medical branch, the new "walter reed" will be 100% under navy control. Navy is creating a new multistar admiral to run it. There will be some army physicians and personel there though.

Never heard of the AF being in on this fiasco. As in usual politics vs military fashion, this is complete waste of money and resources. So basically they're moving WRAMC to Ft. Belvoir. Seems as though "they" are relocating the Army instead of consolidating it with the Navy.

 

[backrow]

I hope nobody misinterpreted my post as being racist.

I knew what you meant. Anyone who has put one foot inside the death star will know what you were talking about.