Columbia vs. UCSF vs. UCLA

[sfoksn]

Hey guys, I know that there has been so many discussions about school versus threads lately, but I think just like everyone's situation, my situation is unique as well.

So I thought I would ask you guys for your input in helping me decide which school to go to.

I primarily chose my schools based on how much I liked the school and how much I can imagine myself being happy there. Specialization rate or what not is not important for me at all, because those factors are completely dependent on the students' individual ambitions and determination to stay focused on specialization track.

Well, here we go..

UCSF:

Pro:
1. I live 15 minutes away from UCSF. I could live at home closer to my family.
2. Tuition is cheaper compared to Columbia. Received scholarship here.
3. Tremendously high reputation in medical-related fields.
4. Research oriented, and may easily pursue MS in various fields.
5. SF is awesome, and I know it like the back of my hand.
6. All my high school friends (most of my closest friends didn't even go to college) are there, rooting for me to come back.

Con:
1. No medically-incorporated curriculum.
2. Relatively low reputation in the eyes of patients (perhaps this is not the case for CA residents, but I am looking at the US public in general)
3. Perhaps less externship opportunities since not many med/dental schools are around in close proximity like NYC.
4. Staying close with my family and limiting my educational experience to west coast.

UCLA:

Pro:
1. Supposedly it has good reputation in dental field.
2. Systemic based curriculum, I like this approach.
3. I know the dental school and many of the faculties, and perhaps could maintain connection.
4. OMS track program is appealing. Not sure how much it will help compared to other schools, but definitely something to keep in mind.
5. Cheaper tuition.
6. No hassle about moving.
7. Many research options.

Con:
1. Again, limiting my experience to west coast.
2. I don't want to stay in UCLA for next 4 years... The school sucks (not about dental school, but the undergrad is just horrible).
3. Extremely diluted reputation in layman's perspective because of its undergraduate university.
4. No medically incorporated curriculum.

Columbia:

Pro:
1. Medically incorporated curriculum. I love this, because I feel that I will learn the most here preparing to enter OMS residency (fingers-crossed)
2. Great reputation overall, in dental field, medical field, or in layman's perspective.
3. Many research options and ability to get MS in the field I desire to study.
4. Funded DDS/MPH program. I am interested in public health sector in OMS..
5. Extremely friendly faculty that care a lot about my questions. The dean as well as academic dean are just so nice and thorough in answering my questions. They make me feel very welcome.
6. NYC. Always wanted to live here.
7. Many Korean students (international as well). Gotta love my culture.
8. High concentration of hospitals/medical/dental schools. Easy access to various externships, relatively speaking.
9. Very small pro, but coming from Korean background, we care so much about the school's name.. I don't even understand why.. My parents would love to say that their son is going to an ivy league school

Con:
1. Higher tuition.
2. Further away from family.
3. Apparently, UCSF trumps Columbia in term of medical school, I don't know if that's relevant or not.
4. Scholarships are non-existent.
5. Please add more to con list to alert me about things I am considering.


I am sure you noticed, but I don't really care about clinical exposure. Whether I go to the most clinical school or most non-clinical school, in a year or two in residency or private practice, we'll all reach the same level (according to people I interviewed).

I also do not care about tuition very much, because my ultimate goal in life is not about money and I know I will be able to pay them off eventually no matter where I go. Whether or not I pay 3200/mo for 10 yrs or 2700/mo for 10 yrs as my loan repayment, I can live without that 500 dollars.

I do, however, value medical incorporation in curriculum, should it become one of the distinguishing factors in following OMS paths as boards go P/F. It's just more interesting to be exposed to medical side, in my opinion.

I also care about research opportunities that are available at each school, because I want to work in the field of public health in the future.

Location has tremendous impact in where I spend next 4 years for me. If I can't be happy in that place, I won't be able to focus and study, and will fail

LA, SF, and NYC are few of the only places that I felt that I would be happy (although I haven't visited much of the midstates )

Anyways, please correct me if I have wrong information or would like to add more information or you would like to argue differently on some of the pros and cons I listed for each school.

I really appreciate all your input, and I wish you the best of luck in choosing your schools as well.

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[Charmm]

Good luck!

 

[gigawatt]

OP, I thought you were set on Columbia with the HPSP? What happened...change of heart?

 

[Charmm]

I remember this too, I thought I was mixing up with some body else though

 

[JBieber]

dang sfoksn, quite the predicament. Don't know which school to vote for lol. Are you not doing the military scholarship anymore? And you said yourself you don't want to stick around in LA for another 4 years, so just go with UCSF or Columbia.

Oh, and what is this OMS track you speak of at UCLA?

 

[Charmm]

J, vote for columbia looooool

 

[sfoksn]

It really depends on your future plans. As you said it yourself, all are good schools. If you think nationally, Columbia may be more popular. UCSF is still a pretty good choice, but as I said, In east coast things are different and you really dont hear anything from UCs around here. The academic dean is encouraging us to apply for the MPH since it is funded and seems attractive to a lot of students. Research is highly valued and off course I can go on and on and on about columbia cause I go here. At the moment I honestly do not have any thing negative to say about the school. Good luck!

Lovely, thank you so much! If I go to Columbia, I hope you can mentor me as an upperclassman

OP, I thought you were set on Columbia with the HPSP? What happened...change of heart?

Hey gigawatt, HPSP seemed to limit my scope of career path by so much. It does not allow me an option to get dual degree, does not give me the freedom to apply to different specialties if I choose not to go into OMS, holds me back 4 years that I could use for many different things, and also potentially dangerous if I were to go through military OMS program and serve as an military OMS.

I am still pretty set on Columbia, and I have been completely set until I heard back from UCSF and they offered me a substantial amount of scholarship. Also, many of the research professors that I work with, in both school of dentistry and school of medicine, suggested that I should seriously consider UCSF as it is a truly great institution with world class faculties.

Where are you going?!

 

[gigawatt]

UCSF:

Con:

2. Relatively low reputation in the eyes of patients (perhaps this is not the case for CA residents, but I am looking at the US public in general)

Very few patients over the course of your career are ever even going ask where you did your training. It truly doesn't matter. UCSF has a bulletproof reputation in the medical community, whether the general public knows about it nationally or not.

3. Perhaps less externship opportunities since not many med/dental schools are around in close proximity like NYC.

I've known people going to east coast schools who have done externships on the west coast. You don't have to live in close proximity to anything. It may make it a little cheaper, but an extra flight and temporary accommodations aren't going to break the bank. Plus, you're not going to limit yourself to programs in any one city, no matter where you choose to go.

UCLA:

Pro:

4. OMS track program is appealing. Not sure how much it will help compared to other schools, but definitely something to keep in mind.

I don't know anything about this, but sounds like it would fit what you're looking to do since you seem bent on OMS.

Con:

2. I don't want to stay in UCLA for next 4 years... The school sucks (not about dental school, but the undergrad is just horrible).

Really?! I've never heard anyone have such a negative experience at UCLA!

3. Extremely diluted reputation in layman's perspective because of its undergraduate university.

I don't even know what you mean here, but, again, it won't matter.

Columbia:

Pro:

1. Medically incorporated curriculum. I love this, because I feel that I will learn the most here preparing to enter OMS residency (fingers-crossed)

There's been some debate about whether or not going to a combined-curriculum school actually helps any and, if so, how much. Armorshell's talked about it a bunch, if you search for it.

 

[Charmm]

Where are you going?![/QUOTE]

 

[gigawatt]

Hey gigawatt, HPSP seemed to limit my scope of career path by so much. It does not allow me an option to get dual degree, does not give me the freedom to apply to different specialties if I choose not to go into OMS, holds me back 4 years that I could use for many different things, and also potentially dangerous if I were to go through military OMS program and serve as an military OMS.

I am still pretty set on Columbia, and I have been completely set until I heard back from UCSF and they offered me a substantial amount of scholarship. Also, many of the research professors that I work with, in both school of dentistry and school of medicine, suggested that I should seriously consider UCSF as it is a truly great institution with world class faculties.

Where are you going?!

Agreed on the HPSP. You're bound by the needs of the military, which isn't to say that you wouldn't be able to get some of those opportunities, but you have to know going in that everything is up to them. Military first, you second.

Still up in the air between UCLA and Columbia...so kind of the same boat.

 

[gigawatt]

OP, either your PreDents is a mess or you're trying to throw people off your trail...

What about Harvard? You got in but took it off the table in favor of Columbia? UConn? ...and those withdrawals can't be right if you're still looking at UCLA...?

 

[sfoksn]

look forward to see you; the orientation week will be so much fun+ we will get you started

Agreed on the HPSP. You're bound by the needs of the military, which isn't to say that you wouldn't be able to get some of those opportunities, but you have to know going in that everything is up to them. Military first, you second.

Still up in the air between UCLA and Columbia...so kind of the same boat.

It's always the same dilemma.. UCLA and Columbia just have everything. Are you in-state for CA?

OP, either your PreDents is a mess or you're trying to throw people off your trail...

What about Harvard? You got in but took it off the table in favor of Columbia? UConn? ...and those withdrawals can't be right if you're still looking at UCLA...?

I didn't particularly enjoy dealing with some of the faculties there, although they felt really intelligent. I guess I had a really high expectation how Harvard would be, and was pretty disappointed when I got the interview tour. Plus I would much prefer NYC over Boston. I put high importance on location, and I knew both Columbia and Harvard offers similar kind of education so why not. Also I like H/P/F rather than P/F. UConn.. I am kinda regretting not putting down deposit there, but what can I do now.. Haha. Farmington was such a country-side, though. I am not sure if I am up for that, living in urban cities all my life.

Ah.. What happened with UCLA was that they gave me an earlier interview, I didn't respond to them to make an appointment because I didn't really want to go there, then they gave me another interview date later.. I should change that

 

[321931]

Pro:

7. Many Korean students (international as well). Gotta love my culture.

Doesn't so-cal have a higher concentration of Korean students and or individuals in general? I mean they have a K-Town down there. All my Korean friends that attend UC Berk. really miss their so-cal Korean hot spots.

And yeah, I know how ya feel. Gotta love my canto-culture hehe. SF for-the-win

Anyways, all are good schools, but personally, I based my decision on the environment/people you will be with for the next 3-4 years. I put my vote in for UCLA, so take my vote with a grain of salt.

Edit: "9. Very small pro, but coming from Korean background, we care so much about the school's name.. I don't even understand why.. My parents would love to say that their son is going to an ivy league school"

I think this is common in most Asian background. LoL, I can totally relate to ya.

 

[sfoksn]

Doesn't so-cal have a higher concentration of Korean students and or individuals in general? I mean they have a K-Town down there. All my Korean friends that attend UC Berk. really miss their so-cal Korean hot spots.

And yeah, I know how ya feel. Gotta love my canto-culture hehe. SF for-the-win

Anyways, all are good schools, but personally, I based my decision on the environment/people you will be with for the next 3-4 years. I put my vote in for UCLA, so take my vote with a grain of salt.

UCLA has little international students.. In other words, hella bananas but not real Koreans, lol. K-town Koreans are not even acculturated enough to be Koreans, IMO.

Thanks for your input!

 

[sobe55]

Hey sfoksn!

Fellow CDM class of 2015 kid here If you decide to go anyway

as far as the korean thing goes, theres a pretty large korean dental society at columbia (from talking to my friend who is a d1 and browsing through sites and such). (im not korean though lol)

I interviewed at UCSF as well, and theyre generous with the scholarships, SF is GREAT, soooo willing to help you get into any research (i asked at my interview about one program and my interviewer was all "get her the contact info of so and so") and theyre a nice family too (those post acceptance phone calls are a nice touch!) If youre thinking of practicing in California, might be worth just staying in California (may be more networking opportunities?)

I ultimately decided to go to CDM because I think Im more of a NYC kinda person, I do like the MPH offering as well, and its east coast (closer to my hometown).

To me theyre pretty much even so go with what youre feeling. Where do you want to be for the next four years? What brings a bigger smile to your face? (corny, I know.)

Its tough man! Good luck with the decision because it wasnt easy for me!

 

[rickblas]

I would've thought there would be more votes for UCSF...so many people on these boards advocate to go with the cheaper option...but i guess this is not the case here?

UCSF does have a great reputation in the medical community all over the U.S. (i am from the East Coast and all medical professionals I know here talk highly of UCSF), and that's what matters doesn't it?

 

[Machiavelliansm]

I would've thought there would be more votes for UCSF...so many people on these boards advocate to go with the cheaper option...but i guess this is not the case here?

UCSF does have a great reputation in the medical community all over the U.S. (i am from the East Coast and all medical professionals I know here talk highly of UCSF), and that's what matters doesn't it?

from this poll, it appears UCSF's waitlist is the longest and Columbia's and UCLA's are shorter but equal. hehe.

 

[Kahr]

Based on your pro/con list, it sounds like you already know which one you really want to attend, and your list for UCLA makes me wonder why you even bothered including it. So, Columbia. (Not gonna bother giving reasoning, you already have good ones listed, for you)

 

[yjdentist]

# of pros says it all! columbia!

korean to korean, i feel you about parents caring about ivy league.
surprised they didnt force harvard on you...

i have a friend who wanted to go to stanford med school over harvard and his parents told him that he was being disobedient and disappointing them... so he went to harvard... he's a twinkie too. sorry, random story...

good luck!

 

[Maygyver]

Based on your pro/con list, it sounds like you already know which one you really want to attend, and your list for UCLA makes me wonder why you even bothered including it. So, Columbia. (Not gonna bother giving reasoning, you already have good ones listed, for you)

I agree.

To OP: Can I ask why you don't like UCLA?

 

[iamsyc]

Hey guys, I know that there has been so many discussions about school versus threads lately, but I think just like everyone's situation, my situation is unique as well.

So I thought I would ask you guys for your input in helping me decide which school to go to.

I primarily chose my schools based on how much I liked the school and how much I can imagine myself being happy there. Specialization rate or what not is not important for me at all, because those factors are completely dependent on the students' individual ambitions and determination to stay focused on specialization track.

Well, here we go..

UCSF:

Pro:
1. I live 15 minutes away from UCSF. I could live at home closer to my family.
2. Tuition is cheaper compared to Columbia. Received scholarship here.
3. Tremendously high reputation in medical-related fields.
4. Research oriented, and may easily pursue MS in various fields.
5. SF is awesome, and I know it like the back of my hand.
6. All my high school friends (most of my closest friends didn't even go to college) are there, rooting for me to come back.

Con:
1. No medically-incorporated curriculum.
2. Relatively low reputation in the eyes of patients (perhaps this is not the case for CA residents, but I am looking at the US public in general)
3. Perhaps less externship opportunities since not many med/dental schools are around in close proximity like NYC.
4. Staying close with my family and limiting my educational experience to west coast.

UCLA:

Pro:
1. Supposedly it has good reputation in dental field.
2. Systemic based curriculum, I like this approach.
3. I know the dental school and many of the faculties, and perhaps could maintain connection.
4. OMS track program is appealing. Not sure how much it will help compared to other schools, but definitely something to keep in mind.
5. Cheaper tuition.
6. No hassle about moving.
7. Many research options.

Con:
1. Again, limiting my experience to west coast.
2. I don't want to stay in UCLA for next 4 years... The school sucks (not about dental school, but the undergrad is just horrible).
3. Extremely diluted reputation in layman's perspective because of its undergraduate university.
4. No medically incorporated curriculum.

Columbia:

Pro:
1. Medically incorporated curriculum. I love this, because I feel that I will learn the most here preparing to enter OMS residency (fingers-crossed)
2. Great reputation overall, in dental field, medical field, or in layman's perspective.
3. Many research options and ability to get MS in the field I desire to study.
4. Funded DDS/MPH program. I am interested in public health sector in OMS..
5. Extremely friendly faculty that care a lot about my questions. The dean as well as academic dean are just so nice and thorough in answering my questions. They make me feel very welcome.
6. NYC. Always wanted to live here.
7. Many Korean students (international as well). Gotta love my culture.
8. High concentration of hospitals/medical/dental schools. Easy access to various externships, relatively speaking.
9. Very small pro, but coming from Korean background, we care so much about the school's name.. I don't even understand why.. My parents would love to say that their son is going to an ivy league school

Con:
1. Higher tuition.
2. Further away from family.
3. Apparently, UCSF trumps Columbia in term of medical school, I don't know if that's relevant or not.
4. Scholarships are non-existent.
5. Please add more to con list to alert me about things I am considering.


I am sure you noticed, but I don't really care about clinical exposure. Whether I go to the most clinical school or most non-clinical school, in a year or two in residency or private practice, we'll all reach the same level (according to people I interviewed).

I also do not care about tuition very much, because my ultimate goal in life is not about money and I know I will be able to pay them off eventually no matter where I go. Whether or not I pay 3200/mo for 10 yrs or 2700/mo for 10 yrs as my loan repayment, I can live without that 500 dollars.

I do, however, value medical incorporation in curriculum, should it become one of the distinguishing factors in following OMS paths as boards go P/F. It's just more interesting to be exposed to medical side, in my opinion.

I also care about research opportunities that are available at each school, because I want to work in the field of public health in the future.

Location has tremendous impact in where I spend next 4 years for me. If I can't be happy in that place, I won't be able to focus and study, and will fail

LA, SF, and NYC are few of the only places that I felt that I would be happy (although I haven't visited much of the midstates )

Anyways, please correct me if I have wrong information or would like to add more information or you would like to argue differently on some of the pros and cons I listed for each school.

I really appreciate all your input, and I wish you the best of luck in choosing your schools as well.

Seems reason enough. Curriculum, the Korean parents thing works, and it's NYC, you can't beat that. And you're going back to CA after anyways.

I think you CA residents with these [insert great state school in CA] vs. [prestigious East Coast ivy school] have it much better than us with the opposite but similar problem. I think you can have the best of both worlds with experiencing school/life on the other side (and some of the most world-renowned schools at that too) and yet get to go back to wonderful CA afterwards. Lol.

I wish I had gotten into UCLA, UCSF, UoP, USC. (I only applied to USC and UoP out of the list lol) I would have gone in a heartbeat!

 

[rickblas]

from this poll, it appears UCSF's waitlist is the longest and Columbia's and UCLA's are shorter but equal. hehe.

haha I chuckled. Anyways I retract my stupid vote for UCSF....To OP just go to the school you liked the best and as others said this was obvious.....

 

[sfoksn]

# of pros says it all! columbia!

korean to korean, i feel you about parents caring about ivy league.

Yeah. Tough being an A-sian.

I agree.

To OP: Can I ask why you don't like UCLA?

Hey Maygyver, well, the cons list some of the reasons.. But mainly, I just don't want to stay in LA for next 4 years. The weather is nice and all, but I am so extremely bored with the city and the school.

Same old restaurants, I've eaten out at pretty much every single good restaurants in K-town multiple times, and LA is a very hard city to get around to. Public transportation is very inconvenient, and having personal transportation may break your balls because of the traffic. Getting from one hot spot to another in LA takes forever!

I also feel that UCLA doesn't produce academics, but just tons of clinicians. I don't know of any dental school professors who are from UCLA SoD. They all go off to private practices and start earning money. I am not too much of a money person.. I want something more fulfilling than just money.

Also.. The fact that my research professors, who have been professors at UCLA SoD for decades, tells me that I should go to UCSF over UCLA says a lot about the school, in my opinion.

Based on your pro/con list, it sounds like you already know which one you really want to attend, and your list for UCLA makes me wonder why you even bothered including it. So, Columbia. (Not gonna bother giving reasoning, you already have good ones listed, for you)

I thought people may be able to provide more interesting pros about UCLA to change my mind...

I would've thought there would be more votes for UCSF...so many people on these boards advocate to go with the cheaper option...but i guess this is not the case here?

UCSF does have a great reputation in the medical community all over the U.S. (i am from the East Coast and all medical professionals I know here talk highly of UCSF), and that's what matters doesn't it?

Yeah. UCSF is a great school that is affordable as well. I am conflicted.

 

[rickblas]

I think you CA residents with these [insert great state school in CA] vs. [prestigious East Coast ivy school] have it much better than us with the opposite but similar problem.!

So true! I wish NY had huge, ginormous, popular state schools in great, fun cities (LA/SF). PSh east cost ivies should favor in state to make it fair hahahaha that would be awesome...

 

[sfoksn]

So true! I wish NY had huge, ginormous, popular state schools in great, fun cities (LA/SF). PSh east cost ivies should favor in state to make it fair hahahaha that would be awesome...

Isn't Stony Brook awesome and cheap, though? UC's aren't cheap anymore..

 

[rickblas]

Isn't Stony Brook awesome and cheap, though? UC's aren't cheap anymore..

Its cheap, and I think it's awesome for dental education (and was/still am definitely considering it, waitlisted ). However it is neither known well amongst lay people (like the UCs), hated by the undergrads who go there, "supposedly" no social life, has one of the ugliest campuses, SB's football team sucks, and is 2 hours away from civilization in the middle of suburbia (2hr train ride from NYC). haha ya..............................

O ya i forgot UCs raised tuition and that California is in financial crisis, but with that hefty UCSF scholarship....hm. Hope you make the best choice the fits you though, good luck!

 

[Machiavelliansm]

I also feel that UCLA doesn't produce academics, but just tons of clinicians. I don't know of any dental school professors who are from UCLA SoD. They all go off to private practices and start earning money. I am not too much of a money person.. I want something more fulfilling than just money.

could be that people who go to UCLA eventually adopt that socal materialistic mentality because of all the bentleys they see in westwood and feel the need to gun for one I'm sure you can go into academics from whichever school with ease.

It's really puzzling how UCSF doesn't have more votes...it seems whenever there is a UCLA vs UCSF poll/thread, UCLA wins out...

 

[UndergradGuy7]

I have no opinion for you, but you pro/con list for UCLA makes it seem like you hate UCLA, even though in the poll UCLA is tied for #1.

 

[Pennywisdom]

Voted Columbia because it sounds like you're set with Columbia. If I were in your shoes, I'd go to UCSF because of that "substantial" scholarship.

Congratulations and good luck!

 

[flapaTron]

op, a major overtone of your thoughts seems to be based on reputation. as such, it would seem that Harvard would fulfill this requirement the best (as clinically irrelevant as reputation is).

congrats on having so many choices.

 

[sfoksn]

I have no opinion for you, but you pro/con list for UCLA makes it seem like you hate UCLA, even though in the poll UCLA is tied for #1.

I was being honest about what I thought... UCLA definitely has a lot of positives in dental school for sure.

I just did not like my experience here as an undergrad, that's all. UCLA is no doubt one of the best dental schools in US.

op, a major overtone of your thoughts seems to be based on reputation. as such, it would seem that Harvard would fulfill this requirement the best (as clinically irrelevant as reputation is).

congrats on having so many choices.

Reputation comes into play, however it is not one of the most important factors for me. Like you would agree, wherever we go, it's dependent on us to make things happen. My more important reasons have to do with the location of the school, cultural life around it (since I'd like to go into public health, schools in proximity to inner city would be ideal), strength of the didactics, and student body.

I don't think any of the school I listed above lack any kind of reputation in dental field compared to Harvard.

And, thank you very much I hope to meet you if I choose to go to Columbia!

 

[Mr Tooth Fairy]

1. Don't worry about the "layman" opinion of where you go to school. I REALLY doubt this comes up much. In picking a dentist I've NEVER even looked to see where they went to school. Your average joe isn't going to know anything about your dental school or its reputation (or care). You're a good dentist, or you aren't.

2. I usually vote for the school that gets you in the least amount of debt.

3. If you are looking for change, NYC would be perfect for you. The west coast is very different from the east. If you're looking for the same old, comfortable lifestyle, stay in SF.

The decision really boils down to what YOU want. You're fortunate to have these options, and need to pick the school that is best for you.

 

[Mr Tooth Fairy]

from this poll, it appears UCSF's waitlist is the longest and Columbia's and UCLA's are shorter but equal. hehe.

You seem really hung up on this, and convinced that everyone on UCSF's waitlist is determined to trick anyone interested in UCSF to go elsewhere.

There are probably about 5 regular posters here that are on the UCSF waitlist (looking at the current poll numbers, this wouldn't sway the results as much as they are leaning away from UCSF).

It's not all about some secret society of UCSF waitlister's trying to take over the world.

I voted for Columbia because of the way the OP described it. From his writing, it appears to be the top choice in his/her mind, and that's what really matters.

 

[corpus luteum]

OP, as you mentioned, your situation is unique, just like everyone else's. And from your personal values and interests, Columbia seems to be the best match for you.

None of the cons you suggested for Columbia conflict with the main things you're looking for in a school. In fact, you respond to these "cons" in your own post...

Con:
1. Higher tuition.
I also do not care about tuition very much, because my ultimate goal in life is not about money and I know I will be able to pay them off eventually no matter where I go.

2. Further away from family.
limiting my educational experience to west coast.

3. Apparently, UCSF trumps Columbia in term of medical school, I don't know if that's relevant or not. lol.

4. Scholarships are non-existent. (same as #1)

Regardless, you're in a great position.. every school has its pros and cons-- think about which one you would most regret not going to if you picked somewhere else. Good luck!

 

[amcmahon]

# of pros says it all! columbia!

Agreed. You came up with much more convincing reasons to attend Columbia than anywhere else.

 

[Montserrat]

3. Apparently, UCSF trumps Columbia in term of medical school, I don't know if that's relevant or not.

It's not relevant, mainly because UCSF dental students do not share medical coursework with the medical students. The strength of didactic education doesn't cross over like at would at UConn or Columbia, so the point is moot. Though both are allied health institutions, a solid medical school doesn't relegate special status to the dental school at all.

In terms of public health -- the Mailman school is supposed to be pretty top notch. If public health is your goal with the inner city being your desired destination, Washington Heights is right up your alley. Though I'd suggest taking a closer look at your scholarship offer at UCSF -- sounds like you got a pretty decent offer. If you have any questions, feel free to send me a PM.

 

[Noelle23]

Although, we could definitely take over the world with the sheer number of us!!

You seem really hung up on this, and convinced that everyone on UCSF's waitlist is determined to trick anyone interested in UCSF to go elsewhere.

There are probably about 5 regular posters here that are on the UCSF waitlist (looking at the current poll numbers, this wouldn't sway the results as much as they are leaning away from UCSF).

It's not all about some secret society of UCSF waitlister's trying to take over the world.

I voted for Columbia because of the way the OP described it. From his writing, it appears to be the top choice in his/her mind, and that's what really matters.

 

[Machiavelliansm]

Although, we could definitely take over the world with the sheer number of us!!

Seeee, I knew it!! Enough to sway any poll!

 

[Mr Tooth Fairy]

Seeee, I knew it!! Enough to sway any poll!

She's one of the 5. And honestly, most don't have any illusions or delustions of them getting in this year (too high on the waitlist).

 

[sfoksn]

It's not relevant, mainly because UCSF dental students do not share medical coursework with the medical students. The strength of didactic education doesn't cross over like at would at UConn or Columbia, so the point is moot. Though both are allied health institutions, a solid medical school doesn't relegate special status to the dental school at all.

In terms of public health -- the Mailman school is supposed to be pretty top notch. If public health is your goal with the inner city being your desired destination, Washington Heights is right up your alley. Though I'd suggest taking a closer look at your scholarship offer at UCSF -- sounds like you got a pretty decent offer. If you have any questions, feel free to send me a PM.

Thanks, if I attend Columbia in the future, I hope to meet you in person. When you say "both are allied health institutions," are you talking about Columbia and Conn? I am having trouble understanding what you are exactly trying to say with bolded sentence.

1. Don't worry about the "layman" opinion of where you go to school. I REALLY doubt this comes up much. In picking a dentist I've NEVER even looked to see where they went to school. Your average joe isn't going to know anything about your dental school or its reputation (or care). You're a good dentist, or you aren't.

2. I usually vote for the school that gets you in the least amount of debt.

3. If you are looking for change, NYC would be perfect for you. The west coast is very different from the east. If you're looking for the same old, comfortable lifestyle, stay in SF.

The decision really boils down to what YOU want. You're fortunate to have these options, and need to pick the school that is best for you.

Can you tell me some of the differences that I may not be aware of? I don't know about east coast very much since I've been in the west coast my whole life.

Yeah.. I don't know what I exactly want... I guess the biggest thing is that I don't know if medically incorporated curriculum is helpful nor effective in making us competent dental professionals. I feel like medical exposure would be seen favorably if I want to continue with OMS path, but I am not sure about this either. If anyone could shed some light on this it would be appreciated.

OP, as you mentioned, your situation is unique, just like everyone else's. And from your personal values and interests, Columbia seems to be the best match for you.

None of the cons you suggested for Columbia conflict with the main things you're looking for in a school. In fact, you respond to these "cons" in your own post...

Con:
1. Higher tuition.
I also do not care about tuition very much, because my ultimate goal in life is not about money and I know I will be able to pay them off eventually no matter where I go.

2. Further away from family.
limiting my educational experience to west coast.

3. Apparently, UCSF trumps Columbia in term of medical school, I don't know if that's relevant or not. lol.

4. Scholarships are non-existent. (same as #1)

Regardless, you're in a great position.. every school has its pros and cons-- think about which one you would most regret not going to if you picked somewhere else. Good luck!

That's true, I hadn't noticed that. I guess having Columbia as my first choice all throughout my UG years affected me even though I was trying to stay impartial and just state the facts.

 

[Montserrat]

Sorry, I worded that poorly. I was referring to UCSF and Columbia. Both are allied health institutions, with schools of nursing, medicine, and dentistry located closely to one another. However, having a great medical school as part of the institution won't make you a better dentist. A medical integrated curriculum won't make you a better dentist. It's a philosophical difference in education -- you learn more about medical curriculum and the trade off is time to work on your hand skills. By the end of second year, other schools will have done way more clinically than my class and my predecessors. There is a reason why the school is changing the curriculum to be more balanced. There are many OMS residents who didn't share undergrad dental didactic classes with medical students and they still managed just fine. I doubt anyone will be shortchanged with the change to board questions -- it will still be designed to recruit the best dental students regardless of the educational philosophy differences between schools.

 

[JBieber]

bump4u :]

 

[babypapa]

I am wondering why not Harvard? Honestly, I am really eager to ask you "Are you out of your mind?" I think it is insane to choose Columbia over Harvard given what you are seeking from your school. You can have everything you can get from Columbia; Super fancy research experience, reputation among Korean patients, higher specialty rate, P/F grading system, emphasis on general medicine in the curriculum, more respects from your colleagues and above all opportunity to form close network with big guys in biomedical research field not to mention of Public Health. Look at the quality of papers published by Harvard on New England Journal of Medicine in regards to the public health policy. This institution is best in the world. If you want to stay in academia, this network will provide you a great leverage worldwide. In Harvard, you won't be bound only to a dental research field. If you can find a interesting research topic at its medical school, the school will greatly encourage you to go ahead because of their education philosophy. If I were your elder bother, I would slap your face and force you to go to Harvard as best as I can. Sorry for my discoutesy, I just got carried away.

 

[babypapa]

Sorry, I did not know you've already turned down their offer. Then I will vote for Columbia.

 

[hopefullyadent]

I am wondering why not Harvard? Honestly, I am really eager to ask you "Are you out of your mind?" I think it is insane to choose Columbia over Harvard given what you are seeking from your school. You can have everything you can get from Columbia; Super fancy research experience, reputation among Korean patients, higher specialty rate, P/F grading system, emphasis on general medicine in the curriculum, more respects from your colleagues and above all opportunity to form close network with big guys in biomedical research field not to mention of Public Health. Look at the quality of papers published by Harvard on New England Journal of Medicine in regards to the public health policy. This institution is best in the world. If you want to stay in academia, this network will provide you a great leverage worldwide. In Harvard, you won't be bound only to a dental research field. If you can find a interesting research topic at its medical school, the school will greatly encourage you to go ahead because of their education philosophy. If I were your elder bother, I would slap your face and force you to go to Harvard as best as I can. Sorry for my discoutesy, I just got carried away.

harvard is NOT the best institution in the world...no one can judge that...it is filled with corrupt people as shown by this article: http://www.bostonmagazine.com/articles/bitter_pills/

also their goal on public healthy policy is very simple: ration health care and copy the healthcare of britain (which has a crappy healthcare system and does not get as good results as america)..don't believe me just google Berwick Medicare and you'll find out

ppl like u need to stop acting like harvard is some sort of heaven (its just a school geez) and that harvard docs are angels....they are far from that

 

[babypapa]

harvard is NOT the best institution in the world...no one can judge that...it is filled with corrupt people as shown by this article: http://www.bostonmagazine.com/articles/bitter_pills/

also their goal on public healthy policy is very simple: ration health care and copy the healthcare of britain (which has a crappy healthcare system and does not get as good results as america)..don't believe me just google Berwick Medicare and you'll find out

ppl like u need to stop acting like harvard is some sort of heaven (its just a school geez) and that harvard docs are angels....they are far from that

That is not just a problem of Harvard. In my opinion, it reflects one of the biggest flaws in the current health care system sustained by greedy capitalism of the world. This problem has been consistently pointed out during the year long debates about Health care Reform Bill. Even in my home country with an Universal Health Care System, we have the same problem among health care providers. I believe no institution in this country would be free from such allegation. By the way, I just tried to emphasize physical supports and resources OP can get if he goes to Harvard no matter whether the moral standard among its constituents really reaches the same level or not. Also I do not agree with your opinion about their agenda in regards to health care policy but I do not want to make any argument in this place.

 

[sfoksn]

I am wondering why not Harvard? Honestly, I am really eager to ask you "Are you out of your mind?" I think it is insane to choose Columbia over Harvard given what you are seeking from your school. You can have everything you can get from Columbia; Super fancy research experience, reputation among Korean patients, higher specialty rate, P/F grading system, emphasis on general medicine in the curriculum, more respects from your colleagues and above all opportunity to form close network with big guys in biomedical research field not to mention of Public Health. Look at the quality of papers published by Harvard on New England Journal of Medicine in regards to the public health policy. This institution is best in the world. If you want to stay in academia, this network will provide you a great leverage worldwide. In Harvard, you won't be bound only to a dental research field. If you can find a interesting research topic at its medical school, the school will greatly encourage you to go ahead because of their education philosophy. If I were your elder bother, I would slap your face and force you to go to Harvard as best as I can. Sorry for my discoutesy, I just got carried away.

I agree with all the points, both Columbia and Harvard is pretty at par I feel in terms of all the asepcts I mentioned. In my public health classes, we read way more papers from Columbia than Harvard. Probably because of the different focus in public health issues, but that is the focus I am interested in and Columbia seems to have it.

Finding research topics across allied health schools on the campus is same for Columbia.

The main reason why I chose to go to Columbia over Harvard if I were to go to east coast is because of its location and cultural life around it more than anything. It's been my first choice for many years. If I were interested in biomedical engineering, however, I would have chose Harvard because it just offers so much more connections in that field in MA than NY, and more biomedical engineering intellectuals are focused in that area...

 

[babypapa]

The main reason why I chose to go to Columbia over Harvard if I were to go to east coast is because of its location and cultural life around it more than anything. It's been my first choice for many years. If I were interested in biomedical engineering, however, I would have chose Harvard because it just offers so much more connections in that field in MA than NY, and more biomedical engineering intellectuals are focused in that area...

Yea, same. Columbia has been my first choice for many years but I chose Stony Brook for one reason for another. Columbia is a really really great school and I am so pleased to hear that your career goal aligns with their academic philosophy. Go to Columbia, you won't regret your decision. We might be a good company if I chose to go there. I wish you the best of luck for your future.

 

[Charmm]

Good luck

 

[Charmm]

Yea, same. Columbia has been my first choice for many years but I chose Stony Brook for one reason for another. Columbia is a really really great school and I am so pleased to hear that your career goal aligns with their academic philosophy. Go to Columbia, you won't regret your decision. We might be a good company if I chose to go there. I wish you the best of luck for your future.

Dentistry rocks