Converting grade?

[Furstan88]

Hi,

I'm a swede thinking about a medical education in the US. I've searched the Internet and it's a little confusing so I hoped you could help me out. First of all, how do you count grades over there? If you for example have B's (which is approximately my average), what do you get? And what is needed to get into medical school? What is max etc?

What more will I need? Is it a good idea to take the MCAT-test? How long does the application process take?

What is the difference in costs between medical schools? I understand that a average cost is about 33.000 dollars per year?

Hope you can help me out guys!

Kind Regards
/Kristoffer Fürst

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[Pessimists101]

Roughly this is how grades are calculated.
A.....4.0
B.....3.0
C.....2.0
D.....1.0

Some schools do pluses and minuses in which case an A+ would equal a 4.0 and an A might equal 3.8 and an A- a 3.6

For most medical schools you are required to take a year each of Biology, Physics, Organic Chemistry and Chemistry with labs. Some schools also require a year in math and English depending on the school. You need letters of recommendation from your institution and professors usually a minimum of 2. Some clinically experience and some research to demonstrate your ability to multi task and your commitment to your profession.

I believe all Medical schools require you to take the MCATs. It would be a good idea to take it after completing the required courses. Application processing time varies by institution from 5months to a year. The cost also varies. from 25,000 to about 60,000 per year depending on whether you live on campus or off, or whether you attend a private or public institution. Hope that helps.

 

[Furstan88]

Thanks for your answer!

Alright, then I might have about 3.0-3.2 now. Is that way too low? When I get my results on my latest 5 exams I will have about 3.4 I hope.

Okay, and one year of each of those equals 39 week of just that subject? Cause a bachelor here is just 3 years, but it is given at a university so it is pretty much to learn, most student spend 50-80 hours a week studying to make C's or D's.

Could you give examples of clinical experience and reasearch? In sweden, there is no such thing as volunteer work since the hospitals are ran by the government, so everyone gets the same treatments (resulting in waitingtimes such as 1-2 years for surgery). And research is mostly done when you have finished your master exam, because doing research when just have just a bachelor is kind of pointless.

 

[Dendrite]

Converting grades from overseas is tough, because the standards for examinations are different. I know people that studied overseas for college, making C's, and then moved to the states and maintained an A/B+ average while enrolled in U.S. university courses.

A 3.4 is good, although you still need to do very well on the MCAT. If you enroll in courses at an accredited United States university, and end up getting an A average, then it will speak of your ability to handle the coursework, and may send a message of the difficulty of your coursework and evaluations in Europe. If you will already complete the prerequisite coursework to apply to medical school, then a 3.4 is still fine, but make sure to get in the 90th percentile on the MCAT to be safe. There are also regulations for those international students; make sure you have your resident alien registration all set up.

Clinical volunteer work is not as hard to get here. There are many not-for-profit and for-profit hospitals that allow students to volunteer pending background checks and orientation procedures. Shadowing opportunities also exist, where you can follow physicians/surgeons and observe procedures. Research opportunities are offered through universities and university-affiliated hospitals. In all of these cases, contacting each of these different places individually will help you get the positions.

 

[Furstan88]

Thanks again for answer.

Yeah, that's the same picture I have. The problem is that I will apply to med school directly from here. I will have finished my bachelor in a year from now. Does that mean I will have to apply in september/october? And if so, by what time will have to have my MCAT test finished?

I looked at some parts of the MCAT on www.aamc.org and it seems that my knowledge from high school is enough for most of the questions, so I won't have to study that much. Does the result on MCAT matter more than my GPA? Say, for example that I get 95% on my MCAT.

What is "resident alien registration"?

Okay, though one for me to get that volunteer work then. Is there any chance to get in without it? And what about those years in bio, chem and english? I can't really fit those into a swedish bachelor.

 

[Dendrite]

Thanks again for answer.

Yeah, that's the same picture I have. The problem is that I will apply to med school directly from here. I will have finished my bachelor in a year from now. Does that mean I will have to apply in september/october? And if so, by what time will have to have my MCAT test finished?

I looked at some parts of the MCAT on www.aamc.org and it seems that my knowledge from high school is enough for most of the questions, so I won't have to study that much. Does the result on MCAT matter more than my GPA? Say, for example that I get 95% on my MCAT.

What is "resident alien registration"?

Okay, though one for me to get that volunteer work then. Is there any chance to get in without it? And what about those years in bio, chem and english? I can't really fit those into a swedish bachelor.

You have to have an equivalent of one year of general biology with labs, one year of general chemistry with labs, one year of organic chemistry with labs, one year of physics with lab, one year of english, and one year of math (either calculus or statistics). There usually are no exceptions to these prerequisites.

Volunteer work, although not strictly required, is unofficially a must. When evaluating your file, admissions committees need to make sure you have had exposure to the field of medicine. It is frowned upon if you do not have such experience.

An "Alien Registration Card" is a green card. If you will be applying while a Sweden national, you will be doing so as an international student, and the odds are stacked against you. Not many U.S. medical schools accept international students, although there are a handful of them. Moving to the states, establishing residency, and either studying or working may put you on track to getting a green card, indicating your plans on remaining in the U.S. after getting a medical degree. Local government offices will have more information on this than I can give.

Getting a 95% on the MCAT is a tremendous feat; if you can do it, it will work in your favor, but it is beneficial to take the MCAT and receive your score before applying.

 

[Furstan88]

Okay, I will look with hospitals and similar around here and see if I can get to do some volunteer work.

The visa for studying in the US is quite easy to get as I understand. When you are accepted to your school you just fill out forms at the ambassy and it's taken care of. At least that's the procedure for my friends, but thay only went to study undergrad, maybe there is a difference?

How much is one year of all those? Putting all those years together makes 6 years and pre-med school is only 4 in the US? Do you read many subjects at the same time and still count them as whole years? Here, one year of biology is one year spent reading only biology (40 weeks).

All this is very new to me, the american school system obviously is a lot different from the swedish. I really appreciate the help!

 

[Dendrite]

Okay, I will look with hospitals and similar around here and see if I can get to do some volunteer work.

The visa for studying in the US is quite easy to get as I understand. When you are accepted to your school you just fill out forms at the ambassy and it's taken care of. At least that's the procedure for my friends, but thay only went to study undergrad, maybe there is a difference?

How much is one year of all those? Putting all those years together makes 6 years and pre-med school is only 4 in the US? Do you read many subjects at the same time and still count them as whole years? Here, one year of biology is one year spent reading only biology (40 weeks).

All this is very new to me, the american school system obviously is a lot different from the swedish. I really appreciate the help!

Here in the states, you can take a year of Biology, Physics, and Chemistry with the labs at the same time, depending on whether you can handle all three subjects within the same year and still do well. So yes, you can take many subjects at the same time. You can finish all of those courses in 1.5-2 years. The prices for taking these courses differ from school to school.

I don't have much information about obtaining student visas, so someone else has to field that question.

Good luck.

 

[Furstan88]

Ah, ok. But is there any measurements in like points or similar so I can compare? For example, if a student is studying full time, how much is he expected to do in one year?

And I didn't get how long the application process is? If I want to start med school september 2009, when will I have to apply?

 

[seansss]

I have a quick question about undergrads that have an A=3.6, A-3.0, A+=4.0 policy. When you submit your transcripts do the med schools recalculate your grades to where an A gives you a 4.0? Thanks

 

[chad5871]

This thread is better suited for discussion in the main Pre-Allopathic forum, where you may receive some additional feedback. I am moving it there now.

 

[Law2Doc]

I have a quick question about undergrads that have an A=3.6, A-3.0, A+=4.0 policy. When you submit your transcripts do the med schools recalculate your grades to where an A gives you a 4.0? Thanks

I'm not sure the prior poster was right that such a system exists. Some places make A+ a 4.0, but an A is also a 4.0. Other places I have seen make an A+ a 4.3, and an A a 4.0, but AMCAS will convert A+s to 4.0 (so your AMCAS GPA is lower than your college GPA). I have never heard of places that make an A less than a 4.0. But if so, then your AMCAS GPA would be higher than your college GPA. Doesn't really happen, in my experience.

 

[Law2Doc]

Thanks for your answer!

Alright, then I might have about 3.0-3.2 now. Is that way too low? When I get my results on my latest 5 exams I will have about 3.4 I hope.

A 3.0 - 3.2 and a foreign (college?) transcript are likely going to be prohibitive to get into US med schools. The average in US allo med schools is now around 3.5, and I suspect folks applying internationally require even higher than this. You won't have a state school to apply to, and these tend to be the biggest acceptors of the below average numbers. Will you have a college degree? You will need one to go to med school here (your post wasn't clear at what stage you are at). You won't get into med school coming from a foreign high school, even if you do take the prereqs here. you probably need your bachelors and then take the prereqs here to have a shot. And yes, you do need to have an MCAT score. And you will need to do well. I sure wouldn't take the approach that you "don't need to study that much" for the MCAT. Most US students finish college level classes in all those subjects and study for a number of months, taking repeated practice tests, before sitting for this test. Bear in mind that a third of the test is verbal reasoning/reading comprehension, which tends to be harder on folks who are not native speakers. So don't get cocky.

 

[Furstan88]

I'm sorry if I sounded cocky, that wasn't my intension at all.

Well, it isn't really a college transcript, it's a university transcript (I guess that's a difference?). And yes, I will have a bachelor degree of science in physics, computer science, biology or energy engineering depending on what I do with my next year. But I won't even have a shot of getting applying with just that degree and a resonable score on the MCAT?

Okay, maybe I can take two years from now then getting my score up to 3.7-3.8 or something like that and taking time to get a result as good as possible on my MCAT. But if you don't think I will have a shot as long as I havn't been at a college there, what's the point?

And what about those years? I still don't get how to count them.

 

[bugmser]

I'm sorry if I sounded cocky, that wasn't my intension at all.

Well, it isn't really a college transcript, it's a university transcript (I guess that's a difference?). And yes, I will have a bachelor degree of science in physics, computer science, biology or energy engineering depending on what I do with my next year. But I won't even have a shot of getting applying with just that degree and a resonable score on the MCAT?

Okay, maybe I can take two years from now then getting my score up to 3.7-3.8 or something like that and taking time to get a result as good as possible on my MCAT. But if you don't think I will have a shot as long as I havn't been at a college there, what's the point?

In all honesty you're not likely to get a very good estimation of your chances from this forum. Though well intentioned we can really only comment about our own experiences and the competitiveness of students from here. The university and grading system is very different here in comparison to many other countries. A 3.0-3.2 or "B" average in sweden is not necessarily a 3.0-3.2 or "B" average here. I actually know 3 different Int'l students who have matriculated to medical schools here from 3 separate countries (England, France, and India). One of which had an "A" average but 2 of these students had "B" averages in their respective university systems. A "B" average in sweden may be the equivalent of an "A" average here, I have no idea how to compare that and neither will anyone else on this forum. I would imagine admissions committees would look at your academic coursework with respect to other people from your country or university if they have that to go by. Though more than likely they will use your MCAT score to gauge your academic competitiveness with respect to applicants from this country. The 3 students I mentioned all had scores of 39 or above (41, 39, 39 respectively) which is at or above the 99% of all test takers. Coming from the european system your basic science background is probably much stronger than those coming from the US system so what I would do is just get a review book and some practice AAMC MCAT exams and learn to familiarize myself with the test. In terms of finding out your competitiveness your best bet is to contact the admissions offices at schools you are interested in, they will be able to provide you with better information for your situation and what numbers you will need to be competitive. Don't forget that in addition to your academics you will need to show some commitment to medicine through volunteering and/or shadowing. Unlike many other countries where medical seats are guaranteed for top students solely on numbers, admissions here is much more subjective and even with the best scores it can be very hard to gain admission if all your extracurriculars are not in order. With that being said it is not so impossible as some may make it. There are obviously international students that matriculate at schools here every year. Get in touch with admissions offices, shadow/volunteer, do well on the MCAT, and with a little luck you'll be matriculating at US medical school. Best of luck.

 

[Furstan88]

Thanks for really great answer. I will try to contact some schools to see what they think of my chances. =)

 

[chad5871]

By the way, my family heritage is predominantly Swedish and I've always wanted to visit Sweden! It's cool to have you on the forums!

 

[Furstan88]

Cool =). It's very different from the US and most part of Europe I can promise.

 

[Furstan88]

Hi again!

I have talked to medical schools and I will have to take my bachelor in the US. When is the application period for college? (is it too late is want to start after the summer?)

And also, is there a significant difference when applying to medical school depending on what college I went too?

I probably have already done a great part of the prereqs here in Sweden but I need to get the grades in the US. Is it possible to do everything in less than 4 year? (most people do 4 years at college before applying to medical school, right?)

 

[Dendrite]

Hi again!

I have talked to medical schools and I will have to take my bachelor in the US. When is the application period for college? (is it too late is want to start after the summer?)

And also, is there a significant difference when applying to medical school depending on what college I went too?

I probably have already done a great part of the prereqs here in Sweden but I need to get the grades in the US. Is it possible to do everything in less than 4 year? (most people do 4 years at college before applying to medical school, right?)

It is common practice to do 4 years of study for a bachelors in the states, but if you meet the requirements to graduate early, then that is no problem; you can then graduate in 2-3 years if possible. For the most part, it doesn't matter what undergraduate school you go to get a bachelors when applying to medical school, as long as it is accredited by national standards.

You can begin your college studies at the beginning of semester periods (i.e. in the beginning of the summer semester, Fall semester, or Spring semester). Most people apply to college the Spring preceding their entrance in the Fall semester at college, but this timing can fluctuate also; all you have to do is contact whatever college you are interested in before applying.

Good luck.

 

[Furstan88]

Thanks for answer.

So there is no "deadline" for applying? I would really like to start this Fall semester. Is there a application process similar to the one with med school or is it often so easy to get in that as long as you can pay for your education there is no problem?

 

[Dendrite]

Thanks for answer.

So there is no "deadline" for applying? I would really like to start this Fall semester. Is there a application process similar to the one with med school or is it often so easy to get in that as long as you can pay for your education there is no problem?

There is a deadline for applying, and each school differs somewhat with deadlines. You have to apply individually to each school. The best way to do it would be to give a call or send an e-mail to a school you are interested in, and work with the admissions department to expedite your entrance, especially since it is June and you are seeking admission by late August.

 

[Furstan88]

Thanks again for great answer.

What kind of program will have to apply for? Is there a certain "pre-med" program that some colleges offer or how does it work?

I have no idea even where to start looking for colleges. Do you have any recommendation of some in NY or LA? Is there a site where I can search for colleges matching what I want? I am so lost in this US jungle right now, but it sure is fun. I don't even know what town, what state or even what side of the country I would like to live in.