Decisions

[timtambam]

Here is me: cGPA 3.38, sGPA 3.42, MCAT 508 (126/128/126/128 in april 2017), BS psychology & BA philosophy in 2012, EMT-B license since 2014, roughly 1-2 community college classes in the evenings 2013-2016, and 1/semester in the evenings of 2019. I've given up on MD programs due to current MCAT. 4 years of work as medical assistant in clinic with great reviews/recs (currently working the same roles as nurses as a special exception to the required licensing). Scribing x 1 year = shadowing? I'm not sure how to count that. 0 hrs research. Handful of hours volunteering at clinic, but I'm just doing the exact same things I get paid for, so I stopped doing that.

I have, in my mind, two options before me (that I consider 'best options'):
option 1: continue working in the clinic, take community college classes (7 hrs): bio II + lab and infectious disease (online), then in summer, university for a prove-yourself biology course load, report these scores to SMP's and maybe go for MD with a plan to take MCAT again AFTER the SMP (i.e. early summer 2021). after this spring semester, cGPA = 3.41, sGPA = 3.50. after summer of 16 hrs, cGPA = 3.466, sGPA = 3.619. Or after summer of 12 hrs, cGPA = 3.45, sGPA 3.595.

option 2: quit working, become a full time student: take 4 classes at same community college, 15 hrs: bio II with lab, infectious disease (online), genetics + lab, microbiology + lab, MCAT this summer 2020, apply to DO's/MD's if possible in may, still apply for SMP for backup if I don't get in. After this spring semester, cGPA = 3.44, 3.568 (not sure if you round this when reporting...).

The questions:
1. Is it too late to apply to DO schools right now? Like this week?
2. option 1 or option 2 or other? (I attached an excel sheet of my GPA to give an idea of the flexibility after all this school. sGPA is very flexible, cGPA obviously not).
3. I prefer MD programs over DO, but really am okay going to DO school - I just want to be a doctor and I'm tired after all these years of poor advice that just puts more burden on me to prove myself. I'm so glad to have found SDN. I remain confident in my ability to repeat MCAT score or improve it, to get all A's in a full semester of community college. Should I be giving up on MD based on my stats/projected stats?
4. I'm open to whatever gets me to being a doctor (DO or MD) fastest, unless someone can explain why waiting another year for MD is worth it over DO sooner.
5. There is another option, 3, which I've dismissed: no classes spring semester, start new job for double salary, full bio course load at university for the summer session. This is douche-y to my would-be new employer, but they may be agreeable to the plan. Am I right to dismiss this?

Any input is appreciated. And questions as well, I'm sure I've left something out. I am getting lost in all the variables to consider, and I'm not sure which ones weigh more importantly...

-Tommy

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[Ki-100]

I am not good at giving advice. I think the average MD score is 510 and gpa 3.7 and DO is gpa 3.5 and 503. I mean your MCAT is not too far off but the gpa might hurt your chance for MD. Also it is very late this cycle to apply to DO I suggest apply this June for DO/MD. i sure you will have no problem for DO but MD i cannot 100% sure.

 

[Whysoez]

I am not good at giving advice. I think the average MD score is 510 and gpa 3.7 and DO is gpa 3.5 and 503. I mean your MCAT is not too far off but the gpa might hurt your chance for MD. Also it is very late this cycle to apply to DO I suggest apply this June for DO/MD. i sure you will have no problem for DO but MD i cannot 100% sure.

OP will need to retake MCAT either way, it will be considered expired in 3 months.

OP: option 2 is faster path, also do consider that SMPs are notoriously known for being extremely rigorous. If you fail at SMP that will hurt your chances at both DO and MD.

 

[Ki-100]

OP will need to retake MCAT either way, it will be considered expired in 3 months.

OP: option 2 is faster path, also do consider that SMPs are notoriously known for being extremely rigorous. If you fail at SMP that will hurt your chances at both DO and MD.

I did not see the date lol

 

[Goro]

The questions:
1. Is it too late to apply to DO schools right now? Like this week?
Yes. Too late.

2. option 1 or option 2 or other? (I attached an excel sheet of my GPA to give an idea of the flexibility after all this school. sGPA is very flexible, cGPA obviously not).
Your stats are fine for DO right now.

For MD, read this:

• Goro's advice for pre-meds who need reinvention

3. I prefer MD programs over DO, but really am okay going to DO school - I just want to be a doctor and I'm tired after all these years of poor advice that just puts more burden on me to prove myself. I'm so glad to have found SDN. I remain confident in my ability to repeat MCAT score or improve it, to get all A's in a full semester of community college. Should I be giving up on MD based on my stats/projected stats?

If you're boning for the MD, see above.


4. I'm open to whatever gets me to being a doctor (DO or MD) fastest, unless someone can explain why waiting another year for MD is worth it over DO sooner.

DO pathway will be faster


5. There is another option, 3, which I've dismissed: no classes spring semester, start new job for double salary, full bio course load at university for the summer session. This is douche-y to my would-be new employer, but they may be agreeable to the plan. Am I right to dismiss this?

Not really helpful. In a single semester of good grades isn't going to be enough data points for getting you to a competitive positions for MD schools.

You need >150 hours of nonclinical volunteering. You need to show off your altruistic side.

 

[timtambam]

First thanks to everyone above - wow! What a great community.


Some remaining questions:

1. re: >150 hrs nonclinical volunteering: I have 2009=450hrs, 2010=100hrs, 2011=20hrs, 2012=200hrs, 2013=200hrs, 2014=20hrs, 2015 and on=<10hrs/yr
Should I aim at getting something more regular into the mix again? I would be doing homeless volunteering and at-risk youth mentoring again.

2. do I need official shadowing, or does the 1 year of scribing suffice? I haven't ever shadowed or scribed a DO. I don't see the personal benefit given my unlimited access to ask questions, join appointments that are of interest to me, and get lunch with these docs and talk about the non-clinical aspect of physician life. Would it benefit my application to have some official shadowing, particularly with a DO?

3. are my stats for DO so fine that I could just continue working, no classes this semester, and studying in the evenings for an MCAT retake in April/May? Or do you all think a bump from one semester at CC would help with DO schools? In my mind, to 'prove myself', I would show my dedication to med school by quitting the job, and taking all the classes I can until I get into school (i.e. spring at CC, summer and beyond at university).

other note: The reinvention post is fantastic. I had read it a few days ago and it really helped formulate my thoughts

 

[Goro]

First thanks to everyone above - wow! What a great community.


Some remaining questions:

1. re: >150 hrs nonclinical volunteering: I have 2009=450hrs, 2010=100hrs, 2011=20hrs, 2012=200hrs, 2013=200hrs, 2014=20hrs, 2015 and on=<10hrs/yr
Should I aim at getting something more regular into the mix again? I would be doing homeless volunteering and at-risk youth mentoring again.

2. do I need official shadowing, or does the 1 year of scribing suffice? I haven't ever shadowed or scribed a DO. I don't see the personal benefit given my unlimited access to ask questions, join appointments that are of interest to me, and get lunch with these docs and talk about the non-clinical aspect of physician life. Would it benefit my application to have some official shadowing, particularly with a DO?

3. are my stats for DO so fine that I could just continue working, no classes this semester, and studying in the evenings for an MCAT retake in April/May? Or do you all think a bump from one semester at CC would help with DO schools? In my mind, to 'prove myself', I would show my dedication to med school by quitting the job, and taking all the classes I can until I get into school (i.e. spring at CC, summer and beyond at university).

other note: The reinvention post is fantastic. I had read it a few days ago and it really helped formulate my thoughts

1) You're good to go then on volunteering
2) While not shadowing or scribing with a DO won't hurt you, it WILL help you if you do so. Ditto getting a LOR from same. We look for people who go the extra mile.
3) Yup; you're fine right now for DO including my school. So go ahead and work, and enjoy life.
Pre-meds have this delusion about "dedication". Doing well and having a good app is your dedication. Do what you love and love what you do.

 

[timtambam]

1) You're good to go then on volunteering
2) While not shadowing or scribing with a DO won't hurt you, it WILL help you if you do so. Ditto getting a LOR from same. We look for people who go the extra mile.
3) Yup; you're fine right now for DO including my school. So go ahead and work, and enjoy life.
Pre-meds have this delusion about "dedication". Doing well and having a good app is your dedication. Do what you love and love what you do.

OMG. This is crazy. I can't believe it.
You're telling me, at cGPA 3.38, sGPA 3.42, MCAT 508 (meet or exceed this in april/may), and given all above, I could NOT take anymore classes, which would allow me to start making double the money until DO school? That is a dream. I don't want to go crazy because I know I put a lot of numbers out there and might have confused someone on my current stats...

 

[Goro]

OMG. This is crazy. I can't believe it.
You're telling me, at cGPA 3.38, sGPA 3.42, MCAT 508 (meet or exceed this in april/may), and given all above, I could NOT take anymore classes, which would allow me to start making double the money until DO school? That is a dream. I don't want to go crazy because I know I put a lot of numbers out there and might have confused someone on my current stats...

Yup. Get to work

 

[timtambam]

Yup. Get to work

I am so sad...
I've noticed something terrible.
I took biology I without lab in 2009 and got a C. And I never took biology II. I also took microbiology for healthcare professions...
The most recent class I took was last semester, online, and that prof is willing to write a LOR, although she says this is not a good idea since the class was online. We did do >5 meetings together, but it doesn't sound like she's very enthused about writing for me.

I'm studying for the MCAT and thinking Bio II with lab at CC right now wouldn't be a bad idea. I have another chance at a LOR, too.

What do you all think?

 

[paradoxic_toxic]

but it doesn't sound like she's very enthused about writing for me.

Stay far away. Don't wreck your application with a bad LOR.

I'm studying for the MCAT and thinking Bio II with lab at CC right now wouldn't be a bad idea. I have another chance at a LOR, too.

Do it. You need Bio 2 as a pre-req anyways.

 

[never-too-late]

I am so sad...
I've noticed something terrible.
I took biology I without lab in 2009 and got a C. And I never took biology II. I also took microbiology for healthcare professions...
The most recent class I took was last semester, online, and that prof is willing to write a LOR, although she says this is not a good idea since the class was online. We did do >5 meetings together, but it doesn't sound like she's very enthused about writing for me.

I'm studying for the MCAT and thinking Bio II with lab at CC right now wouldn't be a bad idea. I have another chance at a LOR, too.

What do you all think?

I'm no expert, but I think the pre-req at a CC is not great: I wouldn't do it. Especially if you had a C in BIO I. And you might need that BIO I lab: a lot of schools require the pre-reqs plus labs. Maybe just do the whole BIO suite all over again at a 4-year school? Might help boost both gpa's as well if you can kill it. And honestly, if you can't kill it at BIO, med School seems like a stretch. Summer classes are often cheaper and fast!

 

[Goro]

I am so sad...
I've noticed something terrible.
I took biology I without lab in 2009 and got a C. And I never took biology II. I also took microbiology for healthcare professions...
The most recent class I took was last semester, online, and that prof is willing to write a LOR, although she says this is not a good idea since the class was online. We did do >5 meetings together, but it doesn't sound like she's very enthused about writing for me.

I'm studying for the MCAT and thinking Bio II with lab at CC right now wouldn't be a bad idea. I have another chance at a LOR, too.

What do you all think?

What exactly are you lacking?

A year of Biology?

A LOR?

Material for MCAT prep?

 

[timtambam]

What exactly are you lacking?

A year of Biology?

A LOR?

Material for MCAT prep?

Missing:
-bio I lab.
-bio II lec + lab.
- 1-2 LOR's? (below).

I previously self-studied MCAT and felt that was well worth the time/money. I wouldn't really be depending on the bio class to help with this.. but it probably would help some in studying for the bio section.

I still feel confident in my ability to ace biology at CC or univ levels.

My LOR right now are:
1. MD (neuro) i've known for 1 year who has knowledge of my intellect/learning neurology/patient interaction
2. old supervisor at a clinic who has 3 years of knowledge of my character including leadership, as well as above
3. the online prof from CC who did not believe a LOR from an online prof @ CC was worth anything - this is what i mean be "not enthused"
4. DO (PM&R), do not know very well, but intend to over next month. I am shadowing with him over the next few days.

 

[Goro]

Most med schools require year of biology with lab. Thus, any two bio + lab courses will suffice.

If you need a LOR, then take a course at a CC and get LOR from that. Do not use the online prof as a recommendor.

 

[timtambam]

Most med schools require year of biology with lab. Thus, any two bio + lab courses will suffice.

If you need a LOR, then take a course at a CC and get LOR from that. Do not use the online prof as a recommendor.

So, anatomy and physiology classes with labs would count? And even ecology/evolution with lab?

 

[Whysoez]

I'm no expert, but I think the pre-req at a CC is not great: I wouldn't do it. Especially if you had a C in BIO I. And you might need that BIO I lab: a lot of schools require the pre-reqs plus labs. Maybe just do the whole BIO suite all over again at a 4-year school? Might help boost both gpa's as well if you can kill it. And honestly, if you can't kill it at BIO, med School seems like a stretch. Summer classes are often cheaper and fast!

Nothing wrong with CC pre-regs, much cheaper too.

 

[Goro]

So, anatomy and physiology classes with labs would count? And even ecology/evolution with lab?

Yes.

 

[dial1010usa]

I retook my chemistry classes at CC after graduating, no question was asked, got my LOR from CC professor.
I wanted to raise my GPA so I got from C to A.
CC courses are fine and get LOR from your CC professor.