Derm chances?

[C_Mill]

Hey guys, I am debating whether I should take a year off to do derm research. In M3 now. Step score is a 230, I have all high pass in rotations right now. My school is fairly new and we don't have a home Derm base. I have however done research since M1.

So far 1 abstract publication, 1 random article published, 2 papers on the way. I just received an opportunity for a skin cancer research fellowship at an incredibly prestigious institution, but I am debating taking it because realistically I am not competitive. I wonder if it will even make a difference. I see publishing 5 papers at best w/ the opportunity. It will give me some good letters of recommendation. I also worry if I take the year, because research is great and I don't mind taking a year to do it--will it make me less likely to match to Internal? My biggest fear is matching no where.

Thoughts?

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[efle]

Step score is a 230
all high pass in rotations
school is fairly new and we don't have a home Derm base

I think it looks extremely grim even with a research year

 

[longhaul3]

I think the 25th percentile in derm was 245 between 2017-19. Median was around 249. So 230 would be a pretty extreme outlier.

 

[C_Mill]

I think the thing that I like most about derm are the minor procedures, I love working with my hands + clean procedures. Are there other specialties that are less competitive and offer something similar?

 

[longhaul3]

I think the thing that I like most about derm are the minor procedures, I love working with my hands + clean procedures. Are there other specialties that are less competitive and offer something similar?

Radiology, crit care, anesthesia

 

[libertyyne]

You can shoot your shot at derm with those numbers and 3rd year grades. However the odds are stacked against you. You can still scramble into an IM spot somewhere after failing to match , but be prepared for that.
There are three things that competitive specialties look for
1. Step
2. Clinical Grades
3. Research

You could possibly be weak in one, and be a rockstar somewhere else to make up. You are weak in all three. Making up for one will still leave your short the other two.

 

[Cawolf]

I think the thing that I like most about derm are the minor procedures, I love working with my hands + clean procedures. Are there other specialties that are less competitive and offer something similar?

FM, IM sub-speciality (CC, GI+endoscopy, pulm+bronch, cards, etc.), and EM all offer procedures without surgery in addition to the suggestions above. I enjoy similar things to you and was personally disappointed in my dermatology rotation - biopsies, injections, and cryotherapy didn't seem that "procedural". I guess the occasional biopsy involved a couple interrupted sutures, but anything more complex was rare outside of the micrographic surgery-trained people.

 

[C_Mill]

Yeah you're right, the thing I enjoy the most are the MOH's, which I'm sure would be another very competitive fellowship after trying to get into Derm. Unfortunately I wasn't able to appreciate any specialties while in IM, but it's good to hear you liked them--it gives me hope I will too.

 

[C_Mill]

You can shoot your shot at derm with those numbers and 3rd year grades. However the odds are stacked against you. You can still scramble into an IM spot somewhere after failing to match , but be prepared for that.
There are three things that competitive specialties look for
1. Step
2. Clinical Grades
3. Research

You could possibly be weak in one, and be a rockstar somewhere else to make up. You are weak in all three. Making up for one will still leave your short the other two.

Yeah! The plan would be to double apply to internal as a second option so fingers crossed I'd end up matching somewhere. I'm just debating if the year will end up being valuable and teach me how to conduct research/write papers, or if it will inadvertently hurt my changes of getting into IM bc the programs I apply to will automatically assume they are my second choice

 

[libertyyne]

Yeah! The plan would be to double apply to internal as a second option so fingers crossed I'd end up matching somewhere. I'm just debating if the year will end up being valuable and teach me how to conduct research/write papers, or if it will inadvertently hurt my changes of getting into IM bc the programs I apply to will automatically assume they are my second choice

You are a US MD, albeit an average one. Most IM places would be happy to have you.

 

[Splenda88]

Yeah! The plan would be to double apply to internal as a second option so fingers crossed I'd end up matching somewhere. I'm just debating if the year will end up being valuable and teach me how to conduct research/write papers, or if it will inadvertently hurt my changes of getting into IM bc the programs I apply to will automatically assume they are my second choice

Chances are slim-to-none for derm even with 1 yr of research. You have too many things against you. One the other hand, chances are great for a solid mid tier IM program.

Do IM, then GI/Card--then $$$.... Or Radiology-- then $$$

 

[Deecee2DO]

Chances are slim-to-none for derm even with 1 yr of research. You have too many things against you. One the other hand, chances are great for a solid mid tier IM program.

Do IM, then GI/Card--then $$$.... Or Radiology-- then $$$

Solid mid tier with a 230? I am getting a wide range of scales of competitiveness on SDN for strong mid tier IM. I was told 240 avg Step 1 with research, so if a 230 will cut it then my stress level just went down a ton lol. I am still shooting for 250+ but knowing I dont NEED a 245 to be safe in matching mid tier Uni IM sounds less stressful. Of course not everything you hear on SDN is gospel so I never know whats real and whats not

 

[Splenda88]

Solid mid tier with a 230? I am getting a wide range of scales of competitiveness on SDN for strong mid tier IM. I was told 240 avg Step 1 with research, so if a 230 will cut it then my stress level just went down a ton lol. I am still shooting for 250+ but knowing I dont NEED a 245 to be safe in matching mid tier Uni IM sounds less stressful. Of course not everything you hear on SDN is gospel so I never know whats real and whats not

I am not sure if you are attending a DO school. Unfortunately, a DO student might need a higher score. I graduated in 2018 and people in my class with 230+ were getting solid invites from midtier programs (eg, U Miami, U Florida, U South FL, Cornell etc...)

 

[Frogger27]

Solid mid tier with a 230? I am getting a wide range of scales of competitiveness on SDN for strong mid tier IM. I was told 240 avg Step 1 with research, so if a 230 will cut it then my stress level just went down a ton lol. I am still shooting for 250+ but knowing I dont NEED a 245 to be safe in matching mid tier Uni IM sounds less stressful. Of course not everything you hear on SDN is gospel so I never know whats real and whats not

MD with 230 is an average student, hence should match at an "average" aka mid tier IM program.. Which btw these programs will set you up for any fellowship. If you are a DO I would shoot for 240+ though

 

[libertyyne]

Solid mid tier with a 230? I am getting a wide range of scales of competitiveness on SDN for strong mid tier IM. I was told 240 avg Step 1 with research, so if a 230 will cut it then my stress level just went down a ton lol. I am still shooting for 250+ but knowing I dont NEED a 245 to be safe in matching mid tier Uni IM sounds less stressful. Of course not everything you hear on SDN is gospel so I never know whats real and whats not

OP is an MD student. The average MD student matches at an average IM program , which by definition would be mid tier. If you are flexible with location you too should be able to match into a mid tier IM position with an average step score.
IM programs need capable bodies to fill seats. Heck, they will even interview and rank non superstar FMGs/IMGs. IM just has a massive number of seats.

 

[Deecee2DO]

OP is an MD student. The average MD student matches at an average IM program , which by definition would be mid tier. If you are flexible with location you too should be able to match into a mid tier IM position with an average step score.
IM programs need capable bodies to fill seats. Heck, they will even interview and rank non superstar FMGs/IMGs. IM just has a massive number of seats.

Good to know. thank you. Comparing applicants from mid tier to top tier must be night and day then-huge jump in competitiveness. Top tier IM is like surg-sub competitive if im not mistaken?

 

[ciestar]

Good to know. thank you. Comparing applicants from mid tier to top tier must be night and day then-huge jump in competitiveness. Top tier IM is like surg-sub competitive if im not mistaken?

Places like MG and NYP love prestige and pedigree on top of all that stuff too.

 

[libertyyne]

Good to know. thank you. Comparing applicants from mid tier to top tier must be night and day then-huge jump in competitiveness. Top tier IM is like surg-sub competitive if im not mistaken?

This may be common sense to many, but was interesting to plot out for me. Based on the Tableau data for 2018.

Many of us fall victim to heuristics, and one I caught myself thinking was that high board scores were synonymous with matching to a handful of specialties, most of the time.

Namely, I thought that the eight specialties with the highest proportion of 250+ scorers (high scorers) were capturing the majority of them. These eight specialties, defined in my mind by filling 25-50% of their residency spots with high scorers, included: Ortho, Diagnostic Rads, Derm, ENT, Rad Onc, Plastics, Neurosurg, and Interventional Rads.

Turns out, these combined only account for 38% of high scorers. Far more choose everything else! Even discounting internal medicine, a randomly selected high scorer is more likely to match outside those specialties than within them (41.3% vs 38.0%).

The Y axis of this chart is the percentage of 250+ scorers that chose to match this specialty. For example, among the population of 250+ scorers, 6.8% matched diagnostic radiology.

View attachment 292602

Efle did this chart that shows a higher percent of 250+ scorers are going into IM. This is probably the level of competition at the top. Some ofthese folks are probably going to home programs or programs close to home as well. But you can definitely find some studs in these circles. These are probably the people you are competing against for competitive fellowship matches though.

 

[Deecee2DO]

Efle did this chart that shows a higher percent of 250+ scorers are going into IM. This is probably the level of competition at the top. Some ofthese folks are probably going to home programs or programs close to home as well. But you can definitely find some studs in these circles. These are probably the people you are competing against for competitive fellowship matches though.

Wow thats crazy. Thanks for the info. Now I can imagine how competitve GI or cards must be at the top. Nuts. Also, theres a guy I know that did IM at Yale and hes a DO. I didnt think Yale took DOs since theyre all about status. Wondering if its a lie lol ive never heard of a DO at yale ever other than this guy sounds fishy

 

[efle]

Wow thats crazy. Thanks for the info. Now I can imagine how competitve GI or cards must be at the top. Nuts. Also, theres a guy I know that did IM at Yale and hes a DO. I didnt think Yale took DOs since theyre all about status. Wondering if its a lie lol ive never heard of a DO at yale ever other than this guy sounds fishy

Yale IM isnt nearly as much of a top program as its college or med school

 

[Deecee2DO]

Yale IM isnt nearly as much of a top program as its college or med school

Still top tier or mid tier? Research heavy? Frieda says avg Step 1 is 235-245 which seemed low. Guessing for a DO youd need 250+ with harddd ties to the program or letters from people who matter

 

[libertyyne]

The point of this aside, is no matter how low the bar is to get something you should always be striving for excellence, because it keeps locations/fellowships/fields open. when you are a med student your only job is to study and do well in school and on rotation. Doesn't really make sense to artificially aim at being average or anything less than exceptional.

 

[Deecee2DO]

The point of this aside, is no matter how low the bar is to get something you should always be striving for excellence, because it keeps locations/fellowships/fields open. when you are a med student your only job is to study and do well in school and on rotation. Doesn't really make sense to artificially aim at being average or anything less than exceptional.

Exactly. Thats why i am shooting for as high of a step score as humanly possible. I dont understand why people only strive for avg. It does however affect stress levels so knowing a potentially lower avg than originally thought helps me to know that if I screwed up on test day and got a lower score than planned for one reason or another im not doomed. Nerves can kill your score ha

 

[efle]

The point of this aside, is no matter how low the bar is to get something you should always be striving for excellence, because it keeps locations/fellowships/fields open. when you are a med student your only job is to study and do well in school and on rotation. Doesn't really make sense to artificially aim at being average or anything less than exceptional.

I mean, on the flip side, not everyone can be top quartile. Hell half of people can't even be above-average. If someone knows they want to do something like EM, it makes zero sense for them to kill themselves studying for boards and grinding on the wards to steal an AOA spot from some plastics gunner. It's only on SDN that the prevailing mentality is Exceptional or Bust.

 

[libertyyne]

I mean, on the flip side, not everyone can be top quartile. Hell half of people can't even be above-average. If someone knows they want to do something like EM, it makes zero sense for them to kill themselves studying for boards and grinding on the wards to steal an AOA spot from some plastics gunner. It's only on SDN that the prevailing mentality is Exceptional or Bust.

I mean maybe its just the kind of person I am, I never had an opportunity just to study before in college as I had to work to make ends meet. But the problem with aiming to be average is you end up below average if you miss your mark by a little. If you aim to be exceptional and you miss your mark , you end up being average or above average its no big whoop. I will say that i think striving for excellence at least helps on the wards too. Therefore the mantra of do the best you can, and let the chips fall where they may, and helps to minimize regret later on. This also helps if you suddenly develop a love for rashes later on.

 

[Deecee2DO]

I mean maybe its just the kind of person I am, I never had an opportunity just to study before in college as I had to work to make ends meet. But the problem with aiming to be average is you end up below average if you miss your mark by a little. If you aim to be exceptional and you miss your mark , you end up being average or above average its no big whoop. I will say that i think striving for excellence at least helps on the wards too. Therefore the mantra of do the best you can, and let the chips fall where they may, and helps to minimize regret later on. This also helps if you suddenly develop a love for rashes later on.

I completely agree with this. Always shoot for the stars

 

[FindersFee5]

I mean, on the flip side, not everyone can be top quartile. Hell half of people can't even be above-average. If someone knows they want to do something like EM, it makes zero sense for them to kill themselves studying for boards and grinding on the wards to steal an AOA spot from some plastics gunner. It's only on SDN that the prevailing mentality is Exceptional or Bust.

I mean maybe its just the kind of person I am, I never ha d an opportunity just to study before in college as I had to work to make ends meet. But the problem with aiming to be average is you end up below average if you miss your mark by a little. If you aim to be exceptional and you miss your mark , you end up being average or above average its no big whoop. I will say that i think striving for excellence at least helps on the wards too. Therefore the mantra of do the best you can, and let the chips fall where they may, and helps to minimize regret later on. This also helps if you suddenly develop a love for rashes later on.

I think both of these viewpoints have merit. The important thing to remember in medical school is that your cohort is different, and, unless you went to an uber elite college, stronger than anything you've been a part of before. Being average in this group of people is nothing to be ashamed of. If you're so worried about being top quartile, or 90th percentile or whatever and you're not able to meet that arbitrary and likely unrealistic benchmark, you'll be stressing yourself out and causing unnecessary pain . My school started with anatomy and I was killing myself, but was never above 75th percentile on any test. Realized by the end that a good number of my classmates were just straight up smarter than me, AND just as hard working, and there was no point in comparing myself to anybody but yesterday-me.

That being said, comparing only to your past self is actually great motivation for self improvement. That's where striving for excellence comes in. I realized that I'm a lot happier at the end of the day if I can honestly tell myself that I gave it my all. There's a deep satisfaction that comes with knowing that you performed at the limits of your abilities (while maintaining a growth mindset and understanding that your limits today are not necessarily your limits tomorrow).

 

[efle]

I mean maybe its just the kind of person I am, I never had an opportunity just to study before in college as I had to work to make ends meet. But the problem with aiming to be average is you end up below average if you miss your mark by a little. If you aim to be exceptional and you miss your mark , you end up being average or above average its no big whoop. I will say that i think striving for excellence at least helps on the wards too. Therefore the mantra of do the best you can, and let the chips fall where they may, and helps to minimize regret later on. This also helps if you suddenly develop a love for rashes later on.

It's the kind of person you are. Plenty of others are fine with setting a target, doing enough to get it, and then relaxing after that. There is literally always something more you could be doing that day - more anki reviews, more practice Qs, more research, more reading. At least in my class, there's a fairly clear delineation between people who get an endorphin high from grinding the grind in their every waking hour, versus those who just want a decent match and lots of time to chill. Guess which ones seem to all become neurosurgeons

 

[efle]

There's a deep satisfaction that comes with knowing that you performed at the limits of your abilities

But I mean, do you really feel this way? Now that Step 1 is officially going Pass/Fail, if you went back in time would you still have put in all those hours grinding for the 270, just so you'd feel that deep satisfaction? I'd take all the hours of restaurants and bars with friends, time with SO and family, video games and Netflix on my own, etc.

 

[DokterMom]

Yeah! The plan would be to double apply to internal as a second option so fingers crossed I'd end up matching somewhere. I'm just debating if the year will end up being valuable and teach me how to conduct research/write papers, or if it will inadvertently hurt my changes of getting into IM bc the programs I apply to will automatically assume they are my second choice

IMO, it's highly likely your IM programs will assume/know they're second choice. Learn to love the one you're with --

 

[FindersFee5]

But I mean, do you really feel this way? Now that Step 1 is officially going Pass/Fail, if you went back in time would you still have put in all those hours grinding for the 270, just so you'd feel that deep satisfaction? I'd take all the hours of restaurants and bars with friends, time with SO and family, video games and Netflix on my own, etc.

I mean, in my case I'll be applying with a scored step 1, so value wise I'm still absolutely fine with my choice

Maybe some of the biochem **** I memorized wasn't as useful as other things I could have been learning, but the process of studying for step 1 was valuable in teaching me about myself and how my mind worked, and I wouldn't change that. It's also important to draw a distinction between working as hard as you realistically can and working as hard as it's technically possible to work. I worked hard, but I never felt like I actually had to give anything up - I still had time to see friends, go on trips, get married, and visit with family throughout the preclinical years (3rd year has been a different story). Learning the level of effort you're capable of sustaining over the long term and working to slowly push that level, while balancing that with a healthy mental and emotional state, is very worthwhile knowledge.

 

[efle]

I mean, in my case I'll still be applying with a scored step 1, so value wise I'm still absolutely fine with my choice

Maybe some of the biochem **** I memorized wasn't as useful as other things I could have been learning, but the process of studying for step 1 was valuable in teaching me about myself and how my mind worked, and I wouldn't change that. It's also important to draw a distinction between working as hard as you realistically can and working as hard as it's technically possible to work. I worked hard, but I never felt like I actually had to give anything up - I still had time to see friends, go on trips, get married, and visit with family throughout the preclinical years (3rd year has been a different story). Learning the level of effort you're capable of sustaining over the long term and working to slowly push that level, while balancing that with a healthy mental and emotional state, is very worthwhile knowledge.

Fair enough, I suppose I felt I tested out my limits enough in college. Now, I take on all the free time I possibly can while achieving my (reasonable) goals, and would never ever want to return to the former level.

As a Derm resident put it to me today, we've all met the surgeons who didn't realize how much their work would compete with their sources of joy outside the hospital. But we never seem to meet dermies who wish they'd spent the rest of their 20s and early 30s in the hospital to find out what they were made of.

It's a laudable attitude - the modern version of "to live deep and suck out all the marrow of life" I think - but one that has been dispelled from me personally.

 

[FindersFee5]

Fair enough, I suppose I felt I tested out my limits enough in college. Now, I take on all the free time I possibly can while achieving my (reasonable) goals, and would never ever want to return to the former level.

As a Derm resident put it to me today, we've all met the surgeons who didn't realize how much their work would compete with their sources of joy outside the hospital. But we never seem to meet dermies who wish they'd spent the rest of their 20s and early 30s in the hospital to find out what they were made of.

It's a laudable attitude - the modern version of "to live deep and suck out all the marrow of life" I think - but one that has been dispelled from me personally.

Although they don't phrase it as "I wish I'd spent more time in the hospital," I've met dermatologists who are super burned out and hate their job. Would they like their job more if they had been surgeons? Maybe. Probably not. But maybe.

I personally know that I'd rather work a job I love for 10 hours a day than a job I hate for 7 hours a day. If it became 12-14 hour days everyday maybe the arithmetic starts to shift. But one of the advantages to the surgical sub I'm looking at is the potential to have pretty good control over hours as an attending if that's a priority.

 

[efle]

I've met dermatologists who are super burned out and hate their job. Would they like their job more if they had been surgeons? Maybe. Probably not.

100% definitely not. They just hate working. They could just do Mohs if they'd rather work with their hands than talk to patients, make 700k/year and still have fantastic lifestyle. They'd betch about any job, just like you can find people in any career that lament the greener grass over every other fence.

I hope your love of the grind persists for you my man. Society definitely needs more of you and libertyne than me.

 

[username456789]

Fair enough, I suppose I felt I tested out my limits enough in college. Now, I take on all the free time I possibly can while achieving my (reasonable) goals, and would never ever want to return to the former level.

As a Derm resident put it to me today, we've all met the surgeons who didn't realize how much their work would compete with their sources of joy outside the hospital. But we never seem to meet dermies who wish they'd spent the rest of their 20s and early 30s in the hospital to find out what they were made of.

It's a laudable attitude - the modern version of "to live deep and suck out all the marrow of life" I think - but one that has been dispelled from me personally.

I’m a dermatologist.

I busted my ass in school and the hospital in my 20s and 30s so that I could enjoy the rest of my life. Seemed like a much better trade off than just doing “pretty well” in med school and being stuck the rest of my life.

I 100% feel that the long term payoff of securing your field of choice is worth the grind up front. Then again, this is coming from someone whose goal was an extremely competitive but extremely rewarding field.

 

[efle]

I’m a dermatologist.

I busted my ass in school and the hospital in my 20s and 30s so that I could enjoy the rest of my life. Seemed like a much better trade off than just doing “pretty well” in med school and being stuck the rest of my life.

I 100% feel that the long term payoff of securing your field of choice is worth the grind up front. Then again, this is coming from someone whose goal was an extremely competitive but extremely rewarding field.

Derm was the reasonable goal I was mentioning, though I think ultimately I may be picking something else. I'm talking about the people aiming for Barrow Neurosurg who would rather do flashcards than watch TV because they need to feel productive

Derm doesn't spend their life in the hospital to nearly the degree that those people do

 

[libertyyne]

Derm was the reasonable goal I was mentioning, though I think ultimately I may be picking something else. I'm talking about the people aiming for Barrow Neurosurg who would rather do flashcards than watch TV because they need to feel productive

I think that is insane. Because you need to watch a little tv to decompress to retain the stupid flashcards. Got to keep the monkey in your head happy as well.

 

[ooh a bean]

Derm was the reasonable goal I was mentioning, though I think ultimately I may be picking something else. I'm talking about the people aiming for Barrow Neurosurg who would rather do flashcards than watch TV because they need to feel productive

I have a friend who's literally like this. He's at a top 20 school shooting for (Barrows + whatever top 5 ns program) neurosurgery, and he tells me he actually feels lost when he's not doing work. He also apparently set the record at our undergrad for most TA positions held during college, with something like 11 courses.

 

[libertyyne]

I have a friend who's literally like this. He's at a top 20 school shooting for (Barrows + whatever top 5 ns program) neurosurgery, and he tells me he actually feels lost when he's not doing work. He also apparently set the record at our undergrad for most TA positions held during college, with something like 11 courses.

I knew a guy like this. He was spending 50 hours a week in anatomy lab, working multiple research projects. Dude was always working going into neurosurgery. Dude couldn't pass cbse at the end of the day and had to take a year off. So this attitude is present on both ends of the spectrum.

 

[ooh a bean]

I knew a guy like this. He was spending 50 hours a week in anatomy lab, working multiple research projects. Dude was always working going into neurosurgery. Dude couldn't pass cbse at the end of the day and had to take a year off. So this attitude is present on both ends of the spectrum.

people like this kill me

It's like those gyms bros who do all upper body lifts and end up with chicken legs

 

[cupcake81]

Hi guys, I am an incoming M1 and I am interested in matching into Derm. Could anyone give some advice about what I can do over the next few years in order to ensure I am competitive for Derm residency. With STEP being P/F and my classes also being P/F, I am worried about ways to differentiate myself other than research. Could someone please tell me what they would do in this predicament? I want to make sure I cross all my T's and dot all my I's so that I am not disappointed in 3 years. Thanks

 

[efle]

Hi guys, I am an incoming M1 and I am interested in matching into Derm. Could anyone give some advice about what I can do over the next few years in order to ensure I am competitive for Derm residency. With STEP being P/F and my classes also being P/F, I am worried about ways to differentiate myself other than research. Could someone please tell me what they would do in this predicament? I want to make sure I cross all my T's and dot all my I's so that I am not disappointed in 3 years. Thanks

It's all the same stuff as before just without Step 1. So class rank (if applicable), clerkship Honors and AOA (if applicable), productive research, do a Derm elective where they like you, do Derm aways if you have specific targets, get strong letters, and interview well. There's no secret recipe

 

[yellowbluegreen]

Hey Guys, DO student here.

I was wondering if you guys could give me some advice in regards to my chances in Derm. I currently have no LOR related to Derm, so I need to get on it ASAP if it's worth giving it a try.

Step 1: 244
Step 2: 256
Research: 11 publications but not really derm orientated and 6 Poster presentations (more IM related)

Thank you in advance!

 

[collegestud2013]

Hey Guys, DO student here.

I was wondering if you guys could give me some advice in regards to my chances in Derm. I currently have no LOR related to Derm, so I need to get on it ASAP if it's worth giving it a try.

Step 1: 244
Step 2: 256
Research: 11 publications but not really derm orientated and 6 Poster presentations (more IM related)

Thank you in advance!

Derm has gotten slightly less competitive in the last year or so due to the expansion of residency positions, and may be less competitive this upcoming cycle given the poor job market due to COVID (derm, as an outpatient heavy and elective procedure-heavy specialty was one of the hardest hit specialties due to COVID and will probably continue to be the case for the foreseeable future. However, there' still a lot more applicants than spots. So it looks like a long shot given that you're a D.O. and no derm-related research (11 pubs and 6 posters is a lot but they like to see something derm related), even if you are able to get a strong derm LOR. Your Step scores are slightly below average. If you're able to get the LOR you could double apply to derm and a backup specialty that you would still be happy with, which sounds like Categorical IM in your case. Remember that if you double apply, you would need to go on interviews in 3 different types of programs: for Derm, prelim IM (or prelim Surgery or TY), and categorical IM.

 

[yellowbluegreen]

Derm has gotten slightly less competitive in the last year or so due to the expansion of residency positions, and may be less competitive this upcoming cycle given the poor job market due to COVID (derm, as an outpatient heavy and elective procedure-heavy specialty was one of the hardest hit specialties due to COVID and will probably continue to be the case for the foreseeable future. However, there' still a lot more applicants than spots. So it looks like a long shot given that you're a D.O. and no derm-related research (11 pubs and 6 posters is a lot but they like to see something derm related), even if you are able to get a strong derm LOR. Your Step scores are slightly below average. If you're able to get the LOR you could double apply to derm and a backup specialty that you would still be happy with, which sounds like Categorical IM in your case. Remember that if you double apply, you would need to go on interviews in 3 different types of programs: for Derm, prelim IM (or prelim Surgery or TY), and categorical IM.

Ahh I did not even think about the three different interviews! Ya I know my chances of Derm are slim but I thought worth a try maybe. Thank you for the detailed response! I really appreciate it!

 

[PhillyMed777]

and may be less competitive this upcoming cycle given the poor job market due to COVID

Not sure where you are getting this from
The people applying this cycle have been preparing for the application since last year. The majority of who will match have done a research year last year as well.

 

[slowthai]

Not sure where you are getting this from
The people applying this cycle have been preparing for the application since last year. The majority of who will match have done a research year last year as well.

Do you know the ballpark for the percentage of people that do a research year?

 

[PhillyMed777]

Do you know the ballpark for the percentage of people that do a research year?

Yes
Of those who match over 50 percent have done a research year

 

[slowthai]

Yes
Of those who match over 50 percent have done a research year

Dang, it's getting crazy out here, lol. Even neurosurg doesn't have that many doing research years (30%). But I'm not surprised, it's derm.

 

[davidxavi]

Yes
Of those who match over 50 percent have done a research year

Where did you find this number?