Disadvantaged Students

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BrittHoch1

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Hello,
I was curious as to why medical schools want to know whether you are disadvantaged or not. Does this increase your chances into medical school, or is there some sort of financial aid involved? I'm just curious on what the point is of them knowing that information. Thanks in advance for the responses!
 
BrittHoch1 said:
Hello,
I was curious as to why medical schools want to know whether you are disadvantaged or not. Does this increase your chances into medical school, or is there some sort of financial aid involved? I'm just curious on what the point is of them knowing that information. Thanks in advance for the responses!
Click to expand...
It might cast light on your GPA, inability to find many EC's during school due to work obligations, statements etc. Idk, I think it's just one more piece of the puzzle the adcoms need to know who you are.
 
They're trying to build a diverse class that has both diverse backgrounds and diverse interests so them understanding as many dimensions of you as they can would be conducive to that. Financial aid is calculated separately and they generally calculate that based on your parents' tax information.
 
freak7 said:
It might cast light on your GPA, inability to find many EC's during school due to work obligations, statements etc. Idk, I think it's just one more piece of the puzzle the adcoms need to know who you are.
Click to expand...

I was reading from other forums that they usually take your situation, whatever it may be, until you were 18 years old. Are you able to go a little beyond that? There was quite a bit from 9 years of age until well after 18, so I'm just curious. To sum it up as short as I can, I can just say what comes to mind. My dad got ALS when I was 9 years old, died when I was 12, I'm the oldest siblings, and definitely had to pick up a lot of slack when he got sick. We were on Medicaid and food stamps while my mom tried to work any part time job she could for us. My dad had his GED while my mom had her high school diploma. My teen years were a little rough because I feel like my mom fell apart a couple years after my dad died. She became an alcoholic for a few years. I started working at 14 years of age to help with whatever I could. Even with all of this, I still got my academic honors diploma. My mom got sick when I was 18 years old, and to make a long story short, she died when I was 20 years old. I got pregnant at 19, was a single mother, and she died shortly after my son was born. She was pretty much my only resource until I met my husband. The only reason why I'm doing ok now is because of my husband. I truly don't know where I would be without him. We do have 2 other kids. I also was diagnosed with Crohn's maybe a year after my mom died and spent years in agony, but I have been doing ok since my bowel resection surgery a few years ago. Currently, I'm 29 years old, so how much information would they actually need from my parents? Even if they didn't die, would they actually need any information from them at all? And if they are wanting information, what happens if they are both deceased? Sorry for my long message! I definitely do not want to come across as "Oh, look at me" because even though I have been through a lot, I still have it so much better than others. I'm truly grateful for my life right now. I'm just curious on how to present this, and whether I'm supposed to provide any information regarding my parents.
 
aldol16 said:
They're trying to build a diverse class that has both diverse backgrounds and diverse interests so them understanding as many dimensions of you as they can would be conducive to that. Financial aid is calculated separately and they generally calculate that based on your parents' tax information.
Click to expand...

If you use the word diverse...one more time....
 
sullen-burger said:
If you use the word diverse...one more time....
Click to expand...
Diverse. Diverse. Diverse. Diverse. Diverse. Diverse. Diverse. Diverse. Diverse. Diverse. Diverse. Diverse. Diverse. Diverse. Diverse. Diverse. Diverse. Diverse. Diverse. Diverse. Diverse. Diverse. Diverse. Diverse. Diverse. Diverse. Diverse. Diverse. Diverse. Diverse. Diverse. Diverse. Diverse. Diverse. Diverse. Diverse. Diverse. Diverse. Diverse. Diverse. Diverse. Diverse. Diverse. Diverse. Diverse.
 
BrittHoch1 said:
So, they basically just want to know you as a "whole"? And to piece your academic career and whatever else together?
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I will probably have a 3.5 cgpa when it's all said and done. Sgpa might be a little higher, but that would be nice if they considered my life experiences like that. And to be honest, my parents passing from illnesses and me having what I have is what makes me want to be a doctor. If anything good can come out of this, it's that I can help others.
 
sullen-burger said:
If you use the word diverse...one more time....
Click to expand...
73747958.jpg
 
BrittHoch1 said:
I was reading from other forums that they usually take your situation, whatever it may be, until you were 18 years old. Are you able to go a little beyond that? There was quite a bit from 9 years of age until well after 18, so I'm just curious. To sum it up as short as I can, I can just say what comes to mind. My dad got ALS when I was 9 years old, died when I was 12, I'm the oldest siblings, and definitely had to pick up a lot of slack when he got sick. We were on Medicaid and food stamps while my mom tried to work any part time job she could for us. My dad had his GED while my mom had her high school diploma. My teen years were a little rough because I feel like my mom fell apart a couple years after my dad died. She became an alcoholic for a few years. I started working at 14 years of age to help with whatever I could. Even with all of this, I still got my academic honors diploma. My mom got sick when I was 18 years old, and to make a long story short, she died when I was 20 years old. I got pregnant at 19, was a single mother, and she died shortly after my son was born. She was pretty much my only resource until I met my husband. The only reason why I'm doing ok now is because of my husband. I truly don't know where I would be without him. We do have 2 other kids. I also was diagnosed with Crohn's maybe a year after my mom died and spent years in agony, but I have been doing ok since my bowel resection surgery a few years ago. Currently, I'm 29 years old, so how much information would they actually need from my parents? Even if they didn't die, would they actually need any information from them at all? And if they are wanting information, what happens if they are both deceased? Sorry for my long message! I definitely do not want to come across as "Oh, look at me" because even though I have been through a lot, I still have it so much better than others. I'm truly grateful for my life right now. I'm just curious on how to present this, and whether I'm supposed to provide any information regarding my parents.
Click to expand...
Pretty open and shut disadvantaged
 
BrittHoch1 said:
I will probably have a 3.5 cgpa when it's all said and done. Sgpa might be a little higher, but that would be nice if they considered my life experiences like that. And to be honest, my parents passing from illnesses and me having what I have is what makes me want to be a doctor. If anything good can come out of this, it's that I can help others.
Click to expand...
first part will make sense in the context of your underprivileged statement. Second part is great PS fodder
 
BrittHoch1 said:
So, they basically just want to know you as a "whole"? And to piece your academic career and whatever else together?
Click to expand...
Yes for example. A kid with 4.0 GPA whose parents are both doctors, received private tutoring, went to elite high school and college, no need to work while studying vs. a kid with 4.0 GPA with your story.
 
BrittHoch1 said:
I was reading from other forums that they usually take your situation, whatever it may be, until you were 18 years old. Are you able to go a little beyond that? There was quite a bit from 9 years of age until well after 18, so I'm just curious. To sum it up as short as I can, I can just say what comes to mind. My dad got ALS when I was 9 years old, died when I was 12, I'm the oldest siblings, and definitely had to pick up a lot of slack when he got sick. We were on Medicaid and food stamps while my mom tried to work any part time job she could for us. My dad had his GED while my mom had her high school diploma. My teen years were a little rough because I feel like my mom fell apart a couple years after my dad died. She became an alcoholic for a few years. I started working at 14 years of age to help with whatever I could. Even with all of this, I still got my academic honors diploma. My mom got sick when I was 18 years old, and to make a long story short, she died when I was 20 years old. I got pregnant at 19, was a single mother, and she died shortly after my son was born. She was pretty much my only resource until I met my husband. The only reason why I'm doing ok now is because of my husband. I truly don't know where I would be without him. We do have 2 other kids. I also was diagnosed with Crohn's maybe a year after my mom died and spent years in agony, but I have been doing ok since my bowel resection surgery a few years ago. Currently, I'm 29 years old, so how much information would they actually need from my parents? Even if they didn't die, would they actually need any information from them at all? And if they are wanting information, what happens if they are both deceased? Sorry for my long message! I definitely do not want to come across as "Oh, look at me" because even though I have been through a lot, I still have it so much better than others. I'm truly grateful for my life right now. I'm just curious on how to present this, and whether I'm supposed to provide any information regarding my parents.
Click to expand...

Here's what you are asked to share on the application:
Your parents names, whether they are still alive (Y/N), if alive the county in which they live, their highest level of education achieved, where that education was received, and their profession/occupation. There are some blue collar as well as white collar occupations to choose from. Based on this, the AAMC will classify the family in which you grew up by socioeconomic status (SES) based on education and employment. Because your parents didn't attend college, you would be classified in the lowest SES even if you don't check the "disadvantaged" box. IIRC, all students may answer the questions about growing up, it used to be only those who checked the disadvantaged box could do so. Some of the questions are whether you received government aid (like Medicaid, free school lunch, etc), if you worked before age 18, etc. There is also a place on the application (but it isn't very noticeable, IMHO) about the number of dependents you have. Of course, your birth date is on the application so how old you are will be somewhat obvious.

Most schools require some information from parents if a student is going to get any need-based aid but if your parents are deceased, getting info from them is a moot point.
 
Last edited:
BrittHoch1 said:
Hello,
I was curious as to why medical schools want to know whether you are disadvantaged or not. Does this increase your chances into medical school, or is there some sort of financial aid involved? I'm just curious on what the point is of them knowing that information. Thanks in advance for the responses!
Click to expand...
Lower ses students are also underrepresented in medical school. And are more likely to not complete medical school. Also they may not have access to stuff that money buys like prep courses and such.
 
libertyyne said:
Lower ses students are also underrepresented in medical school. And are more likely to not complete medical school. Also they may not have access to stuff that money buys like prep courses and such.
Click to expand...

I noticed this while reading about the SES disadvantaged status earlier in the cycle. I did not indicate that I considered myself SES disadvantaged, but was categorized as such by AMCAS because neither of my parents completed college. From what I was reading, it was unclear whether schools considered this a desirable (underrepresented) or undesirable (less likely to complete medical school) thing though, and I was somewhat uncomfortable with having that label applied to me.
 
Cauchy1 said:
I noticed this while reading about the SES disadvantaged status earlier in the cycle. I did not indicate that I considered myself SES disadvantaged, but was categorized as such by AMCAS because neither of my parents completed college. From what I was reading, it was unclear whether schools considered this a desirable (underrepresented) or undesirable (less likely to complete medical school) thing though, and I was somewhat uncomfortable with having that label applied to me.
Click to expand...

Hello,
I understand what you mean. That was somewhat why I asked the question. It somewhat makes me uncomfortable to be classified as that, even though I don't consider myself disadvantaged now. My husband is an engineer, and we live a comfortable life, but it sounds like I'm still considered disadvantaged based from my childhood. I guess this is something I might want to talk to an advisor about. I mean, I don't have a problem talking to anyone about my life if they want to know about it, but I certainly don't want to say, "Oh, look at everything I have been through." And to be honest, some of what I went through has shaped me into why I want to be a doctor now, such as both of my parents dying from illnesses before I was 20 years old, me going through severe illness myself, and some other personal situations, but I don't want to use my situation as trying to get something out of it by being classified as disadvantaged. I feel like there should be a way to present this in a way that I would like. Hopefully an advisor would have some good advice.
 
BrittHoch1 said:
Hello,
I understand what you mean. That was somewhat why I asked the question. It somewhat makes me uncomfortable to be classified as that, even though I don't consider myself disadvantaged now. My husband is an engineer, and we live a comfortable life, but it sounds like I'm still considered disadvantaged based from my childhood. I guess this is something I might want to talk to an advisor about. I mean, I don't have a problem talking to anyone about my life if they want to know about it, but I certainly don't want to say, "Oh, look at everything I have been through." And to be honest, some of what I went through has shaped me into why I want to be a doctor now, such as both of my parents dying from illnesses before I was 20 years old, me going through severe illness myself, and some other personal situations, but I don't want to use my situation as trying to get something out of it by being classified as disadvantaged. I feel like there should be a way to present this in a way that I would like. Hopefully an advisor would have some good advice.
Click to expand...

Regardless of where you are now, how you grew up did form you as a person and that is important. I've seen a very successful application from a non-traditional applicant who was born to a teen mom and raised by grandparents and who enlisted in the military right out of HS. At the time he applied at ~30 years of age he was making 100K/yr but that didn't negate his childhood experience and how that would play into how he would related to patients who come from a similar community.
 
LizzyM said:
Regardless of where you are now, how you grew up did form you as a person and that is important. I've seen a very successful application from a non-traditional applicant who was born to a teen mom and raised by grandparents and who enlisted in the military right out of HS. At the time he applied at ~30 years of age he was making 100K/yr but that didn't negate his childhood experience and how that would play into how he would related to patients who come from a similar community.
Click to expand...

That's a very good point! And it did shape me into who I am. Even when it comes to addictions, I want to somehow help these people. My mom became an alcoholic and pill popper after my dad died (she was still a great mom when she wasn't trashed, things were just bad when she wasn't sober), and I can see first hand how hard it is for families, the addict themselves, and how this really is a disease. She eventually developed secondary pulmonary hypertension and died when I was 20. The doctor believed it was her lifestyle that quickly spiraled her health out of control. But anyway, I know that not every addict wants to be an addict. These people don't want to be this way, they are probably really great people when they are sober (just like my mom was), and we really should treat this as a disease. I don't know how I would help these addicts and their families, but I'm sure I can find a way. Having various interests makes it hard to pinpoint what I plan to specialize in, but I'm sure I will have a better idea later. But you are right when you say that our lives shape us into who we are today.
 
I am sincerely sorry to hear about how tough you had it and how much was thrown at you at such a young age. Yes, you'll be labeled "disadvantaged" solely due to your parents' educations. They tend to look at parents with more advanced educations as better able to provide more opportunities for their kids (because they have a more intimate knowledge of college systems? Idk. Plenty of people without bachelor's degrees become very successful people). Also, by virtue of receiving public assistance, you fall into that category too. You were a child and couldn't help your circumstances. Would I say you had a disadvantaged childhood? Yes. It is nothing to be ashamed of or you need to worry about as far as "labeling". Kids of doctors absolutely have it easier as far as applying to med school is concerned. Why? Can they afford mcat prep classes, have their parents pay for school, an easier time networking for shadowing? Yes.

Basically, I wouldn't look at being labeled disadvantaged with a stigma. It is part of who you are and where you came from. It is your story. What you went through is terrible, but you overcame so much and should be proud of yourself. You'll have plenty to talk about in secondaries as well!

Best of luck to you 🙂
(Coming from another disadvantaged applicant and child of alcoholics who successfully got into med school).
 
I wouldn't be surprised if they used it to filter people out, or at least had a quota limitation for financial/fit reasons. One applicant with an extremely poor LizzyM score who posted here mentioned how he listed his under-18 parental incomes as poverty level, but mentioned in "additional information" that his parents now had 7-figure incomes. Stanford, etc didn't mind his 50/60 lizzym.

Perhaps lizzymV2 should include parental income?
 
Nommonnom said:
I wouldn't be surprised if they used it to filter people out, or at least had a quota limitation for financial/fit reasons. One applicant with an extremely poor LizzyM score who posted here mentioned how he listed his under-18 parental incomes as poverty level, but mentioned in "additional information" that his parents now had 7-figure incomes. Stanford, etc didn't mind his 50/60 lizzym.

Perhaps lizzymV2 should include parental income?
Click to expand...
No. Its irrelevant. If someone is rich, they can pay. If someone is poor, they can take out loans. The only people who are iffy financially are international students who are ineligible for federal aid.
 
ciestar said:
I am sincerely sorry to hear about how tough you had it and how much was thrown at you at such a young age. Yes, you'll be labeled "disadvantaged" solely due to your parents' educations. They tend to look at parents with more advanced educations as better able to provide more opportunities for their kids (because they have a more intimate knowledge of college systems? Idk. Plenty of people without bachelor's degrees become very successful people). Also, by virtue of receiving public assistance, you fall into that category too. You were a child and couldn't help your circumstances. Would I say you had a disadvantaged childhood? Yes. It is nothing to be ashamed of or you need to worry about as far as "labeling". Kids of doctors absolutely have it easier as far as applying to med school is concerned. Why? Can they afford mcat prep classes, have their parents pay for school, an easier time networking for shadowing? Yes.

Basically, I wouldn't look at being labeled disadvantaged with a stigma. It is part of who you are and where you came from. It is your story. What you went through is terrible, but you overcame so much and should be proud of yourself. You'll have plenty to talk about in secondaries as well!

Best of luck to you 🙂
(Coming from another disadvantaged applicant and child of alcoholics who successfully got into med school).
Click to expand...

Hi ciestar,

Thank you for your words of encouragement. I do want to make it clear that I consider myself to be in a good position in life. My husband is an engineer, makes a good income, and we have 3 healthy kids. My life has made me who I am, you are right, but I just hope I can present it in a way that doesn't look like I'm trying to get pity. Nor do I necessarily want to be treated differently. And to be honest, I was afraid of having a negative label. I don't want it to be something where they think I'm emotionally and mentally unstable. Obviously my parents couldn't do much for me, but I have able to figure things out on my own, gotten through it, and I have a very supportive husband. So you were also considered a disadvantaged student? How are they when you talk about your story? Like I said, I'm fine with talking to anyone who wants to know. I'm not the type of person to just tell anyone what happened, but I'm open to discussion if anyone has questions if that makes any sense.
 
BrittHoch1 said:
Hi ciestar,

Thank you for your words of encouragement. I do want to make it clear that I consider myself to be in a good position in life. My husband is an engineer, makes a good income, and we have 3 healthy kids. My life has made me who I am, you are right, but I just hope I can present it in a way that doesn't look like I'm trying to get pity. Nor do I necessarily want to be treated differently. And to be honest, I was afraid of having a negative label. I don't want it to be something where they think I'm emotionally and mentally unstable. Obviously my parents couldn't do much for me, but I have able to figure things out on my own, gotten through it, and I have a very supportive husband. So you were also considered a disadvantaged student? How are they when you talk about your story? Like I said, I'm fine with talking to anyone who wants to know. I'm not the type of person to just tell anyone what happened, but I'm open to discussion if anyone has questions if that makes any sense.
Click to expand...

I am the same way. While I am not a mother, my husband does have a good income and my life is radically different than it was when I graduated high school. You can definitely present in a way that you're not looking for pity based on your own accomplishments. It just shows your capabilities and you don't use your past as a crutch to explain any shortcomings in your life. I honestly think the pity factor thing comes into play when people try to use it to gain a leg up on other applicants or explain away their flaws, such as a bad GPA.

Honestly, I think my story landed me an interview last year. The adcom I interviewed with thought it was inspiring and that I overcame a lot to get where I am now. They do find it impressive, as not everyone can take hurdles and overcome them cleanly. Your mom is an example, unfortunately. Your mom's grief was just too much for her, but you used it as almost a spark to get through it. Now look at you! Many of my essays on overcoming obstacles or resiliency were written highlighting what I did overcome. I never once asked for pity and just showed, despite it all, I can take a lot and still accomplish what I set out to.
 
ciestar said:
I am the same way. While I am not a mother, my husband does have a good income and my life is radically different than it was when I graduated high school. You can definitely present in a way that you're not looking for pity based on your own accomplishments. It just shows your capabilities and you don't use your past as a crutch to explain any shortcomings in your life. I honestly think the pity factor thing comes into play when people try to use it to gain a leg up on other applicants or explain away their flaws, such as a bad GPA.

Honestly, I think my story landed me an interview last year. The adcom I interviewed with thought it was inspiring and that I overcame a lot to get where I am now. They do find it impressive, as not everyone can take hurdles and overcome them cleanly. Your mom is an example, unfortunately. Your mom's grief was just too much for her, but you used it as almost a spark to get through it. Now look at you! Many of my essays on overcoming obstacles or resiliency were written highlighting what I did overcome. I never once asked for pity and just showed, despite it all, I can take a lot and still accomplish what I set out to.
Click to expand...

That is awesome of you! Congratulations with getting into medical school. Are you in your first year of medical school? May I ask what school you attend to? I'm hoping to get into IU School of Medicine at the South Bend campus.
 
libertyyne said:
Lower ses students are also underrepresented in medical school. And are more likely to not complete medical school. Also they may not have access to stuff that money buys like prep courses and such.
Click to expand...
So you are saying that there is a significant difference in attrition rates for low SES students compared to their mid to high SES peers, at American (non-Caribbean) medical schools? Sources please.
 
BrittHoch1 said:
That is awesome of you! Congratulations with getting into medical school. Are you in your first year of medical school? May I ask what school you attend to? I'm hoping to get into IU School of Medicine at the South Bend campus.
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Thanks! I am a first year at Drexel!
 
libertyyne said:
https://www.aamc.org/download/165418/data/aibvol9_no11.pdf.pdf
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Thank you very much.
The overall attrition rate for low SES students is 2.1%, whereas the attrition rates for middle and high SES students are 1.4 and 1.3, respectively. I am not disagreeing with anything here, I just really want to point out the the difference is not so drastic that low SES students should be concerned about potentially labeling themselves as "damaged and high risk goods" if they disclosed their SES level on their application.
 
climbergirl838 said:
Thank you very much.
The overall attrition rate for low SES students is 2.1%, whereas the attrition rates for middle and high SES students are 1.4 and 1.3, respectively. I am not disagreeing with anything here, I just really want to point out the the difference is not so drastic that low SES students should be concerned about potentially labeling themselves as "damaged and high risk goods" if they disclosed their SES level on their application.
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I cant find it now but there is newer research that indicates higher attrition rates in lower SES groups. I myself am low SES, and knowing my life circumstances does give me a window into the plethora of issues that could pop up to hasten my dropping out. One just has to be mindful of not becoming a statistic and fend off / avoid anything that might cause a withdrawl, and keep an eye on studying hard to catch up. The overrall rate of dropping out is 1.5X compared to higher SES groups that is not insignificant.
 
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