Do Doobs give you Boobs?

[frikarika]

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Hear me out here. We had a lecture the other day by one of our pediatric endocrinologist, he mostly discussed growth hormone, prolactin, yada yada yada. Well, I wasn't really paying attention, but then he asked something like "What is the number one cause of increased breast size in adolescent boys?" Well my first guess was eating too much junk food and playing Xbox 12 hrs a day...but to my surprise he said "Chronic marijuana use." Has anyone else heard of this? I did a quick pubmed search for "Gynecomastia from cannabis use" and nothing really supported what he said. I have heard that THC is structurally similar to estrogen and has some affnity for estrogen receptors..perhaps that is the mechanism?

Anyway I thought it was interesting.

 

[masterofmonkeys]

genistein/diadzien in soy, and various commonplace chemoestrogens are probably much much bigger factors in etiology than marijuana.

I've heard the marijuana-moobs myth before. Never seen much evidence offered though.

 

[iMD]

id like to see the proof on that. maybe youd get moobs from eating too much but i dont think actual gyno

 

[Law2Doc]

...

I've heard the marijuana-moobs myth before. Never seen much evidence offered though.

Gynecomastia is a well known and actually well documented side effect of MJ. On pubmed you will see it was described in the NEJM back in 1972, and echoed in a number of other publications since then. However more recent studies have questioned this. See eg http://www.annals.org/cgi/content/full/119/3/253 .

There is still no compelling definitive research on it, but certainly a great deal of anecdotal evidence of folks who are major chronic users (pun intended) who have gynecomastia. A lot of med students can probably tell you they've seen pretty convincing evidence on the wards among drug using patients.

 

[WellWornLad]

Did he also tell about the number one cause of hairy palms?

 

[Droopy Snoopy]

Gynecomastia is a well known and actually well documented side effect of MJ. On pubmed you will see it was described in the NEJM back in 1972, and echoed in a number of other publications since then. However more recent studies have questioned this. See eg http://www.annals.org/cgi/content/full/119/3/253 .

There is still no compelling definitive research on it, but certainly a great deal of anecdotal evidence of folks who are major chronic users (pun intended) who have gynecomastia. A lot of med students can probably tell you they've seen pretty convincing evidence on the wards among drug using patients.

👍 Also weak but consistent evidence for decreased sperm counts. BTW just like to say that's a great thread title.

 

[badasshairday]

Anecdotal: In high school, I had a friend who smoked in incredible amount of MJ. He had started smoking in 6th grade, by the time we were sophmores in high school 15 y/o), he smoked a several times a day and I remember him telling me his nipple was tender. I was like WTF, go see the doctor! Keep in mind though that he was smoking a ridiculous amount of cannabis.

 

[Boges]

Anecdotal: In high school, I had a friend who smoked in incredible amount of MJ. He had started smoking in 6th grade, by the time we were sophmores in high school 15 y/o), he smoked a several times a day and I remember him telling me his nipple was tender. I was like WTF, go see the doctor! Keep in mind though that he was smoking a ridiculous amount of cannabis.

Hahaha...well there you go.

 

[durty]

I remember him telling me his nipple was tender.

This is a not too infrequent side effect of puberty, some males develop nodes under the nipples that go away with time...possibly the cannabis was delaying his growth cycles.
-durty

 

[Slack3r]

Chronic anti-histamine use can also give puffy nips.

 

[Forthegood]

That's it, I'm baking happy brownies before my gf gets here...

 

[iMD]

since we seem to be sharing anecdotal stories:

i vaporize marijuana every single day and go through about a quarter of an ounce per week, for a full year (that's a lot, relatively, for those that arent familiar with how much that is). im fully functional, workout regularly, and do not have gyno. just one man's experience though.

though the difference between being fat and having gyno can range from being subtle to obvious, of all the marijuana users i have met, i've never seen anyone with gyno.

 

[badasshairday]

since we seem to be sharing anecdotal stories:

i vaporize marijuana every single day and go through about a quarter of an ounce per week, for a full year (that's a lot, relatively, for those that arent familiar with how much that is). im fully functional, workout regularly, and do not have gyno. just one man's experience though.

though the difference between being fat and having gyno can range from being subtle to obvious, of all the marijuana users i have met, i've never seen anyone with gyno.

Are you an adolescent boy?

 

[iMD]

Are you an adolescent boy?

sorry, i think that whole "full year thing" implies that ive only been doing this recently. didnt mean it that way 🙂 i was an adolescent boy, same results.

 

[Law2Doc]

since we seem to be sharing anecdotal stories:

i vaporize marijuana every single day and go through about a quarter of an ounce per week, for a full year (that's a lot, relatively, for those that arent familiar with how much that is). im fully functional, workout regularly, and do not have gyno. just one man's experience though.
...

You are apparently so stoned all the time you don't even realize you now have D cups.

And FWIW, the folks who are stoned every day are frequently not as "fully functional" as they THINK they are. Sort of like when you think you are an amazing philosopher or poet while stoned, and write the stuff down, only to read it the next day.

 

[iMD]

You are apparently so stoned all the time you don't even realize you now have D cups.

And FWIW, the folks who are stoned every day are frequently not as "fully functional" as they THINK they are. Sort of like when you think you are an amazing philosopher or poet while stoned, and write the stuff down, only to read it the next day.

umm. i throw up big numbers on the bench press, so ill take that d-cup comment as a compliment. and youre right, fully functional probably isnt the correct term. functional enough to receive high marks, do well on the mcat, etc etc. i plan on quitting for medical school though so i have to have a bit of fun while i still can.

 

[TMP-SMX]

Good luck quitting. I know some med students who use it to reduce stress.

 

[iMD]

thanks, i quit cigarettes and have been clean for a long while now.

anyway, how many of your classmates use marijuana or coke? maybe it's because i hang out with a specific group of medical students but hot damn do a lot of them use. ask them if they used it in their adolescent years and see if they suffered from gyno 😀 id rather listen to first hand experience than rely on a study that weakly associates it (though i havent read it so im a bit ignorant on that)

 

[Sora]

As sort of a corollary, I've heard resveratrol, one of the red wine extracts, acts as a superagonist for estrogen receptors.

 

[badasshairday]

maybe it's because i hang out with a specific group of medical students but hot damn do a lot of them use. ask them if they used it in their adolescent years and see if they suffered from gyno 😀 id rather listen to first hand experience than rely on a study that weakly associates it (though i havent read it so im a bit ignorant on that)

I don't think many people smoked a crap ton during puberty years to get that affect, mostly because they didn't have cash to get the crop. 15 year old's smoking a quarter oz (let alone an 1/8 oz) a week would be rare.

 

[Law2Doc]

thanks, i quit cigarettes and have been clean for a long while now.

anyway, how many of your classmates use marijuana or coke? maybe it's because i hang out with a specific group of medical students but hot damn do a lot of them use. ask them if they used it in their adolescent years and see if they suffered from gyno 😀 id rather listen to first hand experience than rely on a study that weakly associates it (though i havent read it so im a bit ignorant on that)

The number of cocaine users in med school is likely pretty negligible, and likely drops even lower once you get clinical exposure and see some of the damage it can do. MJ probably is used by a handful, but nobody is going to talk about it outside of their small circles, because you have so much at risk -- drug related misdemeanors in med school can make it impossible to get a license. I think a decent number of folks use questionably necessary prescription drugs, based on various threads.

Best to quit pronto and stay far away from anything that can screw up your future. Growing breasts is really the least of your problems if you get caught using on this path. You don't want to toke your way out of a career.

 

[BORNagainSTDENT]

Edit: I have had bad experience with endo's.

 

[Law2Doc]

there are forums full of people with gyno and hormonal problems that can't even get a endocrinologist to draw bloods. I have personally had experience with how unwilling they are to help. Most people end up going to a DO to even get full testing. It's really really common and alot of people end up taking things into their own hands.

I'm not sure if you are saying DO's are last resort physicians or that they are better at dealing with endocrine issues, but either way you are off base and probably trying to start a flame war. DO's learn the same medicine, and the medical standard of care is going to be the same. If there is an indication to draw blood you will have exactly the same likelihood of it being drawn if the doctor is an MD or DO. They often work together in the same groups/hospitals. Let's not turn a thread that has nothing to do with MD vs DO into that kind of thread. 😕

 

[BORNagainSTDENT]

well I'm sorry I was not trying to start a flame war, I would actually delete the last part if it wouldn't show up in the quote any way. Your right I can't expect to have a conversation about it with out people getting personally offended and thinking I am trying to say one philosophy is better than other. I wrote that post poorly and it wasn't clear.
I would like to make it clear that I was not saying DO's are a last resort, I was actually saying something postitive about them. I myself am interested in MD at this point, so don't think I am knocking the MD schools either. I guess this is the wrong thread any way, I have personal frustrations that should be kept in a related forum. please ignore.