DO Match List Thread 2020

[Peach Newport]

IR is def a top 3 most overrated specialty among med students nowadays.

the everyday work of IR blows. the cool tech and so called respect are just a smoke show. That prestige only belongs to NSG or Plastic.

Lol I think you could make the argument that the everyday work of any specialty blows. For example, did you know there are people out there who find laparoscopic cholecystectomies interesting?

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[Epilepsy365]

Lol I think you could make the argument that the everyday work of any specialty blows. For example, did you know there are people out there who find laparoscopic cholecystectomies interesting?

true dat.

I always fell asleep driving that cam bc the room was too dark.

 

[AnatomyGrey12]

For example, did you know there are people out there who find laparoscopic cholecystectomies interesting?

 

[slowthai]

What I also find interesting about IR is that they appear to have less of a bias against DOs than the other most competitive fields. Wonder why that's the case.

 

[Dr.Bruh]

Marian reporting a 95.1% match rate and 100% placement per their website. Nice that they actually delineated between match rate and placement rate.

Some deets from the article: 67% going into PC. 40% staying in Indiana. Top 5 specialties: FM (42), IM(35), Peds(20), EM(17), Anesthesiology (8).
They don't have a specific match list but state 20 matches at St. Vincent and 19 at IUSOM.

 

[Kardio]

What I also find interesting about IR is that they appear to have less of a bias against DOs than the other most competitive fields. Wonder why that's the case.

Because Y90 beads imbued with AT Still’s BDE are shown to be more efficacious than unimbued ones. There was a piece in JAMA on it a few years back.

 

[deleted446889]

Does anyone have info on WVSOM?

 

[WhereMyLiberalsAt]

Marian reporting a 95.1% match rate and 100% placement per their website. Nice that they actually delineated between match rate and placement rate.

Some deets from the article: 67% going into PC. 40% staying in Indiana. Top 5 specialties: FM (42), IM(35), Peds(20), EM(17), Anesthesiology (8).
They don't have a specific match list but state 20 matches at St. Vincent and 19 at IUSOM.

I always forget about them... Indiana that is. That’s a US territory, correct? Won it in the Mexican, American war if I remember correctly.

 

[uglypremed]

Does anyone have info on WVSOM?

Was just about to ask this

 

[solitarius]

I second this.

The competition in psych this year was absolutely brutal - people on the psych forums are reporting a 65% nationwide match rate. Tons of psych hopefuls unmatched with even USMDs with good scores falling to their 10+ rank list position. I sincerely doubt BID, MGH, or B+W were interviewing DOs this year.

More like their 3 - 6+ rank position

 

[harrislakers123]

IR and Plastics are different because traditionally DOs do these as fellowships rather than integrated

 

[Joltheadq]

I can’t believe that FM an IM filled up so fast on SOAP. I’m still without a residency because of flags. The feeing of powerlessness is describable. Very reminiscent of my college graduation following the crash of 08. I have only myself to blame. I just wish there weren’t so many IMGs taking the spots that other wise would take a risk on me. At least I could afford to pay back my debt to my country. How can a domestic students end up like this? I pray for that I might find a spot mid april. An IMG has his/her domestic country to fall back on at least. US residency is all I have. My feelings are hurt. No offense to anyone, it just hurts.


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[zNoodlez]

I can’t believe that FM an IM filled up so fast on SOAP. I’m still without a residency because of flags. The feeing of powerlessness is describable. Very reminiscent of my college graduation following the crash of 08. I have only myself to blame. I just wish there weren’t so many IMGs taking the spots that other wise would take a risk on me. At least I could afford to pay back my debt to my country. How can a domestic students end up like this? I pray for that I might find a spot mid april. An IMG has his/her domestic country to fall back on at least. US residency is all I have. My feelings are hurt. No offense to anyone, it just hurts.


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Are you USMD?

 

[LateNightChef]

No plastics matches this year. There are no AOA programs in plastics. There are a handful of former AOA GS places with plastics fellowships.

On the Plastics match google sheets it says there’s a VCOM match at Cleveland clinic

Kind of both. They're about as anti-DO as it gets. The only other fields I can think of that may be somewhat more biased are ophtho, neurosurg, and CT, but they're the same for all intents and purposes.

You have to think about the fact that there's only ~180 spots. That's one of the fewest number of spots in all specialties. Plus consider the fact that the average applicant is a baller from a US MD. I imagine the only way you'll win out is if your daddy is the PD, you just absolutely won the hearts and minds of everyone on your aways, or you did multiple research years.

this is true. 3rd year DO student here that was attempting to pursue IP until somewhat recently. All the DO integrated residentsI talked to did a research year or initially went into GS then transferred to an open spot. I applied to about every plastics research year there was and got denied, so definitely think IP (depending which program) are pretty biased against DOs, although you’re right that the high caliber students and limited spots makes it difficult

 

[Epilepsy365]

I can’t believe that FM an IM filled up so fast on SOAP. I’m still without a residency because of flags. The feeing of powerlessness is describable. Very reminiscent of my college graduation following the crash of 08. I have only myself to blame. I just wish there weren’t so many IMGs taking the spots that other wise would take a risk on me. At least I could afford to pay back my debt to my country. How can a domestic students end up like this? I pray for that I might find a spot mid april. An IMG has his/her domestic country to fall back on at least. US residency is all I have. My feelings are hurt. No offense to anyone, it just hurts.

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Been saying it for a while that there's no reason for PDs to take FMG in any residency spots unless they are leftovers after the DO/USMD match.

I really hope that things work out for you. I, too, was a graduate of 2008 and deeply remember the pain and struggle from back then.

You really need to find out programs that are unfilled after SOAP and call them. Best of luck.

 

[AnatomyGrey12]

On the Plastics match google sheets it says there’s a VCOM match at Cleveland clinic

You're right. I was looking at the NRMP data for DO seniors. There was 1 plastics match this year from a DO grad. I'd assume that's the VCOM match.

I'm convinced that matching IP as a DO is honestly more about luck than anything. Our plastics match didn't do a research year, only had 1 pub unrelated to plastics, and 230's Step 1.

 

[LateNightChef]

You're right. I was looking at the NRMP data for DO seniors. There was 1 plastics match this year from a DO grad. I'd assume that's the VCOM match.

I'm convinced that matching IP as a DO is honestly more about luck than anything. Our plastics match didn't do a research year, only had 1 pub unrelated to plastics, and 230's Step 1.

Damn that's what my app looks like atm lol. They probably killed their away, but just personally not willing to risk not matching when I can see myself doing another specialty

 

[slowthai]

Damn that's what my app looks like atm lol. They probably killed their away, but just personally not willing to risk not matching when I can see myself doing another specialty

So I assume you wouldn't be willing to take the GS route, like at all?

 

[LateNightChef]

So I assume you wouldn't be willing to take the GS route, like at all?

I used to be opposed to it, but I would now that I had my actual gen surg rotation. I'd still rather do a different surgical subspecialty (still competitive but more feasible than integrated plastics)

 

[BorntobeDO?]

I wonder what the salary is like for a PGY-14...

Well at least he should get PSLF

 

[BorntobeDO?]

yes
View attachment 299504

Wow, thats really good.

 

[BorntobeDO?]

One of the reasons why IMGs and FMGs keep getting higher and higher match rate is because their numbers of applicants also keep decreasing. 5K out of 10K is 50%, but 5K out of 8K is 62%.

Edit: It will probably start decreasing once the bottleneck occurs with the increasing number of US applicants.

The amount of matched MD's decreased slightly also. Very interesting. DO's and IMG's increased at MD expense. Thats probably not gonna happen again, but I am glad for 2020 that it did.

 

[BorntobeDO?]

MGH, BWH, BID? An incredible match, regardless.

Probably South Shore

 

[BorntobeDO?]

Was it brutal for top tier or all residencies? I saw 6-7 of my class match in psychiatry.

All, my class went from 12 psych last year to like 6 this year. Psych may be the new derm after all.

 

[BorntobeDO?]

I can’t believe that FM an IM filled up so fast on SOAP. I’m still without a residency because of flags. The feeing of powerlessness is describable. Very reminiscent of my college graduation following the crash of 08. I have only myself to blame. I just wish there weren’t so many IMGs taking the spots that other wise would take a risk on me. At least I could afford to pay back my debt to my country. How can a domestic students end up like this? I pray for that I might find a spot mid april. An IMG has his/her domestic country to fall back on at least. US residency is all I have. My feelings are hurt. No offense to anyone, it just hurts.


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Sorry man, I would look into HCA programs, they probably have some spots left.

 

[Dr.Bruh]

A key note about this data is that the raw number of DOs that went unmatched this year (613) is less than the previous 2 years despite there being an increase of 2,000 DO applicants (653 in 2019 with 1000 less applicant and 645 in 2018 with 2000 less applicants).

 

[DrStephenStrange]

A key note about this data is that the raw number of DOs that went unmatched this year (613) is less than the previous 2 years despite there being an increase of 2,000 DO applicants (653 in 2019 with 1000 less applicant and 645 in 2018 with 2000 less applicants).

Do these numbers take into account the AOA match?

 

[BorntobeDO?]

A key note about this data is that the raw number of DOs that went unmatched this year (613) is less than the previous 2 years despite there being an increase of 2,000 DO applicants (653 in 2019 with 1000 less applicant and 645 in 2018 with 2000 less applicants).

The number that went unmatched after SOAP is the one I care about. But that is encouraging, I agree. This was a fantastic match for 2020 overall.

 

[BorntobeDO?]

Do these numbers take into account the AOA match?

It doesn't, but it doesn't matter for the comparison he made, the change was a good one.

 

[RowanNora]

Anyone have the list for AZCOM/Midwestern?

 

[BorntobeDO?]

Not your choles grey, they will always be super interesting.

 

[Blunt Dissection]

From some searching, looks like the CCF IP match this year was a PGY-3 GS resident at CCF South Pointe. One of the current plastics fellow is also from South Pointe, so looks like it's becoming a strong program to try to aim for if plastics is the ultimate goal for a DO applicant. Otherwise, a rough year for DOs applying IP.

 

[deleted1041468]

All, my class went from 12 psych last year to like 6 this year. Psych may be the new derm after all.

Well I mean that could be just because less people are interested. I am not buying it’s that hard. I have seen people in the bottom of the class(terrible board score) match community and people middle of the class match university at a good school. I think psych is competitive but only slightly. Decent scores and excellent interview skills will go a long way. I wish there was a way to see how many that wanted the specialty didn’t get it and had to either SOAP or match their backup.

 

[Robotfishbrain]

Well I mean that could be just because less people are interested. I am not buying it’s that hard. I have seen people in the bottom of the class(terrible board score) match community and people middle of the class match university at a good school. I think psych is competitive but only slightly. Decent scores and excellent interview skills will go a long way. I wish there was a way to see how many that wanted the specialty didn’t get it and had to either SOAP or match their backup.

This has been the consensus for the past 2-3 years on the psych forums. Everything is more competitive now obviously, but man, people who failed PE and had low comlex scores (no usmle) at my school have matched at some impressive R1 programs. No idea wtf is going on but I think interviews are much more heavily weighted than in any other specialty. In addition, the average COMLEX/USMLE of accepted applicants is below average of all accepted applicants. Psych = new derm used to just be a meme, but I think people are taking this seriously.

 

[Dr. Death]

The number that went unmatched after SOAP is the one I care about. But that is encouraging, I agree. This was a fantastic match for 2020 overall.

Why? The goal should be as many matches as possible. What's the point of going through all of 4th year, auditions, ERAS, interviews if you're just going to SOAP? It's devastating for anyone that has to do it and should not be considered an acceptable outcome. Also a decent number of those who SOAP end up in a dead-end prelim year and are back in the match again as an inferior candidate next year. Raw match number is the one that tells you how many people ended up in the specialty they were aiming for and is the number we should care about.

 

[CoomassieBlue57]

Why? The goal should be as many matches as possible. What's the point of going through all of 4th year, auditions, ERAS, interviews if you're just going to SOAP? It's devastating for anyone that has to do it and should not be considered an acceptable outcome. Also a decent number of those who SOAP end up in a dead-end prelim year and are back in the match again as an inferior candidate next year. Raw match number is the one that tells you how many people ended up in the specialty they were aiming for and is the number we should care about.

Not necessarily. Raw match numbers include students that matched advanced programs but not Prelim/Transitional, therefore these students are considered unmatched but ended up in their desired specialty.

 

[Dr. Death]

Not necessarily. Raw match numbers include students that matched advanced programs but not Prelim/Transitional, therefore these students are considered unmatched but ended up in their desired specialty.

Fair, but it is a better representation than post-SOAP placement. My class had around an 85% match rate. We've got 2 people that wanted to do gen surg, 2 people that wanted to do OB, one ENT, one Psych, a couple EM. They are now almost all in peds or family. So when you look at the 100% placement post-SOAP you don't get a grasp that one in 7 people in this class didn't get the specialty they wanted.

 

[Deecee2DO]

Fair, but it is a better representation than post-SOAP placement. My class had around an 85% match rate. We've got 2 people that wanted to do gen surg, 2 people that wanted to do OB, one ENT, one Psych, a couple EM. They are now almost all in peds or family. So when you look at the 100% placement post-SOAP you don't get a grasp that one in 7 people in this class didn't get the specialty they wanted.

That honestly sucks for those people. Does a lot of that come down to poor planning and being uninformed or just being unlucky? ENT is just so hard to match as a DO so if an applicant is applying with Step 1 in the 230s minimal research and minimal connections in the field and they only rank ENT progrMs without backup then have to SOAP isnt that something that could have been avoided with a backup plan? I know minimal about this stuff compared to you guys as im only an M2 and havent gone through the process yet just trying to understand better

 

[Dr.Bruh]

Fair, but it is a better representation than post-SOAP placement. My class had around an 85% match rate. We've got 2 people that wanted to do gen surg, 2 people that wanted to do OB, one ENT, one Psych, a couple EM. They are now almost all in peds or family. So when you look at the 100% placement post-SOAP you don't get a grasp that one in 7 people in this class didn't get the specialty they wanted.

Curious is thats an outlier or not. Bc with KCU the last 2 years its been about 10-12 (of 250) that go unmatched but 100%. still 92-94% match what they want. Marian had 95% rate this year, and I recall an article that had the schools that match the high % of student at their number 1 choice and like 3 DO schools were on the list.

 

[Epilepsy365]

That honestly sucks for those people. Does a lot of that come down to poor planning and being uninformed or just being unlucky? ENT is just so hard to match as a DO so if an applicant is applying with Step 1 in the 230s minimal research and minimal connections in the field and they only rank ENT progrMs without backup then have to SOAP isnt that something that could have been avoided with a backup plan? I know minimal about this stuff compared to you guys as im only an M2 and havent gone through the process yet just trying to understand better

There is an element of luck involved too. I know people with good board scores with double digits EM IIs who went through the SOAP.

Likewise, it’s also possible to be disappointed and matched down lower on your list while the quoted statistics is that 75% of people get top 3 choices.

In today environment, matching to your desired specialty in a decent location is a big W for DOs.

 

[Chibucks15]

Curious is thats an outlier or not. Bc with KCU the last 2 years its been about 10-12 (of 250) that go unmatched but 100%. still 92-94% match what they want. Marian had 95% rate this year, and I recall an article that had the schools that match the high % of student at their number 1 choice and like 3 DO schools were on the list.

That depends though on goals and relative understanding of their competitiveness. DO schools self select for primary care despite what you read on here. It's a lot easier to match first choice primary care

 

[BorntobeDO?]

Why? The goal should be as many matches as possible. What's the point of going through all of 4th year, auditions, ERAS, interviews if you're just going to SOAP? It's devastating for anyone that has to do it and should not be considered an acceptable outcome. Also a decent number of those who SOAP end up in a dead-end prelim year and are back in the match again as an inferior candidate next year. Raw match number is the one that tells you how many people ended up in the specialty they were aiming for and is the number we should care about.

Its not that I think its better than the match, its that I think getting a residency is a far more acceptable outcome than not getting one. At the end of the day, SOAP matches get to be doctors, while people who aren't able to SOAP usually don't, or lose a year if lucky. Thats why I care about the number after SOAP.

 

[BorntobeDO?]

Well I mean that could be just because less people are interested. I am not buying it’s that hard. I have seen people in the bottom of the class(terrible board score) match community and people middle of the class match university at a good school. I think psych is competitive but only slightly. Decent scores and excellent interview skills will go a long way. I wish there was a way to see how many that wanted the specialty didn’t get it and had to either SOAP or match their backup.

It was already mentioned as having a 77% match rate for DO's and 65% overall. I haven't verified those numbers, but the represent a large increase in competitiveness for sure.

 

[BorntobeDO?]

Fair, but it is a better representation than post-SOAP placement. My class had around an 85% match rate. We've got 2 people that wanted to do gen surg, 2 people that wanted to do OB, one ENT, one Psych, a couple EM. They are now almost all in peds or family. So when you look at the 100% placement post-SOAP you don't get a grasp that one in 7 people in this class didn't get the specialty they wanted.

I agree with your point here, that is important. But all those people also get to be doctors, which is the purpose of medical school.

 

[CoomassieBlue57]

still 92-94% match what they want

Not necessarily first choice speciality though, as about 10% of students apply to more than one speciality.

 

[AnatomyGrey12]

Does a lot of that come down to poor planning and being uninformed or just being unlucky?

A bit of both. I think some people didn't play the surgery game right. Honestly anyone applying surgery with only COMLEX is at risk of not matching, regardless of how high your COMLEX is. There are former DO programs that now require USMLE of everyone and won't accept applicants without it. The ENT person knew they were reaching and last I heard was pretty happy with their SOAP. Luck definitely plays a role to some extent. It is possible to have a lot of interviews but not be high enough on anyones rank list to slip off and go unmatched. It's not that common, but it does happen every year.

 

[Epilepsy365]

I personally know of someone with Step 1 240s and double digits GS IIs who didn’t match to GS. That person SOAPed into a FM/Peds/IM spot. Stuff happened.

This person is very normal and well liked without any sense of ego.

 

[Ho0v-man]

So this thread took the expected turn...

 

[DNC127]

Curious is thats an outlier or not. Bc with KCU the last 2 years its been about 10-12 (of 250) that go unmatched but 100%. still 92-94% match what they want. Marian had 95% rate this year, and I recall an article that had the schools that match the high % of student at their number 1 choice and like 3 DO schools were on the list.

OSU is a weird school with the extreme positive of having its own residencies, but students make poor decisions because of this and rely on them. Tons of students in our class only applied to OSU residencies. I know a few that applied to only 3 programs and a handful and only applied 1... because of this people get burned when they overestimate how much they are liked. Other schools have to match elsewhere because they don’t have the GME infrastructure we do which forces them to apply more broadly. So despite OSU being arguably top 3 in DO schools, it will probably have a lower match rate than most because 90%+ of our students are from Oklahoma and they don’t apply outside of Oklahoma

 

[AnatomyGrey12]

OSU is a weird school with the extreme positive of having its own residencies, but students make poor decisions because of this and rely on them. Tons of students in our class only applied to OSU residencies. I know a few that applied to only 3 programs and a handful and only applied 1... because of this people get burned when they overestimate how much they are liked. Other schools have to match elsewhere because they don’t have the GME infrastructure we do which forces them to apply more broadly. So despite OSU being arguably top 3 in DO schools, it will probably have a lower match rate than most because 90%+ of our students are from Oklahoma and they don’t apply outside of Oklahoma

And not to mention people count on OU for some reason, when OU really isn't all that friendly to us in anything outside of primary care. Possible to match with solid apps, but I know more than a few people that are "targeting in state residencies" and they are including OU on their target list when they are applying to a moderately competitive specialty with just COMLEX.