Does your school provide Instruments???

[Celeripedean]

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hey, does your school provide instruments in the tuition or do you just buy some at the start of every year from some seller like Gill Podiatry?

 

[Dr_Feelgood]

hey, does your school provide instruments in the tuition or do you just buy some at the start of every year from some seller like Gill Podiatry?

At DMU, it is not included, but we do not buy new equipment every year, just once.

 

[Feli]

I don't think any med/pod/dent/etc school provides clinical or diagnostic instruments. We got a list from our clinical dean of bare minimums that local pod attendings will expect us to have, and you can always buy more or upgraded versions of the required ones. We did get to borrow and return oto/opthalamoscopes for physical diagnosis lab, though; don't even think of wasting your $ on buying that no matter what you're told.

Gill is good quality and has nice stuff. I'm quite satisfied. However, if you haven't bought yours yet, I'd just go to Home Depot for the Dremel; get one with a Lithium-Ion battery so it has no memory and you can recharge it any time (my Gill one had Ni-Cad that you have to wait until it dies totally to recharge).

Also, for some basic instruments like a Lister and Mayo scissors, Kelly clamp, etc, you will find that allheart.com is much cheaper ($5 versus $25 or so). They're cheaper in both cost and quality, but hey... we're on a student budget here. If you start a private practice down the line and need high quality scissors and clamps that you an autoclave over and over without damaging, you can always buy those later on.

 

[DrNdogg]

At CSPM the school orders a set list of instruments for each student in the incoming class. The cost of the instruments is figured into our tuition

 

[Feli]

At CSPM the school orders a set list of instruments for each student in the incoming class. The cost of the instruments is figured into our tuition

You guys order your instruments first semester? Wow.

We ordered ours near the middle of 2nd year so that they arrived for us to use in late 2nd year pod med and biomechanics lab and 3rd year clinics.

Does CSPM have a very low attrition rate? It seems weird to require brand new students buying expensive instruments when they might not even pass basic sciences and make it to clinical years. That'd be like registering for pt1 boards on orientation day 😕

 

[bdaddyjolley]

At Temple you have to buy them but the upper classmen do fundraisers for their class in that they sell the instruments to you so you can get them through them at discounts since they order in bulk. Or you can get them on your own.

 

[DrNdogg]

You guys order your instruments first semester? Wow.

We ordered ours near the middle of 2nd year so that they arrived for us to use in late 2nd year pod med and biomechanics lab and 3rd year clinics.

Does CSPM have a very low attrition rate? It seems weird to require brand new students buying expensive instruments when they might not even pass basic sciences and make it to clinical years. That'd be like registering for pt1 boards on orientation day 😕

The school orders them for us. We need them by Spring semester of 1st year for Intro to Clinical Medicine class, where we learn what each instrument is, how to trim nails and calluses, write SOAP notes, write prescriptions, etc. Also, we start clinics in June after 1st year, so we need our instruments for that.

As for the attrition rate, it has remained relatively low since the merger with Samuel Merritt College, and the increase in stability of the school.

 

[Feli]

The school orders them for us. We need them by Spring semester of 1st year for Intro to Clinical Medicine class, where we learn what each instrument is, how to trim nails and calluses, write SOAP notes, write prescriptions, etc. Also, we start clinics in June after 1st year, so we need our instruments for that.

As for the attrition rate, it has remained relatively low since the merger with Samuel Merritt College, and the increase in stability of the school.

Yeah I forgot Cali starts clinics at the start of 2nd year. That's just wacky, but I guess you do need instruments.

Have you guys even taken radiology, biomechanics, pharm, or path yet before you are caring for patients? Out of curiousity, how many days/wk are your 2nd year clinics? I couldn't imagine losing the study time during 2nd year. Our 2nd year is definitely the hardest part academically with physio lab, path, pharm, derm, and micro.

I wouldn't have even known where to start with a H&P or procedure at the start of 2nd year. Heck, I didn't even know that staph was coag positive or the dose of a NSAID at that point...

 

[DrNdogg]

Yeah I forgot Cali starts clinics at the start of 2nd year. That's just wacky, but I guess you do need instruments.

Have you guys even taken radiology, biomechanics, pharm, or path yet before you are caring for patients? Out of curiousity, how many days/wk are your 2nd year clinics? I couldn't imagine losing the study time during 2nd year. Our 2nd year is definitely the hardest part academically with physio lab, path, pharm, derm, and micro.

I wouldn't have even known where to start with a H&P or procedure at the start of 2nd year. Heck, I didn't even know that staph was coag positive or the dose of a NSAID at that point...

No, we don't take clinincal courses (except for intro) before some of us start seeing patients; it all depends on what rotation schedule you have. Most of the patients seen in 2nd year are palliative care, and for the more interesting cases (onychocryptosis, Morton's neuroma, hypermobile 1st ray, etc.) we get help from our attendings, who understand we may not have had these things in class yet. Most of the treatment in 2nd year is conservative, if anything surgical does come up we would refer them (unless it's something like an ingrown nail). As for prescriptions, we've learned how to write them but we haven't had pharm yet so our attendings write it out for us. We don't do full H&P's in 2nd, we take a good history but the PE is focused on the lower extremity. There's nothing like hands on learning.

By 3rd year clinics we are expected to write prescriptions, know how to take a full H&P, pre-op for surgery, treat ulcers and other more complex foot pathologies.

2nd year clinics have 2 days a week dedicated to them, with 6 mo of clinical rotations. During non-rotation months we get those days off. It is a little rough on us because we have to squeeze in 20-24 credits into 3 days. But that's the sacrifice we make to start clinics early. And I love it.

 

[doclm]

hey, does your school provide instruments in the tuition or do you just buy some at the start of every year from some seller like Gill Podiatry?

At Scholl we get our instuments in the beginning of the 2nd year. The price is included in the tuition. This equipment will serve us througout the clinical periods starting in the 2nd year (for the class of 2010) and for Intro of clinical medicine with the MD class.

We get a dremmel, tuning fork, reflex hammer, pen lights, blood pressure cuff, all the nippers, tissue pickup, scapels, scissors', ect, ect, that comes standard in a Podiatry clinic. Plus we are required to purchase other items that we need for intro to clinical medicine.

 

[Ski Bum]

At scholl they order you the majority of your instruments, unfortunately the person who put together the list of instruments probably hasnt practiced podiatry since the early 80's and you will only use about 3-4 things you get. The dremmel is a nice addition to your garage tools, however. Our intro to clinical med...i would suggest NOT buying anything extra unless you have money burning a hole in you pocket.

my two cents

 

[KHep]

At scholl they order you the majority of your instruments, unfortunately the person who put together the list of instruments probably hasnt practiced podiatry since the early 80's and you will only use about 3-4 things you get. The dremmel is a nice addition to your garage tools, however. Our intro to clinical med...i would suggest NOT buying anything extra unless you have money burning a hole in you pocket.

my two cents

Don't forget that they moved Essentials of Clinical Reasoning to the first year schedule at Scholl. So, right away we had to purchase stethoscope, sphyg, oto/opthalmoscope, etc. We don't get the fun stuff that is more relevant to podiatry until next year and talk about crazy...it was my third day of school and I had a simulated patient that I had to do an HPI on. 😱

 

[Dr_Feelgood]

Don't forget that they moved Essentials of Clinical Reasoning to the first year schedule at Scholl. So, right away we had to purchase stethoscope, sphyg, oto/opthalmoscope, etc. We don't get the fun stuff that is more relevant to podiatry until next year and talk about crazy...it was my third day of school and I had a simulated patient that I had to do an HPI on. 😱

That is crazy. I can see it being in the first year but not in the first week of the first year.

 

[KHep]

It was crazy. I feel like we don't know anything yet, but I guess they want to train us the same way that they are training the M-1s. It's a fun class, but they didn't change anything else in our first year curriculum, so we have all of what the P-2s had plus this extra class.

 

[Dr_Feelgood]

It was crazy. I feel like we don't know anything yet, but I guess they want to train us the same way that they are training the M-1s. It's a fun class, but they didn't change anything else in our first year curriculum, so we have all of what the P-2s had plus this extra class.

I do agree with Scholl's direction. They are moving towards integration, but I wish that they would just go 100%. Podiatry needs a school that is integrated with a MD program.

 

[doclm]

It was crazy. I feel like we don't know anything yet, but I guess they want to train us the same way that they are training the M-1s. It's a fun class, but they didn't change anything else in our first year curriculum, so we have all of what the P-2s had plus this extra class.

I agree that this info makes more sense for P2's because we already had Physiology, Neuro, Anatomy, and HPI last year. Did you see the physical list for this week? (head, nose, eyes, CN's, ears) I can imagine that most of the neuro tests don't make a whole lot of sense for the M1's and P1's.

However, the advice for you first years will be to learn as much as you possibly can in this class. It will help consolidate your basic science education this year with clinical reasoning. Also, I think that the requirement for that huge Bates' book and Harrisons will pay off in the years to come.

 

[Ralph Ralph]

Well, there is a way to get to take classes with MD students. Go to an MD school. We are the feet doctors, so I will take classes that are geared for our specific specialty. That way you can guarantee your job security. If we integrate with MDs, we will lose what makes us special and possibly the cases that are so near and dear to our hearts. Podiatry is an exceptional field, let's not dilute our profession by gumming it up with extra bodies not as invested as we are in our classes.

 

[Dr_Feelgood]

Well, there is a way to get to take classes with MD students. Go to an MD school. We are the feet doctors, so I will take classes that are geared for our specific specialty. That way you can guarantee your job security. If we integrate with MDs, we will lose what makes us special and possibly the cases that are so near and dear to our hearts. Podiatry is an exceptional field, let's not dilute our profession by gumming it up with extra bodies not as invested as we are in our classes.

Your comments are always so accurate. Lets look at a few of them:

I just decide on OCPM, and the decision was an easy one. I visited several schools, but OCPM stood out. Brand new school, brand new equipment/lab supplies. All the students were happy to be there and the staff was helpful and friendly. It's a beautiful campus too. I want to go to the best school, and OCPM has taken the lead in that regard. The whole "tier" system has definately changed.... I think it's awesome that they're striving to maintain high levels of technology and education through such drastic changes... I can't wait to be immersed into that environment.

Podiatry still seems to be sneaking under the radar, and is one of medicine's big secrets (good for us). So, it's still not real competitive to get into a school yet. Some of the upper tier schools (Barry, OCPM, AZ) are having to up their standards somewhat, but the field's still wide open at most of the schools. You're gonna do fine if you have the drive, good luck!!

yeah you'll probably have a hard time getting in to the top couple, OCPM and Barry, but you'll find a home somewhere I'm sure. Keep it up!!

I'm sure that as an applicant your experiences far outweigh mine. I would like to know what experience you base your comments on? I do think that you found a great school in OCPM b/c they have a separatist attitude also. But the fact is we take more classes that are the same as MD and DO programs than different classes. I'm sure that you cannot and have not appreciated this.

I wonder though, you say you visited DMU. I've got a few questions about the campus since you've seen it and felt it was not as nice as OCPM.

• Tell me how the anatomy labs are set up?
• Where was the clinic?
• How many buildings are used by CPMS on campus?

Since you comment about the school, I want to ensure that you have been there and you are not looking to mislead other people about the school. Again, I appreciate your post and opinions but please make sure you have facts to back them up.

 

[cool_vkb]

I 100% support you. Anyone who makes comments or advises abt certain school or residency or hospital should really have strong proof.

Plus what kind of primitive mentality this gentleman has. Doesnt he knows abt resolution 2015 or our new level of co-operation with AOFAS people. These days its all abt co-operation. The more we have exposure with MD students and the more we are in top of class then only our fellow MD classmates will appreciate us and recognize us. Now we have two classes Anat and ECR and Interproffesional health teams. And i guess atleast MD students graduating from CMS do have a good idea of what podiatry is and how good and knowledgable Pod students are. Unlike some MD/DO graduates who have no idea of what podiatry is. and we cant blame them because they never got the exposure of our field. I think the more classes we have with MDs. the more popularity and patient base we will be making in future. because at the end of the day these fellow MD/DO students who become IM,FM , Peds or orthos are gonna refer us their foot & ankle cases.

Its not like we want to be MDs but atleast basic courses like biochem, physio, anat, pharma, patho ,and some general rotations can be done along with MD or DO students. And the whole point of this thing should be just to have same level of professional education and to make our profession popular. So that tomorrow when Mr.X MD is sitting in his IM practice and gets a Foot problem he should be able to refer his patient confidently to Dr. Cool_vkb,DPM 😀

 

[FootFetish]

Don't forget that they moved Essentials of Clinical Reasoning to the first year schedule at Scholl. So, right away we had to purchase stethoscope, sphyg, oto/opthalmoscope, etc.

Holy $*#&! I can't believe you have to buy an oto/opthalmoscope. That is something you'll never use out side of your ICM garbage class because every clinic room has one on the wall. That's ridiculous. Rent one.

 

[Dr_Feelgood]

Holy $*#&! I can't believe you have to buy an oto/opthalmoscope. That is something you'll never use out side of your ICM garbage class because every clinic room has one on the wall. That's ridiculous. Rent one.

They make us buy one at DMU also. I sold mine back to last year's first year students. Lost money of course but something is better than nothing.

 

[Feli]

I agree that was a total waste of $300+ to buy oto/opthalamoscopes. You barely ever use those again, and they're too big and bulky to carry around even if you did. If you need one, the clinic or hospital would have it anyways.

Someone should really bring it up the admins. We just sign the scopes out for the semester of PD lab and then bring them back, and that works just fine to avoid costing the students a ton of $ that is much better spent on books, etc. If the admins don't budge, you can at least share with a lab partner and then put it on eBay or sell it to new 1st year students later to cut your losses.

That is a lot like the "required" microscope purchace at NYCPM. Ouch...

 

[gsrimport]

The school does not supply instruments but you could probably get around not having any.

 

[Ralph Ralph]

Your comments are always so accurate. Lets look at a few of them:







I'm sure that as an applicant your experiences far outweigh mine. I would like to know what experience you base your comments on? I do think that you found a great school in OCPM b/c they have a separatist attitude also. But the fact is we take more classes that are the same as MD and DO programs than different classes. I'm sure that you cannot and have not appreciated this.

I wonder though, you say you visited DMU. I've got a few questions about the campus since you've seen it and felt it was not as nice as OCPM.

• Tell me how the anatomy labs are set up?
• Where was the clinic?
• How many buildings are used by CPMS on campus?

Since you comment about the school, I want to ensure that you have been there and you are not looking to mislead other people about the school. Again, I appreciate your post and opinions but please make sure you have facts to back them up.

Well you're right about that. OCPM is separated from the rest. It's lonely at the top, but someone has to hold that position. Hey, I went and visited a couple of schools and I chose OCPM. It seemed like the best school, newest facilities, nicest campus, the list goes on. I don't mean to hurt anyone's feelings, I just picked the school that looked best. I am allowed to have an opinion and that is it. I'm gonna jump through those hoops for you just as soon as I get some extra time.....

 

[krabmas]

That is a lot like the "required" microscope purchace at NYCPM. Ouch...

the scope is for rent and you get half back after you return it.

 

[krabmas]

Well you're right about that. OCPM is separated from the rest. It's lonely at the top, but someone has to hold that position. Hey, I went and visited a couple of schools and I chose OCPM. It seemed like the best school, newest facilities, nicest campus, the list goes on. I don't mean to hurt anyone's feelings, I just picked the school that looked best. I am allowed to have an opinion and that is it. I'm gonna jump through those hoops for you just as soon as I get some extra time.....

Just because you think it is best does not mean that it is. What are your credentials to decide that? Did you do a double blind randomized trial to determine the percentage of people that also think this? Have you finished even a semester of school yet?

Things that look pretty on the outside are not always so pretty on the inside. And beauty is definitely not the determining factor for intellegence or imparting knowledge, which is what is most important in a school.

 

[Dr. Gangrene]

We buy some basic instruments at Azpod 1st semester.

 

[Dr_Feelgood]

Well you're right about that. OCPM is separated from the rest. It's lonely at the top, but someone has to hold that position. Hey, I went and visited a couple of schools and I chose OCPM. It seemed like the best school, newest facilities, nicest campus, the list goes on. I don't mean to hurt anyone's feelings, I just picked the school that looked best. I am allowed to have an opinion and that is it. I'm gonna jump through those hoops for you just as soon as I get some extra time.....

Did you not read this line?

Again, I appreciate your post and opinions but please make sure you have facts to back them up.

You are completely entitled to your opinion and I am not trying to strong-arming you. My questions about DMU are based on the fact that I don't think that you have ever been on the campus. I have never been to the new OCPM campus and it maybe beautiful. They may have amazing new technology, but many of the other schools may have the same things already and OCPM may have been catching up. Remember that AZPOD is brand new, Scholl only moved to there campus 5 years ago, Barry is working on a new building, and DMU has built new buildings (2 years ago) and gutted and remodeled most of the old buildings (on-going). You see while you love your independence from other health professions, these schools share the expense and are able to build and upgrade more frequently. This is one of a million reasons that integration is the future of podiatric education (many of your alumni feel the same way, I just spoke to one today on this topic).

Again, it would just like to know that you have seen other places before you make claims. This applies to everything that is posted on here. Since podiatry applicants, MDs, DOs, and other health professionals read these boards, it is important that all of your opinions are as factual as possible.

 

[tleg121]

I agree, OCPM is definately using its new assets to lead the way. GO OCPM! Too bad podiatry schools don't have a football team, then you all could settle this the gentlemenly way. Go Dolphins 2007!!

 

[Ski Bum]

i have now become stupider since i read this...thanks

 

[jonwill]

i have now become stupider since i read this...thanks