DVM/PhD Programs??

[MangoPeel]

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Are there any such programs?

 

[cudvm2005]

Yes, of course there are. There are also DVM/MS's and I think MBA's and MPH's. Check out the school's website and you should be able to find out info.

 

[southerncomfort]

I think most schools have combined programs, with concentrations in various fields (i.e., pathology). I know several DVM/PhDs at the research center where I work. Most are in pathology/pathogenesis, working on SIV/AIDS, genetic diseases, viral diseases (West Nile), TB, plus a few in more administrative roles (program director, research center director). It's a great field, and they need more DVM scientists in research.

 

[skibum]

Mango,
What are you interested in? The reason I ask, is because I was initially interested in a PhD because I know I want to teach at some point. I was told not to bother if that was the only reason, as you can easily teach with just a DVM. Research however, obviously requires a PhD.
I know for CSU's program you start off with the PhD curriculum for the first 2 years, then embark on the DVM curriculum. Once you are through the required coursework/clinicals then you complete your PhD. It sounds quite rigorous! I'm also not sure what kind of stipends you can expect. Have you looked into any programs?

 

[Herpeto]

Skibum,
Did they just change the curriculum setup at CSU? I have a couple friends in the DVM/PhD program and they attended the veterinary classes for the first two years, then took two years to perform their research project and will finish up with two year in the hospital rotations.


Herp

 

[skibum]

They must have, because I talked to an admissions counselor a couple years back and I swore I remember him describing the program as you just did. I remember thinking it would be weird to start out with one set of DVM classmates, then finish with another. So I was surprised recently when I checked the website again and it said the opposite - 2 years PhD, 4 years DVM, then finish up your dissertation (1-2 years). Maybe they found that taking a 2 year "break" from the DVM curriculum had negative impacts or something.

Have your friends enjoy the DVM/PhD program? What kind of research are they interested in? Just curious. Congrats on getting into DO school by the way. It must be cool to know that come fall, you will be attending some sort of medical school, be it for animals or humans!

 

[Herpeto]

skibum,

They enjoy the program thus far. They are currently working on the research aspect of their duties. One has a focus on rabies in different bat species and another is working on a specific canine disease (can't recall) in the same lab.

It is nice to know I will be attend a medically related school next year, however I am unsure which career path to select at the moment. I have been thinking more about my future financial situation and definitely want to be financially secure. My goal as of now is to accrue my first million by the age of 45. This should set me on my way to financial freedom. Is it wrong to select my future career based on future salary level and benefits if I would enjoy both careers equally?

Herp

 

[MissBehavior]

I'm an undergrad looking into the possibility of doing a DVM/PhD dual degree. Different schools have different programs (VMSTP, VSTP, etc). Some of them will fund your entire education, some just the PhD part. I've been told that, though these programs are competitive, there are not as many applicants for them as you might think.

Have any of you been accepted into one of these programs? If so, what are you studying for your PhD, and what kind of experience/qualifications did you have?

 

[ginkogirl]

Hello all,

As with many of you, I'll be applying to veterinary school soon (this summer). I'm considering pursuing vetmed research instead of (or possibly in addition to) clinical practice. I had two questions related to this original thread. Firstly, does anyone have an idea of whether you can be involved in the field of veterinary research with just a DVM, but no PhD? I'm prepared to pursue 4 years of full-time graduate education, but 8 seems like it may be a bit much. Also, has anyone heard about vets doing research then moving into clinical practice or doing a bit of both at the same time?

Does anyone have input or find themselves in a similar situation?

~Lisa

 

[MissBehavior]

Ginkogirl,

From what I understand, DVM/PhD's often do both clinical and research work. They usually focus on one area, and do the other part-time. By completing a dual degree program, you may be able to save yourself a year of school by completing both degrees in 7 years.

Let me know if you find any more information about these programs!

 

[chickenboo]

I had two questions related to this original thread. Firstly, does anyone have an idea of whether you can be involved in the field of veterinary research with just a DVM, but no PhD? I'm prepared to pursue 4 years of full-time graduate education, but 8 seems like it may be a bit much. Also, has anyone heard about vets doing research then moving into clinical practice or doing a bit of both at the same time?

Really, you can do whatever you want with your degree. I know of DVM/PhD's who exclusively practice, who exclusively do research, and who do both. Most of the "both" category tend to be in an academic setting (that is, they practice at a teaching hospital and do research for the university). One that I worked with got her DVM first, practiced for awhile, and then went back to school to get her PhD, and is now just doing research (and wants to get into teaching). So there's that route too, and one that seems to be fairly common. I know when I mentioned it in my interviews, I got a lot of nods and "that's what I did" from the faculty on my interview panels.

You certainly can do research with just a DVM. I think that most DVMs that go this route do clinical research rather than bench/basic research. I think people are highly encouraged to get PhDs if they would like to pursue bench research (and having worked for a just-MD in a basic research lab, I can see why). As far as doing both at the same time, again, it certainly can be done. Like I said above, those people tend to be in an academic setting and have NO LIVES. So I would give some thought to what kind of lifestyle you want to have, too. If you want to have a life outside vet med, doing both (at the same time, anyway) may not be the way to go.

I guess I just want to stress that you can really do whatever you want with your degree--it just depends on what your motivations and goals are. Most combined programs are 7 years, but it also depends on how fast you're getting your research done. 🙂 If you do want to get both, it can be a nice way to pay for your DVM degree! A lot of schools now have summer or year-long research programs as well, so there are plenty of opportunities to get exposure to research while in vet school (although I'm sure you already have some, if you're thinking of getting a PhD!), without necessarily having to get a PhD.

 

[kate_g]

I'm finishing a PhD program next year, and considering going for DVM afterward, so I thought I'd offer my perspective. I've asked the "is this crazy, and should I have just done a dual degree program from the start?" question of several vets with various involvement in research. I obviously don't have the option of doing the two degrees concurrently anymore, so they may have been less willing to say that's what I should have done, but their unanimous opinion was that doing the degrees separately was better than doing a dual program. The reasoning was that the dual program is directed by the vet school, and they tend to short-change the PhD portion of the program time-wise. PhD research rarely, if ever, goes as quickly as you expect, so there's a chance you won't really get to do as complete a project as you would if you were concentrating only on the PhD. The implication being that you don't end up as good a scientist in the end. I'm sure there are differences school to school as far as how they work these programs and how much liberty you get to do research at its own pace. The other downside to doing a dual degree is you're limited to doing your PhD work with faculty at the same university as you do your vet degree. Depending on the specificity of what you want to do, that may not give you the choice of the best labs in the field. Or conversely, if you choose based on the lab, you might end up at the vet school that would otherwise be your first choice. So you're likely to have to compromise on either your lab choice or your vet school choice.

If your goal is to mostly do clinical work and do research on the side, then you're likely to be working in collaboration with another PI and it matters less that you're absolutely the best scientist you could be. AND, as has been mentioned previously, at least the PhD portion of the program should be funded, and sometimes you get funding for the DVM portion, too. So there are definitely reasons you might decide the dual-degree program is for you. But if you're coming at it from the research side, you might be better off to try to put the funding out of your mind and do what's best for your research career - and there's always the chance that your first-choice lab will be at your first-choice school, making for an easy decision!

 

[ginkogirl]

Thank you chickenboo and kate_g for your responses!

I definitely hear what you are saying about the time commitment involved, being that sometime in the next 10 years or so I'd like to have kids and actually be able to spend time with them! I think my problem is I just want to do everything. I've always been intent on vetmed, but for the past year I have been knee deep in research (as one of you guessed) and am loving it. I'm currently working in the molec-cell/genetics field, but somehow can't see myself working with microorganisms for the rest of my career leading me to consider veterinary research as a possibility. Thanks again for the feedback, maybe I'm not *quite* as insane as originally thought!

~Lisa