Economically Disadvantaged with $100K Income?

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Dbate said:
Thanks, I really appreciate all of the advice people have given in the thread.

I am going to use the FAP to apply because my parents have three other children (and a grandchild) to support and I can't selfishly take money away from them.

I couldn't afford to apply to med school otherwise because I don't make enough from my campus job to pay for all the app fees.
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Thats a lame excuse imo. My family makes about 1/3 what your family income is and I didn't even apply to FAP. Get a credit card if you need to pay for applications and interviews.

The idea of someone with a household income of 90k being disadvantaged is beyond laughable and ridiculous enough to make truly disadvantaged people mad that you would choose to abuse the system.

Even people who aren't disadvantaged should be annoyed, this is the same type of **** people pull with welfare. If you don't need it, then you shouldn't get it.
 
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Dbate said:
I had a question about the economically disadvantaged box on the AMCAS.

Throughout my childhood my parents made about $100-110K, but my mom lost her job during the recession and our family income declined a bit. Not by much, but to about $87K.

Because the poverty guidelines for a family of six (my parents plus four kids) lists $30K as the standard. And the AMCAS allows those who make 300% of the poverty level receive the financial assistance program, I qualified for it.

Should I mark disadvantaged for the AMCAS application because I received the FAP?

I feel like this is meant for people who are really disadvantaged their whole lives. I mean I had the average childhood: suburban neighborhoods, good schools, etc. So I don't think I should qualify.

But should I check the box because of the FAP?

I looked through past threads and it seems as if most people stated that the decision to check was based on personal decisions. But if I check the box, will adcoms penalize me because of how much my family actually earns?
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If your family has a grand child, I'm guessing some of your siblings work. You would likely not be eligible for FAP either. FAP takes into account the TOTAL family income, not just your parents'. I'm guessing the parent of the grandchild makes at least $3k (or you might), which would put you over.
 
seracus said:
If your family has a grand child, I'm guessing some of your siblings work. You would likely not be eligible for FAP either. FAP takes into account the TOTAL family income, not just your parents'. I'm guessing the parent of the grandchild makes at least $3k (or you might), which would put you over.
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Actually, I did a little research for you.

Assuming the parent of the grandchild earns his/her own income and is not supported by your parents (at least half of living expenses), then they do NOT count for your household size.

Source: http://www2.ed.gov/offices/OSFAP/DirectLoan/RepayCalc/poverty.html

Therefore, your actual household size would be 5, and you would NOT qualify for FAP.

This whole thread reeks of slime. Did you also pull this BS to get into your HYP college?
 
I love the way people are getting all worked up about the FAP thing, which wasn't even the main point of this thread. The bottom line is, if you're eligible for FAP you're eligible for it. The government sets the poverty rate level and the AAMC decides that 300% of the poverty rate is what they'll cover. If they wanted to cover less than that they would have. If a family that size makes $89,000 the year of application they're still eligible.

Now if the OP was actually ineligible that's a whole different story but the responses going "I didn't take the FAP money and my family makes half that!!!??!?!" are pointless. Sorry you made yourself pay more money for applications. I'm not sure who exactly you thought you were helping...the AAMC? The schools that charge you $100 an application for the privilege of pre-screening your secondary? They'll be happy to take the money you're handing them I suppose.

Like this gem:

Thats a lame excuse imo. My family makes about 1/3 what your family income is and I didn't even apply to FAP. Get a credit card if you need to pay for applications and interviews.
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lol wat? Oh yeah sounds like a good idea I'll jack my credit up by racking up thousands of dollars of application expenses on a credit card instead of taking the free applications AAMC will give me.
 
calvnandhobbs68 said:
I love the way people are getting all worked up about the FAP thing, which wasn't even the main point of this thread. The bottom line is, if you're eligible for FAP you're eligible for it. The government sets the poverty rate level and the AAMC decides that 300% of the poverty rate is what they'll cover. If they wanted to cover less than that they would have. If a family that size makes $89,000 the year of application they're still eligible.

Now if the OP was actually ineligible that's a whole different story but the responses going "I didn't take the FAP money and my family makes half that!!!??!?!" are pointless. Sorry you made yourself pay more money for applications. I'm not sure who exactly you thought you were helping...the AAMC? The schools that charge you $100 an application for the privilege of pre-screening your secondary? They'll be happy to take the money you're handing them I suppose.

Like this gem:



lol wat? Oh yeah sounds like a good idea I'll jack my credit up by racking up thousands of dollars of application expenses on a credit card instead of taking the free applications AAMC will give me.
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He's not even eligible unless he either 1) counts a sibling that should not be counted, or 2) in the case that he counts all siblings, fails to report his siblings' and his own (if existent) income to AAMC. Both of those options would be unethical but probably would pass AAMC's scrutiny as they do not demand tax returns for siblings and for the applicant as far as I know.
 
Dbate said:
I had a question about the economically disadvantaged box on the AMCAS.

Throughout my childhood my parents made about $100-110K, but my mom lost her job during the recession and our family income declined a bit. Not by much, but to about $87K.

Because the poverty guidelines for a family of six (my parents plus four kids) lists $30K as the standard. And the AMCAS allows those who make 300% of the poverty level receive the financial assistance program, I qualified for it.

Should I mark disadvantaged for the AMCAS application because I received the FAP?

I feel like this is meant for people who are really disadvantaged their whole lives. I mean I had the average childhood: suburban neighborhoods, good schools, etc. So I don't think I should qualify.

But should I check the box because of the FAP?

I looked through past threads and it seems as if most people stated that the decision to check was based on personal decisions. But if I check the box, will adcoms penalize me because of how much my family actually earns?
Click to expand...

I don't get it... you'd be willing to be admitted as a "disadvantaged" applicant but have (in the past) resisted listing your race on your application so as not to have that as a factor in the admissions decision. :confused:

Furthermore, having a family with an annual income well above the median family income in the US ($52K http://quickfacts.census.gov/qfd/states/00000.html) you are going to be laughed out of the adcom meeting.

You can qualify for FAP and not be "disadvantaged". Save "disadvantaged" for the kid raised by a single parent working a blue collar, low wage job or on disabilty and scraping by on SSI.
 
seracus said:
He's not even eligible unless he either 1) counts a sibling that should not be counted, or 2) in the case that he counts all siblings, fails to report his siblings' and his own (if existent) income to AAMC. Both of those options would be unethical but probably would pass AAMC's scrutiny as they do not demand tax returns for siblings and for the applicant as far as I know.
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Really? I didn't see the part where he said that sibling received less than half their support from his parents. Now if he says that's true then he would be ineligible.

As far as I know there is no part on the FAP for sibling income. Again, if the AAMC wanted to include sibling income in their assessment they would require to submit all sibling tax returns.
 
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calvnandhobbs68 said:
Really? I didn't see the part where he said that sibling received less than half their support from his parents. Now if he says that's true then he would be ineligible.

As far as I know there is no part on the FAP for sibling income. Again, if the AAMC wanted to include sibling income in their assessment they would require to submit all sibling tax returns.
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Highly agree.

Apply as "disadvantaged," with all the nebulousness that that entails...no.

Take the FAP is you qualify for it by being truthful in answering the questions that the AAMC sets out as requirements to be able to apply and spend a little less on it? Hell yes. This isn't sneaking one past the AAMC, it's doing exactly as they want applicants to do. Revealed preferences and all that.
 
My household income is <70k. Got FAP but didn't apply as disadvantaged. Schools decided I was disadvantaged anyway (other factors involved)...

Moral of the story, take the FAP, but don't apply as disadvantaged. If you're on the border (which you don't look like you are), schools will decide for themselves.
 
calvnandhobbs68 said:
I love the way people are getting all worked up about the FAP thing, which wasn't even the main point of this thread. The bottom line is, if you're eligible for FAP you're eligible for it. The government sets the poverty rate level and the AAMC decides that 300% of the poverty rate is what they'll cover. If they wanted to cover less than that they would have. If a family that size makes $89,000 the year of application they're still eligible.

Now if the OP was actually ineligible that's a whole different story but the responses going "I didn't take the FAP money and my family makes half that!!!??!?!" are pointless. Sorry you made yourself pay more money for applications. I'm not sure who exactly you thought you were helping...the AAMC? The schools that charge you $100 an application for the privilege of pre-screening your secondary? They'll be happy to take the money you're handing them I suppose.

Like this gem:



lol wat? Oh yeah sounds like a good idea I'll jack my credit up by racking up thousands of dollars of application expenses on a credit card instead of taking the free applications AAMC will give me.
Click to expand...

I didn't mean people should avoid FAP. The only reason I said I didn't take out FAP was because the OP made it out to seem like it was impossible to apply without it even though his family income is way above average. If I can do it with 1/3 the household income (not that my parents payed for anything anyways) then there is no reason he should have trouble.

I actually didn't apply for FAP because I didn't really know what it was when I was going through the process, I assumed it was for people below the poverty line.

I guess you're right that if you qualify for FAP then go for it. I just think its a little ridiculous to try and pretend that a guy from a family with a household income of 100k that goes to a HYP school is really going to struggle to pay for apps.

Also does a grandkid really count? Are the grandkids parents not supporting the child at all? So if his sibling is supporting the child wouldn't that mean his household income is actually higher?
 
def1 said:
I actually didn't apply for FAP because I didn't really know what it was when I was going through the process, I assumed it was for people below the poverty line.
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uninformed and didn't take advantage of the program. Then criticize at people who do on the Internet.


:clap:
 
tn4596 said:
uninformed and didn't take advantage of the program. Then criticize at people who do on the Internet.


:clap:
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I didn't apply through AMCAS, I applied through TMDSAS. The only thing it would have helped me with would be the cost of the MCAT.

Doesn't change my opinion that this thread is ridiculous.
 
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Not agreeing with the OP's characterization of "disadvantaged," but if the OP lives in a more expensive city in California, his family's household income would actually be around average:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/California_locations_by_per_capita_income

We have to differentiate "median household income" from "median family income." The difference can sometimes be as much as $20,000.

Looking at San Francisco, where I live (which is the most expensive city in the country in general), the median household income is $71,000, but the median family income is $85,000. Why is it so expensive? The average rent for a typical 2 bedroom apartment is $2.7k/month.

Yet I believe the difference between the two statistics is because household income accounts for all members of a household whereas family income accounts for all members of a family living in one household. Hence why the household income statistic is smaller: it is skewed by those who live with roommates or live alone.

Ergo, spewing out the "OP, the median household income in the U.S. is $31,000" statistic doesn't potentially correlate with the OP's neck of the woods. That statistic is heavily skewed by the large amounts of rural area in this country (i.e. most of the electorate lol).

I also don't know if the above statistics account for gross or net income. Nor do I know if the OP's family's income statistic is gross or net.

Point is, there are a ton of variables. Yet, the OP is definitely not disadvantaged.
 
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Dbate said:
It's so unfortunate that even though I can't see your original posts, I can still see them when someone quotes them.

There is a massive flaw in the ignore list.
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The fact that you have NickNaylor on your ignore list is really the biggest travesty in this thread. He is a solid poster who is always level headed, and able to provide valuable insight. Even if you disagree with his opinions, it's important to to consider them to be able to properly evaluate your own. And with some of the threads you have started? you could really use some of that evaluation...
 
As someone who grew up with a widowed mom supporting two kids on disability, I wouldn't consider you disadvantaged at all. I understand that from your perspective you might be, but in the grand scheme of things you really aren't.
 
This is the type of mindset that we DON'T want in medicine. The ends don't always justify the means.
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Actually my bioethics textbook (Veatch) states that physicians tend to favor consequentialist ethical viewpoints more than deontological ones.


You wanna be a doctor but you don't want to face scrutiny for ethically questionable actions?

I think you meant to click on THIS forum instead:
http://www.top-law-schools.com/forums/index.php
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You've been watching too much Grey's Anatomy. Doctors don't get to decide ethical issues, committees decide for them if the law says nothing (and most of the time, the law will decide for you.)

And at this point, I don't "wanna" be a doctor: I will start medical school in less than 4 months. I'm GOING to be a doctor.
 
NickNaylor said:
And premeds everywhere were thrown to the fire and brimstome and there was relentless gnashing of teeth.

Sent from my Nexus 7
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:laugh::laugh::laugh::thumbup::thumbup: That was awesome!

But be careful! I think you're in danger of being in the Ignore Lists of these sensitive, idealistic premeds! :scared:
 
I wouldn't do it. Even if you qualify for FAP, ADCOMs can still use common sense to see who is actually disadvantaged or not. With the outrage this thread is generating, you can only imagine the outrage ADCOMs would have if you interviewed.

Checking the disadvantaged box isn't quite the same as gaming something like the JAMP program in Texas, which I believe relies on FAFSA.
 
Do you think that calling yourself "disadvantaged" is going to give you an advantage?

I am sure it is apparent who is really "disadvantaged"-based on your age, work history, scholarships, ECs, personal statement, income, etc.

I mean, they all go through the applications.

There are very few tricks you can do to sway the system, due to extreme circumstances.

I, myself, have an extreme circumstance-4 medical withdrawals during undergrad-due to a rare autoimmune neurological disease that affects my autonomic nervous system, that I have just received treatment for in the past year.

I am strongly considering giving up on my dream. No matter what, I have skid marks all over my transcripts and my application due to my medical problems. However, who knows what the future will hold. No matter what, I have an uphill battle to face in order to even have a chance.

Also, I imagine being "economically disadvantaged" comes with having a lot of skid marks on apps, although they probably are stellar, in general.

I suggest you think long and hard about what a hardship truly is.

You will not be able to give yourself an edge on your app by checking off boxes. The adcoms know what to look for.
 
Why does it even matter what your parents make? My parents aren't going to pay a dime for my medical school tuition.
 
The idea is pretty outrageous.

The only way you are going to stand out by checking off a box on AMCAS is by making a fool of yourself.

I imagine that applicants who have hardship due to being economically disadvantaged have all sorts of supportive indications on their apps-scholarships, academic records, work history, ECs, military service, and income. Those are the obvious indicators.

I also would have a hard time believing that somebody who genuinely has a hardship due to being economically disadvantage would have a hard time demonstrating such, directly or indirectly, in his or her AMCAS app.

Good luck trying to convince the adcoms that you genuinely have a hardship. They see enough applications to identify such factors, especially when an individual explicitly marks "economically disadvantaged" on their apps.

Even if an individual has such a hardship, it would be hard to believe if the individual would be given a significant advantage, if any.
 
90k household sounds pretty disadvantaged to me. Can your family even afford 3 cars?
 
nysegop said:
Why does it even matter what your parents make? My parents aren't going to pay a dime for my medical school tuition.
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+pity+

because growing up poor provides significant difficulties in access to education, healthcare, and a whole host of other things that many people take for granted....like, ya know, food and shelter

for admissions, a person's achievements are often analyzed in the context of the environment in which they were raised...there are inherent advantages in coming from a wealthy and educated family compared to being a first generation college student when it comes to navigating the higher education system
 
def1 said:
I didn't mean people should avoid FAP. The only reason I said I didn't take out FAP was because the OP made it out to seem like it was impossible to apply without it even though his family income is way above average. If I can do it with 1/3 the household income (not that my parents payed for anything anyways) then there is no reason he should have trouble.

I actually didn't apply for FAP because I didn't really know what it was when I was going through the process, I assumed it was for people below the poverty line.

I guess you're right that if you qualify for FAP then go for it. I just think its a little ridiculous to try and pretend that a guy from a family with a household income of 100k that goes to a HYP school is really going to struggle to pay for apps.
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Well said, exactly how I feel as well. If you can get FAP then yea you may as well go for it, I don't know anyone who would give up thousands of dollars like that. My family makes less than 50K a year and they managed to put me through school including board, and my twin sisters going into college at the same exact time as well. There are SEVERAL families in the U.S. that have very similar situations, that doesn't make them disadvantaged. I'm sorry, but the OP trying to claim disadvantage status bothers me as well.
 
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