Envision evaluating option for bankruptcy filing

[deleted941485]

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Hopefully this pandemic sees a good number of AMCs and CMGs go under

Nah they’ll just consolidate and the biggest bit of ferment will control ever increasing amount of market share

NAPA came out on top it seems

 

[BIGphysician]

Nah they’ll just consolidate and the biggest bit of ferment will control ever increasing amount of market share

NAPA came out on top it seems

Going to be like one massive amazon company handling all of anesthesia


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[deleted941485]

Going to be like one massive amazon company handling all of anesthesia


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Exactly. Crisis wiped out the marginal players but the ruthless will survive here. NAPA has that in spades. These were dangerous players that just got a lot more dangerous.

 

[BIGphysician]

Exactly. Crisis wiped out the marginal players but the ruthless will survive here. NAPA has that in spades. These were dangerous players that just got a lot more dangerous.

Then you add the crna independent practice evolution- serious problem for all of us


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[dannyboy1]

Going to be like one massive amazon company handling all of anesthesia


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Nah. If they become to big of a pain in the @ss the hospital can just hire their own. I think that’s where this specialty is headed in the next 20 years. Time will tell which employer will screw you more.

 

[BIGphysician]

Nah. If they become to big of a pain in the @ss the hospital can just hire their own. I think that’s where this specialty is headed in the next 20 years. Time will tell which employer will screw you more.

That’s a good point- why don’t they already do that?


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[aneftp]

Nah. If they become to big of a pain in the @ss the hospital can just hire their own. I think that’s where this specialty is headed in the next 20 years. Time will tell which employer will screw you more.

Hospital employee w2 become another cog in the wheel. I think it’s funny once people become w2 for hospital system.

generally if you ever sat in hospital committees or boards. And first thing surgeons will every complain about it anesthesia is lazy. Yes. It’s true. Sit on these boards. My surgeons friends tell me always tons of complaints about anesthesia staffing (This is with anesthesia being private contractor whether true private or third party amc private)

well if anesthesia is w2 hospitals employee. It’s hard for surgeons to complain about staffing anesthesia to hospital management. lol.

 

[kmurp]

Former colleague of mine now at Envision, tells me her vacation thus year has been cancelled until further notice.

 

[dannyboy1]

Former colleague of mine now at Envision, tells me her vacation thus year has been cancelled until further notice.

That $hit is probably not legal. Vacation is typically specified in your contract. I would check your state labor laws.

 

[skypilot]

That $hit is probably not legal. Vacation is typically specified in your contract. I would check your state labor laws.

Laws don’t matter. Only power matters in this game of thrones. Stick your neck out and see what happens.

 

[dannyboy1]

Laws don’t matter. Only power matters in this game of thrones. Stick your neck out and see what happens.

See what the job market is and act accordingly. Remember PTO is accrued. Meaning if you get 6 weeks you get accrue 1 week for every 2 months worked. You already worked for it and it is owed to you. They have to pay you for it at the very least. I’m sure they sent around an email canceling PTO. it’s definitely worth showing the email to a labor lawyer....

 

[ambiturner]

That’s a good point- why don’t they already do that?


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Hospitals until recently didn’t see a ton of upside in employing anesthesiologists. We don’t bring in patients, having us in a separate group is a convenient way to separate from a high legal liability field, some anesthesiologists are total HR nightmares (I’m sure we can all think of some), and when we’re private they don’t have to deal with overtime when a surgeon wants to do an appy at 1 am. And as mentioned above, we’re an easy punching bag for surgeon frustration, rather than admitting that their inefficient ORs are either the surgeons own fault or the result of administrative incompetence.

 

[aneftp]

See what the job market is and act accordingly. Remember PTO is accrued. Meaning if you get 6 weeks you get accrue 1 week for every 2 months worked. You already worked for it and it is owed to you. They have to pay you for it at the very least. I’m sure they sent around an email canceling PTO. it’s definitely worth showing the email to a labor lawyer....

Pto is not accured in the private world of medicine. When team health brought out my old practice. They let the practice run itself and if someone wanted to front load the 10 weeks of vacation beginning of the year. It wouldn’t have made a difference. As long as coverage was there. They let practice manage itself. Business as usual

that’s why every amc locally manages itself unless there is trouble. Than the amc will reign in.

 

[dannyboy1]

Pto is not accured in the private world of medicine. When team health brought out my old practice. They let the practice run itself and if someone wanted to front load the 10 weeks of vacation beginning of the year. It wouldn’t have made a difference. As long as coverage was there. They let practice manage itself. Business as usual

that’s why every amc locally manages itself unless there is trouble. Than the amc will reign in.

I work for an AMC and have PTO written in my contract. 6 weeks. It is standard for my practice.

 

[dannyboy1]

Pto is not accured in the private world of medicine. When team health brought out my old practice. They let the practice run itself and if someone wanted to front load the 10 weeks of vacation beginning of the year. It wouldn’t have made a difference. As long as coverage was there. They let practice manage itself. Business as usual

That sounds like a practice where you are unit based. If you are straight salary you definitely have PTO. and it accrues.

 

[aneftp]

That sounds like a practice where you are unit based. If you are straight salary you definitely have PTO. and it accrues.

Nope straight w2 amc with some overtime built in and weekend pay. Not unit base. So some manipulation of the schedule to work even less

And it’s not just team health. I have friends at American anesthesiology where the old partners manipulate the schedule to the advantage. For more time off. And also Sheridan envision practices as well

AMC are generally hands off with local practice. So practices that don’t bother AMC parent company. AMC leaves them alone and they do what they want in terms of work hours and time off

 

[Arch Guillotti]

An internal email was posted that was not appropriate. I deleted it as well as some posts that quited it in case anyone was wondering where it went.

 

[BIGphysician]

If you look around the job boards, companies/groups are posting help wanted for anesthesiologist perm positions like I haven't ever seen. Basically every desirable practice location you've ever wanted to work in, over the last week, is hiring now. A lot of those are Envision practices. What's up with that?

 

[Southpaw]

If you look around the job boards, companies/groups are posting help wanted for anesthesiologist perm positions like I haven't ever seen. Basically every desirable practice location you've ever wanted to work in, over the last week, is hiring now. A lot of those are Envision practices. What's up with that?

people aren't happy there, have left, so now they're looking for more suckers?

 

[BLADEMDA]

Envision is NOT going out of business. They simply wanted to restructure debt. They are planning on acquiring more practices if possible. They want to rid themselves of underperforming groups and focus on profitability. They now realize growth at all costs doesn’t work.

 

[IMGASMD]

Envision is NOT going out of business. They simply wanted to restructure debt. They are planning on acquiring more practices if possible. They want to rid themselves of underperforming groups and focus on profitability. They now realize growth at all costs doesn’t work.

I could have told them that...... 😉
Hire me as their next consultant, they should.

 

[ambiturner]

If you look around the job boards, companies/groups are posting help wanted for anesthesiologist perm positions like I haven't ever seen. Basically every desirable practice location you've ever wanted to work in, over the last week, is hiring now. A lot of those are Envision practices. What's up with that?

I too am finding this very interesting. Job market was good before the lockdown started so maybe just a return to pre-COVID expectations? Seems like most hospitals are up and running around 100% at this point.

 

[narcotics999]

I too am finding this very interesting. Job market was good before the lockdown started so maybe just a return to pre-COVID expectations? Seems like most hospitals are up and running around 100% at this point.

2.5 months of backlog?
Old anesthesiologists retire or decrease work hours due to covid-19?

 

[chocomorsel]

2.5 months of backlog?
Old anesthesiologists retire or decrease work hours due to covid-19?

So the old sellouts are now scared for their lives? How interesting.

 

[deleted126335]

So the old sellouts are now scared for their lives? How interesting.

Not at all surprising.
Mortality is directly correlated with age and associated comorbidities. Perfectly rational choice.


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[BIGphysician]

I saw one of my colleagues make a comment recently that really struck a chord and made me take pause:

What would things look like if anesthesiologists unionized?

Given the assault on the profession on all fronts- I wonder if ASA, or anyone, has ever simulated an outcome if this occurs.


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[Tony C anesthesia]

I saw one of my colleagues make a comment recently that really struck a chord and made me take pause:

What would things look like if anesthesiologists unionized?

Given the assault on the profession on all fronts- I wonder if ASA, or anyone, has ever simulated an outcome if this occurs.


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Remember, the ASA is not there to protect us. The ASA is a money sucking scam as long as we are so idiots to pay them membership fees, etc. The ASA practically has done nothing but issuing useless statements.

 

[deleted126335]

Anybody care to share details of the Envision call ?😀

 

[cthrowaway]

I caught the last 20-30 minutes. It was only a pep rally where they tooted their own horns about how well they've weathered the storm.

All harmless, meaningless, vanilla-flavored rallying the troops. Nothing of any consequence, either good or bad.

Envision's corporate focus is clearly on ER doctors--and not anesthesiologists--but that's unlikely to be breaking news to anybody.