Estimated Costs of Veterinary School

[AuburnVet]

I too am a career changer from engineering. I am 36 going for next fall so I will be around 41 when I get out. Hey, you are gonna be 40 something one day, so why not go for it ?
Anyhow, I read this thread and I thought some of you might find this info helpful:

http://oregonstate.edu/financialaid/sites/default/files/loaninteresttables.pdf

It basically shows you how much your monthly payment is going to be based on the number of years and the amount of loan you pull out. I think for most of us, 150-160K would be normal for in-state tuition. That would put the payment at around 1800/month for 12 year-payment and around 1100 for 25-year payment. That is a lot of cheddar ,considering vets don't make as much. Depressing but what other choice is there?

IBR and ICR. Every single person here needs to look into it.

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[Mez]

Hello everyone, I took a quick look at what everyone was talking about here but I can't seem to find anyone who did international studies. I am Canadian and planning to attend a US or off shore school since I could not get in here after SEVERAL attempts and I am wondering if anyone who does not have parents or someone paying for their school did international studies and are paying it back them-self? Is the debt crippling or is it ok as long as you are smart with ur $? Did anyone come across good scholarships for international students? And what school is cheapest for international students?

Note: I started my own thread too but still couldn't find anyone who did international studies and are paying the debt themselves.

Thnx all!

 

[KCgophervet]

Hello everyone, I took a quick look at what everyone was talking about here but I can't seem to find anyone who did international studies. I am Canadian and planning to attend a US or off shore school since I could not get in here after SEVERAL attempts and I am wondering if anyone who does not have parents or someone paying for their school did international studies and are paying it back them-self? Is the debt crippling or is it ok as long as you are smart with ur $? Did anyone come across good scholarships for international students? And what school is cheapest for international students?

Note: I started my own thread too but still couldn't find anyone who did international studies and are paying the debt themselves.

Thnx all!

I'm not sure your issue is limited to just international students. I believe (feel free to correct me if I'm wrong!) that out of state tuition is the same whether you're coming from New Jersey, Ontario, or Zimbabwe. So I'm guessing there are A LOT of people around here who are accruing or in the process of accruing mountains of debt.

I was lucky enough to get into my in-state school, however since the U of MN has one of the highest in state tuition rates I'm in a boat similar to that of attending UW-Madison out of state.

There are posts floating somewhere around here (probably in this thread actually) that link to a map that has estimated total costs for each school/state depending on IS or OOS tuition rates.

Hope that helps (and is actually relevant, if there are different tuition rates for international students then my bad!)

 

[wildcatj]

For those of you who have access to VIN (and it might be accessible to those who don't) I found this EXTREMELY helpful in looking at the different loan repayment plans and helping to estimate if you can actually survive after vet school.

Just some general thoughts as I was looking at what my situation will probably be like...
I'm probably looking at ~200k in debt including undergrad if everything goes well. If I were to do PAYE (pay as you earn) I would be done making payments in 20 years but would have 117k worth of taxes in the end. I would never even touch my principle and I would still have 200k+ of unpaid interest. BUT if this option stays in place, the most I would ever pay in this scenario would be $750/mo (and that would be at the 20 year mark, hopefully I'll be making some money by then). In order to have enough saved up for taxes I would need to save ~$600/mo. A $1300/mo payment is at least doable, and most of the years would be significantly less. And that $600/mo is assuming no accumulating interest on the savings I'm putting aside.
Even the 25yr repayment plan is semi-doable at $1600/mo. Though the nice thing about PAYE is that on the off-chance that they change it so you don't have to pay taxes on the forgiven amount, then you just have a nice chunk of savings set aside.

 

[moosenanny]

Just so you are aware, not everyone qualifies for PAYE:

"Who is eligible for Pay As You Earn?
You must be a new borrower. You are a new borrower if you had no outstanding balance on a Direct Loan or FFEL Program loan as of Oct. 1, 2007, or if you had no outstanding balance on a Direct Loan or FFEL Program loan when you received a new Direct Loan or FFEL Program loan on or after Oct. 1, 2007. In addition, you must have received a disbursement of a Direct Subsidized Loan, Direct Unsubsidized Loan, or Direct PLUS Loan for graduate or professional students on or after Oct. 1, 2011, or you must have received a Direct Consolidation Loan based on an application that was received on or after Oct. 1, 2011."

 

[felinelvr44]

Just so you are aware, not everyone qualifies for PAYE:

"Who is eligible for Pay As You Earn?
You must be a new borrower. You are a new borrower if you had no outstanding balance on a Direct Loan or FFEL Program loan as of Oct. 1, 2007, or if you had no outstanding balance on a Direct Loan or FFEL Program loan when you received a new Direct Loan or FFEL Program loan on or after Oct. 1, 2007. In addition, you must have received a disbursement of a Direct Subsidized Loan, Direct Unsubsidized Loan, or Direct PLUS Loan for graduate or professional students on or after Oct. 1, 2011, or you must have received a Direct Consolidation Loan based on an application that was received on or after Oct. 1, 2011."

So you are ineligible if you have direct loans from undergrad? Am I reading that right?

 

[wildcatj]

Just so you are aware, not everyone qualifies for PAYE:

"Who is eligible for Pay As You Earn?
You must be a new borrower. You are a new borrower if you had no outstanding balance on a Direct Loan or FFEL Program loan as of Oct. 1, 2007, or if you had no outstanding balance on a Direct Loan or FFEL Program loan when you received a new Direct Loan or FFEL Program loan on or after Oct. 1, 2007. In addition, you must have received a disbursement of a Direct Subsidized Loan, Direct Unsubsidized Loan, or Direct PLUS Loan for graduate or professional students on or after Oct. 1, 2011, or you must have received a Direct Consolidation Loan based on an application that was received on or after Oct. 1, 2011."

Thanks for pointing that out. I believe I would qualify for it based on checking my eligibility earlier, but you're right, there are definitely people that would be excluded.

 

[felinelvr44]

For those of you who have access to VIN (and it might be accessible to those who don't) I found this EXTREMELY helpful in looking at the different loan repayment plans and helping to estimate if you can actually survive after vet school.

This is extremely helpful! (and extremely sobering)

 

[wildcatj]

So you are ineligible if you have direct loans from undergrad? Am I reading that right?

I didn't see this earlier felinelvr. But to answer your question, I, for example, should be eligible for PAYE because I didn't take out loans for undergrad until after Oct 1 2007. If you already had loans previous to that date you wouldn't be eligible.

 

[Kpowell14]

it is very aggervating that many VIN maps/ student loan simulators do not work on my ipad or iphone!

 

[cs5910]

For those of you who have access to VIN (and it might be accessible to those who don't) I found this EXTREMELY helpful in looking at the different loan repayment plans and helping to estimate if you can actually survive after vet school.

Just some general thoughts as I was looking at what my situation will probably be like...
I'm probably looking at ~200k in debt including undergrad if everything goes well. If I were to do PAYE (pay as you earn) I would be done making payments in 20 years but would have 117k worth of taxes in the end. I would never even touch my principle and I would still have 200k+ of unpaid interest. BUT if this option stays in place, the most I would ever pay in this scenario would be $750/mo (and that would be at the 20 year mark, hopefully I'll be making some money by then). In order to have enough saved up for taxes I would need to save ~$600/mo. A $1300/mo payment is at least doable, and most of the years would be significantly less. And that $600/mo is assuming no accumulating interest on the savings I'm putting aside.
Even the 25yr repayment plan is semi-doable at $1600/mo. Though the nice thing about PAYE is that on the off-chance that they change it so you don't have to pay taxes on the forgiven amount, then you just have a nice chunk of savings set aside.

That link made me cry... But was very helpful, thank you!

 

[SV88]

For those of you who have access to VIN (and it might be accessible to those who don't) I found this EXTREMELY helpful in looking at the different loan repayment plans and helping to estimate if you can actually survive after vet school.

Just some general thoughts as I was looking at what my situation will probably be like...
I'm probably looking at ~200k in debt including undergrad if everything goes well. If I were to do PAYE (pay as you earn) I would be done making payments in 20 years but would have 117k worth of taxes in the end. I would never even touch my principle and I would still have 200k+ of unpaid interest. BUT if this option stays in place, the most I would ever pay in this scenario would be $750/mo (and that would be at the 20 year mark, hopefully I'll be making some money by then). In order to have enough saved up for taxes I would need to save ~$600/mo. A $1300/mo payment is at least doable, and most of the years would be significantly less. And that $600/mo is assuming no accumulating interest on the savings I'm putting aside.
Even the 25yr repayment plan is semi-doable at $1600/mo. Though the nice thing about PAYE is that on the off-chance that they change it so you don't have to pay taxes on the forgiven amount, then you just have a nice chunk of savings set aside.

Your explanation made me feel much better

 

[gumtree]

Hey, I'm not sure if everyone caught this on the news, but here's a nice article explaining the interest rate increase on federal student loans: http://www.consumerfinance.gov/blog/changes-to-federal-student-loan-interest-rates/

As of last July, graduate and professional students cannot take out new subsidized loans, so this change won’t affect non-undergraduates. Again, this does not impact rates in loans you already took out or loans that aren’t based on financial need, like the Direct Unsubsidized Loan.

So as I understand it, this change has no effect on those of us who have completed undergrad and are in vet school. However, it will have an effect on students who apply for federal student loans to complete their undergraduate pre-vet education in the future. ..Right?

 

[TooLove]

I've just been told that 20,500 is the maximum allowed for veterinary students for an unsubsidized direct loan.... Why did I think it was 40,500?

 

[deb1123]

I've just been told that 20,500 is the maximum allowed for veterinary students for an unsubsidized direct loan.... Why did I think it was 40,500?

Whoever told you that was wrong. I just got my financial aid package today and got offered $36,762.00 for the ford federal unsubsidized [additional] loan The limit is most definitely not just 20,500.

I guess instead of it being called a "direct" loan, the 40,500 limit for vet students is called the "additional" loan.

 

[wildcatj]

I've just been told that 20,500 is the maximum allowed for veterinary students for an unsubsidized direct loan.... Why did I think it was 40,500?

It's 20500 with the exception of vet, med school, and some other professional programs that are eligible for 40500.

 

[TooLove]

Whoever told you that was wrong. I just got my financial aid package today and got offered $36,762.00 for the ford federal unsubsidized [additional] loan The limit is most definitely not just 20,500.

I guess instead of it being called a "direct" loan, the 40,500 limit for vet students is called the "additional" loan.

Okay that's good to know but I'm still seeing 20,500. I thought it would be changed by the school based on being in a professional program. Is it possible I applied for it incorrectly? I'm just panicking because I'll need to change my PLUS loan amount if that's the case..

 

[felinelvr44]

Okay that's good to know but I'm still seeing 20,500. I thought it would be changed by the school based on being in a professional program. Is it possible I applied for it incorrectly? I'm just panicking because I'll need to change my PLUS loan amount if that's the case..

Call your school's financial aid office. I had almost the exact same questions (and came here first to try and figure it out on my own) but with a 4-minute phone call to my school, had everything completely cleared up for me. I found some of the wording to be confusing for the loan amounts.

 

[TooLove]

Call your school's financial aid office. I had almost the exact same questions (and came here first to try and figure it out on my own) but with a 4-minute phone call to my school, had everything completely cleared up for me. I found some of the wording to be confusing for the loan amounts.

That was directly from financial aid

 

[felinelvr44]

That was directly from financial aid

You called and they said you were only eligible for $20,500? That seems really strange. My financial aid package on paper was a little confusing (and I also thought I could only get $20,500 just from looking at it on paper) but when I called the financial aid office and explicitly asked "I thought vet students were eligible for $40,500?" they cleared everything up for me.

 

[TooLove]

You called and they said you were only eligible for $20,500? That seems really strange. My financial aid package on paper was a little confusing (and I also thought I could only get $20,500 just from looking at it on paper) but when I called the financial aid office and explicitly asked "I thought vet students were eligible for $40,500?" they cleared everything up for me.

Yes I was told that only med students are eligible for $40,500. I'm sure this is incorrect but in the interest of time I had to up my PLUS amount to account for the difference. When I questioned it I was told that this is always how it's been done for vet students. I couldn't find anything about direct loans which explicitly says that vet students are eligible for the higher amount.

 

[wildcatj]

You're going to AVC, right? I don't know if it's different because it's international, but I would definitely talk to someone on here who goes there to ask about it. Because you don't want to take out extra PLUS loans if you can help it since the interest rate is so high.

 

[that redhead]

I only get $20,500...where does it say that we can get up to $40,500?

 

[TooLove]

You're going to AVC, right? I don't know if it's different because it's international, but I would definitely talk to someone on here who goes there to ask about it. Because you don't want to take out extra PLUS loans if you can help it since the interest rate is so high.

Yeah I spoke with someone who will be in my class, same as what redhead said. Apparently no one has ever questioned it? I can't find anywhere where it would limit international students from getting the same amount. Obviously I would like to take advantage of the lower interest rate. I will try to find a number to call when I get back in town.

 

[TooLove]

Update: Just got off the phone with the number on the federal aid website and got nowhere. Basically I spoke with a very nice man who regurgitated everything that is already written in the fine print when you get your loan info. He agreed that I should be eligible for more but basically their hands are tied because the amount you can borrow is determined by your school. Not really sure where to go from here. I might try to call the financial aid office of a different school to clarify. Are there any OVC US students on here who could weigh in?

 

[that redhead]

Yeah I spoke with someone who will be in my class, same as what redhead said. Apparently no one has ever questioned it? I can't find anywhere where it would limit international students from getting the same amount. Obviously I would like to take advantage of the lower interest rate. I will try to find a number to call when I get back in town.

Eileen, the loans lady, said she called the Dept of Education today and asked; we're ineligible because we're at a foreign school

 

[TooLove]

Eileen, the loans lady, said she called the Dept of Education today and asked; we're ineligible because we're at a foreign school

Yep she told me that too. I also talked to someone I know at OVC who said the same thing. Bummer. You would think that would be explicitly stated somewhere.

 

[vetassured]

Hey guys,

I've been wondering about this for a while. If I got accepted to an out-of-state school, could I go for a couple of years and become a resident somehow? Maybe if I had a house or family with jobs in that state?

 

[justavet]

Varies with the school. General answer is no.
I know of four schools that routinely reclassify out of state residents to instate after the first year:
OSU (the Ohio State University)
NCSU (North Carolina State U)
UCD (UC Davis) and
UMO (U of Missouri)

 

[vetassured]

Varies with the school. General answer is no.
I know of four schools that routinely reclassify out of state residents to instate after the first year:
OSU (the Ohio State University)
NCSU (North Carolina State U)
UCD (UC Davis) and
UMO (U of Missouri)

Good to know! Thank you

 

[vetassured]

Also, I have another question about residency. If I moved to another state and gained residency but didn't get into the veterinary school there, could I still apply as a resident in my home state or regain residency if accepted?

It just seems like a gamble to move somewhere, possibly not be accepted, and then not be considered a resident in your home state either.

 

[Jess Monster]

Also, I have another question about residency. If I moved to another state and gained residency but didn't get into the veterinary school there, could I still apply as a resident in my home state or regain residency if accepted?

It just seems like a gamble to move somewhere, possibly not be accepted, and then not be considered a resident in your home state either.

In my opinion this is why a person needs to be very discerning about where they want to attend. Where is your best chance of admission? Where do you really want to go? Where can you more easily/realistically afford?

You can't hold residency in two states at one time. So, yes, you would have to re-establish residency in your "home" state. I would agree that this would be a huge gamble.

Only one of the schools I'm applying to this year won't allow me to be a resident after my first year. Realistically, while a great school, if it accepted me as an OOS, there is a good possibility I'd say "no," unless they offer some kind of grant or scholarship that lowers the burden of that $54,000 tuition... for all four years. Regardless of where I go, I'm going to be making roughly the same amount of money when I'm out, so opting for a smaller debt burden is very important to me. If I have to go multiple cycles to get that "best" choice (which is my in-state), so be it. In the interim between now and acceptance, I will be making money and saving money.

 

[vetassured]

In my opinion this is why a person needs to be very discerning about where they want to attend. Where is your best chance of admission? Where do you really want to go? Where can you more easily/realistically afford?

You can't hold residency in two states at one time. So, yes, you would have to re-establish residency in your "home" state. I would agree that this would be a huge gamble.

Only one of the schools I'm applying to this year won't allow me to be a resident after my first year. Realistically, while a great school, if it accepted me as an OOS, there is a good possibility I'd say "no," unless they offer some kind of grant or scholarship that lowers the burden of that $54,000 tuition... for all four years. Regardless of where I go, I'm going to be making roughly the same amount of money when I'm out, so opting for a smaller debt burden is very important to me. If I have to go multiple cycles to get that "best" choice (which is my in-state), so be it. In the interim between now and acceptance, I will be making money and saving money.

I agree. It will be a good while before I apply, but I'm willing to reapply if needed in hopes of getting in a school that's affordable. Thank you for answering my question.

 

[twelvetigers]

Only one of the schools I'm applying to this year won't allow me to be a resident after my first year. Realistically, while a great school, if it accepted me as an OOS, there is a good possibility I'd say "no," unless they offer some kind of grant or scholarship that lowers the burden of that $54,000 tuition... for all four years. Regardless of where I go, I'm going to be making roughly the same amount of money when I'm out, so opting for a smaller debt burden is very important to me. If I have to go multiple cycles to get that "best" choice (which is my in-state), so be it. In the interim between now and acceptance, I will be making money and saving money.

What if they are the only school to accept you and offer no scholarship? Would you turn down your acceptance and try to apply to schools again?

Not trying to be standoffish, just making sure you have thought about that (just in case).

 

[Jess Monster]

What if they are the only school to accept you and offer no scholarship? Would you turn down your acceptance and try to apply to schools again?

Not trying to be standoffish, just making sure you have thought about that (just in case).

Without some kind of assistance, I would decline the offer. It's Colorado, btw. My chances as an OOS non-sponsored with lower than average stats don't work in my favor considering the size of their OOS applicant pool.

As it is, I may end up not applying there this year if my final recommender doesn't feel comfortable about the ETS-PPI evaluation (which is, imo, difficult for certain types of recommenders to complete).

 

[twelvetigers]

I wouldn't apply if you wouldn't go unless you feel like you really have a good chance to be offered additional support. What's the point?

 

[Jess Monster]

I wouldn't apply if you wouldn't go unless you feel like you really have a good chance to be offered additional support. What's the point?

It's still an excellent school with strong ties to federal regulatory agencies and there is always a possibility for some financial assistance.

I won't really know what type of assistance I'll be eligible for or the amount until (if) they offer me a seat. To me that possibility is at least worth the application fees.

I'm not expecting to be paying in-state tuition levels with financial assistance, but, as it stands, without any assistance, CSU will cost approximately $80,000 more than receiving a very similar education at Ohio State. Any decreases in that amount will be welcomed.

 

[CloudlessNights]

It's still an excellent school with strong ties to federal regulatory agencies and there is always a possibility for some financial assistance.

I won't really know what type of assistance I'll be eligible for or the amount until (if) they offer me a seat. To me that possibility is at least worth the application fees.

I'm not expecting to be paying in-state tuition levels with financial assistance, but, as it stands, without any assistance, CSU will cost approximately $80,000 more than receiving a very similar education at Ohio State. Any decreases in that amount will be welcomed.

I don't know if you know, but financial aid packages are usually handed out by most schools (not sure about CSU) after the May 15th deadline to accept an acceptance. That means you would have to pay the $500 deposit, and then potentially find out you have to decline anyway (if they didn't give you the aid you wanted).

 

[wildcatj]

I don't know if you know, but financial aid packages are usually handed out by most schools (not sure about CSU) after the May 15th deadline to accept an acceptance. That means you would have to pay the $500 deposit, and then potentially find out you have to decline anyway (if they didn't give you the aid you wanted).

I know there are some schools that you can't even apply for scholarships until after you get there.

 

[Mangojuice]

I have a student loan burden from my previous incarnations in undergrad and grad school.

As it happens, there is a very good vet school in my state. It's difficult for me to justify taking on OOS tuition, on top of my existing debt.

So I'm applying to the in-state school. I'm 49 and just beginning prereqs, which I am paying for without loan assistance. It doesn't really make sense for me to come out of this gig with 300k in debt at age 56.

Now if I had done this 20 years ago...

 

[Jess Monster]

I don't know if you know, but financial aid packages are usually handed out by most schools (not sure about CSU) after the May 15th deadline to accept an acceptance. That means you would have to pay the $500 deposit, and then potentially find out you have to decline anyway (if they didn't give you the aid you wanted).

I am aware. Before that deadline, the financial aid office at the school will be able to estimate what types of non-loan based aid you would be eligible for, including grants and some need based scholarships (obviously not the same as guaranteeing the money but it makes acceptance more promising). I've looked at some of the specific veterinary scholarships offered at CSU and, based on my background, I could qualify for a few of those as well. There is money available, of that I am sure.

I know there are some schools that you can't even apply for scholarships until after you get there.

From what I've seen those tend to be very specific scholarships to the vet school (donation funds from alumni and private trusts). Those are nice sources of money, but many are not renewable... at least based on CSU's list. I would be more focused on broader graduate/professional need-based aid offered at the university level. I've also looked into their work study programs and how those apply to professional students.

There is money out there. It's just a matter of how much would be enough to make OOS tuition feasible?

 

[hygebeorht]

I want to jump into the discussion as someone who applied to CSU and got in IS, but has also had IS friends accepted as OOS students.

For CSU, the difference is not trivial at all. It's mind-bogglingly expensive as an OOS school and pretty dang affordable as an IS school. So I understand your logic, Jess Monster. If you're looking for the best financial bet and you feel you are unlikely to get into CSU as an IS student, you may want to think about moving for residency somewhere else, or applying to somewhere like Missouri, which is affordable after gaining residency and is only a day's drive from CO. I would recommend applying to both, though. Applying to only one school is risky and can make the school feel safer about rejecting you since you aren't going to be going anywhere.

Just my 2c.

 

[Minnerbelle]

I looked at some of the specific veterinary scholarships offered at CSU and, based on my background, I could qualify for a few of those as well. There is money available, of that I am sure.

From what I've seen those tend to be very specific scholarships to the vet school (donation funds from alumni and private trusts). Those are nice sources of money, but many are not renewable... at least based on CSU's list. I would be more focused on broader graduate/professional need-based aid offered at the university level. I've also looked into their work study programs and how those apply to professional students.

There is money out there. It's just a matter of how much would be enough to make OOS tuition feasible?

Um... I don't want to be mean or anything but I would rethink this plan. The many private scholarships listed are essentially parsed out to all the PVM students so most people get a max of a couple thousand dollars... So no... there really isn't that much money out there. Unless there are specific large sum scholarships that you have a really good chance of getting (and even then that's risky), I wouldn't count on it.
If you wouldn't go there without significant scholarship money, I would not commit to going with the illusion that you will find money. If all you're risking is application costs to apply, by all means apply if it's worth it to you to see if they will offer you sig scholarship money. At least for c/o 2014 they did not require any deposit whatsoever to hold your spot, and interview costs are a nonissue. Unless something's changed... Quite possible since I'm so far removed from admission nowadays.

I'm pretty proactive about applying for scholarships and money opportunities, and I'm pretty good at snagging niches where I stand out, but in 3 years the amount I've made does not come close to the 80k differential you're considering

 

[Jess Monster]

Um... I don't want to be mean or anything but I would rethink this plan.... Unless there are specific large sum scholarships that you have a really good chance of getting (and even then that's risky), I wouldn't count on it.
If you wouldn't go there without significant scholarship money, I would not commit to going with the illusion that you will find money. If all you're risking is application costs to apply, by all means apply if it's worth it to you to see if they will offer you sig scholarship money.

The underlined is my intent. Application fees are a drop in the bucket compared to that extra tuition. Colorado is an excellent school and, financial issues aside, I would gladly attend if offered a seat. Realistically, though, if there is not enough potential aid to make it more financially appealing, it's not a viable option for someone who has debt from undergrad and graduate school (which I have). What I'm planning is to pay the couple hundred extra to apply and see if I even have a chance, which is the same risk every other pre-vet student undertakes when applying to multiple schools. If the amount can't be brought down to a level I would be comfortable with, I say "no" and don't reapply the next year.

This is why this plan is not risky to me, at all. I'll be out no more money than applying to any other school. Instead of them saying no, I may be the one saying no. Those are financially equal consequences of applying.

 

[twelvetigers]

So, here's my assumption. If you make it into CSU OOS, you are pretty likely to make it in IS or into another school OOS, so you will have a choice and it won't matter - you can see what happens and pick a place as you see fit.

However, if you somehow ONLY got into CSU, and then DIDN'T get the amount you wanted to negate the cost - then you would have to turn down an acceptance point blank and then apply the next year. Even if you don't apply to CSU again, I still feel like (because of your VMCAS or whatever) schools will know you previously applied, and I worry that they would know you were previously accepted. And would that somehow affect how they look at your app? I've always gotten the impression that it's taboo to turn down an acceptance like that.

That may be an unreasonable way to look at it, but that was what I was getting at in the first place.

 

[Jess Monster]

However, if you somehow ONLY got into CSU, and then DIDN'T get the amount you wanted to negate the cost - then you would have to turn down an acceptance point blank and then apply the next year. Even if you don't apply to CSU again, I still feel like (because of your VMCAS or whatever) schools will know you previously applied, and I worry that they would know you were previously accepted. And would that somehow affect how they look at your app? I've always gotten the impression that it's taboo to turn down an acceptance like that.

That may be an unreasonable way to look at it, but that was what I was getting at in the first place.

I understand. I agree that it's a taboo but I feel that it's a taboo held among pre-vet students more so than admitting institutions. I think there are many students that would balk at refusing your only acceptance, considering how much emphasis and energy is put into the application process. Some students can't stand the thought of waiting and will accept anything, anywhere - after all, dreams are priceless and, apparently, sometimes have expiration dates. Honestly, this is what I see as part of the financial problem with vet school though. Too many of us are too eager and too desperate just to get in that we perpetuate a system that is not working for us financially. Waiting for a favorable opportunity is not a bad thing, but you still have to seek out those opportunities by applying to different schools.

We need to be better at shopping around and we should expect schools to work with us to reduce the debt burden of that education, especially if they "want" us. If they can't do that, I say screw 'em. Walk away and look somewhere else. That's the only bargaining chip we have in this process and we're not using it well as a collective of very intelligent, capable students.

Anyway, schools can definitely see the current and perhaps the past institutions applied to but, as things are documented now on the VMCAS, there is no place to put what the final status of previous applications have been. That said, schools only know what you're legally required to tell them or what one institution is legally allowed to share with other schools about a student (which isn't much without the student's permission). If you never attended the school and you only declined the offer (which in and of itself is not unusual, considering many people receive multiple offers), I just can't imagine schools would care that much. There is no risk to them at all - they either have a long waitlist to replace you or another shot at getting your sweet, sweet loan dollars if you decline an offer somewhere else.

A student being negatively judged by a school for avoiding what she considers to be an irresponsible financial choice would be ridiculous to me, though I still suspect that the taboo is maintained by peers and "pre-vet" culture more so than the schools themselves.

Personally, I think from Day One our heads are filled with terrible financial advice, like discouragement from attending affordable community colleges, the huge push to build up 1000's of hours of what frequently become unpaid or poorly paid experiences, the inclination toward back-to-back schooling without taking time off to pay down loans and build up savings, etc.

 

[Minnerbelle]

We need to be better at shopping around and we should expect schools to work with us to reduce the debt burden of that education, especially if they "want" us.

The problem with this statement I think is that schools don't "want" us like you think they do. They want our money, and they'll take whatever best students will fill the seats that will give them the money. There are very few students that the schools will take a financial hit to take because the school wants them so badly.

 

[wildcatj]

The problem with this statement I think is that schools don't "want" us like you think they do. They want our money, and they'll take whatever best students will fill the seats that will give them the money. There are very few students that the schools will take a financial hit to take because the school wants them so badly.

Yeah, this really doesn't exist in vet school like it does in undergrad. There are 100 people lined up to take your place if you don't accept, and schools definitely remind you of that when you're applying.

 

[Jess Monster]

The problem with this statement I think is that schools don't "want" us like you think they do. They want our money, and they'll take whatever best students will fill the seats that will give them the money. There are very few students that the schools will take a financial hit to take because the school wants them so badly.

... and that's one of the biggest problems of this system. I know that schools don't really "want" students like that, but it's how this process should work. They want the bragging rights of having the best and the brightest but they want their purse too. That conflicts with what's best for the student and it's not sustainable at the current rate. Something is going to give.

Schools want student money, but the admission process shows that many schools are also very motivated to maintain prestige. I would guess that if more students were willing to turn down schools and wait for a better offer in following years, to the extent that many schools start noticing things like fewer applicants, falling class stats, and higher attrition rates, things would change more quickly. How much would schools be willing to do to prove how badly they "want" those high achieving students?

I don't have to accept an offer I'm not satisfied with and no one should feel compelled to do so either - even if the school kindly reminds you of how not-special and disposable you are, despite making it to the top of their list, and how many other students would gladly sacrifice their firstborns to Cthulhu to take your spot. We give schools their power. They need our money. That's the only way we'll change them.

 

[gfa240]

I am moving to Montreal damn it!