Everyone is taking Adderall

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Amit1

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I just found out a lot of people are taking this drug to increase their performance on the MCAT. They have been taking it every practice test to get used to the results. Is this putting me and everyone else at a disadvantage???

On an up note I study 1/3 as much as those guys and have been ripping them on the practice tests.

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I can't believe I'm reading some of these posts. You should feel like a wuss just for taking Adderall. It means you couldn't do it by yourself. Your own self-esteem and confidence is lowered by taking this stuff, moral/legal arguments be damned. False merit will eventually catch up to you, whether you realize it or not.
 
adderall is the newest gateway drug.
 
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Ladies and Gentlemen, I present to you one of the side effects of Adderall, inexplicable random spam-like posting on SDN!
 
ginko bilboa(spelling) is an herb that is given to aid in memory but it takes 3 months to get the full benefits

Keberson said:
are there OTC drugs that assist in concentrating?
 
I can speak on this topic from experience.

I got myself stressed, while I was dealing with some personal issues, got depressed started freezing up. Had a doctor diagnose me with prozac and aderall. Prozac didn't do anything because I wasn't actually depressed. However The adderal kept me working.

What happens though is you take it and each day you take it it does less for your brain and makes your nervous system more stimulated... you platue, and run out of dopamine. So you have to use more to get the same affect in about 4 days. What happens is within 4 days you already are much worse of studying or doing anything than you would be without having taken it at all.

It's not a magic drug, for long anyways. And it will just help you keep building the box of perfection and elitism around yourself until it all crashes down and you realize it really didn't matter that much to sacrifice your life to amphetamines.

Not to say it can't be used. It doesn't get you addicted to itself, you just get addicted to how clear you are able to think.... until you resting heart rate is 140 and you have a 160/125.
And.. if any of you have read harrypotter, do you remember the lucky potion. And how that worked? The first time you used it it was great but you could only use it a few times before it started reversing the effect....
 
The OP could also do a Heath Ledger on us too. Abusing drugs to make you performance better is stupid. The health professions are full of abusers, Anesthesiologists are the ones most likely to do a Heath Ledger, drug yourself up until you sleep to death.
 
lol... while studying maybe... but on the MCAT.... it just won't work

The people who even consider using this drug are simpy not confident in their own abilities... people who do well on the MCAT KNOW their material. If you don't know it, only a new brain might help... not this drug. If you walk in there thinking you will do well because of adderall, you will get owned. You have to be confident in your own abilities.
 
The people who even consider using this drug are simpy not confident in their own abilities... people who do well on the MCAT KNOW their material. If you don't know it, only a new brain might help... not this drug. If you walk in there thinking you will do well because of adderall, you will get owned. You have to be confident in your own abilities.

Very good statement. I agree. Using prescription drugs where they are not indicated and doing so illegally isn't the answer. Preparing for the MCAT properly is. Just because it's a commonly prescribed drug doesn't make it legal to take without a prescription or less dangerous. There are no shortcuts to medical school; at least none, in my opinion, that don't have a significant cost associated with them.

:thumbup:
 
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I worry about some of you would be "doctors"... this whole "drugs are the solution to everything" attitude is precisely what's wrong with psychiatry these days. Doctors are so willing to prescribe, prescribe, prescribe, at the drop of a hat.

And no wonder... look at all the pre-meds self-medicating!

People just like short-cuts I guess... and don't tell me there are no side effects to this behavior. You're taking a drug, it's messing with your nervous system, and of course there are going to be long-term repercussions, whether you admit it to yourself or not.

You could get the same results through practicing meditation, and/or exercising regularly. I find that if I exercise in the morning, I'm much better able to concentrate throughout the day. Ditto when I take the time to eat healthy and watch out for the glycemic index of foods.

I really think a lot of people (esp kids) being diagnosed as ADD could really be suffering simply the effects of living in unhealthy (physically or mentally) ways. If you don't get enough sleep, if you eat like crap, if you don't exercise, is it any wonder that your mind wanders when you try to study?

Even depression can often be alleviated through exercise or counseling just as well as through medication... yet what is a psychiatrist's first inclination? "Have some drugs!" It's a sad state of affairs... and one of the worst things about the model of Western medicine, which often neglects the body-mind connection.
 
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This is what I think:

Meds are ok if you medically need them, you can't help it if you actually need adderall to concentrate.

Taking vitamins and focusing on your nutrition to improve your thinking is alright as well. Athletes do this all the time.

Taking amphetamines to improve your focus to improve your scores is just wrong. I know that the pre-med environment can be tough but resorting to drugs (acquired illegally if you're not prescribed them) is not the answer. This is like all those athletes taking steroids. Sure, it might work, sure you might get away with it, sure you might be ok with the risks BUT the bottom line is that what you are doing is wrong.

I'd like to think that the people working in medicine are much more ethical than the general population but things like this undermines that belief. Becoming a doctor is not just about the numbers. It is about proving that you are intellectually and mentally ready to become a physician. In my mind, a student that uses these drugs to try to improve some numbers automatically fails the "readiness to become a physician" test. They are either 1) intellectually incapable so they must resort to "cheating" 2) or their sense of ethics has gone haywire. Either way, I wouldn't want physicians who have done this to touch me.

I believe that any ethical person can become a physician if they work hard enough at it. I also believe that it is possible for unethical people to become ethical if they work hard. Believe in your own abilities, not those of your drugs.

Guys, its the journey to become a doctor, not the end product that matters. If your journey is dishonest, what makes you think the doctor that comes out at the end will be any different? Would you want a doctor like that to be treating you or the ones you love? Think about it.
 
Not even that... but...

practically speaking, it just won't work

Sure... there's always that kid who got a 38 on his MCAT by taking adderall... but I guarantee that he would have pulled a 38 without taking adderall as well.

Adderall does NOT make you smarter or more hardworking
 
That's just unbelievable. Medicine is the profession with the highest incidence of drug abuse and you guys are getting started already. :(
As premed students, you should already know that there is o such thing as smart pills. You can take drugs that make you more awake, but if you are already a ***** that just makes you a wide awake *****. I hope no one seriously considering taking drugs to "help" their MCAT testing gets into med school. The profession and the patients would be ill served by someone like that.

Some people truly benefit from the effects of Adderall. The people on this board who are more calm and collected while on adderall may just "actually" need it.

I know there are other people who abuse it, but they, as was mentioned earlier, are likely doing more harm than good. Its a drug which benefits people with abnormal brain anatomy and physiology. If you're not one of those people, don't take it.

I personally was always bored out of my mind, can never focus, etc, etc, and it was affecting my MCAT studies. I thought I may need adderall or something similar. But, after a visit to my GP and some major research I realized the likely root of my problem was the fact that I never had to "work" in my classes and I just didn't know how to control myself and hadn't developed the discipline it takes to focus for long periods of time.

I sat my *** down, started studying, carefully considered what I could do to be a more efficient and more focused studier, and I'm improving.

So, for those of you who don't actually have ADD, it may behoove you to drop the Adderall and just force yourself to study and build up that stamina. Tthe adderall may inhibit you from maximizing your potential.
 
I agree, there's a reason why these meds are PRESCRIBED for people who actually need them. You'll get nasty side effects if you don't have it and take it for a short-cut. Because your brain is still developing, adderall will fry it and prevent you from learning, that's from some study I heard. Just study a lot and you'll be fine. I fear for the future of doctors if they are doing this already, just think what they'll do once they get access to meds. :(
 
I can speak on this topic from experience.

I got myself stressed, while I was dealing with some personal issues, got depressed started freezing up. Had a doctor diagnose me with prozac and aderall. Prozac didn't do anything because I wasn't actually depressed. However The adderal kept me working.

What happens though is you take it and each day you take it it does less for your brain and makes your nervous system more stimulated... you platue, and run out of dopamine. So you have to use more to get the same affect in about 4 days. What happens is within 4 days you already are much worse of studying or doing anything than you would be without having taken it at all.

It's not a magic drug, for long anyways. And it will just help you keep building the box of perfection and elitism around yourself until it all crashes down and you realize it really didn't matter that much to sacrifice your life to amphetamines.

Not to say it can't be used. It doesn't get you addicted to itself, you just get addicted to how clear you are able to think.... until you resting heart rate is 140 and you have a 160/125.
And.. if any of you have read harrypotter, do you remember the lucky potion. And how that worked? The first time you used it it was great but you could only use it a few times before it started reversing the effect....

NECRO ****ING POST
 
OH gee Adderall and Ritalin are so old-school.
Heres what I do to stay awake the OTC way.

Mix Red Bull + Dark Malaysian Black Coffee + Tabasco Sauce + 20 Packets of Fine Sugar ( i usually use Sweet n Low, id like it simple )

It should be about 1/4 cup of each, I usually eye it, mix it all in till its in a cup.
I mix around a bit till i reach the top of my mug or cup.
I take about 2-3 of these every 2 hrs.


Works =)
 
Sure... there's always that kid who got a 38 on his MCAT by taking adderall... but I guarantee that he would have pulled a 38 without taking adderall as well.

Adderall does NOT make you smarter or more hardworking

That's a guarantee that you would definitely lose. Unless you gave him alot of extra time to study/waste time if he didn't use it.

Of course this doesn't take into account the effect it'll have on him after he's through with the mcat.
 
That's a guarantee that you would definitely lose. Unless you gave him alot of extra time to study/waste time if he didn't use it.

Of course this doesn't take into account the effect it'll have on him after he's through with the mcat.

I even know several people personally who've tried it on the SAT and failed miserably. One was a pretty bright kid and took it before his SAT. He definitely had concentration.... but on his pencil... he could NOT stop focusing on his pencil.. and just ending up doing horribly and had to retake.

Ask any high scorer if they've ever taken it.. they simply do not need to. Self-confidence is key.

If you want to prove your point, take the MCAT twice for me.. once with aderall and once without adderall (within a short time frame)... actually, I dare you to try it.
 
I even know several people personally who've tried it on the SAT and failed miserably. One was a pretty bright kid and took it before his SAT. He definitely had concentration.... but on his pencil... he could NOT stop focusing on his pencil.. and just ending up doing horribly and had to retake.

So, you're telling me a person who wasn't diagnosed with ADD took adderall (an amphetamine) and reacted like a person without ADD on an amphetamine (tweaking out)? :D No surprise there, right? haha.
 
i think i could see adderall helping for an overnight mirco test you need to cram for but nothing like the mcat where you need to study for months (for most of us).

and if you really need adderall to help you with undergrad tests i feel sorry for you, if you can't hack the tests during undergrad i doubt you'll have enough patience to study for something like the mcat or do well on it.

and dont most medical schools screen for drugs after 1st year? ur gonna have a tough time explaining why you're testing positive for amphetamines with no prescription...
 
I know right. I was like "do I need to start taking some":eek:
Well I hate swallowing pills of any kind so that's out.

Anyway they just help you focus. Some exercising and deep breathing can do that.

The way people talk about taking them....it's like their "smart" pills of something:rolleyes: Like "take a handful of Adderall and you'll make a 40 on the MCAT"

If the WERE smart pills, then that would be a different story.
 
Anyone who advocates the unprescribed use of Adderall or any other controlled substance is in fact advocating abuse. Abuse has been defined several times on this thread, and several people have stated that they use Adderall w/o prescription.

This part has nothing to do with people's morals. It has everything to do with the legality and ethical standing of their actions.

Tolerating abuse is advocating abuse.

Word

:thumbup:
 
I can't entirely disagree with that quote, however, I personally think that the we are "over regulated" as a country and as a people, so I personally can't admonish anyone for recommending some sort of pharmaceutical/nutraceutical just because its against the law to partake of said pharma/nutra without a prescription. I would suggest always obeying laws while they are in effect, but I think we really need to reprioritize where our government concentrates its efforts. I.e. we really need to quit worrying about joe blow MCAT taking adderall and barry bonds taking steroids and focus on issues that are much more critical to the overall survival and success of our country (which I won't go into because I'm already teetering pretty far over the off-topic line right now).

/rant
 
As for the comments on ADD. ADD is a diagnosis that physicians use to make money for big wig pharmaceutical companies so they can make more money. Before pharmaceutical companies began to monopolize health care there was no such thing as ADD or many other clinical 'diagnosis' that can be treated with prescription medicines. You either choose to focus or you don't, ADD has existed as long as humans.

On students who take adderall: Anyone who needs to take adderall in order to enhance their performance will eventually pay the toll for it later in life. Its just like taking steroids as a short term crutch. Your putting something in your body that is not supposed to be their and has been synthesized in a lab somewhere. But at least all you loners who take adderall will know what to blame later in life when you have severe health complications that our generation hasn't seen because of the recent onset of this pill poping craze in our generation. At least there will be physicians out there who didn't take any short cuts to treat you ;p.
 
As for the comments on ADD. ADD is a diagnosis that physicians use to make money for big wig pharmaceutical companies so they can make more money.
/me looks for black helicopters.

Are you going into medicine?

Before pharmaceutical companies began to monopolize health care there was no such thing as ADD or many other clinical 'diagnosis' that can be treated with prescription medicines. .
There didn't used to be such a thing as AIDS, or cancer, and so on and so forth, that we were aware of, however, they DO exist!

ADD DOES exist, although it is probably very over-diagnosed. There are very specific physiological and even anatomical differences that can be observed in a person with ADD as opposed to a person who is considered "normal". The same thing goes for the various ADHD's.

Another thing: just because something is "synthetic" doesn't mean its inherently bad. And just because something isn't synthetic doesn't mean its inherently good!
 
Just a word of caution... some of these posts are coming awfully close to being construed as providing medical advice- which none of you are allowed to do, and which we don't permit on SDN.

If things cross the line, I will be closing this thread. Please be careful with your comments.
 
So, you're telling me a person who wasn't diagnosed with ADD took adderall (an amphetamine) and reacted like a person without ADD on an amphetamine (tweaking out)? :D No surprise there, right? haha.

lol yup

I've seen people get decent results on regular school tests b/c they need the concentration to concentration on tests/absorb information.

But on the MCAT, you're not simply absorbing... your recall has to improve, something I don't think adderall will help with.
 
I even know several people personally who've tried it on the SAT and failed miserably. One was a pretty bright kid and took it before his SAT. He definitely had concentration.... but on his pencil... he could NOT stop focusing on his pencil.. and just ending up doing horribly and had to retake.

Ask any high scorer if they've ever taken it.. they simply do not need to. Self-confidence is key.

If you want to prove your point, take the MCAT twice for me.. once with aderall and once without adderall (within a short time frame)... actually, I dare you to try it.

Yeah you're right, doing almost anything new or unfamiliar during the test just adds extra challenge. I thought you meant if he was also using it to study for test from atleast a month before.
 
(+)

Dextroamphetamine can enhance working memory and verbal memory consolidation in healthy humans. However, working memory improvements will only result from individuals with suboptimal dopaminergic signaling in the prefrontal cortex (the front part of your brain).

Further, the response is represented by an "inverted U" shaped curve. Too much dopamine will impair performance.

(-)

In nonhuman primates, Dextroamphetamine has been shown to induce "enduring" atrophic changes in the dendritic spines of the prefrontal cortex lasting >3 years post-drug! Additionally, amphetamine sensitization (an augmented psychomotor response to subsequent drug "challenges") is associated with impaired spatial working memory and sustained visual attention. This sucks... big time.

Conclusion:

I am not so sure at this point. Toxicity at therapeutic dosages has not been well studied. There is no consensus in the literature. Adderall may very well help a healthy human perform better on some neuropsychological tests but it seems like this use will be accompanied by a "persistent" deficit. Personally, I wouldn't touch it because sensitization (while it may be reversible with some treatment... probably antipsychotics) could occur to some degree in just a few doses of the drug.



Neuropsychopharmacology. 2007 Apr;32(4):919-31. Epub 2006 Aug 16.

Amphetamine sensitization alters dendritic morphology in prefrontal cortical pyramidal neurons in the non-human primate.
Selemon LD, Begović A, Goldman-Rakic PS, Castner SA.

1Department of Neurobiology, Yale University School of Medicine, New Haven, CT 06520-8001, USA. [email protected]

Amphetamine (AMPH) sensitization in the nonhuman primate induces persistent aberrant behaviors reminiscent of the hallmark symptoms of schizophrenia, including hallucinatory-like behaviors, psychomotor depression, and profound cognitive impairment. The present study examined whether AMPH sensitization induces similarly long-lasting morphologic alterations in prefrontal cortical pyramidal neurons. Three to 3(1/2) years postsensitization, sensitized, and AMPH-naïve control monkeys were killed. Blocks of prefrontal cortex were Golgi-impregnated for elucidation of pyramidal dendritic morphology in layers II/superficial III (II/IIIs), deep III, and V/VI. In AMPH-sensitized animals as compared to AMPH-naïve controls, pyramidal dendrites in layer II/IIIs exhibited reduced overall dendritic branching and reduced peak spine density (22%) on the apical trunk. Across all layers, the distance from soma to peak spine density along the apical trunk was decreased (126.38+/-7.65 mum in AMPH-sensitized compared to 162.98+/-7.26 microm in AMPH-naïve controls), and basilar dendritic length was reduced (32%). These findings indicate that chronic dopamine dysregulation, consequent to AMPH sensitization, results in enduring, atrophic changes in prefrontal pyramidal dendrites that resemble the pathologic alterations described in patients with schizophrenia and may contribute to the persistence of schizophrenia-like behavioral changes and cognitive dysfunction associated with sensitization. These findings may also provide key insights into the etiologic origin of the pronounced behavioral disturbances and cognitive dysfunction associated with schizophrenia.



Biol Psychiatry. 2005 Apr 1;57(7):743-51.

Amphetamine sensitization impairs cognition and reduces dopamine turnover in primate prefrontal cortex.
Castner SA, Vosler PS, Goldman-Rakic PS.

Department of Psychiatry, Yale University School of Medicine, New Haven, Connecticut 06519, USA. [email protected]

BACKGROUND: Amphetamine (AMPH) sensitization in monkeys produces long-lasting behavioral changes that model positive (hallucinatory-like behaviors) and negative (psychomotor depression) symptoms of schizophrenia. The extent to which this model produces the core deficit in schizophrenia--working memory impairment--is unknown. METHODS: Two groups of rhesus monkeys were sensitized to AMPH over 6 weeks. In one group, acquisition of cognitive tasks (delayed response, visual discrimination, delayed nonmatch-to-sample) was examined beginning 6+ months postsensitization. The second group was pretrained to stability on delayed response before sensitization. Regional postmortem concentrations of dopamine and its metabolites were examined in tissue from age-matched AMPH-naive and AMPH-sensitized monkeys using high-performance liquid chromatography with electrochemical detection (HPLC-ECD). RESULTS: The AMPH-sensitized monkeys were profoundly impaired in their ability to acquire cognitive tasks compared with AMPH-naïve monkeys. Pretrained monkeys showed impaired delayed response performance for several months following sensitization. Analysis by HPLC revealed that AMPH sensitization significantly reduced dopamine turnover in prefrontal cortex and striatum. CONCLUSIONS: Impairments in the acquisition and performance of spatial delayed response in association with reduced dopamine turnover in prefrontal cortex following AMPH sensitization provide further support for the relevance of this model to both the etiology and the treatment of cognitive dysfunction in schizophrenia.
 
Anyone who advocates the unprescribed use of Adderall or any other controlled substance is in fact advocating abuse. Abuse has been defined several times on this thread, and several people have stated that they use Adderall w/o prescription.

This part has nothing to do with people's morals. It has everything to do with the legality and ethical standing of their actions.

Tolerating abuse is advocating abuse.

Word

So go get a prescription if you want to take adderall. Cheap and legal. :)
 
form what i hear from my friends at berkeley, not necessarily pre-meds, but some are, adderall is pretty commonplace over there. i dont think its such a big deal if you use it, ethically wise. i hear it just gets you VERY focused. no jitters, no crash, none of that. seems like they need to make this stuff over the counter.
 
i dont think people are saying that taking aderall can subsitute for studying. people are not saying that it is a "magic pill-take it and youll do well"...so some of you are over reacting. what people are trying to say is, after studying for the exam and already knowing the material, you can take aderall on test day to stay focused. thats all aderall does. no one is claiming that its a magic "smart pill".
 
Adderall is so last year!

Meth is where its at.

Really though, Adderall or whatever amphetamine of choice wont help you get a better score on your MCAT if you aren't preparing, lets be realistic.
 
Propanolol = XANEX = highly highly highly addictive!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


I'm not sure if anyone addressed this comment, but WTF?! Propanolol is a Beta Blocker. It has nothing to do with Xanax (a Benzo). It will lower your blood pressure and take the edge off nervousness. Many people take propanolol for test taking anxiety, tremor, or public speaking.

I'd like to add that taking Adderall is completely legit if you actually need it. If you don't need it, then you will start to feel speedy and experience undesirable effects (shakiness, anxiety, etc.). Adderall won't make anyone get a higher score unless they actually need the medication.
 
Adderall is so last year!

Meth is where its at.

Really though, Adderall or whatever amphetamine of choice wont help you get a better score on your MCAT if you aren't preparing, lets be realistic.


[YOUTUBE]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t-3qncy5Qfk[/YOUTUBE]
 
Has anyone every tried using propanolol to help relieve anxiety and to increase your ability to focus and study? I have never tried ritalin but while studying for both finals and the MCAT a week ago I tried propanolol to reduce the anxiety. This completely reduces anxiety and makes it easy to focus on what you are studying rather than on the future and tests.

hmmm...propanol is used for hypertension. Some doc's prescribe it to lessen certain anxiety effects such as heart palpitations, but never heard of it being used to reduce anxiety or make you focus. Propanol is a very mild Beta-blocker so it doesn't work as well as Adderall.

The bottom line is no drugs can make you do better on a test; you have to already have the knowledge in you. For example, a person who has ADHD may perform better on an exam with adderall than without, but its not really going to help someone who has no trouble focusing. No drug can make a dumb person perform better on a test! Now, if they come out with a "smart-drug" I'll be the first one in line!
 
Come on guys, take some of this evidence of schizophrenic side effects with a grain of salt. Your not going to have voices telling you to kill people if you take 10-20 mgs. The people that get the schizo side effects have been taking 100+ mgs and have not slept for 2+ days (I've seen it first-hand). So even in that case the schizophrenic side effects can't be completely from just excessive amp use. The lack of sleep can cause hallucinations also.

You guys realize that going into a practice there are going to be drug seekers that will doctor shop for their 'tabs, adderall, benzos, oxys, dexes, and whatnot. I have a lot of friends that do a LOT of drugs. Some of them are never going to amount to anything, and some of them are responsible and are still able to pull off stellar grades and keep good jobs. It's all about moderation. IMHO I think the drug war is stupid, and too many non-violent people are being locked up for things that shouldn't be illegal. Addiction is a DISEASE not a crime. Anyways, I'm off my soapbox.

For the above poster, adderall DOES make you work harder. You take less breaks and can get way more done that regularly. One day I studied physics for 12 straight hours. One subject for twelve hours, not an easy accomplishment. I tell you one thing, maybe not for the actual MCAT, but adderall helped me prep way harder than I could otherwise.

Oh and BTW I actually am prescribed. I was diagnosed when I was around 10 so I don't even get the euphoric effects people speak of. I just makes me hyper focused and whatever I'm doing interesting enough to where I don't want to do anything else.

It would be way harder with inattentive ADD to study for the MCAT, because it is a long-haul proces and there are WAY too many distractions.
 
weed is better than adderall. everything makes sense. verbal? like poetry baby. the focus is unparalled. i suggest everyone toke up, it makes a world of a difference (physics, becomes the ****)

on a side note, i think adderall depends on the user. imagine a confident, hard working student who knows his stuff, and who has no dependence on the drug. if he one day decides to take it, do you really not think it would give him a leg up? come on now

on the other hand, imagine a poor student who has no confidence in his studying abilities and has poor study habits. he takes the drug because he thinks he needs it to do well and focus on tasks at hand. the drug might make him do better than other kids who have poor study habits, but compared to a sober, studious, critically thinking student, he will still probably perform worse

really, its just a drug. if its not perscribed to you and you don't have ADHD it depends on your ethics/morality
 
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lol, i was thinking the exact same thing while reading this thread. man, would i like to get my hands on some of that...
Then have sleep apnea and get a sleep study done and start falling asleep at 11am after waking up fresh, or so you thought.

TBH, a couple cups of tea, spaced over two hours after waking and lasting into the first hour of school along with drinking a lot of water, cutting carbs (due to the crash), and regular cardio exercise worked wonders.
 
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