Experiences of PharmD's applying for MBA

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greenteapanacea

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I was wondering if any pharmacists would like to share their experiences with applying to and/or attending business school. Were adcoms confused by your degree and professional background? How difficult was the transition from clinical work to business courses?

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Why would you want to waste more time and money? If PharmDs are a dime a dozen, MBAs (just like law degrees) are a nickel a dozen.
 
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What job can a pharmacist get a with an mba that he couldn't get without one?
 
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Why would you want to waste more time and money? If PharmDs are a dime a dozen, MBAs (just like law degrees) are a nickel a dozen.
Because PharmD/MBAs are a rare breed while PharmD/MBA/PhDs are yet a rarer breed. So more power to the PharmD/MBA/MBA/MD/PA/RN/PT/JD/OD/DDS who has that holistic view on healthcare and has all their bases covered from a knowledge standpoint. Who wouldn’t hire someone with that kind of experience/knowledge?


(On a side note though, one of my former preceptors in school had 3 graduate degrees on top of their PharmD which just makes me do a double face palm)
 
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I was wondering if any pharmacists would like to share their experiences with applying to and/or attending business school. Were adcoms confused by your degree and professional background? How difficult was the transition from clinical work to business courses?
Adcoms are seeing enough healthcare folks applying for MBAs that you won’t be a black sheep or anything like that. Every single one in the T50 has had at least some representation of MDs, PhDs or PharmDs in the past. In fact your doctorate will be an asset.

In general, business courses are easier than clinical and shouldn’t pose an issue.

Why would you want to waste more time and money? If PharmDs are a dime a dozen, MBAs (just like law degrees) are a nickel a dozen.
This isn’t true of all MBAs, though. It makes sense to get one if looking to advance, particularly for positions that look for it as a pre-requisite. I’m not as familiar with the hospital world but have heard that’s the case for DOPs?

What job can a pharmacist get a with an mba that he couldn't get without one?
Don’t know OPs reason for wanting one but if not for advancement, MBAs can be used to pivot to another industry, functional area, etc - a reset card of sorts.
 
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They will be familiar with pharmacy degrees. I’m getting an MBA and I swear like 1/3 of the class is in pharmacy school.
It’ll be interesting to see if it works out...
 
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FWIW, the four people I know who got MBAs got absolutely nothing out of them.
 
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Any degree is worthless without purpose and application.

While my peers mocked business simulations and how 'easy' the tests were, I loved my MBA classes.

I continuously thought of ways to apply didactics in real life pharmacy scenarios.

Getting an MBA was like my playground for business and entrepreneurship.

I am finding as I ascend in my career, my MBA is becoming more and more useful.
 
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FWIW, the four people I know who got MBAs got absolutely nothing out of them.
What careers/positions were they in before the MBA and after the MBA?

My experience has been that those people fall into a few categories:
1. Dual degree candidates
2. Online MBAs without job sponsorship
3. Retail pharmacy or hospital pharmacy staffing without plan/sponsorship (ending up in the same place)

There are definitely people for whom an MBA makes plenty of sense. e.g. hospital staff pharmacist being groomed for DOP, retail -> industry/corporate, industry med affairs -> industry bus dev, hospital -> med tech PM, etc. It just takes some planning and timing, and think OP should apply if it would be beneficial.
 
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Get a manager job BEFORE doing an MBA. And retail PIC is not a real manager job, you are 95% production work.
 
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What careers/positions were they in before the MBA and after the MBA?

My experience has been that those people fall into a few categories:
1. Dual degree candidates
2. Online MBAs without job sponsorship
3. Retail pharmacy or hospital pharmacy staffing without plan/sponsorship (ending up in the same place)

There are definitely people for whom an MBA makes plenty of sense. e.g. hospital staff pharmacist being groomed for DOP, retail -> industry/corporate, industry med affairs -> industry bus dev, hospital -> med tech PM, etc. It just takes some planning and timing, and think OP should apply if it would be beneficial.

Two in marketing, two in engineering. They didn't get a raise or promotion or anything, it was literally a waste for them. The big wigs in their companies didn't have MBAs so they didn't find them valuable.
 
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Ask yourself this...if anyone can get an MBA nowadays, then what is the value in it?
 
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Two in marketing, two in engineering. They didn't get a raise or promotion or anything, it was literally a waste for them. The big wigs in their companies didn't have MBAs so they didn't find them valuable.
I think that goes back to the idea of sponsorship - someone in your organization should specifically say or imply that you need it to advance. It’s not like MBA = auto promotion.

Ask yourself this...if anyone can get an MBA nowadays, then what is the value in it?
I see why MBAs have this rep and generally I agree, but there’s a bit of nuance here... It’s valuable if someone can make use of its core purposes: reputational boost, recruiting opportunities and/or peer/alumni network.

Some people say the same thing about the PharmD. How do we differentiate ourselves?
Through skills and experiences, not credentials.
 
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Why not add a law degree on top of it?

Snakiness aside, it’s another saturated degree
 
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I think that goes back to the idea of sponsorship - someone in your organization should specifically say or imply that you need it to advance. It’s not like MBA = auto promotion.


I see why MBAs have this rep and generally I agree, but there’s a bit of nuance here... It’s valuable if someone can make use of its core purposes: reputational boost, recruiting opportunities and/or peer/alumni network.

Through skills and experiences, not credentials.


Meh. My company suggested i should really consider it because I was the natural choice to be director. Buuutttt I would’ve been director anyway. Still a waste of my time and money.
 
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Meh. My company suggested i should really consider it because I was the natural choice to be director. Buuutttt I would’ve been director anyway. Still a waste of my time and money.
I don’t profess to know about your situation, but from what I’ve been told I would imagine it would help keep you competitive vs. other DOPs in switching jobs.

Regardless, there is still certainly a use for an MBA for some people, as it might for OP.
 
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Really a waste of money in majority of cases especially all these kids who have no work experience, who are getting MBAs
 
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What type of MBA? Are you referring to the dual degree or University of Phoenix crap? Or a more prestigious Executive MBA, etc from Wharton, Harvard, etc.?
 
What type of MBA? Are you referring to the dual degree or University of Phoenix crap? Or a more prestigious Executive MBA, etc from Wharton, Harvard, etc.?
My personal worthless MBA is not a dual degree or online MBA, nor a ranked MBA program, nor exec MBA program.

Standard, state school, in-person MBA. Prob would’ve been better off with a BIS degree or MPH.
 
My personal worthless MBA is not a dual degree or online MBA, nor a ranked MBA program, nor exec MBA program.

Standard, state school, in-person MBA. Prob would’ve been better off with a BIS degree or MPH.
In hindsight, would you have attended a better MBA program? E.g ranked, eMBA
 
A PharmD/MBA is almost worthless unless your MBA is a top 10 MBA and you're looking to switch into non-retail based pharmacy. You'll be competitive for industry jobs, start-ups, and administrative jobs. If you have a HBS/GBS/Wharton/Sloan degree, you won't be starving for a job.
 
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A PharmD/MBA is almost worthless unless your MBA is a top 10 MBA and you're looking to switch into non-retail based pharmacy. You'll be competitive for industry jobs, start-ups, and administrative jobs. If you have a HBS/GBS/Wharton/Sloan degree, you won't be starving for a job.



In hindsight, would you have attended a better MBA program? E.g ranked, eMBA

Is eMBA better?
I wouldn’t have attended a better MBA program. I’m just not clear on what an MBA gets anyone. I did it because I work in managed care and I my boss said “oh you should”. It hasn’t changed my job or salary and it likely never will. When we look at pharmacists with an MBA for hiring, we typically pass over them for one reason or another (make too much money, don’t want an entry level managed care job, etc).

I would do MPH because I think it translates into other sectors better along with a PharmD (Public health, quality, etc).


I would argue if you have a Harvard, Wharton, etc MBA, then your pharmacy degree was probably pointless (and pharmacy degree is cheaper)
 
A PharmD/MBA is almost worthless unless your MBA is a top 10 MBA and you're looking to switch into non-retail based pharmacy. You'll be competitive for industry jobs, start-ups, and administrative jobs. If you have a HBS/GBS/Wharton/Sloan degree, you won't be starving for a job.
T50 should still be fine provided the school recruits for the jobs desired, though shooting as high as possible would be a good idea. Eg many of Anthem’s corp strat employees come from Indiana University. Same with UHG’s Corp dev and UW-Madison, and same with pharma for Rutgers in various roles.
Is eMBA better?
I wouldn’t have attended a better MBA program. I’m just not clear on what an MBA gets anyone. I did it because I work in managed care and I my boss said “oh you should”. It hasn’t changed my job or salary and it likely never will. When we look at pharmacists with an MBA for hiring, we typically pass over them for one reason or another (make too much money, don’t want an entry level managed care job, etc).

I would do MPH because I think it translates into other sectors better along with a PharmD (Public health, quality, etc).


I would argue if you have a Harvard, Wharton, etc MBA, then your pharmacy degree was probably pointless (and pharmacy degree is cheaper)
From what I’ve seen this largely depends on industry and function. Hospital and managed care are generally more brand agnostic and other degrees find use as well (Eg MHA for hospital, MPH for managed care). For pharma MPHs see less use except in areas like HEOR/market access (naturally, as managed care’s counterpart). Same with Comm Strat, Bus Dev, Corp Strat - mostly MBAs here.
 
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T50 should still be fine provided the school recruits for the jobs desired, though shooting as high as possible would be a good idea. Eg many of Anthem’s corp strat employees come from Indiana University. Same with UHG’s Corp dev and UW-Madison, and same with pharma for Rutgers in various roles.
From what I’ve seen this largely depends on industry and function. Hospital and managed care are generally more brand agnostic and other degrees find use as well (Eg MHA for hospital, MPH for managed care). For pharma MPHs see less use except in areas like HEOR/market access (naturally, as managed care’s counterpart). Same with Comm Strat, Bus Dev, Corp Strat - mostly MBAs here.


Do you work in pharma? Do you hire? Does seeing an MBA on a resume sway you either way? What about managed care experience?

I will say that sometimes I view an MBA as a negative, particularly if we are looking for a more MTM type role. Never had an MBA be the reason we did interview but have had it be a reason we didn’t.
 
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Do you work in pharma? Do you hire? Does seeing an MBA on a resume sway you either way? What about managed care experience?

I will say that sometimes I view an MBA as a negative, particularly if we are looking for a more MTM type role. Never had an MBA be the reason we did interview but have had it be a reason we didn’t.
Worked in pharma. Currently hire in a different field. Personally it wouldn't, but an MPH or MHA wouldn't sway me either - moreso work experience and the particular institutions they came from as I consider the PharmD enough for most things related to healthcare. I myself decided an MBA wouldn't be worth it for me at this juncture and am exploring whether an MS in Comp Sci or MS/MBA would serve my needs better in a few years.

There is definitely an MBA bias in certain areas, though - about 60% of the people at my level for my line of work are T15 MBAs with the majority hailing from M7, and the other 40% PhDs, MDs, JDs. A good MBA provides switching opportunities that other degrees may or may not provide. For example you're not as likely to get into commercial pharma from retail by going the MPH route - it's just not as relevant. Same story for CVS or Walgreens Growth Strategy or Innovation.

I can see why that might be the case for an MTM pharmacist, and if that's OP's goal maybe another option would be better. All of this to say that there is a time and place for each degree. Not as likely to advance in HEOR without an MPH or PhD, and an MBA is certainly not going to land a job at the CDC.
 
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You would need to have a gameplan in place. The need for professionals who understand both the science/technology/healthcare and financials/business is quite large actually.

Just depends on planning. No need to go to (insert community colleges here) for an MBA. Like previously said, it is much more advantageous for you to aim for a FULL-TIME T15 if you are early on in your career. Your networking opportunities will be unparalleled.

If later on, then spring for a eMBA or part-time depending on seniority.
 
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When I first read this thread, I took it to be very negative against MBAs for PharmDs. Upon re-reading, I think the consensus is that you should only get an MBA for the right reasons. You should provide us with more background and your career goals. Everyone need plans A, B, and C for finding permanent employment after pharmacy school and I commend you for planning early.

Remember the first day of pharmacy school when they asked everyone to go around and share their background? I’d bet that ninety percent of your pharmacy classmates said they were Biology majors Chemistry minors with a B.S. Imagine if employers asked the same question to those same students four years later. All but a few would say that they are PharmDs. How are you going to distinguish yourself from every other new PharmD with a license in hand? There are many ways to distinguish yourself so early in your career, and an MBA is one of them.

I am very positive towards MBAs but recognize that they are not for everyone. Long story short, having my MBA got me a job I wouldn't have otherwise qualified for since it requires an MBA but not a PharmD. Adding an AACSB accredited live in-person MBA to my PharmD only cost me $31,745 ($19,215 in tuition and $12,530 in loan refunds to live on) plus seven months of opportunity cost of being out of the job market. Keep in mind I was taking an MBA class or two each semester after my third semester of pharmacy school, so that I would only have twelve credits to do after I walked for my PharmD.

@greenteapanacea are you considering enrolling in an MBA after your PharmD, starting a part-time/distance MBA during your APPE year, or formally switching to a dual PharmD+MBA program at your current university?
 
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Because PharmD/MBAs are a rare breed while PharmD/MBA/PhDs are yet a rarer breed. So more power to the PharmD/MBA/MBA/MD/PA/RN/PT/JD/OD/DDS who has that holistic view on healthcare and has all their bases covered from a knowledge standpoint. Who wouldn’t hire someone with that kind of experience/knowledge?


(On a side note though, one of my former preceptors in school had 3 graduate degrees on top of their PharmD which just makes me do a double face palm)

I see multiple professional or post-bac degrees as a lifestyle. Similar to the PGY-4.
 
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I think that goes back to the idea of sponsorship - someone in your organization should specifically say or imply that you need it to advance. It’s not like MBA = auto promotion.


I see why MBAs have this rep and generally I agree, but there’s a bit of nuance here... It’s valuable if someone can make use of its core purposes: reputational boost, recruiting opportunities and/or peer/alumni network.

Through skills and experiences, not credentials.

I agree. There are a couple of instances where a MBA is actually handy at a technical level if the major is mathematical/computational finance (stochastic calculus for majors not for mickeys as part of the course) or supply chain management/logistics. However, it's still about the networks as if you're good enough, people find you rather than the opposite. A couple of my students were recruited and presently work for Renaissance that were taught that background (although their actual majors were statistical demography rather than computational finance).
 
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Wow, I didn't expect this thread to expand so quickly!

I'm currently a hospital staff pharmacist, and will eventually move into an industry/agency role after a few years of patient-care. I've read enough on multiple forums to realize that an MBA without experience is useless, so I plan on applying after about 4-5 years. Full/part time attendance depends on whether I am satisfied with my role or seeking to change at that time (I realize that part-time students lose out on career services and internship).

Hypothetical career projection: small community hospital 1-2 years > Memorial Sloan Kettering or Presbyterian 1-2 years > Pharma/Agency (most likely Safety/Med Info/Reg Affairs related role) > business school.
 
Honestly, the above plan makes little sense. No need for MBA in any of the roles you mentioned after the 2nd > Just my opinion

If you said, small hospital > big hospital > healthcare admin or consulting or IB/PE/VC (you know, the things you actually need a MBA for) then go for it

Won't kill your dreams, but maybe seek the advice of someone who has a PharmD/MBA in the roles you described and ask how their career turned out. Good luck
 
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Honestly, the above plan makes little sense. No need for MBA in any of the roles you mentioned after the 2nd > Just my opinion

If you said, small hospital > big hospital > healthcare admin or consulting or IB/PE/VC (you know, the things you actually need a MBA for) then go for it

Won't kill your dreams, but maybe seek the advice of someone who has a PharmD/MBA in the roles you described and ask how their career turned out. Good luck

I think you've misread my plan. I plan on moving through those job areas before I apply for business school, precisely because I don't need an MBA for said roles. I intend on moving into management consulting/business functional areas after an MBA.
 
I have the GI bill so I'm trying to decide if I should pursue a MBA or MPH or something totally random like bachlors in Spanish or masters in finance. I like personal finance, investing, and handling money.
 
I have the GI bill so I'm trying to decide if I should pursue a MBA or MPH or something totally random like bachlors in Spanish or masters in finance. I like personal finance, investing, and handling money.


I also like money and finance. There is precisely one class in an MBA on this.

Go for finance if you want to learn more about finance. Go for economics if you like economics.

Go for mph if you want to do more population health or quality work.

I would really only do MBA if I was shooting for like district manager at a chain or Director of pharmacy in a hospital. Maybe some industry roles I’m not familiar with.

All this to say, pick the job you want first. Don’t get an MBA because it’s all you could think of and they are everywhere like I did.
 
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Wow, I didn't expect this thread to expand so quickly!

I'm currently a hospital staff pharmacist, and will eventually move into an industry/agency role after a few years of patient-care. I've read enough on multiple forums to realize that an MBA without experience is useless, so I plan on applying after about 4-5 years. Full/part time attendance depends on whether I am satisfied with my role or seeking to change at that time (I realize that part-time students lose out on career services and internship).

Hypothetical career projection: small community hospital 1-2 years > Memorial Sloan Kettering or Presbyterian 1-2 years > Pharma/Agency (most likely Safety/Med Info/Reg Affairs related role) > business school.
How do you think you can just jump from the hospital side to industry? Is it that easy in NY?
 
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Wow, I didn't expect this thread to expand so quickly!

I'm currently a hospital staff pharmacist, and will eventually move into an industry/agency role after a few years of patient-care. I've read enough on multiple forums to realize that an MBA without experience is useless, so I plan on applying after about 4-5 years. Full/part time attendance depends on whether I am satisfied with my role or seeking to change at that time (I realize that part-time students lose out on career services and internship).

Hypothetical career projection: small community hospital 1-2 years > Memorial Sloan Kettering or Presbyterian 1-2 years > Pharma/Agency (most likely Safety/Med Info/Reg Affairs related role) > business school.

I don't even think you are clear on your career path... This path makes no sense. So you basically want to engage yourself with all those experiences then go to business school? I think after a Pharm.D, the experiences would weigh in more rather than simply having MBA after. Like you said, MBA is useless if it hasn't been applied through experiences. Anyone can learn business easily with information provided online nowadays... Why are you taking on related roles then going to business school after?
 
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I think you've misread my plan. I plan on moving through those job areas before I apply for business school, precisely because I don't need an MBA for said roles. I intend on moving into management consulting/business functional areas after an MBA.
Seems like you've planned it out. I take it, then, that you'll be applying to business school primarily to move more into commercial areas of biopharma? One question that arises is: why not move into pharma, commercial and/or consulting now?

If you're interested in management consulting, definitely apply to the best business school possible. The recruiting mix differs significantly for, say, MIT Sloan vs. Cornell Johnson vs. a non-UMich state school.
 
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How do you think you can just jump from the hospital side to industry? Is it that easy in NY?
Just wait till reality hits that there is no entry to industry via the scenario OP describes (if clinical pharmacists AT BEST have very little chance of getting in the door, then good luck as a staff pharmacist). Then OP’s grandoise plan will all come burning down.
 
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Just wait till reality hits that there is no entry to industry via the scenario OP describes (if clinical pharmacists AT BEST have very little chance of getting in the door, then good luck as a staff pharmacist). Then OP’s grandoise plan will all come burning down.
I applied for and was offered several industry/agency roles right after graduation. I decided to pursue hospital staffing because the job suited my personal situation at the time. No need to get so negative.

I don't even think you are clear on your career path... This path makes no sense. So you basically want to engage yourself with all those experiences then go to business school? I think after a Pharm.D, the experiences would weigh in more rather than simply having MBA after. Like you said, MBA is useless if it hasn't been applied through experiences. Anyone can learn business easily with information provided online nowadays... Why are you taking on related roles then going to business school after?
From what I've read on the gmat/mba forums, work experience is an important factor for b-school admissions. Starting out in medically-related roles is easier for a PharmD, but I'd like to eventually go into commercial side or consulting.
 
How do you think you can just jump from the hospital side to industry? Is it that easy in NY?
It's not easy by any means, but it's doable. It helps that the NJ/NY/PA area has a large concentration of small/mid-size pharma companies and agencies to start at. Are you also thinking of making the move?
 
It's not easy by any means, but it's doable. It helps that the NJ/NY/PA area has a large concentration of small/mid-size pharma companies and agencies to start at. Are you also thinking of making the move?
I tried, but couldn’t make it. I live in California.
 
Why would you want to waste more time and money? If PharmDs are a dime a dozen, MBAs (just like law degrees) are a nickel a dozen.

This is not an accurate narrative.
 
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Because PharmD/MBAs are a rare breed while PharmD/MBA/PhDs are yet a rarer breed. So more power to the PharmD/MBA/MBA/MD/PA/RN/PT/JD/OD/DDS who has that holistic view on healthcare and has all their bases covered from a knowledge standpoint. Who wouldn’t hire someone with that kind of experience/knowledge?


(On a side note though, one of my former preceptors in school had 3 graduate degrees on top of their PharmD which just makes me do a double face palm)

Just interviewed a recent grad with pharmd/mba for a part-time(20-30hrs) position lol shes been working as a prn at hospital for 10 hrs a week since last September. When asked why shes seeking this position, she said bc there are no jobs out there. Sad but true.
 
Just interviewed a recent grad with pharmd/mba for a part-time(20-30hrs) position lol shes been working as a prn at hospital for 10 hrs a week since last September. When asked why shes seeking this position, she said bc there are no jobs out there. Sad but true.
What’s sad is that these waves of new grads think they’re going to be immune to saturation because they went the extra mile to do a residency or do a dual degree. “All the doom and gloom only applies to those who didn’t try hard in school/do not have extra credentials,” they say. “But the jobs are there/your career options are unlimited/you’ll still get several offers if you get _________ credential.” That’s not how the job market works, my dear snowflakes.
 
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What’s sad is that these waves of new grads think they’re going to be immune to saturation because they went the extra mile to do a residency or do a dual degree. “All the doom and gloom only applies to those who didn’t try hard in school/do not have extra credentials,” they say. “But the jobs are there/your career options are unlimited/you’ll still get several offers if you get _________ credential.” That’s not how the job market works, my dear snowflakes.

Yeah im glad i turned down the duel degree with mba. The thought of having $50k+ loan for a useless piece of paper still keeps me up at night lol
 
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