Failed my part 2 retake. Scared and seeking advice

[Anderson86]

A friend sent me to this site to seek some advice so I thought I would give it a try. Apologies for the long post.

I just found out I failed my boards part 2 retake. I can honestly say that I studied like crazy and gave it my best effort both times. According to other students I have been using the proper resources... So I'm not really sure what happened the past few months.

I will graduate with a good GPA. My interviews and externships both went great and because of that I am in excellent standing with a few residency programs.

I have never failed a class or even a test in my entire academic career until now so I'm still in a state of shock and not sure what to do about being 200k+ in debt with no future. Any guidance you can offer to a terrified student about the future and my options would be much appreciated even if it's bad news I need to hear it... Thank you in advance.

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[bunion123]

I'm sorry to hear that. It sounds like a scary situation. I'm still a prepod. Can I ask what school you went to?

 

[ldsrmdude]

Sorry to hear about the situation. It's going to be tough, I am sure. This means you won't participate in the match, obviously, but there is still the test offering in May. Passing it then may keep you from having to sit out a year. From the sounds of it, next year is going to be worse than this year as far as ratio of residency spots to applicants. If you do have to sit out a year, I would keep in touch with the programs that you feel like you had good standing with, and maybe they would take you next year. Still, better to pass in May and not have to sit out a year.

Just curious, what resources have you been using? It sounds like you will have to study different materials this time around since it didn't help enough the first 2 times. Good luck!

 

[PodunkUDPM]

Just curious, what resources have you been using? It sounds like you will have to study different materials this time around since it didn't help enough the first 2 times. Good luck!

You can bet it was podiatryboardsprep.com or whatever website is being spammed all over these boards

 

[Anderson86]

Bunion123 I sent you a private message with that information.

With regard to the resources I was using:

1st attempt: Kushner Pearls, Presby, PI manual, USMLE step 2, CaliClassifications Manual, the practice tests that were made available,and select sets of class notes as well as suggested review chapters in Christman/McGlamary/Valmassy. I started studying in September and had externships and/or core rotations for the school Sept, Oct, Nov,Dec. I took January off for interviews and boards. On retrospect I should have taken December off but the schedule was set before we got news of the date boards would be held on.

2nd attempt I added Hershey, Foot and Ankle Secrets by Harkless/Johnson and various board review handouts my friends found helpful like the Hrywnak internal medicine review from Chicago.

I did not use the podiatryprep.com website. It looked too risky for the $125 pricetag and I did not have any friends who were using it.

I do plan on retaking the test in May so I am looking to add new sources and revise my strategy. That being said I have low hopes of matching a scramble position because of the general shortage of positions and the scramble being weeks old by the time score reports come back.

What % of people who re-enter the cycle match? I'm assuming it's fairly low as most programs would just assume you are worthless for failing boards the first time. Which I guess is fair.

Also if the worst happens and I never match is a DPM without a residency good for anything else in life? Maybe someone has heard rumors of jobs people in my position got? Sadly... I've heard shoe salesperson and gas station cashier so far in my research. Which would result in 30 years of crushing depression and poverty as I struggle with the loans which I just learned that bankruptcy cannot even save you from.

 

[dtrack22]

What % of people who re-enter the cycle match?

~30% although I would expect that number to dip next year with a large 2013 class and then go up in 2014 when there are less students who will graduate and hopefully even more than 525 seats

 

[FiveOVicryl]

For future reference, stating your class rank (bottom 1/2, top 10%, etc) gives us more information on the type of student you are compared to GPAs.

A 3.4 GPA at one school can be a 2.9 GPA at another school.

Anyways, best of luck and I hopefully you pass that exam in May.

 

[dare1183]

Bunion123 I sent you a private message with that information.

With regard to the resources I was using:

1st attempt: Kushner Pearls, Presby, PI manual, USMLE step 2, CaliClassifications Manual, the practice tests that were made available,and select sets of class notes as well as suggested review chapters in Christman/McGlamary/Valmassy. I started studying in September and had externships and/or core rotations for the school Sept, Oct, Nov,Dec. I took January off for interviews and boards. On retrospect I should have taken December off but the schedule was set before we got news of the date boards would be held on.

2nd attempt I added Hershey, Foot and Ankle Secrets by Harkless/Johnson and various board review handouts my friends found helpful considering my consistent weakness with general medicine questions(the Hrywnak internal medicine review from Chicago).

I did not use the podiatryprep.com website. It looked too risky for the $125 pricetag and I did not have any friends who were using it.

I do plan on retaking the test in May so I am looking to add new sources and revise my strategy. That being said I have low hopes of matching a scramble position because of the general shortage of positions and the scramble being weeks old by the time score reports come back.

What % of people who re-enter the cycle match? I'm assuming it's fairly low as most programs would just assume you are worthless for failing boards the first time. Which I guess is fair.

Also if the worst happens and I never match is a DPM without a residency good for anything else in life? Maybe someone has heard rumors of jobs people in my position got? Sadly... I've heard shoe salesperson and gas station cashier so far in my research. Which would result in 30 years of crushing depression and poverty as I struggle with the loans which I just learned that bankruptcy cannot even save you from.

First of all, Im sorry that you were unsuccessful in passing this time around. But let me tell you something, you're dead wrong if you think you dont have options. You have plenty of options and I will tell what they are. Just dont listen to anyone who tells you that you dont have options.
My cousin finished podiatry school, he failed Part II more than 5 times, no kidding, and guess where he is now? he is doing residency,, yes you heard that right, he is doing residency because he passed on the 6th time. no matter how long it will take you to pass, you need to pass it. and then you will get a residency. dont listen to the B.S that residency directors willthink less of you and wont rank you. thats total BULL. because I can tell you there is many programs , specially in NY that will take you in if you just pass your boards and do one month of externship. They might not be excellent programs, but so what? a podiatrist is a podiatrist is a podiatrist no matter where you did your residency.
But lets assume you were right and no one wants to take you. then you caan go pass part II and become a podiatrist in at least 5 states that dont require residency to be podiatrist. you will be doing everything a podiatrist does except surgery. and guess what? you will make 100k+. sounds too good to be true? its the truth, you will be cutting nails and calluses for the rest of your life,out west .but hey, its 100K there .

now in terms of Boards preparation material. Ok dude, I failed part II the first time I took it. and then I coughed up the $125 for that podiatryboardsprep.com website. and guess what? the questions there were very helpful in pointing my weakness points. They did cover every topic I saw in the exam. I will be lying to you if i say they were the exact questions, how the hell would they do that, BUT they were damn good . so dont listen to ppl who have no clue what the website is about ,that tell you its a scam or whatever. There will be always be negative people around to discourage you . second, dont use too many sources, one source for questions and one book to read at least twice. I did presby twice. and of course questions. but there is no need to be jumping to all these sources, it will be too much and too confusing, just all over the place. The name of the game is FOCUS.

Last word of advise, dont let them bring you down man. seriously, you have plenty of options and its not the end of the world to fail an exam. keep your head up and go on, you going to pass this damn test, you going to get a residency and you going to be a podiatrist . and yes , you going to pay off those 200K in loans.

Disclosure: I dont work for podiatryboardsprep.com/ presby/hershy/ any residency program in NY or out of NY / Caspr/ and Im not the spokesman for the podiatric field.

 

[hyperpodia]

If it were me, I would focus on passing the boards first before worrying about the match/scramble. I would also study using 2 resources, the Pearls, plus Crozer manual. I would read these like 3 times from cover to cover. (PS i did not read them through 3 times) but i think you are using too many resources. Less is more. Most of the students I know used these two for boards and interviews.

 

[MaxillofacialMN]

~30% although I would expect that number to dip next year with a large 2013 class and then go up in 2014 when there are less students who will graduate and hopefully even more than 525 seats

Yikes.... 30%?! I mean, I get that some people don't pass, but if we already have a shortage this is a problem that will compound HEAVILY... oh nooooooooo class of 2017 (hopefully me) is screwedddddddddddd

 

[malleolusman]

I feel I should comment on the boards II study material.

In my opinion, if you are absolutely struggling on this exam - and by struggle I mean failing this exam multiple times - then perhaps it is worth it to purchase this software; cause whats another $125 on your 150k loan; considering the fact that we are headed into a residency shortage of possibly epic proportions in the coming years.

But -- as a first time taker for Part III, I will not be using this site, nor do I find it useful in the least given it's design & pricing layout. I think most who read this site would agree with the following assessment of your [likely this whole thread was designed by the prep people] site.

Criticisms of podiatryboardsprep.com>

$125 dollars to access software for X amount of days. Does not outline how many questions per section. Does not outline how many questions per exam. Does not give whether Q & A are given. And how long is the answer, is it paragraph form... does it give references? Or does it simply give the answer? This should be clearly explained on your site, how the user-interface works. The website's whole design looks as if it were a internet-dead-end. There's just not much substance. If you are going to design a website that looks and feels as it does, then you should also price accordingly. You are priced for a Mercedes, when you should be priced for a Chevy Volt.

Testimonials? I think you know what is wrong with this section.

About Us section: "We are with you every step of the way" Yes, but who are you? Are you DPMs... Is this podiatrist designed? Are you students? Residents? Why not just give the affiliation, particularly if what you are doing is legal?

Do you really think students who passed Part II on the first try will pay $125 for Part III Q & A? $125? I have NO CLUE as to what I am getting. Give your audience their due credit. After all, they are about to cut on people.

Oh, and on the Subscription page, its spelled "Register" not..."regester"

Details Details Details people. You should be paying me for this.

You people didn't do your homework, and it shows.

 

[dare1183]

I feel I should comment on the boards II study material.

In my opinion, if you are absolutely struggling on this exam - and by struggle I mean failing this exam multiple times - then perhaps it is worth it to purchase this software; cause whats another $125 on your 150k loan; considering the fact that we are headed into a residency shortage of possibly epic proportions in the coming years.

But -- as a first time taker for Part III, I will not be using this site, nor do I find it useful in the least given it's design & pricing layout. I think most who read this site would agree with the following assessment of your [likely this whole thread was designed by the prep people] site.

Criticisms of podiatryboardsprep.com>

$125 dollars to access software for X amount of days. Does not outline how many questions per section. Does not outline how many questions per exam. Does not give whether Q & A are given. And how long is the answer, is it paragraph form... does it give references? Or does it simply give the answer? This should be clearly explained on your site, how the user-interface works. The website's whole design looks as if it were a internet-dead-end. There's just not much substance. If you are going to design a website that looks and feels as it does, then you should also price accordingly. You are priced for a Mercedes, when you should be priced for a Chevy Volt.

Testimonials? I think you know what is wrong with this section.

About Us section: "We are with you every step of the way" Yes, but who are you? Are you DPMs... Is this podiatrist designed? Are you students? Residents? Why not just give the affiliation, particularly if what you are doing is legal?

Do you really think students who passed Part II on the first try will pay $125 for Part III Q & A? $125? I have NO CLUE as to what I am getting. Give your audience their due credit. After all, they are about to cut on people.

Oh, and on the Subscription page, its spelled "Register" not..."regester"

Details Details Details people. You should be paying me for this.

You people didn't do your homework, and it shows.

Thats the problem . its that many people are negative and skeptical about everything . They tend to discredit everything because they think they smart and dont need any additional help. Thats because they passed it the first time around. If you tell them the sun comes out from the east, They will still ask , oh why.
$125 compared to 200K is nothing if it helps you pass. there is two other websites that offer questions. one is charging $250 per module with about 300 questions and it was a total waste of my money but the podiatryboardsprep.com seemed to be more legit questions for studying. Know the concepts not the answers. Its $125, I dont know where you are from, but that doesnt even buy you a text book over here.
Just because you were able to pass it the first time, doesnt mean alot of people dont need additional help.

 

[dtrack22]

Yikes.... 30%?! I mean, I get that some people don't pass, but if we already have a shortage this is a problem that will compound HEAVILY... oh nooooooooo class of 2017 (hopefully me) is screwedddddddddddd

It's really not much different than the 40% rate for MD re-applicants...and it's a VERY different population who's re-applying

As for the class of 2017; CPME has finally put a hard cap on enrollment and shored up their own bylaws/policies&procedures so that a new school cannot be opened and accredited without a much stricter approval process. There shouldn't be a "shortage" for the class of 2014, and I'd expect CPME, COTH, etc. reach there goal of 110% (seats to graduates) within the next 5 years or so and any students in the class of 2013 who are "qaulified" and are left out next year to have landed a spot by that time. Of course, that's pure speculation based on current numbers and the people who are currently in place to fix the problem.

I feel bad for the CPME, they are constantly fighting against schools who allow students who haven't passed boards to move on in their schooling and in some cases actually "graduate". The deans of these schools then blame the NBPME, CPME, COTH, and whoever else they think they can make accountable for their school's failures. The re-applicant pool is then filled with people who should never have been there in the first place. I would guess CASPR gets around 50-60 applications every year from students are are not and will not be eligible for the match (due to not passing boards). At least the new match process eliminates those students before they land a program, only to find out they are ineligible a few weeks before residency because they didn't pass part II...shortage, surplus, shortage, surplus...I would put money on the cycle perpetuating itself until our applicant pool doubles in size.

 

[MaxillofacialMN]

Well, at least ONCE I past boards I should be fine... Haha

 

[dare1183]

The interesting part is that malleolusman thinks the person who started this thread as way to ask for help and advice is actually the website owner or one of its employee. why cant he just be someone in need of advise? its just too much skepticism . No one here cares if that person signs up or not. Its just a thought, It worked for me, and I passed on my 2nd attempt. Thats all

 

[podo trest]

Dear Dare-

If you think anybody is believing you're not the owner, or an integral part of the shady website in question you're kidding yourself. It is SO obvious. Also, if you really want to make money, you should really think about working on your English skills.

Thanks,

Podo Trest

 

[NeilD]

Yup, most of what we hear about this field from inside academia rarely translates into the real world. Pretty bleak future. Feel bad for people with a lot of student loans in Podiatry.

 

[podo trest]

Reminds me of a penny stock. The "troll" bashers are always so obvious as well. Wonder why that is.....

 

[dare1183]

Dear Dare-

If you think anybody is believing you're not the owner, or an integral part of the shady website in question you're kidding yourself. It is SO obvious. Also, if you really want to make money, you should really think about working on your English skills.

Thanks,

Podo Trest

Lol very funny.you made me laugh. Thank you : ) If I was the owner of the website, I would be very proud. Im not going to waste my time in this BS. I am not Anderson86 and I did not start this thread neither am I the owner of the website in question. Im just a student arguing with the *****s who think they are too smart,. Wake up and smell the coffee.

 

[podo trest]

Glad I could make you chuckle, as you've given this forum quite a few.

 

[dare1183]

Glad I could make you chuckle, as you've given this forum quite a few.

yes you made my foreign a** chuckle pretty good

 

[dare1183]

Yup, most of what we hear about this field from inside academia rarely translates into the real world. Pretty bleak future. Feel bad for people with a lot of student loans in Podiatry.

Neil we really dont care what people like you( drop outs) think about our profession. you can go to your caribbean medical school that dont require MCAT or even a Bachelor degree for admission. you going to make a great doctor one day (in the caribbean)lol

 

[Sig Savant]

First, thank you dtrack22 for contributing much positive and accurate information here.

Next, the OP should research the Practice Management one year internships. In addition, as I think dtrack can confirm, there are more than 20 residency spots set to open up in the next 12 months. If those new programs are looking for residents prior to 2013 match, they will pull from the scramble list. I would find all of these programs and make connections, as well as study nonstop for the May offering. Lastly, if new programs open and steal residents (this happened this year), that will leave openings at other residencies - find those places and try to squeeze in. (assuming you pass in May).

Study hard and good luck.

 

[moneymoneymoney]

Yup, most of what we hear about this field from inside academia rarely translates into the real world. Pretty bleak future. Feel bad for people with a lot of student loans in Podiatry.

what stage of your podiatric career are you in?

 

[jonwill]

Yup, most of what we hear about this field from inside academia rarely translates into the real world. Pretty bleak future. Feel bad for people with a lot of student loans in Podiatry.

Yes because no one believes all of the successful podiatrists out there including the ones on this forum. We'd rather listen to the handful of failures. Let me go find an MD, DO, or DDS who has failed so I can start talking about how bleak the future is for those specialties! No one believes you friend because there are all of us to prove you wrong.

 

[NeilD]

3rd year, plan on finishing up the DPM next year and will be applying to Med school this fall. Have the grades and MCAT scores for an "American" Medical school but mistakenly followed my older brother and Uncle into Podiatry without really thinking about it. That will be remedied soon.

 

[dare1183]

3rd year, plan on finishing up the DPM next year and will be applying to Med school this fall. Have the grades and MCAT scores for an "American" Medical school but mistakenly followed my older brother and Uncle into Podiatry without really thinking about it. That will be remedied soon.

HAHAHA Now you really made me laugh. OMG LOL

 

[347932]

3rd year, plan on finishing up the DPM next year and will be applying to Med school this fall. Have the grades and MCAT scores for an "American" Medical school but mistakenly followed my older brother and Uncle into Podiatry without really thinking about it. That will be remedied soon.

Good luck to you. Seriously.

That was your choice and you seem pretty bent on swaying others to see things YOUR way even though for all intents and purposes, YOU made the wrong choice for YOU, and are admitting it to all here.

Please stop posting all the doom and gloom as you aren't far enough in YOUR career to give an accurate picture of YOUR experiences in it.

Thanks.

 

[PADPM]

3rd year, plan on finishing up the DPM next year and will be applying to Med school this fall. Have the grades and MCAT scores for an "American" Medical school but mistakenly followed my older brother and Uncle into Podiatry without really thinking about it. That will be remedied soon.

Wow, you must be a really confident person. Due to the fact that your brother and uncle have not been successful, you are now "assuming" that you also will not succeed with the DPM degree.

Wake up and smell the toast burning. Realize that your uncle and brother are in the minority. I can honestly not think of more that 2 DPMs who I know who are not sucessful.

I really don't know why I'm wasting my time on you, because we all know it's useless. Have a great time with that Caribbean Med school degree. I'm waiting to read your bitter posts in a few years about how hard it is to return to the U.S. with that second rate MD degree from the Caribbean.

 

[PADPM]

To the original OP. It's a shame that you failed, but at THIS time you can't worry about the scramble, residencies, etc. Your ONLY focus at this time is passing that exam. After that, all your cards will fall into place. Stop worrying about hypothetical situations. Work hard, pass the exam and your worries will resolve.

 

[Anderson86]

Thank you for the advice those of you that gave me some feedback.

To answer some questions...

Practicing in the states mentioned without a residency does not sound possible given that you need to go through residency to get properly reimbursed as a podiatrist and for admission rights at hospitals. Thank you for the positive words though I will press forward with boards or something else down the road no matter what... I'm just not sure what yet which is why I am here.

My GPA put me in the top 50% of my class. I was no genius by any stretch of the imagination, but I was never viewed as a slacker or someone at high risk of failing boards. I tore through my classes, clinicals, part 1, externships, and interviews with little difficulty. With regard to actual study effort mine was comprable to many of my fellow students that passed the exam. Not trying to brag about any of that I just wanted to provide some context to how I was fairing before this happened.

I am trying to slim down my list of material to study for the May retake as was suggested and I am studying my butt off (again). I realize a late scramble is a longshot but it's better than rolling over and dying and as people have mentioned in the thread spots do suddenly appear late in the game.

As for me starting this thread to promote a company I really don't know what to say about that. I did state before that I am NOT interested in paying $125 to use the prep website. If I had a friend in the school that had used it and could vouch for it then I would consider it. Believe what you will I guess.

The practice management program I had not heard of before so I will have to look into that down the road.

I was curious if anyone heard of or has personal experience with that new "preceptor" program for people in my situation. It's essentially where a DPM (or a group) takes you under it's wing for 10 months while you do basic assistant stuff and study for the retake. The pay is 10k-40k (sometimes benefits) varies by doc. Anyone have experience with that?

I will continue to monitor this thread for feedback or suggestions as time goes on. It's a good study break to read the positive encouragement and advice. Thank you guys!

 

[SuperFeisty]

As a lowly prepod, I don't quite understand how you can be in the top half of your class and fail the Boards. Do they test stuff that you've never seen before? Can someone explain this? I don't want to be that guy who aces all his classes (hopefully) and repeatedly fails the Boards for some reason I don't know. For all those who've passed, did your coursework and experience adequately prepare you? Sorry if it seems I'm asking a dumb question, I just have alarm bells ringing in my head atm (figuratively of course )

 

[dtrack22]

I realize a late scramble is a longshot

If everything you have said is true, I wouldn't say you are a "longshot" that late in the scramble. Last year there were a handful of programs that would rather leave their seat(s) empty than take the "qualified" students who were left. So your competition at that point is pretty terrible. If you pass, there will be seats. If you have residency programs who you believe ranked you, call them and ask them to vouch for you. As long as you aren't/weren't a complete ***** during your clerkships and interviews then you are more than a "longshot" when it comes to the scramble.

I would bet money there are empty seats again this year...

The practice management program I had not heard of before so I will have to look into that down the road.

I was curious if anyone heard of or has personal experience with that new "preceptor" program for people in my situation......Anyone have experience with that?

Sig can correct me if I'm wrong but you two are talking about the same thing. The preceptor program was started and is essentially ran by the AAPPM (academy of podiatric practice management)...hence the term "practice management program"

 

[Anderson86]

As a lowly prepod, I don't quite understand how you can be in the top half of your class and fail the Boards. Do they test stuff that you've never seen before? Can someone explain this? I don't want to be that guy who aces all his classes (hopefully) and repeatedly fails the Boards for some reason I don't know. For all those who've passed, did your coursework and experience adequately prepare you? Sorry if it seems I'm asking a dumb question, I just have alarm bells ringing in my head atm (figuratively of course )

The test does have a unpredictable nature to it. As you probably already know when you pass you are only told you passed. If you fail you get a percentage score which is based on a curve (so it's dependant on how everyone else did that day) and a list of weak areas. In the month of January I was listed as being competent in Ortho but not competent in Radiology. Two months later I was listed as being below minimal competency in Ortho but competent in Radiology. Just an example of how things can go one attempt to the next.

I would say class work gets you 50% of the way to passing. Much of the "true" learning becomes your own responsibility when you enter podiatry school. The doctors and professors are there to keep you on the right path for the most part. Some of them do their best to write boards level tests for the classes but the material that appears on boards can sometimes hit something hard that was not stressed or only briefly mentioned in classwork.

It's why they say to read as many books and journal articles on your own as possible. I really can't stress that enough and you will hear it many times from people in the future. To really be prepared for boards part 2 level material you need to be very dilligent about finding good study materials on your own (ask upperclassmen, read forums, ask the librarians) and reviewing them constantly outside of your class work. It's rough with the schedule you will contend with BUT if you don't take my advice you might end up in my situation... and trust me it's a living nightmare for my family and myself.

 

[Anderson86]

If everything you have said is true, I wouldn't say you are a "longshot" that late in the scramble. Last year there were a handful of programs that would rather leave their seat(s) empty than take the "qualified" students who were left. So your competition at that point is pretty terrible. If you pass, there will be seats. If you have residency programs who you believe ranked you, call them and ask them to vouch for you. As long as you aren't/weren't a complete ***** during your clerkships and interviews then you are more than a "longshot" when it comes to the scramble.

I would bet money there are empty seats again this year...



Sig can correct me if I'm wrong but you two are talking about the same thing. The preceptor program was started and is essentially ran by the AAPPM (academy of podiatric practice management)...hence the term "practice management program"

Yes I've been hearing similar things from the class above me. Funny how fast word spreads of these things... Hopefully I can knock it out this time and rejoin the hunt.

 

[flyhi]

Good Luck, Anderson! Sorry you are going through this and wish you the best of luck with your studying and passing in May.

 

[SuperFeisty]

Me n flyhi are gonna have mad skype study sessions I predict!

 

[Hankmel]

Anderson86-I am curious how everything worked out for you and your career path. I just took my Level II boards retake and I fear I may be in the same position as you in a few weeks (I don't have my results back but I don't feel good about the retake). Any insight or suggestions you may have would be greatly appreciated.

A friend sent me to this site to seek some advice so I thought I would give it a try. Apologies for the long post.

I just found out I failed my boards part 2 retake. I can honestly say that I studied like crazy and gave it my best effort both times. According to other students I have been using the proper resources... So I'm not really sure what happened the past few months.

I will graduate with a good GPA. My interviews and externships both went great and because of that I am in excellent standing with a few residency programs.

I have never failed a class or even a test in my entire academic career until now so I'm still in a state of shock and not sure what to do about being 200k+ in debt with no future. Any guidance you can offer to a terrified student about the future and my options would be much appreciated even if it's bad news I need to hear it... Thank you in advance.

 

[chober]

I sat out for a year, not because of failing boards, but because I didnt match. I can tell you about strategies for the scramble and what needs to be done for next year....albeit this is pending if I match in March or not. Shoot me a private message.