Finding a Job after Pod Residency?

[teefRcool]

Hey guys i'm applying to podiatry and I used to like dentistry for all the wrong reasons. But deep inside i've searched and tumbled into this field and after shadowing and doing immense amount of research in this field i've found myself in love with podiatry. I have already applied and have two interviews hopefully I will do well. One thing however that really bothers me and information that is low on is finding a job after you finally finish 7 years of schooling. I'm asking those that are already in pod schools and maybe have friends that already graduated. Basically my question is are there services by the school that help a freshly graduated Pod find a job or point in a the right direction? If not How difficult is it to find a job or to join a practice or create ones own practice, be succesfull and stable? I was somewhat disturbed from what toejam stated from another thread http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=38634 is this all true? If you guys could elaborate on this i would really appreciate it. Thanks again.

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[bkpa2med]

I'm not a pod but I read many forums on this site. I've heard that finding a job in podiatry or any physician in that case is usually by word of mouth. Someone please correct me if I'm wrong.

Good luck with your app cycle!

 

[cool_vkb]

Hey guys i'm applying to podiatry and I used to like dentistry for all the wrong reasons. But deep inside i've searched and tumbled into this field and after shadowing and doing immense amount of research in this field i've found myself in love with podiatry. I have already applied and have two interviews hopefully I will do well. One thing however that really bothers me and information that is low on is finding a job after you finally finish 7 years of schooling. I'm asking those that are already in pod schools and maybe have friends that already graduated. Basically my question is are there services by the school that help a freshly graduated Pod find a job or point in a the right direction? If not How difficult is it to find a job or to join a practice or create ones own practice, be succesfull and stable? I was somewhat disturbed from what toejam stated from another thread http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=38634 is this all true? If you guys could elaborate on this i would really appreciate it. Thanks again.

Oh dude i cant say u how much dipressed i was when i read that post 2 months back. but after doing some research on my own i found out that there was a group of dirty scoundrels back in 2001 and 2002 who were highly unsucsessfull in their lives and they were writing such discouraging posts. later on they were expelled from SDN and they are still writing on a different forum which i visited once and was abt to change my descion abt joining podiatry. but the Podiatrist whom i shadowed gave me a new direction abt this field.

If u go to OCPM website, u can see there is a section called "great exchange' or something
http://www.ocpm.edu/news/article.asp?ID=177

and similarly like this, there are tons of websites which i want u to GOOGLE search and find out. i know some websites but i dont wanna give all the names here. u shud also do something on ur own right.

So dont worry man! v will be fine. and as seniors have said 1000 times here on this forum that Residency and Board certification always matters. and sometimes if u r in a great residency program u will get job offer and classifieds. I wud say just be perfect in ur field and we will succeed. but like all business fields u gotta have some business sense and common sense.

Now dont expect to get a job or open ur own practice in middle of downtown chicago and think u will make good income. No, its not gonna happen. u have to search a new teritorry and establish ur self or u have to buy an existing practice if u want to settle in a saturated market. This is for setting up ur own practice. but if u just wanna do a job, as i said earlier there any many websites on google and i heard in residencies u do get associateships or job offers.

 

[dpmgrad]

Hey guys i'm applying to podiatry and I used to like dentistry for all the wrong reasons. But deep inside i've searched and tumbled into this field and after shadowing and doing immense amount of research in this field i've found myself in love with podiatry. I have already applied and have two interviews hopefully I will do well. One thing however that really bothers me and information that is low on is finding a job after you finally finish 7 years of schooling. I'm asking those that are already in pod schools and maybe have friends that already graduated. Basically my question is are there services by the school that help a freshly graduated Pod find a job or point in a the right direction? If not How difficult is it to find a job or to join a practice or create ones own practice, be succesfull and stable? I was somewhat disturbed from what toejam stated from another thread http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=38634 is this all true? If you guys could elaborate on this i would really appreciate it. Thanks again.

As mentioned in the previous postings, many of the Podiatry jobs can be obtained via word of mouth. Many of the attendings (Podiatry and Orthopedic Surgeons) in the residency programs and drug/ortho reps are in touch with many of the Podiatrists and Orthopedic Surgeons in the local region and may know about someone looking for a new associates. Residency directors also get mailings from varous future employers looking for new associates. Also in the previous posting, some of the schools also provide access to various job listings. To my knowledge, OCPM, NYCPM, and TUSPM offer this service to their alumni. If other schools offer this service to the alumni, please let me know. I know that DMU and Scholl used to do it. OCPM (via Great Exchange) and NYCPM publish their job listings on their website for public viewing. TUSPM Great Exchange list is restricted only to the TUSPM alumni. Of course, if any of the residents here on SDN is looking for a job, PM me and I would be more than happy to forward to you the latest TUSPM Great Exchange listing. Other job listings can be obtained through various Podiatry publications including APMA News, local State Podiatry Associations publications, Podiatry Management Online News Mailing, etc... You may also want to take a look at some of the Orthopedic journals (FAI, JBJS, JAAOS, etc...) to see if any of the Orthopedic groups are looking for Foot and Ankle Surgeons. Sometimes, job listings are also advertised at some of the national Podiatry meetings, such as APMA Annual Meeting, ACFAS Annual Meeting, Midwest Podiatry Meeting, New York Podiatry Clinical Conference, etc....

 

[Osteodog]

I started out pursuing podiatry, but after doing my own intensive research (albeit after already matriculating and spending some cash), I decided that I'd be better off pursuing medicine even if it took longer to get in and get out.

Of course there are some jobs out there, but the actual number and quality are nowhere near sufficient or comparable to what's available to DO's and MD's. At least that's what I've seen and heard from friends of mine who are DPM's.

With all due respect to the previous posters who attempted to enumerate the various avenues to finding a job, it would be more instructive to actually list these resources (like Monster.com, podiatry journal classifieds, any official job center at any podiatry school, a podiatry headhunting service, any hospital in any state that is looking for a podiatrist, etc., etc., etc.). Why not google "job search" or "job search medicine" or something like that and see if there are ANY job placement services that work with DPM's? I tried it and I didn't find anything. "Word of mouth" or meeting someone at a seminar wouldn't suffice for me after spending up to 200k for my education and investing a ton of blood, sweat and tears. And, when a new DPM does find a job, how much is he/she making the 1st year? Are there any stats on that? The people who I know say that it was a pittance. Remember that a new DPM grad owes the same, if not more money in loans than their MD or DO counterparts. If there are resources for podiatrists to find a job, list them here.

I have a couple of friends who are DPM's and they did find their first jobs through "word of mouth". I can tell you that these jobs were crap (cutting toenails at a nursing home, working part-time for a group who was sending him out to house calls...more cutting toenails). These guys are doing ok now, but they have been out for about 6 years now and aren't making as much as they thought they would be.

Here's my proposal: If there are enough jobs for all of the pod graduates (and the ones who are still looking) then show this poster where the resources are. There aren't any of any quality or significance. How many resources are there for MD's and DO's? Too numerous to mention. I'm nearing completion of med school and I'm finding lots of avenues for job placement when I finish my residency (I found one just yesterday at www.locumtenens.com). There are also any number of urgent care clinics across the country who hire MD's and DO's for full or part-time work. Find any sort of professional job placement service that can work with a new DPM. I don't think there are any.

As an aside, I just finished a rotation in internal medicine at a local clinic. There were at least 10 to 15 patients who came through there with foot/ankle problems that the MD couldn't handle or, in my opinion, had poor advice. His solution was to either send them to a nurse (for a wound problem) or send them to PT for nail, wart or callous problems. I asked him if there was a podiatrist on staff that he referred to and he said something like, "I think so, but I've never used him". This MD has been at this clinic for 15 years. I'm paraphrasing this, but he said something like "why would I send these patients to a podiatrist when I can just send them to a PT/PA/nurse"? Maybe this is an isolated case, but this info would give me some pause.

 

[Osteodog]

Admittedly, I didn't check out "great exchange" before I wrote my post. It was fairly impressive. I haven't seen anything like that in the past.

The only critiques I would offer is that it's a nationwide pod job listing and, if you count the number of jobs available, it still falls far short of the number of new grads looking for positions as well as the already established DPM's. Also, by a cursory count, there were 53 job listings and 30 practices for sale. Maybe I'm wrong (and it wouldn't be the 1st time), but that doesn't sound like a good ratio.

 

[teefRcool]

when purchasing another practice does it usually come with the patients or does it all depend on the seller etc?

 

[Podman]

Admittedly, I didn't check out "great exchange" before I wrote my post. It was fairly impressive. I haven't seen anything like that in the past.

The only critiques I would offer is that it's a nationwide pod job listing and, if you count the number of jobs available, it still falls far short of the number of new grads looking for positions as well as the already established DPM's. Also, by a cursory count, there were 53 job listings and 30 practices for sale. Maybe I'm wrong (and it wouldn't be the 1st time), but that doesn't sound like a good ratio.

Osteodog,

It is an unfair comparison to compare job listings for podiatry to DO/MD listings - Why? For starters, we're a much smaller profession populationwise. How many podiatrists are in this country? 15-16,000 maybe? Better yet, how many podiatrists out there have 3 years of surgical training? An even smaller number - because this is a "newer" revised and more standardized profession, our job listings will not be in our traditional settings. Right now, we rely alot on residency programs because they are in many ways "fraternities" that network with many established DPM's and MD's who look for surgical trained podiatrists. The great exchange section in our OCPM site is just one general example. As an OCPM student, I know for a fact that we have an Alumni network that looks for our graduates and the job offers are not the "chip and clip" offers that were given to your friends - they all REQUIRED surgical training - more than adequate surgical training. There also listings in the APMA classifides...In terms of listing all the job offers/opportunities out there - you can always go back to the sources - the residency programs and call up the residents - ask them...do or do u not have any offers at the moment? how many? And how much pay?

The reality of the profession is that if you are not well trained surgically, you will go extinct and in many ways, our profession is trying to exclusively move to this direction by imposing more and higher standards.

 

[jonwill]

There are plenty of jobs for well-trained surgical podiatrists. Like every other specialty in medicine, the jobs are word of mouth or through residency programs.

No offense Osteodog but I am pretty hesitant about taking any advise from someone who failed in my profession. I am more prone to take advice from the thousands that have succeeded.

 

[dpmgrad]

when purchasing another practice does it usually come with the patients or does it all depend on the seller etc?

It really depends on the arrangement you have with the seller. If the seller is retiring and just want to sell off the entire practice, then it will come with patients.

 

[IlizaRob]

Osteodog, it sounds like you are still rationalizing your decision to quit pod school. Even after an "impressive" look at OCPMs "Great Exchange" you still found a reason to find fault in it. I understand that the failure of podiatry as a profession will only solidify your leaving, but its not as bleak as you seem to think. Everyone must understand as Podman mentioned that there are thousands less pods than MD/DOs. Obviously that will decrease the amount of job opportunities that you might happen to see on the internet or pinned to the telephone post next to your local grocery store. Employers know where to look for pods, at residency programs. So they will solicit their openings there and thats sufficient. Regardless, I did a quick search on the net and found this site who advertises for pods and other physicians. Again, there are not as many offers for pods as FPs because we are much smaller and are more specialized.

http://www.physicianwork.com/

Im sure there are others but didnt look long. For those that claim there are no listings online, well, learn to use the internet.

 

[flypod]

I agree that there is a bright future for podiatrists but my concern is that none of the negatives are being addressed. I come from the airlines and know about professions that require high amounts of training, have a high income potential yet have a dark and gloomy closet in most cases.

I know podiatry has the same. Why are we constructively addressing these issues?

 

[efs]

Take a look at Podiatry Management Online as well. They have a daily e-mail newsletter that almost always has job offers posted.

Networking or word of mouth is pretty common as well.

Put yourself on the other side for a moment. If you wanted to hire a podiatrist where would you go? I can't tell you how many letters come through my residency directors office with job offers. They are out there, just not readily visible to everyone.

 

[flypod]

The sheer economics of having a smaller group of podiatrists vs. MD/DO doesnt equate to less job offers for podiatrists.

How do you justify such logic? The fact that there is a larger podiatrist to patient ratio doesnt lead to less job offers.

That is silly economics. It has been a long time stand of the APMA and other professional podiatry groups that the large patient to podiatrist ratio is positive for pods.

 

[krabmas]

The sheer economics of having a smaller group of podiatrists vs. MD/DO doesnt equate to less job offers for podiatrists.

How do you justify such logic? The fact that there is a larger podiatrist to patient ratio doesnt lead to less job offers.

That is silly economics. It has been a long time stand of the APMA and other professional podiatry groups that the large patient to podiatrist ratio is positive for pods.

where are the pod jobs coming from? The numberous patients are not the ones hiring pods. It is the already established practices hiring pods (pod and ortho groups). If there are not that many pod groups as compared to MD groups it makes sense that there are not as many jobs available.


In 2 years the first major round of 3 year residents will be finishing residency. There will be about 300 of them. I did not misprint that or forget a zero that is right 300. for MDs in every specialty broken down even into subspecialties there are more of them and so it makes sense to have data bases with job listings. but for 300 people why a data base is not really essential.

 

[flypod]

Patient demand creates jobs, not other docs. Not MD or DPM practices.

 

[lillytwig]

I started out pursuing podiatry....

Wow!! are you absolutely incapable of doing ANYTHING for yourself?? i think it is funny that you mention blood, sweat, and tears...you so freely invest this into an education, yet not into finding employment once the education is complete? instead, you spend more $$ to become further educated so somone else can find you a job? i am sorry, but that is a VERY weak reason for leaving something. im sure you have heard the old cliche that nothing worth having comes easy. whywould this not hold true??
how about those pediatricians who are slaving away for 75K. come to vegas and ill introduce you to a few. if infact, you so non-chalantly switched from pod to DO i am assuming, maybe you kicked some major ass, and are landing a worth-while ($) residency--since money, or lack therof after training, seems to be the major qualm here--please coach us, or at east expain to us how with simply a more recognized title you plan to earn more money easier. tell us how to spend another 100K, and when we're all finsihed, how to post a resume on monster.com, or wherever you THINK you would post a cv for a high-paying job to just land in your lap. you see, this is where pre-med students falter. they spend SO much time learning science, then, when they need to sell thier knowledge, they haven't a clue as to how. i don't feel bad for you, nor do i expect you to succeed to any larger an extent than you would have, had you stuck with pod. you are not the ony person in this position; some people just don't know how to do it. no, i am not a budding MD, but i will tell you that urgent care is not gonna make you rich!!
best of luck with all! i'd be happy to give you any business consultation, should you ever choose to try something on your own. i sincerely mean you no disrespect- i am simply puzzled by your thought process.

 

[lillytwig]

As an aside, I just finished a rotation in internal medicine at a local clinic. There were at least 10 to 15 patients who came through there with foot/ankle problems that the MD couldn't handle or, in my opinion, had poor advice. His solution was to either send them to a nurse (for a wound problem) or send them to PT for nail, wart or callous problems. I asked him if there was a podiatrist on staff that he referred to and he said something like, "I think so, but I've never used him". This MD has been at this clinic for 15 years. I'm paraphrasing this, but he said something like "why would I send these patients to a podiatrist when I can just send them to a PT/PA/nurse"? Maybe this is an isolated case, but this info would give me some pause.

thats funny. a PT or a nurese, huh? i don't know about nurses, im sure they can re-bandage a wound just fine. but a PT?? a friend runs 1 PT office of 8 that her family owns, and asked her about that. they don't even have a billing code for clipping. the ONLY foot work they do is for pods and prthopods who send thier recovery to the PT. maybe that/these is/are [an] isolated case(s). why wouldn't a professional outsource to another professional?? especially one trained in only feet work! maybe your doc is just old school...or maybe podiatry is worthless. infact, all you unsurebees, don't apply!! it probably sucks!! you probably won't make any money!! run away s fast as you can!!! i heard that vets are starting to encroach, and that they are runing pods out of town!!!

 

[Dr. Foot]

Too Many Angry People Here ...

 

[jonwill]

Too Many Angry People Here ...

Podiatry is all about love

 

[lillytwig]

Too Many Angry People Here ...

if you can't beat them, join them. right?!?

 

[makingmd]

Just like anything else there is a market everywhere, but in areas where there are more poeple they seem to be lacking. My girlfriend broke her tow and fractured her foot elsewhere. Couldn't find a female doctor any where near our highly populated affluent southern california neighborhood. After searching she found a male doc with an opening. She called me right away and said you want to be a doctor...be a foot doctor!

Just word to all the femme fatals...there is a need.