By playing in this NAVLE game I will know what it feels like to take the NAVLE, so yes please!
In the off chance that someone doesn't realize I'm kidding, don't take that seriously.
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In the off chance that someone doesn't realize I'm kidding, don't take that seriously.
Wait until after finals
All the information you need to pass NAVLE will be contained within the game. Promise.
Neurological? Rabies. Or some dumb horse disease like EPM.
An exotic? Husbandry be ****ed yo.
Dogs? Read the breed and whatever the common disease is, just go for it.
Cats? Infectious or cancer. Or both.
Pigs it's always salmonella/e. coli until it's not, but it doesn't matter because you treat it with oxytet. Or necropsy.
Cows its whatever the most exotic disease is that's on the list. Probably rinderpest.
Chickens? Marek's.
And just screw sensitivity/specificity questions.
Also don't lie on records. Be a good person.
There you go. Guaranteed NAVLE pass.
Truth. Except they never really asked for a DIAGNOSIS. They always described the signs - or gave you some really awful radiograph that basically looked like a Rorschach test - then said "What do you do?" I got really tired of reading the question, thinking "Hey! I know what this is! Go me!" and then getting to the end and readin
Personally, for chickens I always went with abx in the water, for swine I depopulated, for cows I sent them to slaughter really quickly while they were still walking, for horses and exotics I just laughed, and for cats/dogs I actually answered the question right. I still passed, so the bar must be pretty low.
Stupid NAVLE. As much as I hate alpha wolves..........
disclaimer: not actually a guarantee. It's not always Marek's. Sometimes it is Newcastle.
🤣
I feel like we approached this similarly. I just assumed on the ****ty x-rays based on signalment. Abdominal rads on a PU/PD, ADR older intact bitch... hmm...
🤣
I feel like we approached this similarly. I just assumed on the ****ty x-rays based on signalment. Abdominal rads on a PU/PD, ADR older intact bitch... hmm...
In all fairness, that's how I approach clinical life, too. The diagnostics are really just for confirmation of the presumptive diagnosis. 🙂
Oh ooh, I got this!🤣
I feel like we approached this similarly. I just assumed on the ****ty x-rays based on signalment. Abdominal rads on a PU/PD, ADR older intact bitch... hmm...
Owner will bring them in right as you close with the crap rads and you have a choice (in my old area) : stay late and operate on the pyo, send them to the ER (where they won't be able to afford it), or supportive care till morning (of course based on status of the dog) and send her to the Spay/Neuter Clinic in the am for a near free surgery to remove that nasty old uterus!
You missed the most common choice.......
Euth?
Yup. (Though I'm biased since I only see the transfers and/or really bad cases, and my cost is way higher. I imagine not quite as many euthanize at a GP.)
WildZoo
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My finals are over 12/9 and then I'm free for a whole month! Hallelujah!!! And then probably free for the rest of spring semester because really the only reason I haven't been playing lately was NaNoWriMo (I should be either writing or studying right now).
Death Note! Yay! I'd be happy to help mod. Though I should probably try to finish the show first.
Same!
We are 0/3 in pyo euths at my place since I started working there. Iirc 2 were ER transfers, and 1 we had a specialist come in and do.
I can't say I've kept track, but .... I bet I've euth'd 25-33%? I suppose I exaggerated when I said the "most common" choice... but when I quote people a $3500 procedure with a fair prognosis (keep in mind they're usually lateral or nearly so by the time I see them) for a usually-older dog .... tough for a lot of people to swallow.
Curiosity - did the 2 that went to the ER get cut? It's REALLY common for GPs to send us things and then we euth them when they get here because the GP didn't really talk to them about the cost. So they get to us, get sticker shock, and we euth. It's super discouraging.
But I don't like that one. 🙁
That's why I wrote about my old area. Here it would be stay late for surgery, offer a payment arrangement, get screwed over for the bill
Or
Yeah, euth. But I have seen people here (used to work at a clinic in the area) storm out when the vet wouldn't do it for free and say they would give the dog a chance or a bullet.
So, yeah. Don't like that option. Instead, I wrote from my happy place.
While I worked at the ER, the prior practice had been to euth most, but I hooked them up with the S/N Clinic and the low income coordinator and we could get most of the dogs done next day for $0-$600. I referred 3 while I was at the ER and helped with surgery and recovery of 2 of those. (I worked at both for a bit.)
I haven't euthed a pyo yet. Had one die two days after surgery but she was likely septic from presentation and I had given a pretty grave prognosis (and really tried to refer... so prob would have been one of your euths) from getgo... It's prob around $900-1200 for workup/sx at my clinic, which is a lot for the area but people can often make it happen for a fair prognosis and not too old dog.
But we digress a bit. 😛
But we digress a bit. 😛
It's a big bill, not everyone has that money laying around. I would say not very many people at all, actually.
Yup. The first one was a backyard breeder, and I'm shocked she went through with it. She showed up for her scheduled spay with a dog that was nearly flat, and got pissed when our vet stated we were not equipped to deal with such a high risk procedure (we had been battling with this for around a week or two, but our vet was thinking the dog may have been in heat combined with a too-high dose of abx)(She told us the dog was better before showing up with her much worse). Bill ended up being over 5 grand from the ER, but since then she has spayed almost all of her animals and tells everyone she meets about her story and why you should spay. Happy ending there. The second case I believe also pulled through; with the exception of the first story, all the pyos I have seen were caught very early so the dog wasn't in horrendous shape. Our doctors are simply not comfortable doing the procedure without the resources of an ER clinic in case something goes wrong. They are very direct about costs, and make it clear that if the owners aren't willing to pay that we should euthanize at our clinic.
Yeah, and I think that's a smart approach (if an ER is available; obviously, you just do the best you can if not). The surgery really isn't a big deal, but they can require pretty intensive perioperative care. I've had two die before getting them into surgery - one about 15 minutes after presentation, and one overnight (owners declined Sx, wanted to wait until the next day to txfr to somewhere cheaper, but agreed to supportive care ... if I had to guess, I would have lost that one in Sx anyway). I haven't lost one during surgery or post-op. If they survive until after Sx, I expect them to do well.
****ty disease.
When I asked about it, one part was the anesthetic risk (we have emergency drugs but not nearly as many/as much variety)/after surgical care. Especially since we don't keep animals overnight (no staff). The other thing is that we don't have suction or anything like it, so if during removal there was rupture and pus got in the abdomen is would be a nightmare to deal with.
While we are all chatting about pyo, has anyone seen that photo going around Facebook of a kitty pyo that caused the cat to be 3 pounds lighter once it was removed? I have absolutely no idea how that didn't rupture, it was the size of a balloon.
Sure you do. It's called a technician with a 60mL syringe, a three-way stopcock, and a sterile extension line into the abdomen. 🙂 🙂
Way off topic - but during my internship I had a feline patient with a pyo that weighed more than the cat did, surgery went pretty fine and the cat seemed to recover well but over the following day the cat basically started throwing huge clots, we think it ended up with clots in both the spinal cord and the aortic bifurcation. sweet lady, sweet cat. of course.
Heart was actually fine, too. No HCM, no clots. Just bad hypercoagulability or something.
I've seen them swell once pulled from the abdomen as well. We had a teenage rottie bitch come in near lateral. Once opened, the uterus instantly started to swell and they quickly pulled up the sides of the drapes to hold it on the table. Her uterus expanded to be slightly longer than the distance from the body to the top of her head and just as wide as she was. At that point the foamy green pus ruptured her uterus and started to spill across the table. They took a pic at that point.
I think I remember it being some aerobic reactive bacteria, pretty rare, but owners had tried some sort of home douche treatment before bringing her in.
She was super sweet. She stayed with us for treatment of sepsis for a week or so and then pretty frequent bloodwork for the rest of her near year of life.
I think I remember it being some aerobic reactive bacteria, pretty rare, but owners had tried some sort of home douche treatment before bringing her in.
She was super sweet. She stayed with us for treatment of sepsis for a week or so and then pretty frequent bloodwork for the rest of her near year of life.
I wish I'd known that the day my job was to pick up a cat and pour the draining solution out of it's open abdominal incision by flipping it upside down in the air.
Edit: Abdominal wall was still sutured shut, this was just in the subQ/fat layers above the linnea (spelling?).
I've only seen two pyro cases after 3.5 years working in a clinic. One of them was a few weeks before I quit, and the guy just thought his dog was in heat. The vet came out of exam and said she was a 'murder scene.' (Dog lived, and recovered really quickly! It was a happy ending story.)
Also, since no one has done it yet. 
You have made my day. Although, sensitivity and specificity questions are my favorite
None of my coworkers had heard of a pyometra before, and they were reading the surgery schedule and trying to sound it out, it was great.
That'd be cool! I've just read the manga, so it'd be good to have a different perspective.
I've only treated one pyro case. Was in the news after being found in a trash can 50% covered in burns.
🙂
WildZoo
Noble Dubz Dictator, Unyeetable Phasing Wolf
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Volunteer Staff
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Sweet, then we'd have all our bases covered!
I've seen none so... you have me beat.
There was one case I knew of during the time I was working there but I didn't work surgery days at the time so I missed it. I always missed the interesting surgeries (okay, not always but it sure felt like always).
I've had four in three months. Yay rural places!
Lotsa people setting their animals on fire where you live?
Dude, after some of the typos/mispellings that our reception lets through... like the face swollenining I treated yesterday... I didn't even notice something as little as "pyro." 😛
So, about that WW.....
WW? What's that?
I think we legitimately need a NAVLE game for late October/early Nov next year. People who are about to take it can claim they're studying. Everyone else just gets a bit of review. I think this is fantastic. 😛
And I'll PM ya, @kaydubs.
And I'll PM ya, @kaydubs.
Do we get bonus points for turning a non vet med thread into one related to this forum? The process usually goes another way.
On another note, y'all motivated me to go back to Star WWars. It's not as bad as I feared - there's always bit characters to include if I need more names. @Lupin21, thoughts on running it? At this point, I think I need to set a deadline publicly to make sure I test balance - maybe after STL's Immuno game?
I'd play that! With luck, that's be my vacation rotation, too.
Also, @WildZoo, PM me once you finish the series and I'll share my spreadsheet with you. Wouldn't want to spoil things for you.
I can run a back to basics game anytime. Someone just needs to give me the word
I'll put you straight to work, don't worry
I'm also impressed by the turn this thread took 
Back to my practice test. Cheers
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Hello @Trilt,
Thanks for the shout-out.
Guess what?
I do not know how to play WW games. That's "why" I haven't signed-up for any of the WW games.
Does WW require a sizable investment of time? Is it fun and addictive? 🙂
When (and if) I figure out how to play WW games, I'll join everyone in the future.
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Please tag me here or shoot me a message on Facebook when this starts. I want to play.
I'm still in the noobs learn better outside of a noob only game boat. I don't really find the noob games to have helped all that much, the new players develop some bad habits then we spend the next 3-4 games beating out those habits instead of them never developing.
But I sure won't stop a noob game and I'd still probably agree to help mentor. ... just think mentoring works better when the noobs are playing with the more experienced instead of just via a PM guidance.
Or instead of asking about treatment or what to do next they ask what the mechanism of action of the drug that caused the toxicity is. ..... like no, nobody cares about the mech of action, as long as you can save the damn animal.
Word
