Gay and Out - Curious about experiences of other applicants!?

[zpdoc]

sfjohn

i previously attended rpi (NY) and mit (MA) where i studied engineering, and now live in california. i was out at both instutitions, both of which were heavily composed of geeky men, and were conservative

Hey, I went to mit ('99), and I'm not geeky! Nor do I consider myself conservative.

Seriously, though, I'm glad to see that this post is on a good track now. I don't think I have anything really constructive to add, but I want to say good luck to all of you.

---

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[relatively prime]

Originally posted by whyadoctor?


sex is a learned behavior, homosexuals either failed that class or weren't given a teacher.

What the heck? Why do you care? What business is it of yours with whom or how other people have sex? (so long as both both [or all] parties are consenting adults). I just don't get why people care who is having sex with who.

There is evidence to suggest it's genetic... but even if it's not... who the he11 cares?! Even if it's a choice, how is it wrong to chose to be gay? Doesn't everyone have the right to pursue happines so long as they don't hurt anyone?!

 

[scootad.]

Exactly, RP. Poor whyadoc. He seems like a miserable guy. If its the choice between being a satisfied gay person and a miserable hetero like whyadoc [assuming he's hetero which is questionable given his obsession w/ this topic] I'd say the choice is obvious.

What I'll never understand is why some people like whyadoc care so much about what other people enjoy sexually. It doesnt affect him personally so why care? Perhaps repression and jealousy about a move he'd never have the guts to make?

 

[whyadoctor?]

looks like the great hand of censorship is at it again.

 

[Random Access]

Originally posted by whyadoctor?
looks like the great hand of censorship is at it again.

And even if it is, what's your point? You only have a right to limited free expression on this board, pursuant to TOS.

To quote The Skulls:
We live by the rules.
We die by the rules.

 

[sketchyMcG]

So retarted, I feel like I need a helmet just to reply. I really dont feel like your sexual oreientation should be an issue at an interview. The only reason that it would be an issue is if you made it one. Who gives a crap if you like to sleep with men, keep it to yourself. Its none of anyones business and they probably dont want to hear about your sexual preferences anyway.

 

[whyadoctor?]

The Skulls? whoa, anyone who can quote a teeny bopper movie, must be important. any other words of wisdom oh great one?

 

[Random Access]

Originally posted by whyadoctor?
The Skulls? whoa, anyone who can quote a teeny bopper movie, must be important. any other words of wisdom oh great one?

Teeny bopper? The Skulls is a great comedy! Especially if you saw it in North Haven, CT on opening night.

Maybe you should make a real point instead of attacking a movie I watched once.

 

[nappy kat]

Originally posted by sketchyMcG
So retarted, I feel like I need a helmet just to reply. I really dont feel like your sexual oreientation should be an issue at an interview. The only reason that it would be an issue is if you made it one. Who gives a crap if you like to sleep with men, keep it to yourself. Its none of anyones business and they probably dont want to hear about your sexual preferences anyway.

these are my exact same sentiments. LET COMMON SENSE DICTATE, FRUITLOOPS. You all just want attention........why else do you care that everyone knows you're weird (different)? This thread should die with the wisdom set forth in this post.

 

[whyadoctor?]

Originally posted by Random Access
Teeny bopper? The Skulls is a great comedy! Especially if you saw it in North Haven, CT on opening night.

Maybe you should make a real point instead of attacking a movie I watched once.

i have made many "real" points, that's why the thread was moved. any personal attacks came from others against me.

connecticut is a little out of the way!

 

[gramcracker]

quote:
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by sketchyMcG
So retarted, I feel like I need a helmet just to reply. I really dont feel like your sexual oreientation should be an issue at an interview. The only reason that it would be an issue is if you made it one. Who gives a crap if you like to sleep with men, keep it to yourself. Its none of anyones business and they probably dont want to hear about your sexual preferences anyway.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
these are my exact same sentiments. LET COMMON SENSE DICTATE, FRUITLOOPS. You all just want attention........why else do you care that everyone knows you're weird (different)? This thread should die with the wisdom set forth in this post.

Calling the thread 'retarted' already shows so much respect and sensitivity for people different from you. God forbid you actually get accepted to medical school and have a '******' as a patient. Won't it be tough for you to keep a straight face and keep from laughing? Man, ******s are freakin' hilarious!

But I digress. If anyone gets *anything* from this mess-of-a-thread, please realize that, for 99% of gay applicants, it isn't about bringing up how you're 'different' or 'special' or even 'who you have sex with.' It's about coming out, or the process of figuring yourself out, or coming to terms with being gay, or how you deal with being a minority--just like any other minority. You learn a whole lot from coming out, dealing with a hateful and intolerant society. If there's any positives to the process, it's the fact that you gain coping skills, confidence in who you are, the ability to deal with challenging situations, and the appreciation for people's differences. And those are all important qualities that make good doctors. That's why it's brought up if it is. Everyone knows the medical profession tends to be on the more conservative side, and no one that's made it through the premed requirements and MCAT is going to bring up a not-conservative topic like homosexuality unless they think there's real value in bringing it up. In the words of an obnoxious twelve-year-old, "Duh."

 

[cheesewhiz]

Originally posted by sketchyMcG
Its none of anyones business and they probably dont want to hear about your sexual preferences anyway.

dude, in this very clearly gay-oriented thread, we didn't ask for your feedback either, but you had no prob sharing. can't all of the straight *****s just go play somewhere else? you are all so boring. and it's not like we haven't heard the same tired things you keep belaboring. i mean get a life already. why are you all hangin' out in the gay chat area? i think you should all get together and blow eachother. then you can have an uneasy laugh and say that it was "ok" 'cause you're all straight. whatever. you are all so painfully curious. just do it already. go to some city or something where no one knows you. it will be a hell of a lot more fun than fighting with your desires on this message board. i have never seen such sexual frustration from the straights. are you guys all butt ugly or something? computer freaks. whyadoc and nappypussy are posting like every 7 minutes! dudes - turn the computer off. leave your homes. mingle. get laid already. and take gramcracker. he's already started repeating page 2 of this post. see what i mean be boring?

 

[whyadoctor?]

stop insulting us by calling us gay!

 

[cheesewhiz]

Originally posted by whyadoctor?
stop insulting us by calling us gay!

don't get me wrong - i think you want a big dick in your butt. that alone by no means makes you gay. clearly i'm not elevating you to the same social status as myself, *******.

 

[whyadoctor?]

Originally posted by cheesewhiz
don't get me wrong - i think you want a big dick in your butt. that alone by no means makes you gay. clearly i'm not elevating you to the same social status as myself, *******.

if that doesn't...what does? please let me know, i'm dying to get on your same level.

 

[cheesewhiz]

Originally posted by whyadoctor?
if that doesn't...what does? please let me know, i'm dying to get on your same level.

you're still trying to figure that out what being gay is all about? how are you responding to all of this stuff and not absorbing anything? you are so dumb.

apparently i'm not the only one who thinks that you're dumb and rude. i just read some of your other postings. apparently you have a chip on your shoulder for everyone who is not exactly like you - you put down just about every other "type" of person out there - not just we homos. so now i don't feel so bad.

dude - turns out you're just some lameass from orange county who hasn't even gotten any uc interviews! that's your homestate man! they're bagging ya! of course you didn't think that you could spew all of this bull**** on a website and not have an admissions counselor see through your app, did you? anyway, not to brag, but i've already been accepted at some of the places you haven't even been offered to interview at. and it's getting late for ucsf - so fortunately i don't think i'll have to sit next to you in med school, and the fags won't have to worry about you coming up to san francisco with all of your fears and insecurities.

oh - i know you need to be spoon fed info. if you didn't get it yet, you would never be on my level. can't help ya orange county boy. good luck in albany, or wherever you end up.

 

[AegisZero]

Originally posted by whozshoe
Hi everyone,

Actually, there is considerable literature citing ' evidence' for a biological basis for homosexuality. Granted, there are weaknesses in some of the research, but it's still intriguing. Hope you find the references below helpful:

Simon LeVay and Dean Hamer. "Evidence for a Biological Influence in Male Homosexuality." Scientific American, May 1994 pp 20-25

A critique of LeVay and Hamer's research is written by Richard Horton. "Is Homosexuality Inherited", New York Review, July 13:36-41.

None of the present work is definitive, but it certainly suggests that human sexuality is much more complex than a simple "error in the socialization process."
In response to the jamyl's original post, fortunately so far the people I've met in the medical (admissions) community have been pretty accepting of it. UCSF also has resources available to the general public that share personal experiences on whether or not their students/residents/faculty were ever open, and how that affected (more often it didn't seem to affect at all) their candidacy.
Search their website for the link.
PC
Peace and Compassion

Well, before I begin. I dont really care if/if youre not gay. If you love other members of the same sex, or members of the opposite sex, so be it. Its none of my business, but I am willing to support your right to keep it private.

The arguments against a biological basis of homosexuality center around one premise: that if there were such a homosexual gene (or set of genes), it would become diluted into oblivion because such individuals dont reproduce.

I dont think there is a legitimate scientific basis for calling homosexuality an "error in socialization." The fact is, no one knows why. But more importantly, no one should really care why beyond a curiosity standpoint. If a reason were discovered, it most definitely ought not affect the way people are treated or viewed by society. So the goal of such research shouldnt be to change people, but just to understand another facet of our complex social universe.

 

[whyadoctor?]

Originally posted by cheesewhiz
you're still trying to figure that out what being gay is all about? how are you responding to all of this stuff and not absorbing anything? you are so dumb.

apparently i'm not the only one who thinks that you're dumb and rude. i just read some of your other postings. apparently you have a chip on your shoulder for everyone who is not exactly like you - you put down just about every other "type" of person out there - not just we homos. so now i don't feel so bad.

dude - turns out you're just some lameass from orange county who hasn't even gotten any uc interviews! that's your homestate man! they're bagging ya! of course you didn't think that you could spew all of this bull**** on a website and not have an admissions counselor see through your app, did you? anyway, not to brag, but i've already been accepted at some of the places you haven't even been offered to interview at. and it's getting late for ucsf - so fortunately i don't think i'll have to sit next to you in med school, and the fags won't have to worry about you coming up to san francisco with all of your fears and insecurities.

oh - i know you need to be spoon fed info. if you didn't get it yet, you would never be on my level. can't help ya orange county boy. good luck in albany, or wherever you end up.

easy cheesedick, don't get overexcited now.

 

[cheesewhiz]

overexcited? me? dude, try this on for excitement...

wait - first, did i mention lately how dumb you are??

you are SO DUMB that you've left a nice little paper trail all over SDN that both identifies you, where you've interviewed, and shows how feebleminded (and dumb, of course) you are.

if there's anything i'm excited about, it's how this little project i've come up with to protect the future patients of america, and the medical class entering in 2003, from interacting with you. this ROCKS!! read on.

i put together a little care package with an assortment of your sdn postings. this rather lengthy document includes: 1) identification: your profile, your sdn handle, many of your own references to your current residence -- orange county, where you've interviewed and when, etc. 2) evidence of why you shouldn't be a doctor: LOTS of postings where you bash gays, other minorities, question the black man's plight, question how bad felonies really are, and say other dumb, dumb things, and basically show that you can't get along with anyone who is not a cookie cut out of yourself

now how many other orange county boys do you think interviewed at albany med (one of your 2 interviews) on halloween? i think they'll know who whyadoctor? is, don't you??

just maybe the admissions office will think it's a bit too compelling to admit such a loser, given the huge numbers of qualified applicants to their program.

keep posting, and give me more info for georgetown, you *******.

 

[Dr. Wall$treet]

Originally posted by cheesewhiz
overexcited? me? dude, try this on for excitement...

wait - first, did i mention lately how dumb you are??

you are SO DUMB that you've left a nice little paper trail all over SDN that both identifies you, where you've interviewed, and shows how feebleminded (and dumb, of course) you are.

if there's anything i'm excited about, it's how this little project i've come up with to protect the future patients of america, and the medical class entering in 2003, from interacting with you. this ROCKS!! read on.

i put together a little care package with an assortment of your sdn postings. this rather lengthy document includes: 1) identification: your profile, your sdn handle, many of your own references to your current residence -- orange county, where you've interviewed and when, etc. 2) evidence of why you shouldn't be a doctor: LOTS of postings where you bash gays, other minorities, question the black man's plight, question how bad felonies really are, and say other dumb, dumb things, and basically show that you can't get along with anyone who is not a cookie cut out of yourself

now how many other orange county boys do you think interviewed at albany med (one of your 2 interviews) on halloween? i think they'll know who whyadoctor? is, don't you??

just maybe the admissions office will think it's a bit too compelling to admit such a loser, given the huge numbers of qualified applicants to their program.

keep posting, and give me more info for georgetown, you *******.

Cheezwhiz- wayyyyyy too much time on your hands.. can anyone say.. Stalker

 

[whyadoctor?]

anything i've written on this thread, or any others, has been the truth. please, send anything you want to albany, it'll probably add to my application. i interviewed on halloween with a heart surgeon and a pediatric neurologist. that could help them to narrow it down. isn't georgetown catholic? if you didn't know, genius boy, homosexuality is condemned by god and the catholic church. i must've really written some compelling arguments to stir such attention in you, for that i am satisfied.

 

[womansurg]

One of my attendings, who is also a JD (attorney) as well as a surgeon, always says, "never put anything in writing that you're not willing to see blown up in 6 inch tall letters on a placard in the front of a courtroom." Good words to live by...

Having said that, while I come down firmly on the side of tolerance (heck...I'm a flaming liberal...), I do find cheesewhiz's tactics inappropriate here.

Bigotry hurts; racism hurts; intolerance hurts. The answer, however, is open discussion of the ideas and the roots behind these thoughts and feelings. If I poll my surgical colleagues here in this midwestern program, half of them will be openly homophobic and the other half will be disapproving and without understanding. That is the reality of the mindset and backgrounds of the members of our medical community - as well as mainstream America. Unfortunately, the truth is that Whyadoc would find himself in the majority opinion of most medical communities in this country, unless he restricts himself to the larger cities of either coast.

It's critically important that forums exist for people struggling with these ideas to expose them, hear alternate viewpoints, and possibly realize the common bond that exists with people of different mindsets. I think Whyadoc IS uncomfortable with his ideas, which is why he so passionately and persistently airs them in a public forum which is in such uniform opposition. He's trying to understand - and not being successful right away, which is not surprising. He's armed with a lifetime of experiences and persuasions, as well as powerful emotional content - the sources for which can only be speculated.

Let's not silence the debate. Clearly we have a willing audience in Whyadoc; let's take advantage of our opportunities to educate and to inform.

-ws

 

[whyadoctor?]

womansurg...

why are the arguments i've made incorrect? if an individual is diagnosed by myself as being sick, dysfunctional, abnormal, or whatever, does that mean that i have fear or contempt for that patient? does that mean that i am "intolerant" of that patient? i just don't see how you and most everyone else are equating the belief that homosexuality is pathological with intolerance. that would mean that i am intolerant and fearful of abused children whose development has been negatively altered from their abuse. i assure you i am not. as an aspiring physician i wish to change the world i live in by healing, not simply curing, anyone who is in need. while it may be too late to invoke such change in some individuals, not all are lost. and to those i reach out to.

 

[Dr. Wall$treet]

well i havent read every post onthis thread but i can see it started to become a gay bashing thread or so i hvae read in a few posts. i have never been a hating person, so i really didnt care either way like if a guy or girl wanted to be gay then let them go for it ya know, never really affected my life. I had somewhat of an interesting experience that shed some new light on it. I had this buddy, a kid i met in some of my premed classes, he was a total standup guy, smart as hell and we would study and **** together. He seemd totally normal, wed go have beers onece and awhile etc. albeit we werent really good freinds, he was always a cool ass guy taht seemed totally normal. Well like two years later he came out and told me he actually was gay.. at first it wierded me out a bit but afrer a few weeks i was fine, still go have beers with the guy and shoot **** about life and medschool and stuff. Hes cool like he answers quetsions most straights alwys wnat to know about gays but never really can ask.. he is fine to joke about whatever etc. so it defeintly gave me a better impression.. So anyway i dont really care, let people choose their lifestyle as long as they arent preaching it or selling it or hitting on me etc.. more power to em.. as for gay parents adopting kids.. ewll dont get me started on that one, that im against but for the sake of the kid.. anyway taht is a nothre post

 

[medicnas]

Originally posted by cheesewhiz


if there's anything i'm excited about, it's how this little project i've come up with to protect the future patients of america, and the medical class entering in 2003, from interacting with you. this ROCKS!! read on.

i put together a little care package with an assortment of your sdn postings. this rather lengthy document includes: 1) identification: your profile, your sdn handle, many of your own references to your current residence -- orange county, where you've interviewed and when, etc. 2) evidence of why you shouldn't be a doctor: LOTS of postings where you bash gays, other minorities, question the black man's plight, question how bad felonies really are, and say other dumb, dumb things, and basically show that you can't get along with anyone who is not a cookie cut out of yourself

now how many other orange county boys do you think interviewed at albany med (one of your 2 interviews) on halloween? i think they'll know who whyadoctor? is, don't you??

just maybe the admissions office will think it's a bit too compelling to admit such a loser, given the huge numbers of qualified applicants to their program.

keep posting, and give me more info for georgetown, you *******.

You know, Cheezwhiz, your post scares me even more than all of Whyadoc's posts. Why? Because if what you did is true, then it shows just how vicious and unaccepting a person YOU are. I also disagree with Whyadoc's views, but the whole idea is to let people have their say. Somewhere along the line, Cheezewhiz, you felt that God appointed you judge, jury and executioner of the Truth. If you're so closeminded that you cannot even allow discussion to take place then what kind of doctor do you think you'll become? If you come down on the side of liberalism and understanding, you MUST understand that everybody is entitled to think what they like so long as those feeling remain THOUGHTS. Has Whyadoc discriminated against any openly gay individuals (i.e. kept them from getting a job or getting into medical school?): NO. And just because what somebody has to say makes you or anybody else uncomfortable doesn't mean that they have to stop saying it, or should be punished for saying it. I think racism is absolutely deplorable...but does that give me the right to censor a Klansman? Absolutely not. Freedom to be what somebody wants to be (gay, straight, accepting, closeminded) is what this entire thread is about. If you're forcing somebody to act a certain way, you have become the unaccepting type of person you so deplore.

What you're doing is trying to force, quite maliciously I might add, somebody to your own viewpoint. In a way you're trying to censor what Whyadoc has to say. This is wrong. If you disagree with me, then perhaps you'd like to argue with the Supreme Court. Legal precedent, in free speech cases, protects the individual's right to speech (even hate speech) so long as they're not inciting a riot, slandering somebody else, or making threats. If you disagree with this idea of free speech, perhaps you should move out of the country to somewhere like Saudi Arabia, Iraq or China where you would no longer have the right to free speech.

If you're going to preach tolerance, then believe in tolerance and understand what tolerance means. And by God I hope that you were just joking about sending out that mailing.......it's not too late to apologize.

 

[whyadoctor?]

very intelligent medicnas, i applaud you and appreciate your support of freedom.

 

[JScrusader]

Originally posted by AegisZero
Well, before I begin. I dont really care if/if youre not gay. If you love other members of the same sex, or members of the opposite sex, so be it. Its none of my business, but I am willing to support your right to keep it private.

The arguments against a biological basis of homosexuality center around one premise: that if there were such a homosexual gene (or set of genes), it would become diluted into oblivion because such individuals dont reproduce.

I dont think there is a legitimate scientific basis for calling homosexuality an "error in socialization." The fact is, no one knows why. But more importantly, no one should really care why beyond a curiosity standpoint. If a reason were discovered, it most definitely ought not affect the way people are treated or viewed by society. So the goal of such research shouldnt be to change people, but just to understand another facet of our complex social universe.

Sorry if this has been mentioned, I haven't read all of the posts on this thread. Another theory on homosexuality is altruism, i.e., the same altruism that a bee will die for his colony by stinging a predator. Homosexuals would not reproduce, thus not creating or adding a drain on resources within a family unit.

 

[carmell1981]

how many ppl on this thread think that those who simply disapprove (without any kind of malice or hatred) of the homosexual lifestyle (or that the lifestyle might be due to some kind of disorder or defect) is a homophobic? and from what i've read, those ppl are also prejudiced and racist too.
as for me, I sincerely do my best to be considerate, respectful and supportive of those I know who are homosexual as I do everyone else who have shown they deserve such things. Yet at the same time, I will not condone or support their lifestyle. Does that make me a bigot?
i think there might be a biological basis to homosexuality when it comes to people who were born with sexual ambiguity with their sex organs or genotype. i had this brain and behavior class that discussed this at length. it even had a clinical correlate where a young couple went in to see their doctor bec. they had trouble conceiving. when the dr examined the woman, he found out she was actually genetically male, only looked female externally. yet she was socialized enough to actually live and think like a woman. my theory is that those who have homosexual tendencies MAY have some kind of random genetic defect that was not overcome by socialization.
yet I do think that there is a fraction of the homosexual population who choose the lifestyle bec. of blatant lust or sexual appetite (call it what you will) not bec. of genetic/biological basis. how i came up with this conclusion is not supported by experience nor can i admit to having many homosexual friends (I have a few). it merely came by instinctive/reflective thoughts. how we can distinguish btwn two kinds i have no idea either. but it is the second kind that I disapprove of. perhaps i will post later why, for now i think this is too long enough.
peace

 

[relatively prime]

Originally posted by medicnas


What you're doing is trying to force, quite maliciously I might add, somebody to your own viewpoint. In a way you're trying to censor what Whyadoc has to say. This is wrong. If you disagree with me, then perhaps you'd like to argue with the Supreme Court. Legal precedent, in free speech cases, protects the individual's right to speech (even hate speech) so long as they're not inciting a riot, slandering somebody else, or making threats. If you disagree with this idea of free speech, perhaps you should move out of the country to somewhere like Saudi Arabia, Iraq or China where you would no longer have the right to free speech.

If you're going to preach tolerance, then believe in tolerance and understand what tolerance means. And by God I hope that you were just joking about sending out that mailing.......it's not too late to apologize.

Aren't you being a little mellowdramatic? No one is trying to take away this kid's freedom of speech.

Whyadoctor said Stop insulting us by calling us gay.

Now... that's not what I or any intelligent person) calls tolerance...

 

[whyadoctor?]

Originally posted by relatively prime
Aren't you being a little mellowdramatic? No one is trying to take away this kid's freedom of speech. Now... that's not what I or any intelligent person) calls tolerance...

that was a sarcastic response to individuals attempting to somehow insult me by stating that i "want a big dick in my butt", and other comments. i thought that it was atrocious that people who felt so strongly opposed my ideas would use that as a personal attack. do you not see the hypocrisy? i never took it as an insult, but it was definitely intended as one!

 

[relatively prime]

What makes you think that they(he) meant it as an attack? There is a bit of truth (sometimes) to the old suspicion that someone who is ardently anti-gay is such because of repressed homosexual desires. I had a friend once who was so anti-gay it made me uncomfortable... always saying really mean and nasty things about gay people... 2 years later he tells me that he is gay and that it was all a denial/defense thing. Certainly this isn't the case all the time... but it does happen this way sometimes. Your enthusiasm for homophobia might lead someone to wonder if you didn't fall into this case.

It wasn't an attack... but a way of discrediting your arguments as the ravings of a person supressing his own homosexual desires.

Not that I agree with the person who made that statement, I'm just explaining why it wasn't a pesonal atack.

 

[whyadoctor?]

"He seems like a miserable guy. If its the choice between being a satisfied gay person and a miserable hetero like whyadoc [assuming he's hetero which is questionable given his obsession w/ this topic] I'd say the choice is obvious."

"dude, in this very clearly gay-oriented thread, we didn't ask for your feedback either, but you had no prob sharing. can't all of the straight *****s just go play somewhere else? you are all so boring. and it's not like we haven't heard the same tired things you keep belaboring. i mean get a life already. why are you all hangin' out in the gay chat area? i think you should all get together and blow eachother. then you can have an uneasy laugh and say that it was "ok" 'cause you're all straight. whatever. you are all so painfully curious. just do it already. go to some city or something where no one knows you. it will be a hell of a lot more fun than fighting with your desires on this message board. i have never seen such sexual frustration from the straights. are you guys all butt ugly or something? computer freaks."

you are deluding yourself if you believe that the above statements were not written to be insulting. they obviously were. they were written with the hopes that they would somehow intimidate, embarrass, and quiet my speech. if you want to believe that they these statements were an objective attempt to somehow introduce a valid point, i think you should rethink that position.

 

[relatively prime]

Originally posted by whyadoctor?
"He seems like a miserable guy. If its the choice between being a satisfied gay person and a miserable hetero like whyadoc [assuming he's hetero which is questionable given his obsession w/ this topic] I'd say the choice is obvious."

"dude, in this very clearly gay-oriented thread, we didn't ask for your feedback either, but you had no prob sharing. can't all of the straight *****s just go play somewhere else? you are all so boring. and it's not like we haven't heard the same tired things you keep belaboring. i mean get a life already. why are you all hangin' out in the gay chat area? i think you should all get together and blow eachother. then you can have an uneasy laugh and say that it was "ok" 'cause you're all straight. whatever. you are all so painfully curious. just do it already. go to some city or something where no one knows you. it will be a hell of a lot more fun than fighting with your desires on this message board. i have never seen such sexual frustration from the straights. are you guys all butt ugly or something? computer freaks."

you are deluding yourself if you believe that the above statements were not written to be insulting. they obviously were. they were written with the hopes that they would somehow intimidate, embarrass, and quiet my speech. if you want to believe that they these statements were an objective attempt to somehow introduce a valid point, i think you should rethink that position.

Whyadoctor, these people aren't using "you're gay" as an insult. They are using it to annoy you and to discredit your arguements. THey themselves do not think that calling someone gay is an insult... however, they know that given how much homosexuality disgusts you, you would be bothered by being called gay... and that's why they've said this.... to bother you.

It's natural (however immature) to want to hurt or insult someone who has hurt and/or insulted you. Your words are EXTREMELY hurtful to homosexual people and to the people who love them... so these posters have, in their pain and frustration, lashed out at you. Yes, it may have been immature, but you are no better than them... your words no less hurtful and insulting.

But whatever... it's a shame a guy can't start a thread like this without people like you coming in and bashing homosexuals... then having people like me posting in defense.

 

[sketchyMcG]

((((worst thread ever))))

Somebody please wake me up when its over......

 

[Mudd]

There is no way I want to read all of these pages, but a few questions do pop up from the few posts I read.

• 1. Why should someone's sexual orientation affect their qualifications as a doctor? If the gay community is considered underserved, then wouldn't it be better to target doctors willing to serve the gay community as opposed to gay doctors? A person's sexual orientation seems to have little bearing on their ability to be a good physician.
  
  2. If whyadoctor is as homophobic as he is being accused, why does it matter? I fully agree with relatively prime's assessment that he likely a repressed homosexual who lashes out at gays in an effort to keep his true desires at bay. But why does it matter? He has every right to express homophobic views as the rest of us civilized people have to express indifference towards and acceptance of homosexuality. Now if he chooses to be a doctor who witholds care from someone because of their sexual orientation, whether it is denying homosexuals care while he's in his self-denial stage or whetehr it is denying heterosexuals care once he gives in to his inner yearning, he is wrong. But as long as whyadoctor is willing to care for all people equally, his opinion should be as expressable as any.

 

[Mudd]

Originally posted by whyadoctor?
isn't georgetown catholic? if you didn't know, genius boy, homosexuality is condemned by god and the catholic church.

LOL!

Now that is the funniest thing I've read. Yep, those Roman Catholic priests sure are opposed to homosexuality, especially with alter boys.

 

[lola]

bump

 

[relatively prime]

Originally posted by Mudd


2. ... I fully agree with relatively prime's assessment that he likely a repressed homosexual who lashes out at gays in an effort to keep his true desires at bay. But why does it matter? He has every right to express homophobic views as the rest of us civilized people have to express indifference towards and acceptance of homosexuality. .. .[/list]

Hey now... I never said whyadoc necessarily has repressed homosexual desires... you're going to get in in trouble here. I only said it's a POSSIBILITY. I have no idea about what goes on in that head of his... and I don't really care to know either.

He has every right to be [a/an] ________(fill appropriate noun or adjective)... I'm not denying him that, but for the sake of the gay people reading this thread (well... really for the sake of everyone reading this thread), I feel the need to let him and everyone else know that not all straight people are _________ (fill in plural form of word used above).

 

[rbassdo]

Here's a thought...if you're gay(or straight)...don't let the world know...it's medical school...not a march on the capital. Get your education and get out. I'm a heterosexual and that has nothing to do with training to be a doctor.

 

[Mudd]

Originally posted by rbassdo
Here's a thought...if you're gay(or straight)...don't let the world know... I'm a heterosexual and that has nothing to do with training to be a doctor.

Practice what you... hmmm, I can't remember the ending. Maybe you can help me rbassdo.

 

[scootad.]

Ha! What a f*cking hypocrite.

 

[rbassdo]

Hey Mudd,

We could play games with words all day. I was just trying to make a point. Why don't you address this point? If I've noticed one thing about the pre-allopathic forum, it's that people are more interested in critiquing like this, instead of addressing the real heart of the issues.

 

[relatively prime]

Originally posted by rbassdo
Hey Mudd,

We could play games with words all day. I was just trying to make a point. Why don't you address this point? If I've noticed one thing about the pre-allopathic forum, it's that people are more interested in critiquing like this, instead of addressing the real heart of the issues.

Because... most of us get sick and tired of saying the same things over and over again. You haven't brought up a new issue... this "issue" of wether or not to let adcoms know you're gay has been brought up many times... once even in this thread. The simple facts are these...

1) many people are bias against gay people (as you can clearly see on this board)
2) mentioning a struggle (such as one against social bias) to an adcom is a student's personal choice.

A gay person may or may not want to mention his/her struggle with homophobia for the same reasons a black person may or may not want to talk about his/her struggle with racism. It's just that person's personal choice. It depends on how much of a struggle they've had and how relevant they think it is to their lives and/or educational experiences. THere are many reasons a gay person might want to mention their sexuality to an adcom...

1) they are very active in a political group aimed at gaining equal rights for gays
2) they feel that there is a need for more doctors who are sensative to the special needs of homosexuals
3) they may feel that dealing with persecution has played a role in shaping who they are today

THe same goes for any URM or other person who's suffered unfair judgement.


I hope that satisfies your odd desire to have this issue addressed for the billionth time.

 

[tatabox80]

Originally posted by relatively prime
Because... most of us get sick and tired of saying the same things over and over again. You haven't brought up a new issue... this "issue" of wether or not to let adcoms know you're gay has been brought up many times... once even in this thread. The simple facts are these...

1) many people are bias against gay people (as you can clearly see on this board)
2) mentioning a struggle (such as one against social bias) top an adcom is a student's personal choice.

A gay person may or may not want to mention his/her struggle with homophobia for the same reasons a black person may or may not want to talk about his/her struggle with racism. It's just that person's personal choice. It depends on how much of a struggle they've had and how relevant they think it is to their lives and/or educational experiences. THere are many reasons a gay person might want to mention their sexuality to an adcom...

1) they are very active in a political group aimed at gaining equal rights for gays
2) they feel that there is a need for more doctors who are sensative to the special needs of homosexuals
3) they may feel that dealing with persecution has played a role in shaping who they are today

THe same goes for any URM or other person who's suffered unfair judgement.


I hope that satisfies your odd desire to have this issue addressed for the billionth time.

Amen Sista!

 

[whyadoctor?]

Originally posted by Mudd
LOL!

Now that is the funniest thing I've read. Yep, those Roman Catholic priests sure are opposed to homosexuality, especially with alter boys.

applying the exception to the general makes for a very intelligent argument. i guess that's why lola approved.

 

[Mudd]

Originally posted by rbassdo
We could play games with words all day. I was just trying to make a point. Why don't you address this point?

It.s not a word game at all... I used only your words. Your point was very much lost when you start by saying "don't let the world know" your sexual orientation and then three senteces later start off by saying "I'm a hetreosexual..." My point is that there was no need to state that, unless you are so homophobic that you fear being labeled as such by posting in this thread. As far as addressing the point, you obviously haven't read all of the posts. I wouldn't read them all either, but I have posted about five messages addressing points. It just got tiring, so sarcasm became a more entertaining option. Besides, what could I say that the brilliant words of relatively prime haven't said already.

Originally posted by rbassdo
If I've noticed one thing about the pre-allopathic forum, it's that people are more interested in critiquing like this, instead of addressing the real heart of the issues.

Aren't you critiquing the pre-allo forum by saying that? Is your opinion of the pre-allo forum the heart of the issue here?

Relatively Prime
Absolutely brilliant presentation. The only thing I might add is that sexual orientation may be pertinent if a life-changing exerience that in someway involved sexual orientation (volunteer experience or personal experience) impacted the applicant's behavior and pursuit of medicine.

 

[Mudd]

Originally posted by whyadoctor?
applying the exception to the general makes for a very intelligent argument. i guess that's why lola approved.

I think you mean exceptionS. There are several instances of this behavior that have been reported over the last decade or two, which means there are likely hundreds more cases not making news.

And what would you know about intelligent arguments? Using an arbitrary source that lacks clartity on its stance for your foundation is hardly an intelligent post. This whole thing is a matter of opinion; no more and no less. I have formulated my opinion based on my interactions in life. You have formed yours, according to your quote at least, by an indoctrinated religious belief. Look at how the churches of the world have changed their opinions over time on many issues, and then tell me how static and sound your opinion that God has disdane for homosexuals is. You can't quote God here, especially if you believe that God is responsible for every life form, including homosexuals.

The bottom line is that you are a homophobic bigot and I 100% support your right to be as such. I disagree with your opinion and tend to agree with the aforementioned views that you are making an outspoken and valiant effort to suppress your natural tendency for homosexuality. But no matter what the reasons for your bias, you have the right to hold this bias.

 

[whyadoctor?]

Originally posted by Mudd
I think you mean exceptionS. There are several instances of this behavior that have been reported over the last decade or two, which means there are likely hundreds more cases not making news.

And what would you know about intelligent arguments? Using an arbitrary source that lacks clartity on its stance for your foundation is hardly an intelligent post. This whole thing is a matter of opinion; no more and no less. I have formulated my opinion based on my interactions in life. You have formed yours, according to your quote at least, by an indoctrinated religious belief. Look at how the churches of the world have changed their opinions over time on many issues, and then tell me how static and sound your opinion that God has disdane for homosexuals is. You can't quote God here, especially if you believe that God is responsible for every life form, including homosexuals.

The bottom line is that you are a homophobic bigot and I 100% support your right to be as such. I disagree with your opinion and tend to agree with the aforementioned views that you are making an outspoken and valiant effort to suppress your natural tendency for homosexuality. But no matter what the reasons for your bias, you have the right to hold this bias.

i know it is tempting, and maybe a little fun to take my words out of context but, it really holds no ground and accomplishes nothing. if you're coming into this thread at the end then you should probably go back and read my previous posts. i never claimed that homosexuals are disgusting or immoral. i never claimed that because catholicism condemns homosexuality that that makes it wrong. religion was never my argument. mentioning religious beliefs does not make them mine. and i never even said that god holds disdane for homosexuals! according to biblical teachings he loves everyone equally, including sinners/homosexuals. by stating this theological analysis does it mean i believe it? no!

and even if there have been thousands of cases of homosexual clergy in the catholic church, applying this tiny percentage as being indicative of the religion as a whole is fallacious. even if the entire clergy were acting out their homosexual desires, the religion, the catechism still condemns it. do i support this condemnation? once again, i do not.

i have stated previosly that, to my knowledge, no parents intentionally teach their children to be homosexuals. it is also my understanding that human sexual behavior is learned, no one is born "knowing". so the heterosexual message was improperly sent or received. to me this makes homosexuality a disorder.

now, if people want to tear this argument apart, then that is what i hope for. personal attacks and insults are just a result of an acute hypersensitivity to this issue. while i'm sure they will come, they will be ignored.

 

[rbassdo]

I guess I better stay out of this one from now on. You all are right about these issues being brought up over and over. I guess I thought this was a forum where people could voice their own opinions - even if it's a repeat. I think that happens everywhere and all the time.

As for my own statements...maybe I should have said, "IF I was a heterosexual (or homosexual), I wouldn't let the world know." That way, I would not have given away my sexual orientation while contradicting myself. I suppose that would have been much much better and I apologize for my lack of intelligence and word choice.
Don't get me wrong...I believe there is a time and a place for "coming out" or being bold, but I'm not convinced that anyone should be too concerned about how that relates to med school. Maybe a little, but no too much. Again, I'm not the first to voice this opinion.

By the way, Mudd, I WAS critiquing this forum. Sometimes we have to go backwards, a little, before we can go forwards.

Ryan

 

[relatively prime]

rbassdo: Of course the whole point of these threads is for people to voice their opinions, no matter what they are... HOWEVER, it's perfectly useless to ONLY state your opinon. What's more important than your opinion is how you developed this opinion... your reasoning behind it. Otherwise, we'd just start a poll and be done with the whole thing. In your previous post all you said was that people should keep their sexuality to themselves... and that was it... with no explaination as to why you would think that.