Glide Year "Psychedelic Pharmaceutical Investigation" Masters a Good Idea or not?

[HugeHungryHippo]

I've done a DIY post-bacc with 72 credit hours total, 52 being BCPM. I have a 3.71 cGPA during only my post-bacc hours, but my total cGPA including undergrad several years ago is still 3.38... Additionally I scored a 514 on the MCAT. I have 2600 EMT hours, 1600 Scribe hours, Hundreds of volunteer hours mostly from a non-profit that I formed and manage, but some from other experiences, and Prosection Certificate from a cadaver dissection series at a local CC.

I had hoped that I distinguished my academic ability enough during my DIY post-bacc that my undergraduate GPA could be forgiven. At this point however I have not received any II's (only 1 rejection out of 30 MD schools though; going to apply to two DO schools soon) and I am starting to realize that I may need to apply another cycle.

My first question is should I consider a SMP? Since I have a solid MCAT and good grades in many of the typical core classes, it seems like I might get minimal benefit out of attending one, especially considering the price - would it be redundant/unnecessary considering all that I've done during my DIY post-bacc?

I'm leaning towards answering 'yes' to that last question and then wondering what other programs could be a boon to my application. A Masters in Public Health is a common option but personally it doesn't appeal to me. Since I have personal interests in specializing in Psychiatry or Neurology long term - and looking at the emergence of Psychedelics research centers at several Universities - the "Psychedelic Pharmaceutical Investigation" Masters Program at Wisconsin School of Pharmacy seems potentially relevant. It's a 1 year, all online program. Do you think that pursuing this degree would play well on applications, or would it be treated as odd or taboo?

I'm also pursuing a research experience to add to my application next cycle, but is there anything else that I should be considering?

Thanks for your input!

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[Dral]

The psychedelic stuff seems to be on the cutting edge right now. I'm seeing a lot about it. If it really interests you and will apply to what you do in the future, go for it. However, do realize that there will be a bunch of folks (some who were around for or otherwise know about all the stuff in the 60s) who may not look as favorably on it.

A 3.71 is an excellent GPA. It's my impression that MD schools are going to really be looking at that cumulative GPA, while DO schools may appreciate that you did better in your post bac.

I'd say skip the SMP and apply to a nice number of DO schools next time around if you don't get an A this cycle.

 

[deleted367183]

The program may not actually BE flaky, but it sounds flaky, so I would avoid it.

 

[HugeHungryHippo]

The program may not actually BE flaky, but it sounds flaky, so I would avoid it.

Hmm what exactly do you mean by that? It's a new program and I'm not totally convinced it's worth it either - I have a meeting with an advisor for the program next week so hopefully I can get a better sense of things. Any specific questions you think I need to be sure to ask?

 

[deleted367183]

I mean that an adcom would probably think, just by reading the name of the program and seeing that it’s taught online, that the material is not challenging/rigorous/relevant to medicine. Even if it in fact is. Perception is the problem here.

 

[HugeHungryHippo]

I mean that an adcom would probably think, just by reading the name of the program and seeing that it’s taught online, that the material is not challenging/rigorous/relevant to medicine. Even if it in fact is. Perception is the problem here.

Gotcha. That's totally valid. I would worry about the optics of the program on paper. But SMP's don't seem like a fit for someone in my situation, and Public Health Masters don't personally appeal to me, so I'm not sure what other options to pursue - at least this program appeals to me and is relevant to an emerging area of medicine/research.

I have a meeting with an advisor later today so I'll definitely get their opinion.

 

[deleted367183]

How about the research option you mention? Can you pursue that full-time?

 

[Goro]

The psychedelic stuff seems to be on the cutting edge right now. I'm seeing a lot about it. If it really interests you and will apply to what you do in the future, go for it. However, do realize that there will be a bunch of folks (some who were around for or otherwise know about all the stuff in the 60s) who may not look as favorably on it.

A 3.71 is an excellent GPA. It's my impression that MD schools are going to really be looking at that cumulative GPA, while DO schools may appreciate that you did better in your post bac.

I'd say skip the SMP and apply to a nice number of DO schools next time around if you don't get an A this cycle.

I agree with skipping the SMP. You have reinvented yourself.

What was your school list?

 

[HugeHungryHippo]

I agree with skipping the SMP. You have reinvented yourself.

What was your school list?

Schools I applied to:
Georgetown (R), Penn, NYULI, Albert Einstein, Stanford, UCSD, OHSU, UMass, UNC, UVM, Kaiser, University of Utah, Rush, Keck, UNLV, UCR, UCI, UCLA, EVMS, Emory, Mayo, U of Az, Wisc. Madison, U of Colorado, Washu, Yale, California University of Science and Med, UIC, UCDavis (no secondary yet...). No DO schools yet, I'm going to apply to a few shortly...

I see now that my school list was definitely too ambitious (I only applied to Mayo clinic because I have a LOR from an eponymous Physician), but I applied to 30 schools total and did include several schools that I felt were within reach. But maybe I was mistaken about those by assuming schools would overlook my UG performance.

I'm in Cali though and understand how competitive it is here, especially seeing as I don't have any research experience. That's definitely at the top of my list of things to do.

 

[HugeHungryHippo]

How about the research option you mention? Can you pursue that full-time?

Possibly. I'm only in sporadic email contact with the PI but a few days ago he emailed me simply "Are you good to join in January? We can have a Zoom meeting as well if you wish." I responded yes to both but have not heard anything back definitively yet - I am under the impression that it's a volunteer position and I don't know exactly what options are available to me between part-time and full-time commitment. I will ask about it if/when we have that Zoom meeting.

I gather you think my time would be best spent in that volunteer research position?

 

[Goro]

Albert Einstein, Stanford, OHSU, UMass, UNC, Kaiser, University of Utah, UNLV, UCR, U of Az, Wisc. Madison, U of Colorado, Washu, Yale, UIC, (no secondary yet...). No DO schools yet, I'm going to apply to a few shortly...

The above were all donations. Not all MD schools reward reinvention. Several wouldn't have taken you even with a 525 MCAT and a 4.0 GPA, because they only take in-staters.

And should have had DO schools on the list right from the get-go. So hurry on the apps for those, because time's a wastin'

 

[HugeHungryHippo]

The above were all donations. Not all MD schools reward reinvention. Several wouldn't have taken you even with a 525 MCAT and a 4.0 GPA, because they only take in-staters.

And should have had DO schools on the list right from the get-go. So hurry on the apps for those, because time's a wastin'

Valid. Like I said, I see my mistakes now for what they are. I was excited to apply and became overzealous.

 

[Dral]

I'm not trying to add insult to injury here, but that is a very top heavy list of MD schools for a cumulative 3.38 GPA. It looks like you should have a good 50/50 shot though if you formulate the right application strategy (probably higher than 50/50 if you apply to the right schools):

https://www.aamc.org/media/6091/download

Do you have an advisor you can utilize to help out if you need to formulate a list for next year? The MSAR is a good resource as well if you didn't use it already. Also, there are a few individuals here who can help with lists...especially with DO schools including Goro (who already has seen this thread) and @Faha

 

[Faha]

Many of the OOS schools on your list were unrealistic and some are state public schools that accept few non residents with your GPA and no connection to the state. If you need to reapply next year I suggest these MD schools:
TCU-UNT
Tulane
Creighton
NOVA MD
Wake Forest
George Washington
EVMS
Virginia Commonwealth
Penn State
Drexel
Temple
Jefferson
Seton Hall
New York Medical College
Albany
Vermont
Quinnipiac
Oakland Beaumont
Wayne State
Western Michigan
Medical College Wisconsin
Loyola
California University
Kaiser
UC Irvine
UC Davis
Also apply to DO schools and I suggest these:
WESTERN
TUCOM-CA
AZCOM
ATSU-KCOM
KCU-COM
DMU-COM
MU-COM
LECOM (all schools)
PCOM (all schools)
ACOM
CUSOM
Touro-NY
NYITCOM

 

[deleted367183]

Possibly. I'm only in sporadic email contact with the PI but a few days ago he emailed me simply "Are you good to join in January? We can have a Zoom meeting as well if you wish." I responded yes to both but have not heard anything back definitively yet - I am under the impression that it's a volunteer position and I don't know exactly what options are available to me between part-time and full-time commitment. I will ask about it if/when we have that Zoom meeting.

I gather you think my time would be best spent in that volunteer research position?

I don't think it has to be specifically a research position, although a year of FT or committed PT research would certainly not hurt. Just any productive and vaguely medical activity. (Like, I wouldn't travel Europe for a year.) But I wouldn't do the psychedelics program. If it were at a university or medical school, that would be another thing, but it's especially not good that it's at a school of pharmacy. Any interest in bioinformatics or biostatistics? Every field of medicine now needs someone who is literate in one or both.

But it's worth noting that you will likely have to put in some pretty decent time in order to be on a publication, assuming this is the average lab. I unfortunately was not in a position to volunteer full-time, but I got on a publication after a year of HARDCORE part-time contributions.

Also, why not apply to Cincinnati, my medical alma mater? They take plenty of OOS students, myself very much included.

 

[HugeHungryHippo]

Many of the OOS schools on your list were unrealistic and some are state public schools that accept few non residents with your GPA and no connection to the state. If you need to reapply next year I suggest these MD schools:
TCU-UNT
Tulane
Creighton
NOVA MD
Wake Forest
George Washington
EVMS
Virginia Commonwealth
Penn State
Drexel
Temple
Jefferson
Seton Hall
New York Medical College
Albany
Vermont
Quinnipiac
Oakland Beaumont
Wayne State
Western Michigan
Medical College Wisconsin
Loyola
California University
Kaiser
UC Irvine
UC Davis
Also apply to DO schools and I suggest these:
WESTERN
TUCOM-CA
AZCOM
ATSU-KCOM
KCU-COM
DMU-COM
MU-COM
LECOM (all schools)
PCOM (all schools)
ACOM
CUSOM
Touro-NY
NYITCOM

Thank you I appreciate your list. I realize that I neglected to apply strategically, so these recommendations are invaluable to me.

I did receive an Interview at California University in December, so that's been validating. Any opinions on that program specifically? There's no data on it since their first class graduates this year.

 

[HugeHungryHippo]

I don't think it has to be specifically a research position, although a year of FT or committed PT research would certainly not hurt. Just any productive and vaguely medical activity. (Like, I wouldn't travel Europe for a year.) But I wouldn't do the psychedelics program. If it were at a university or medical school, that would be another thing, but it's especially not good that it's at a school of pharmacy. Any interest in bioinformatics or biostatistics? Every field of medicine now needs someone who is literate in one or both.

But it's worth noting that you will likely have to put in some pretty decent time in order to be on a publication, assuming this is the average lab. I unfortunately was not in a position to volunteer full-time, but I got on a publication after a year of HARDCORE part-time contributions.

Also, why not apply to Cincinnati, my medical alma mater? They take plenty of OOS students, myself very much included.

I talked with the PI on Zoom last week and it seemed very open ended. I can commit as much tome to the lab experience as I want. And the student that gave me his contact info mentioned to me that over the long-term working at his lab will lead to getting named on a publication. That said, I start in January which leaves about 6 months before applications open again, which doesn't seem like much time to make my mark. But I'm not sure what else to do so maybe I can commit myself to hardcore lab work.

I will certainly keep Cincinnati in mind. I was so desperate to get applications out that I neglected to make a proper list and was too ambitious. If I go another cycle I will definitely be smarter about the process.

 

[HugeHungryHippo]

I'm not trying to add insult to injury here, but that is a very top heavy list of MD schools for a cumulative 3.38 GPA. It looks like you should have a good 50/50 shot though if you formulate the right application strategy (probably higher than 50/50 if you apply to the right schools):

https://www.aamc.org/media/6091/download

Do you have an advisor you can utilize to help out if you need to formulate a list for next year? The MSAR is a good resource as well if you didn't use it already. Also, there are a few individuals here who can help with lists...especially with DO schools including Goro (who already has seen this thread) and @Faha

No insult taken, it's accurate and I was overly ambitious. I assumed that I had simply distinguished myself from my undergrad GPA, but it's not that simple I guess.

I have one MD interview now with California University SOM, so that is validating.

I don't have a solid advisor, no. My UG institution has a loose pre-med committee and one of the members had been assisting me, but I have not heard from him in several weeks. I'm planning to try and reach out to him again this week.

I did use MSAR but really only looked at my MCAT and post-bacc GPA when choosing schools; did not go very in depth. I'm thinking of applying to Western at this end of this cycle because my post-bacc CC has a good relationship with their school. It may not work out but it could. Otherwise, next year I will have to be wiser when formulating a list of schools. It seems like people utilize this site for it if they don't have a pre-med advisor so I certainly won't shy away from using this resource.

 

[Bonne Nuit]

I'm thinking of applying to Western at this end of this cycle because my post-bacc CC has a good relationship with their school. It may not work out but it could.

If you are planning to apply to any DO schools this cycle, including Western, you need to get in your application NOW, like within the next day or so. It is already extremely late in the cycle.

If you cannot get your application in immediately, you should wait and reapply to MD/DO next cycle should you not get an acceptance this year.