Hardcore Masters??

[NRAI2001]

Well I m currently doing my masters in Biomedical Sciences. Basically its a very intense 1 year program, where you take all of the 1st year med school courses, with the exception of anatomy and genetics.

Because of this my graduate gpa may not be as high as other masters students.

I ll have like a 3.0 or 3.1 or so. Will this be impressive to medical schools? I pretty much got Bs in all of my medical school courses with a few As in my health management courses.

****Getting Bs in medical school is pretty dam tuff, not like getting Bs in undergrad***

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[deleted113029]

Well I m currently doing my masters in Biomedical Sciences. Basically its a very intense 1 year program, where you take all of the 1st year med school courses, with the exception of anatomy and genetics.

Because of this my graduate gpa may not be as high as other masters students.

I ll have like a 3.0 or 3.1 or so. Will this be impressive to medical schools? I pretty much got Bs in all of my medical school courses with a few As in my health management courses.

****Getting Bs in medical school is pretty dam tuff, not like getting Bs in undergrad***

are you saying you took the courses with other med students? if you didn't, then this post is

i know a good number of people with a 4.0 in med school who have also taken anatomy. this is a daunting course that requires a ton of space in the brain. i don't understand your concept of a hardcore masters...this is just too

 

[DrMidlife]

See the post-bac forum. You're in what's called an "SMP" and you'll find your classmates there.

 

[1Path]

Well I m currently doing my masters in Biomedical Sciences. Basically its a very intense 1 year program, where you take all of the 1st year med school courses, with the exception of anatomy and genetics.

I know the type of program you're referring to and NO they aren't always considered "SMP's". And being a Pharm graduate student myself, I THROUGHLY understand what you mean by hard core. This stuff is kicking my a$$, but it's sooooo interesting!!!!

 

[NRAI2001]

I know the type of program you're referring to and NO they aren't always considered "SMP's". And being a Pharm graduate student myself, I THROUGHLY understand what you mean by hard core. This stuff is kicking my a$$, but it's sooooo interesting!!!!

Ya exactly, some people will not really understand the difficulty of medical/pharm school untill they experience it themselves. Even getting a C is pretty tough. Getting Bs is much tougher, and getting As is even much more tough.

 

[NRAI2001]

are you saying you took the courses with other med students? if you didn't, then this post is

i know a good number of people with a 4.0 in med school who have also taken anatomy. this is a daunting course that requires a ton of space in the brain. i don't understand your concept of a hardcore masters...this is just too

Yes I did take the medical courses with the medical students and on their curves. My school is pretty basic science intensive, they stress the point that a hard basic science experience will result to a better usmle...but who cares you wont believe me untill you re in med school. Its MUCH more harder than any undergrad (and I did biology at Berkeley).

 

[deleted113029]

Yes I did take the medical courses with the medical students and on their curves. My school is pretty basic science intensive, they stress the point that a hard basic science experience will result to a better usmle...but who cares you wont believe me untill you re in med school. Its MUCH more harder than any undergrad (and I did biology at Berkeley).

yeah, you're right...i don't know how hard it is in med school. during med school, i just accomplished >250 step 1, >260 step 2, junior AOA. i'll be at Brigham in July...

 

[1Path]

yeah, you're right...i don't know how hard it is in med school. during med school, i just accomplished >250 step 1, >260 step 2, junior AOA. i'll be at Brigham in July...

I assume Brigham was your second on your ROL since you failed to mention that too.

 

[deleted113029]

I assume Brigham was your second on your ROL since you failed to mention that too.

hey man. lemme just have a little fun in the premed forum! i graduate in a couple of weeks so let me be.

 

[NRAI2001]

yeah, you're right...i don't know how hard it is in med school. during med school, i just accomplished >250 step 1, >260 step 2, junior AOA. i'll be at Brigham in July...

Ya sure......troll

 

[TheGalvaniFrog]

Depends on how the grades are curved in your classes. If "B" is equivalent of getting a "Pass" for medical students, you could argue that you have demonstrated that you can handle the med school curriculum as well as the average med student.

 

[deleted113029]

Ya sure......troll

you're one funny naive premed student. that whole "biology at Berkeley" comment is laughable. sounds to me you're trying to come to grips with your insecurities as a student with a low masters GPA.

look at my previous posts over the past year. hook, line and sinker

 

[NRAI2001]

you're one funny naive premed student. that whole "biology at Berkeley" comment is laughable. sounds to me you're trying to come to grips with your insecurities as a student with a low masters GPA.

look at my previous posts over the past year. hook, line and sinker

Get a life... bye bye

 

[NRAI2001]

Depends on how the grades are curved in your classes. If "B" is equivalent of getting a "Pass" for medical students, you could argue that you have demonstrated that you can handle the med school curriculum as well as the average med student.

C = pass
B= high pass
A= honors

**Most of my Bs have been B+ but my school doesnt include +s or -s in the gpa (where B= 3.0 and B+ = 3.3) the little boost would have been nice though.

 

[MochezzmO]

NRAI,

We've talked before about RFU and their new BMS program. Any words of wisdom/caution/advice about applying and whether or not the program is still worth it? I'm going to be applying to BU and RFU for sure, and maybe add drexel.

How are the classes curved at RFU (ie. is the mean a B)? I thought I read somewhere that some classes are not curved and others are, ect... is this true? Also, any numbers on the number of people that have gotten into RFU from the BMS program?

Any help would be greatly appreciated. Also, about me, I'm finishing up my MPH in biostat/epi and all my research is in molecular epi field (studying SNPs and the like). Although, some might say the MPH isnt a hardcore science masters, you can make it such if you pursue that way. I can tell you that I've taken alot of courses with PhD/masters students, and that topics like physio and cell bio are approached much differently (ie. research oriented: techniques, design experiments, explain major concepts, ect). Just giving you an idea for the future.

Bottom line, do it if you really want to do it and see yourself doing it.

Peace and best of luck.

MochezzmO

 

[NRAI2001]

NRAI,

We've talked before about RFU and their new BMS program. Any words of wisdom/caution/advice about applying and whether or not the program is still worth it? I'm going to be applying to BU and RFU for sure, and maybe add drexel.

How are the classes curved at RFU (ie. is the mean a B)? I thought I read somewhere that some classes are not curved and others are, ect... is this true? Also, any numbers on the number of people that have gotten into RFU from the BMS program?

Any help would be greatly appreciated. Also, about me, I'm finishing up my MPH in biostat/epi and all my research is in molecular epi field (studying SNPs and the like). Although, some might say the MPH isnt a hardcore science masters, you can make it such if you pursue that way. I can tell you that I've taken alot of courses with PhD/masters students, and that topics like physio and cell bio are approached much differently (ie. research oriented: techniques, design experiments, explain major concepts, ect). Just giving you an idea for the future.

Bottom line, do it if you really want to do it and see yourself doing it.

Peace and best of luck.

MochezzmO

All the classes are curved to make the mean an 80%. So half the class gets Cs and the other half gets As and Bs. Sounds easy right just be in top 50% right? Its harder than it sounds. People here are really smart, and there is nothing to do besides study (bc of the isolated location of the school) so people study soo much here. Thats why getting a B is a pretty good grade and in the past if you had a 3.0 u were admitted. No one knows whats going on for this year. We are kinda the genia pig year, probably wont really know the outcome of acceptances/rejections till the program is over, well over (i.e. 3 to 5 weeks after the quarter has ended).

To say the least this has been the hardest year of my life. The year just dragged on, felt like I was here for like 3 years. Made a few good friends here, but the classes were much more difficult than I anticipated (everyone felt this way) and the location of the school pretty much sucks hard. If you come here, make sure you know what you are getting yourself into, it definitely wont be an easy year; most people I have talked to said it was the hardest year of their lives also.

Wether or not I get in, we ll see. I have about a 3.0 at the moment, but I m just thinking of backup plans just in case if it doesnt work out. 5 more weeks left!!!

 

[1Path]

To say the least this has been the hardest year of my life............Wether or not I get in, we ll see. I have about a 3.0 at the moment, but I m just thinking of backup plans just in case if it doesnt work out. 5 more weeks left!!!

Having a low "B" average in a Master's degree program is in general a HUGE problem to the adcoms from what I understand. However, I think it's up to each individual applicant to make the arguement of the difficulty of the type of courses you've taken and why they demonstrate your ability to handle medical school ie talk about it in your personal statement. Hopefully, you're applying to the school where you're currently taking the classes so getting into that school should be MUCH easier in general because 1) They KNOW how difficult the classes you're taking are and 2) You managed to get some solid LOR's from med school faculty there too. These 2 things are key.

 

[NRAI2001]

Having a low "B" average in a Master's degree program is in general a HUGE problem to the adcoms from what I understand. However, I think it's up to each individual applicant to make the arguement of the difficulty of the type of courses you've taken and why they demonstrate your ability to handle medical school ie talk about it in your personal statement. Hopefully, you're applying to the school where you're currently taking the classes so getting into that school should be MUCH easier in general because 1) They KNOW how difficult the classes you're taking are and 2) You managed to get some solid LOR's from med school faculty there too. These 2 things are key.

If you dont know about my program; I am basically taking all the first year med classes besides anatomy and genetics. In the past if you had a 3.0 you were guaranteed admission into the medical school. This year they changed the program a little bit so that the 3.0 guarantee is no longer there.

What happens, we ll see.

 

[1Path]

If you dont know about my program; I am basically taking all the first year med classes besides anatomy and genetics. In the past if you had a 3.0 you were guaranteed admission into the medical school. This year they changed the program a little bit so that the 3.0 guarantee is no longer there

I got that the first time you posted.

All I'm simply saying is (and try not to get defensive because my grad GPA is going to be hurt a bit by taking med school classes too) that the "I'm taking med school classes which is why my grad GPA is low" arguement isn't going to fly at all med schools.


So, best of luck to both of us!

 

[relentless11]

All I'm simply saying is (and try not to get defensive because my grad GPA is going to be hurt a bit by taking med school classes too) that the "I'm taking med school classes which is why my grad GPA is low" arguement isn't going to fly at all med schools.

I agree with this. In the OP's case, it may actually look bad to have a 3.0. Graduate/Professional school was never made to be easy. However, you are all expected to do well, in since you are screened for better performance, the bar has been raised. One should be doing around a 3.4 in graduate/professional school work.

I do agree with the OP that med school classes are harder than undergrad classes. But its no reason to get a B. One should be comparing yourself to the other med students and/or graduate students. Grad programs boot you out for getting anything below a B, hence motivating many students to get A-'s if not A's. My program at UCD is through our med school, and thus we also take med school classes. My fellow PhD students average about a 3.5. It was challenging to get A's but certainly not hard, and definitely not a rare event among my classmates. In many cases, med school classes were easier in terms of subject material, if not in terms of it being so interesting it motivated you to do it well!

So the standards are a lot higher if you are doing an SMP, MS, or PhD regardless if you take med school classes. Its part of the game, and if you want to get in, then you have to do well regardless of what classes you take, where you are at, and what you do. Good luck!

 

[NRAI2001]

I agree with this. In the OP's case, it may actually look bad to have a 3.0. Graduate/Professional school was never made to be easy. However, you are all expected to do well, in since you are screened for better performance, the bar has been raised. One should be doing around a 3.4 in graduate/professional school work.

I do agree with the OP that med school classes are harder than undergrad classes. But its no reason to get a B. One should be comparing yourself to the other med students and/or graduate students. Grad programs boot you out for getting anything below a B, hence motivating many students to get A-'s if not A's. My program at UCD is through our med school, and thus we also take med school classes. My fellow PhD students average about a 3.5. It was challenging to get A's but certainly not hard, and definitely not a rare event among my classmates. In many cases, med school classes were easier in terms of subject material, if not in terms of it being so interesting it motivated you to do it well!

So the standards are a lot higher if you are doing an SMP, MS, or PhD regardless if you take med school classes. Its part of the game, and if you want to get in, then you have to do well regardless of what classes you take, where you are at, and what you do. Good luck!

Not getting too defensive here but I think the difficulty of a medical school is very school dependent. At my school (chicago medical school) they really emphasis a difficult basic science because the school thinks it will equate to higher board scores, and for the most part it does. This school is considered a lower tier school, but its matchlist is very very impressive mainly bc of the above average board score this school achieves every year.

But comparing post bacc work to medical school courses is not very comparable. Medical school is much harder. Yes getting As is doable, but its not like undergrad anymore. We started with about 100 students and we re down to 60 now. 40 failed out and i m sure 10 to 15 of the remaining 60 will not have a 3.0.

I think basically I will have to explain to medical schools very clearly that my masters program was not a regular masters where people rarely get anything below a B. People here struggle just to get Cs and pass (med students included), getting Bs is pretty good here. As are very very impressive.

 

[relentless11]

Not getting too defensive here but I think the difficulty of a medical school is very school dependent.

No I totally agree with this too. Really depends on the school. UCD is still relatively a traditional program as well compared to say UCSF which is more PBL. That too can make a difference. Some people do well in PBL environments vs. others. Of course the UC med schools also match very well.

But comparing post bacc work to medical school courses is not very comparable. Medical school is much harder. Yes getting As is doable, but its not like undergrad anymore. We started with about 100 students and we re down to 60 now. 40 failed out and i m sure 10 to 15 of the remaining 60 will not have a 3.0.

Yes, post-bacc in terms of taking undergrad classes is totally not comparable to med school courses. Of course for my case, I was not taking undergrad classes. Would be interesting to see the SMPer's chime in (like say Georgetown). I have no idea what the standards are there, but it would be best to compare it to them. How you address your masters (+ med school classes) issue will be interesting to see since that will be how I will argue my case with my PhD program.

I think basically I will have to explain to medical schools very clearly that my masters program was not a regular masters where people rarely get anything below a B. People here struggle just to get Cs and pass (med students included), getting Bs is pretty good here. As are very very impressive.

I agree that you have to explain to the med schools that its not a "regular program" however stating its because people at your school struggle to get C's and pass is still not the case. All med schools require a C of some kind to pass (UCD requires a 75%). However this is like justifying that it is OK to get C's as an undergrad at Cal due to the competition. As a fellow UC student, I know Cal is ultra-competative, but a C-average or B-average from Cal still won't fly when compared to other UC students that have B+/A- averages. Walk carefully here. I think it'll come down to how you justify it while not making it sound like "well everyone else is like that too" excuse.

 

[TheGalvaniFrog]

From your previous posts it's clear that at your program B = High Pass. I can only assume that only a minority of med students perform at High Pass or higher level. At Georgetown, generally only the top 25% of med students get High Pass or Honors. Assuming the percentage at RFU is not too different, you can certainly claim that you are performing at a level better than the average med student.

It's odd that your program would set the GPA cut-offs to be so low; people generally don't associate a GPA of 3.0 with High Pass performance.

 

[1Path]

I think basically I will have to explain to medical schools very clearly that my masters program was not a regular masters where people rarely get anything below a B. People here struggle just to get Cs and pass (med students included), getting Bs is pretty good here. As are very very impressive.

I guess I plan to go into an entirely different direction. I don't plan to spend one minute explaining why my Master's program is rigorous because too many folks believe grad grades are inflated. When asked why I think I can handle med school, I'm going to simply talk about the classes I successfully completed going head to head with med students.

 

[NRAI2001]

From your previous posts it's clear that at your program B = High Pass. I can only assume that only a minority of med students perform at High Pass or higher level. At Georgetown, generally only the top 25% of med students get High Pass or Honors. Assuming the percentage at RFU is not too different, you can certainly claim that you are performing at a level better than the average med student.

It's odd that your program would set the GPA cut-offs to be so low; people generally don't associate a GPA of 3.0 with High Pass performance.

Well our school doesnt have + or -s in the grades (i.e. a 81% and a 88% both = a B). a B= 3.0 and A = 4.0, so having straight Bs = high passes = 3.0.