torque

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ahhhh I just gotta kick my nuts !!!!

PAT : 18
QR: 18
RC: 18
Bio: 19
GC: 19
OC: 15 (WTF !!!!!)

ok, so I know that score won't cut it.

So what should I do?
Take the DAT again in three months?
Or should I look for a SMP? or postbac?

My GPA isn't that great either.

I think I saw some dental schools have a postbac program where upon the successful completion, the students are guaranteed to get into their dental school.. which ones are they?

Thanks. :(

I'm just so disappointed (married and a baby on the way)...
 
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torque

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BTW, destroyer didn't really work out for me.
There weren't many reactions/problems that I saw in the destroyer. :(
 
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torque

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I just feel terrible for my wife and my baby :(

Wife was crying when I broke the news that I'm not getting in this year.

Man, for all you singles, get in first and then get married.

:(
 
Jun 8, 2009
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what threw you off for OC? You said nothing was like destroyer. what kind of questions did you see mostly?
 
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torque

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what threw you off for OC? You said nothing was like destroyer. what kind of questions did you see mostly?
I didn't say "nothing" was like destroyer, however, I didn't see lots of boiling point/melting point/solubility/Jones reagent/Hydride rxns/rate law etc.

I had a few of NMR/IR related problems.

Honestly, OC was probably my main focused object but man...

And for those of you who haven't taken the DAT yet, go to the bathroom before
you take the seat !!!

I didn't realize Science and PAT section combined was that long and
really had to speed through some of the problems :(
 

sfrice80

Blood, Sweat, and Beers
Jun 11, 2009
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Man that does suck, sounds like you have tough circumstances too, I would just suggest in re-taking in 3 months and hope for the best. Try to study more and I hope your not just relying on destroyer to study. When you say your gpa isnt that great either, what are we looking at? Do you have a degree and if so in what?
 
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torque

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Man that does suck, sounds like you have tough circumstances too, I would just suggest in re-taking in 3 months and hope for the best. Try to study more and I hope your not just relying on destroyer to study. When you say your gpa isnt that great either, what are we looking at? Do you have a degree and if so in what?
sGPA is sub 3.0 and overall GPA is a little above 3.0.
I used Kaplan and destroyer to study for OC.
Will I still have a shot if I take it again within 3 months?
I do have a BA in Psychology from UCI.

If I take it again, since I already submitted everything thru AADSAS, should I call the schools to tell them not to look at the DAT score until I retake'em?

Thanks.:(
 

sfrice80

Blood, Sweat, and Beers
Jun 11, 2009
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Do you have a state school at all? A post-bacc program sounds like not such a bad idea, but if you can absolutely smoke your DAT's in 3 months, you'll still have a chance this cycle, your gpa doesnt help you but some schools really like high DAT's.
 
Jun 8, 2009
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sGPA is sub 3.0 and overall GPA is a little above 3.0.
I used Kaplan and destroyer to study for OC.
Will I still have a shot if I take it again within 3 months?
I do have a BA in Psychology from UCI.

If I take it again, since I already submitted everything thru AADSAS, should I call the schools to tell them not to look at the DAT score until I retake'em?

Thanks.:(
Well, you can still have a shot even now. Dont stress. Its done now and you cant change the scores, you can take it again. But in the meantime if you want you should try with these scores. I took DAT last year and someone i knew did too. We both had scores on lower end...her AA was 18. She did get in. So you never know. Good luck though
 
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torque

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Do you have a state school at all? A post-bacc program sounds like not such a bad idea, but if you can absolutely smoke your DAT's in 3 months, you'll still have a chance this cycle, your gpa doesnt help you but some schools really like high DAT's.
Do you happen to know some schools that offer a postbacc program and when students complete the program, they let'em into their dental school?

I can't seem to remember for the life of me :(

I will and I can smoke the DAT in three months tho.

I don't think any school will look at 15 on OC. Thanks tho.
 

zoralsurgeon

noegruslaroz
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May 25, 2009
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Dude! Don't freak out! I have a friend that got in with 18's...Seriously, don't freak out!! You have a chance! Make your application impressive..The DAT does not determine who will make the best dentist...and they know this...:)
 
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torque

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Dude! Don't freak out! I have a friend that got in with 18's...Seriously, don't freak out!! You have a chance! Make your application impressive..The DAT does not determine who will make the best dentist...and they know this...:)
Thanks buddy. I really appreciate it.

I was so shocked after the test, looking at the screen, feeling really terrible for my wife and baby.. u know what do I tell her, etc, because we've made all plans for next year thinking that I would get in somewhere ....

I have vast experiences with dentistry, and EC's.

I have no doubt I would be the dentist that will take the best care of the patients.. ahhh !!!
 

BiomajorPreDent

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Honestly, people might flame me for this, but I think it really is just the luck of the draw on what kind of test you get.

I took the exam 3 times and in OChem got a 18, 19, 15 using only Kaplan

Which means to me that Kaplan was good enough to do well in OChem

(I know most SDN people get 20+ and consider that good but the average scores of matriculating D1s is 19 so I consider that a good score)

But Kaplan also wasnt good enough

You see what I mean? It depends on the test that you get. So the best way to handle this is to make sure you know everything. Kaplan doesnt cover everything. Your OChem textbook does (or atleast 90% of it)

If I were you, I would retake in 3 months. But use your college textbooks, you can blow through them in a few weeks since you are familar with the material.

Kaplan doesnt cover nearly enough reactions, and I have just started destroyer but I dont know how useful it will be until after I retake next month.

Dont give up, especially if this was just your first time taking the exam.

Even though your GPA is low, SDN scores of 20+ are not representative of the entire applicant pool.
 

cmills66

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Do you happen to know some schools that offer a postbacc program and when students complete the program, they let'em into their dental school?

I can't seem to remember for the life of me :(

I will and I can smoke the DAT in three months tho.

I don't think any school will look at 15 on OC. Thanks tho.
A friend of mine got into buffalo with a 15 in OC, he's a state resident, but still, dont give up hope.
 
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torque

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Honestly, people might flame me for this, but I think it really is just the luck of the draw on what kind of test you get.

I took the exam 3 times and in OChem got a 18, 19, 15 using only Kaplan

Which means to me that Kaplan was good enough to do well in OChem

(I know most SDN people get 20+ and consider that good but the average scores of matriculating D1s is 19 so I consider that a good score)

But Kaplan also wasnt good enough

You see what I mean? It depends on the test that you get. So the best way to handle this is to make sure you know everything. Kaplan doesnt cover everything. Your OChem textbook does (or atleast 90% of it)

If I were you, I would retake in 3 months. But use your college textbooks, you can blow through them in a few weeks since you are familar with the material.

Kaplan doesnt cover nearly enough reactions, and I have just started destroyer but I dont know how useful it will be until after I retake next month.

Dont give up, especially if this was just your first time taking the exam.

Even though your GPA is low, SDN scores of 20+ are not representative of the entire applicant pool.
Thanks.
I feel bad even laying the news to my wife even before I talked to you guys.
 
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torque

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so should I contact each school and tell them not to look at my score yet?
I'm afraid they might reject it before I take the test again..
 

BiomajorPreDent

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Dont worry, everyone gets a little emotional when they dont score what they wanted the day of the exam. It happens to all of us. Tell your wife that you calmed down and thought it over and looked into things and what your plan is. :)

Ideally, you should have put planning to retake in your AADSAS, but since you already sent it, just call each school and tell them that you will be retaking the DAT in 3 months, and they will hold your application until then.

The schools most likely did not get your scores yet so it shouldnt be a problem as long as they know you are retaking.

Also..just a thought..when you make your new appointment, when they ask where you want the new scores sent, I wouldnt send the scores to any schools you applied to. Send them after, once you see your scores if you like them

The reason for this: Hypothetically if you do bad again the next time you take the exam..HYPOTHETICALLY..and you want to retake it again for a 3rd time:

You dont want the adcoms to now see 2 sets of bad scores before seeing the third set of new good ones.

So if you take it again and do bad no big deal, no one sees them. You take it again and do good? You send the scores, and yes they will see the bad ones from the second time you took them, but there will be a 3rd set of good ones.

Now if you do bad the 3rd time also, no big deal, you just go with the scores you have now..which besides organic, arent that bad.

I tried to explain that without being confusing, but it was just an idea.

Ofcourse the plan is to smoke it the next time and be done with it..but its good to have a plan.
 
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torque

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My application hasn't been sent out yet (will be on 30th), can I just put the scores in, and change the Future DAT date to October?
or should I still call the schools?

Thanks.
 

zoralsurgeon

noegruslaroz
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Dont worry, everyone gets a little emotional when they dont score what they wanted the day of the exam. It happens to all of us. Tell your wife that you calmed down and thought it over and looked into things and what your plan is. :)

Ideally, you should have put planning to retake in your AADSAS, but since you already sent it, just call each school and tell them that you will be retaking the DAT in 3 months, and they will hold your application until then.

The schools most likely did not get your scores yet so it shouldnt be a problem as long as they know you are retaking.

Also..just a thought..when you make your new appointment, when they ask where you want the new scores sent, I wouldnt send the scores to any schools you applied to. Send them after, once you see your scores if you like them

The reason for this: Hypothetically if you do bad again the next time you take the exam..HYPOTHETICALLY..and you want to retake it again for a 3rd time:

You dont want the adcoms to now see 2 sets of bad scores before seeing the third set of new good ones.

So if you take it again and do bad no big deal, no one sees them. You take it again and do good? You send the scores, and yes they will see the bad ones from the second time you took them, but there will be a 3rd set of good ones.

Now if you do bad the 3rd time also, no big deal, you just go with the scores you have now..which besides organic, arent that bad.

I tried to explain that without being confusing, but it was just an idea.

Ofcourse the plan is to smoke it the next time and be done with it..but its good to have a plan.
Brilliant advice! 18's ARE NOT BAD! They may look bad because everyone on SDN gets 20+ lol! But this SDN, in my opinion, has members that are overachievers (I'm one of them) lol...And there is nothing wrong with that...YOU WILL BE FINE!
 

crew09

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Jun 13, 2009
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Bro,

Don't give up. Evaluate your options. Call your dschools admission dept. and check for cut offs--avoid assumptions, and at the same time look at some Post Bacc options. One year will hardly make a difference in the long run, I had a friend who completed one and is now doing awesome in dschool as a result. That extra year gave him a 'breather' and an edge academically in dschool.

I had another friend who squeaked in with an 18AA and is now forced to redo his second year. Not to say an 18 is a 'bad' score, but he could have used a post bacc.

Avoid thoughts correlating your DAT score with your career as a dentist--it's a stepping stone.

After checking with your schools and if you can talk to some students similar to your situation who've gotten in, make an informed decision.

3 months, the lessons learned from first DAT experience, more focus on ochem, and you can pull up that AA.

Things happen for the better, keep your options open, best of luck!
 

BiomajorPreDent

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My application hasn't been sent out yet (will be on 30th), can I just put the scores in, and change the Future DAT date to October?
or should I still call the schools?

Thanks.
If you did not E-submit, then just put these scores in and select that you are taking it again in (Month)

Then you dont have to call anyone

BUT

If you already e-submitted but it just hasnt been mailed by AADSAS yet, then you will have to wait until it gets sent out most likely and call each school (If thats the case then right now your kinda in limbo, the schools dont have your app yet so calling right now wont help. But you cant change AADSAS)
 
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torque

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Bro,

Don't give up. Evaluate your options. Call your dschools admission dept. and check for cut offs--avoid assumptions, and at the same time look at some Post Bacc options. One year will hardly make a difference in the long run, I had a friend who completed one and is now doing awesome in dschool as a result. That extra year gave him a 'breather' and an edge academically in dschool.

I had another friend who squeaked in with an 18AA and is now forced to redo his second year. Not to say an 18 is a 'bad' score, but he could have used a post bacc.

Avoid thoughts correlating your DAT score with your career as a dentist--it's a stepping stone.

After checking with your schools and if you can talk to some students similar to your situation who've gotten in, make an informed decision.

3 months, the lessons learned from first DAT experience, more focus on ochem, and you can pull up that AA.

Things happen for the better, keep your options open, best of luck!

Thanks for the encouraging words.

Do you happen to know any good postbacc-programs?
 
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torque

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If you did not E-submit, then just put these scores in and select that you are taking it again in (Month)

Then you dont have to call anyone

BUT

If you already e-submitted but it just hasnt been mailed by AADSAS yet, then you will have to wait until it gets sent out most likely and call each school (If thats the case then right now your kinda in limbo, the schools dont have your app yet so calling right now wont help. But you cant change AADSAS)
I did e-submit already, however I WAS able to put in my scores and change the future DAT date. So I'm wondering I can change the DAT score until they send it out??

Thanks!!!!
 

BiomajorPreDent

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Think of it in a positive way: You cant get piano'ed again :D

Idk about the DAT thing on the AADSAS, I just left mine blank.
 

crew09

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Make sure to start looking at Post Bac's ASAP because of deadlines

http://www.fiu.edu/~preprofc/Dental_Post_Baccalaureate_Programs.htm

http://hpap.syr.edu/pblist.htm

Do a search on the SDN forums

http://forums.studentdoctor.net/forumdisplay.php?f=71

Post Bacc FAQ: http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=114425

I wish I could give specific info regarding CA, but if you call the program offices you can get more specifics, and if possible ask to talk to students in them currently or who have successfully finished the program, that's the best way to evaluate the program and perhaps an insight into getting into the program itself. If the dschool has an 'automatic acceptance' policy an 18 is the required score, so that's good news. Hope you can find one of those, cuz they rock.
 

Teeth4Life

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What schools did you apply to? I really believe that your scores IMO are not terrible...perhaps the OC is a bit questionable, but not bad. I also think that several people on here don't exactly tell the truth about their 20+. Just check out predents and you can still find that there are DS's which took in people with 18's and even 17's...so don't lose hope but retake if you feel the need.
 
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torque

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What schools did you apply to? I really believe that your scores IMO are not terrible...perhaps the OC is a bit questionable, but not bad. I also think that several people on here don't exactly tell the truth about their 20+. Just check out predents and you can still find that there are DS's which took in people with 18's and even 17's...so don't lose hope but retake if you feel the need.
Thanks.

I applied to marquette, nebraska, kentucky, usc, ucla, western, nyu, illinois, louisville, unc, detroit mercy, and uop.

I'm thinking of withdrawing my app from detroit mercy and unc after today because I haven't sent in my secondary/check yet.

Thanks for encouraging words.
 

Teeth4Life

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Feb 27, 2007
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Thanks.

I applied to marquette, nebraska, kentucky, usc, ucla, western, nyu, illinois, louisville, unc, detroit mercy, and uop.

I'm thinking of withdrawing my app from detroit mercy and unc after today because I haven't sent in my secondary/check yet.

Thanks for encouraging words.
This is all from the people that have applied on predents and their average scores so here we go:

Marquette: DAT 18.44 PAT 18.08 (CGPA: 3.5, SGPA: 3.43)
Nebraska: 18.6/18.1 (3.78/3.7)
Kentucky: 18.44/17.64 (3.52/3.37)
USC: 20/19 (3.47/3.37)
UCLA: 22/20 (3.65/3.6)
WESTERN: Not Listed
NYU: 19.06/17.8 (3.29/3.16)
ILLINOIS: Couldn't find sorry :/
Louisville: 18/17 (3.57/3.46)
UNC: 19.7/18.1 (3.6/3.53)
MERCY: 19/18 (3.54/3.51)
UoP: 20.5/19.7 (3.37/3.29)

Ok so essentially these are the average stats you're facing and not all of these schools have all seats filled up yet (luckily for you). Your DAT looks around the range (slightly lower though). I think your strong chances here are NYU,UoP, and Kentucky. Don't lose hope, good luck! :)
 

Teeth4Life

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Feb 27, 2007
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This cycle just started, how could any of those schools be filled up?
Well I was talking in terms of just applying early. I do believe that UoP is filled already not the spots, just the number of applicants if all were accepted but what are the chances of that lol :laugh:
 
Jul 9, 2009
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ahhhh I just gotta kick my nuts !!!!

PAT : 18
QR: 18
RC: 18
Bio: 19
GC: 19
OC: 15 (WTF !!!!!)

ok, so I know that score won't cut it.

So what should I do?
Take the DAT again in three months?
Or should I look for a SMP? or postbac?

My GPA isn't that great either.

I think I saw some dental schools have a postbac program where upon the successful completion, the students are guaranteed to get into their dental school.. which ones are they?

Thanks. :(

I'm just so disappointed (married and a baby on the way)...
You used:
1. Destroyer
2. Kaplan Blue Book

Did you use:
1. Topscore practice test
2. Achiever practice test
3. Clif AP bio
4. Crack DAT PAT

Do you have money for a full out $1200 Kaplan course?

You said, you did not realize how long the science and PAT sections were. That means that you NEVER practiced a single full test before you went in, hence the lack of topscore pro.
 
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torque

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You used:
1. Destroyer
2. Kaplan Blue Book

Did you use:
1. Topscore practice test
2. Achiever practice test
3. Clif AP bio
4. Crack DAT PAT

Do you have money for a full out $1200 Kaplan course?

You said, you did not realize how long the science and PAT sections were. That means that you NEVER practiced a single full test before you went in, hence the lack of topscore pro.
No I didn't use the four items you listed.
I did take the practice test in Kaplan book. But I made a mistake of not pacing the exam right.
Yes, if I had the money for all of that, I would have gotten everything. But unfortunately I'm not financially comfortable getting everything that I want and I need.
 

BiomajorPreDent

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You used:
1. Destroyer
2. Kaplan Blue Book

Did you use:
1. Topscore practice test
2. Achiever practice test
3. Clif AP bio
4. Crack DAT PAT

Do you have money for a full out $1200 Kaplan course?

You said, you did not realize how long the science and PAT sections were. That means that you NEVER practiced a single full test before you went in, hence the lack of topscore pro.

+1

I would say you def need topscore, and achiver and Cliffs atleast

100 for topscore and achiever and Cliffs you can get for 10 online..

Crack is about 50 for the basic edition and Id say get it..but def get topscore and achiver and cliffs before that.

the kaplan course..thats kinda expensive and i dont think it will be that helpful
 

aforgottenshirt

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No I didn't use the four items you listed.
I did take the practice test in Kaplan book. But I made a mistake of not pacing the exam right.
Yes, if I had the money for all of that, I would have gotten everything. But unfortunately I'm not financially comfortable getting everything that I want and I need.
Understand you here, financially speaking. There are cheap/free options for us though! ADA offers a free practice exam here:

http://www.ada.org/prof/ed/testing/dat/index.asp (click on DAT sample test items on right) Although people say it is easier than the actual DAT it's good to practice timing/etc.

Also Kaplan offers a free test on their website if you surf around you'll find it. Just google Kaplan DAT. I also was able to download a bunch of ebooks/pdf docs with DAT or MCAT practice questions for free (hint: search the torrents pages for examkrackers or ACS organic chemistry...:p) Even GRE has free practice tests on biology, chemistry, and math on their website. I haven't taken my DAT yet, but my strategy so far is lots of practice questions - as much as possible! Then review everything that you are weak in repetitively so it is etched into your brain.

Also, everyone loves cliffs AP bio and I believe you can buy that for pretty cheap.

I also am a fan of the option of re-taking if you are that worried about your scores. I think in 3 months you can really kill the DAT and you will be extra motivated this time around! Good luck!!
 
Jul 9, 2009
571
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I think I know why you did poorly in organic. When you use destroyer's roadmap and all the other organic questions, do not just look at the reaction and memorize the product. You HAVE to know the mechanisms involved in the reaction to get the desired product.

In my opinion, destroyer does a very poor job of explaining and showing mechanisms. If you cannot afford the $1200 Kaplan course, then supplement destroyer with an organic chemistry course book.

For next time, if you do not have funds for practice tests, then at least get the Top Score Pro, you do not have to get the achiever because it is just plain hard and does not reflect the real science portion of test.
 
Jul 9, 2009
571
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Status
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If you can get a 19 in OC, your TS will be 19. Bump either the RC or QR up a point or two, and you'll have a AA of 19 as well.

With AA: 19, TS: 19, PAT: 19........you'll be golden.
 
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torque

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If you can get a 19 in OC, your TS will be 19. Bump either the RC or QR up a point or two, and you'll have a AA of 19 as well.

With AA: 19, TS: 19, PAT: 19........you'll be golden.
Thank you!

I will probably save up and get the topscore.

Is it called topscore pro?

Thanks.
 
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torque

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Understand you here, financially speaking. There are cheap/free options for us though! ADA offers a free practice exam here:

http://www.ada.org/prof/ed/testing/dat/index.asp (click on DAT sample test items on right) Although people say it is easier than the actual DAT it's good to practice timing/etc.

Also Kaplan offers a free test on their website if you surf around you'll find it. Just google Kaplan DAT. I also was able to download a bunch of ebooks/pdf docs with DAT or MCAT practice questions for free (hint: search the torrents pages for examkrackers or ACS organic chemistry...:p) Even GRE has free practice tests on biology, chemistry, and math on their website. I haven't taken my DAT yet, but my strategy so far is lots of practice questions - as much as possible! Then review everything that you are weak in repetitively so it is etched into your brain.

Also, everyone loves cliffs AP bio and I believe you can buy that for pretty cheap.

I also am a fan of the option of re-taking if you are that worried about your scores. I think in 3 months you can really kill the DAT and you will be extra motivated this time around! Good luck!!
Yeah I worked on the free practice test before. :)

thanks for the encouraging words.
 

sleepinxlionhar

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Mar 1, 2009
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Study materials do cost a lot. I pretty much bought everything that I could to help me study. Sometimes, I thought, "was it really worth it?" But I thought, in the long run, if these study materials can help me get a good score and into dental school, it doesn't matter how much I spend. Since time is money right? As long as I get in, I'll be happy no matter how much I spend. So I'm pretty much broke right now.

Good luck:thumbup:
 
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torque

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Never mind the question above.
I went ahead and got the cliff's ap bio today.
However I couldn't help but notice that there are also other AP biology books.
So that makes me wonder, what makes the cliff's AP "better" than any other AP bio books? The paper quality doesn't look much better :)

Thanks.
 
Jul 9, 2009
571
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Never mind the question above.
I went ahead and got the cliff's ap bio today.
However I couldn't help but notice that there are also other AP biology books.
So that makes me wonder, what makes the cliff's AP "better" than any other AP bio books? The paper quality doesn't look much better :)

Thanks.
I don't know about other AP bio books, but Cliff's AP Bio is very detailed and covers vast majority if not all the content of DAT bio.
 

DrTootle

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Jul 23, 2008
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Pre-Dental
Never mind the question above.
I went ahead and got the cliff's ap bio today.
However I couldn't help but notice that there are also other AP biology books.
So that makes me wonder, what makes the cliff's AP "better" than any other AP bio books? The paper quality doesn't look much better :)

Thanks.
I used Cliffs and I thought it was a good book. But I would say the more bio material, the better. Cliffs isn't comprehensive. I never looked at that Barron's AP thing, but I would recommend getting as much together as possible. There was still stuff that I had never seen before on the DAT and I had gone through AP cliffs twice really well and one last time skimming through the day before.
 
Jul 5, 2009
221
0
Status
Pre-Dental
I just feel terrible for my wife and my baby :(

Wife was crying when I broke the news that I'm not getting in this year.

Man, for all you singles, get in first and then get married.

:(
there's always a chance and look on the bright side. if you are really want to be a good dentist who take good care of patients. you will be.

i also married and close to the middle of 30's and have credit card det because of the expensive DAT journey.

good luck
 

drpoppapump

10+ Year Member
Jul 2, 2007
50
0
Belleville, Illinois
Status
Pre-Dental
don't try to look in the worst of the entire situation man.. calm down the dat is the not end all be all determining factor in getting into dental school but i guess all you can do is try harder next time for the dat.
 

ArmyGuard63a

10+ Year Member
7+ Year Member
Feb 2, 2009
50
1
Status
Dentist
Hey bro, having just taking the DAT today and feeling that I'm ok to not have to take again, I'd like to send you the Barron DAT study guide that I didn't have time to use. From one married predent to another ;)
PM me!