Help for my desperate student here at a crossroad - time to give up and give in?

[NFkappaB]

Hi everyone,

Recently I made a thread on whether anyone with good stat has never ever gotten into medical school in repeated tries with otherwise good LOR, no institutional or criminal record...etc etc. This was made on behalf of a student of whom I am mentoring (we worked in the same research center where I got my Ph.D). I showed her that thread, but she wants more concrete advice about her specific situation...so here it is.

Basically, she has a 3.65 GPA and a 34 MCAT and the average standard hours of clinical volunteering, shadowing, research, and tutoring. She applied broadly last cycle to about 21 schools, and was only waitlisted at her state school, but rejected elsewhere. For this cycle, her parents are telling her to "get on with her life" and to apply for graduate programs in case she still does not get accepted.

She is extremely unhappy with this demand of her parents, as she wants to be a medical doctor above anything. Currently, she is working as a research tech. at my medical center making 12$/hr and still living at home. The thing is, if she thinks there is a chance that she will NEVER make it to medical school, she is fine with going to graduate school and get a Ph.D as research is her second favourite thing after medicine.

But, she wants to hear what everyone's advice is. With her stats and ECs, do you think EVENTUALLY (hopefully within 3 cycles) she will get an acceptance, therefore she should stand her ground and continue to work at this low-paying job, living at home, and improving her application. OR, is it common that people with good stats sometimes are "unlucky" and just don't get in.....and therefore should consider pursuing other career options?

With myself as an example, I told her how it took me 5 tries (2 before my Ph.D and 3 after my Ph.D) did I finally get in. But she wants to hear other people's direct opinion of her situation.

Thanks a bunch everyone!


Sorry, I forgot to say that she DID contact 3 schools for feedback.

Her state school's assistant dean of admissions simply told her that they didn't hear some things that they "wanted to hear," and that it was indeed her interview that "kind of held her back." Interestingly, the dean told her to apply EARLY DECISION this upcoming cycle.....

The other 2 schools are mid-tiers..and they simply told her that the past year was an extremely competitive year and that she didn't stand out among the other strong competition, but her application was "generally fine and well rounded."

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[DrTroll]

Hi everyone,

Recently I made a thread on whether anyone with good stat has never ever gotten into medical school in repeated tries with otherwise good LOR, no institutional or criminal record...etc etc. This was made on behalf of a student of whom I am mentoring (we worked in the same research center where I got my Ph.D). I showed her that thread, but she wants more concrete advice about her specific situation...so here it is.

Basically, she has a 3.65 GPA and a 34 MCAT and the average standard hours of clinical volunteering, shadowing, research, and tutoring. She applied broadly last cycle to about 21 schools, and was only waitlisted at her state school, but rejected elsewhere. For this cycle, her parents are telling her to "get on with her life" and to apply for graduate programs in case she still does not get accepted.

She is extremely unhappy with this demand of her parents, as she wants to be a medical doctor above anything. Currently, she is working as a research tech. at my medical center making 12$/hr and still living at home. The thing is, if she thinks there is a chance that she will NEVER make it to medical school, she is fine with going to graduate school and get a Ph.D as research is her second favourite thing after medicine.

But, she wants to hear what everyone's advice is. With her stats and ECs, do you think EVENTUALLY (hopefully within 3 cycles) she will get an acceptance, therefore she should stand her ground and continue to work at this low-paying job, living at home, and improving her application. OR, is it common that people with good stats sometimes are "unlucky" and just don't get in.....and therefore should consider pursuing other career options?

With myself as an example, I told her how it took me 5 tries (2 before my Ph.D and 3 after my Ph.D) did I finally get in. But she wants to hear other people's direct opinion of her situation.

Thanks a bunch everyone!

woow... 3.65/34 didn't get in ANYWHERE? I think her numbers are definitely good enough to get in, maybe there are other parts of her application that adcom frown upon?

Did she only apply to top schools? Did she apply late in the cycle? How about her PS? Maybe she need improvement on her interviews?

IDK, maybe she should get some feedback from the school she applied last cycle, and see what they consider her lacking so she can improve on those things.

This forum has plenty of ppl with worse than her stats getting in somewhere, so I think she is definitely still in the run if she can find out what went wrong in the last cycle.

 

[Drrrrrr. Celty]

Someone with stats like those obviously has a major red flag on their application. Possibily clinical volunteering related, or being a horrible interviewer. Simply being stats are only half the whole process. I think she should stand her ground, improve her app and next year apply to a better selection of schools. Like did she apply to just top tier or to a selection of schools of which have below 10% OOS acceptance rates?

 

[LizzyM]

Based on those numbers her chances of being admitted are >80%. However, the schools she's applied to, PS, timing, etc all matter. She was waitlisted (not rejected) at one school which suggests that her interview wasn't a disaster (or she'd have been rejected) but not quite as good as other applications. She should ask now what she could do to improve her application in the next round. If she hasn't received any interviews by December 1 she should consider grad school applications if that is her second choice with regard to a career. Frankly, if she can fix whatever derailed her previous application, she should do fine.

 

[just one]

She needs to contact the schools and ask if they provide any feedback for reapplication. Many times schools will give you the info that specifically held back your application. Stats aren't everything

 

[NFkappaB]

Sorry, I forgot to say that she DID contact 3 schools for feedback.

Her state school's assistant dean of admissions simply told her that they didn't hear some things that they "wanted to hear," and that it was indeed her interview that "kind of held her back." Interestingly, the dean told her to apply EARLY DECISION this upcoming cycle.....

The other 2 schools are mid-tiers..and they simply told her that the past year was an extremely competitive year and that she didn't stand out among the other strong competition, but her application was "generally fine and well rounded."

 

[DrTroll]

Sorry, I forgot to say that she DID contact 3 schools for feedback.

Her state school's assistant dean of admissions simply told her that they didn't hear some things that they "wanted to hear," and that it was indeed her interview that "kind of held her back." Interestingly, the dean told her to apply EARLY DECISION this upcoming cycle.....

The other 2 schools are mid-tiers..and they simply told her that the past year was an extremely competitive year and that she didn't stand out among the other strong competition, but her application was "generally fine and well rounded."

man, what kind of feedback is that, it's about as vague as you can get...

 

[just one]

Sorry, I forgot to say that she DID contact 3 schools for feedback.

Her state school's assistant dean of admissions simply told her that they didn't hear some things that they "wanted to hear," and that it was indeed her interview that "kind of held her back." Interestingly, the dean told her to apply EARLY DECISION this upcoming cycle.....

The other 2 schools are mid-tiers..and they simply told her that the past year was an extremely competitive year and that she didn't stand out among the other strong competition, but her application was "generally fine and well rounded."

Sounds to me like she didn't know enough about the school or herself (or both) and didn't talk about why that school was a good fit for her.

 

[DaisyBuchanan]

Poor girl. That's just depressing.

 

[Nessy]

Yes, sounds like a confidence issue and maybe some immaturity. You are very kind to be writing on her behalf, but why not she?? Food for thought............sounds like there is an undercurrent that is not being revealed?.......hmmmmmm...........
This probably came off at the interview. Somethin' just aint' right here......

 

[gp14]

The only thing I can think of is a bad interview. Maybe she was nervous or did not impress the people conducting her interviews.

 

[JJMrK]

Moving to WAMC.

 

[JJMrK]

Out of 21 schools applied to, how many interviews did she receive?

When did she apply?

 

[NFkappaB]

Out of 21 schools applied to, how many interviews did she receive?

When did she apply?

She applied quite early, I think in June.

She said she received 5 interviews, 4 rejections, and 1 waitlist (at her state school).

 

[curlytop]

The only thing I can think of is a bad interview. Maybe she was nervous or did not impress the people conducting her interviews.

The situation suggests that there's something off-putting about her application, because she applied to 21 schools and had one interview? Twenty schools rejected her before interviews.

OP, maybe I misunderstood, was she offered interviews and then rejected? Or was her only interview from her state school?

She could go for a Masters program or something, that was always my plan if I had to wait a year to apply again. That would be a good use of her year in between cycles, and improve her GPA (not that it's even bad, but a boost would still be great).

 

[JJMrK]

She applied quite early, I think in June.

She said she received 5 interviews, 4 rejections, and 1 waitlist (at her state school).

That's about the ratio of applications to interviews I would expect based on your stats (maybe a few more). No acceptances with 5 interviews (and 4 post-interview rejections) to me indicates interviewing problems, not a problem with your application.

 

[property virgin]

Definitely her confidence/interview issues. If she is not outgoing, work on that. She has to be outgoing or at least try to be during this new round of interviews. I hope she is as sincere about becoming a physician as you were. If you really think she is a good candidate, u should instill that in her to elevate her confidence. I had conducted interviews in the past for my work, and can tell you that an applicant could succeed my expectation by being confident, outgoing and also appreciative/gracious in her interview.

 

[JJMrK]

I'd recommend as many mock interviews as you can set up, especially if they critique you afterward.

 

[LizzyM]

Sorry, I forgot to say that she DID contact 3 schools for feedback.

Her state school's assistant dean of admissions simply told her that they didn't hear some things that they "wanted to hear," and that it was indeed her interview that "kind of held her back." Interestingly, the dean told her to apply EARLY DECISION this upcoming cycle.....

The other 2 schools are mid-tiers..and they simply told her that the past year was an extremely competitive year and that she didn't stand out among the other strong competition, but her application was "generally fine and well rounded."

Five interviews and 4 rejections (one wait list) suggests that there is something very wrong with her message or the delivery although her paper application is fine & well rounded.