How hard is it to get a FP job after residency?

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Octagonecology

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I was just wondering if any residents/attendings could chime in with exactly how one goes about finding a job in FP as their residency nears its end.

Are your email/snailmail boxes flooded with legitimate offers from recruiters? Can you pick and choose where and how you want to work with general ease? Or must you search long and hard for jobs because they are so hard to come by?

I'm just an m1 but I am really curious as to how this process works. Thank you.

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It really depends.

The process is the same as any ol' job. You've got headhunters who email/mail... and even call/page you at all hours. There're want ads that you can peruse through in magazines and internet. Of course, you can find job through word-of-mouth which generally is more effective if you're already local. And there's always the straight up cold-calling where you go door-to-door asking practices if they need someone. Hospital systems do go out to recruit, and they will help the practices under their territory to find another doctor to add as an associate or will sometimes outright employ you. These hospital systems are easy to find at job fairs. You can also always sign up with a locum tenums agency that can help you find independent contract work, or sign up as an independent contractor or employee for a walk-in clinic/urgent care which is what a lot of new grads do until they figure out what they want to do. Some like it so much they just keep doing it. You can always go to the bank, take out a loan, and start your own business.

It's not an "easy" or "hard" thing because it's a "real world" thing, you know? Some people have it easy. Others don't.

In big cities/suburbs, there're a lot of doctors and so competition is tough. But at the same time, because competition is tough in a big market, sometimes groups will make an aggressive move and expand, which is a job opportunity for you. In small, mid-size towns, there may not be as much competition, market may not be as big, but there are a few doctors who corner the market. So competition could just be as tough... or not, depending on where you end up sitting.

There are a few use-&-abuse you jobs and there are jobs that are looking for a long term marriage... and sometimes their contracts reflect that.

It also depends on what you want (or, don't want) to do. Inpatient, outpatient, peds, OB, house calls, nursing homes, clinic, urgent care, extended hours, sports med, ER coverage, concierge, underserved, academics... or a particular population you want to serve.

What's nice about FP is that if you're flexible & well trained, you can do and go anywhere you want. And that's the honest truth (as a recent grad, who've talked to a lot of people & former grads & classmates, and experienced the process myself). Some people I know took jobs they never thought they'd be interested doing. Others went for jobs that they knew would exactly fit them. Some went for the highest paying. Others went for the ones that offered the most flexibility... or took time off.

And then, there are those who were desperate. Either because of their personal/family situation, or because they had expiring visas. And they just took whatever they could get.

Situation varies so much that it's hard to make generalization. Plus, who knows what the world will look like in 7 years for you. That being said, there will always be an FP job. The question is, ok, what else do you want/need?
 
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No, that was a fabulous response. Thank you very much.

What do you make of the jobs posted on the NHS site listed as "loan repayor"? Did any of your class/residency mates approach this option?

I wonder what type of jobs these are...some of them seem to be private practice/clinic type jobs in fairly good sized cities.

If you qualify for the repayor program you only get 25K per year and must do two years. Seems to me if the salary of the job pays much less than 25K than what you could get elsewhere, it would make it financially prohibitive.....thanks in advance.
 
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No, that was a fabulous response. Thank you very much.

What do you make of the jobs posted on the NHS site listed as "loan repayor"? Did any of your class/residency mates approach this option?

I wonder what type of jobs these are...some of them seem to be private practice/clinic type jobs in fairly good sized cities.

If you qualify for the repayor program you only get 25K per year and must do two years. Seems to me if the salary of the job pays much less than 25K than what you could get elsewhere, it would make it financially prohibitive.....thanks in advance.

Exactly, so you have to do the math. Do some comparison shopping, so to speak.

I don't know much about NHSC, although at one point I did look into it. There's scholarship & loan repayment. Scholars are obligated to work at a NHSC scholar site, so they get priority when it comes to hiring. You get into it while you're still in training. Loan repayment is something you apply for as you're looking for a job. The advice I got from people is that you negotiate the best "market" compensation you can get from that organization, then apply for loan repayment. Sometimes, some groups will pay you less salary because they know you're going for the loan repayment. And if you don't get accepted for loan repayment, you're screwed because you accepted a job for less pay. And so you have to do the math (including taxes and how it works for loan repayment). Like I said, some people are desperate for whatever reason, and will sign whatever contracts they can get.

One consideration you should look into is whether you can do fellowship if you choose to become a scholar. I don't know how that works.

The other consideration is whether or not you'd be willing to go where the job is, which may not be in a location that's desirable to you or fit your spouse/family's needs.

I know 1 guy who's a NHSC scholar and the jobs he was considering were in different places in the country. Some local, others not.

Some of these clinics are FQHC... "federally qualified health centers" which GW Bush expanded under his presidency and Obama looks to expand as well. These clinics may provide care to the underserved, underinsured, uninsured, but some will take private pay. They may be well funded, efficiently run, with good staff; but others may not. Your job description will depend on the clinic's needs. By law, they must provide care to adults, children, pregnant women, and (I believe) provide dental care. It's up to the individual clinic to decide who does what. Some will ask FP's do it all, while others will split it up, either amongst the FP's or others like IM, Peds, OB/Gyn. The nice thing about FQHC's is that you are part of the the federal government, so they pay for your malpractice and there is sovereign immunity (i.e. you can't sue the government without the government's permission... you can understand the malpractice advantage in that... especially if you do OB...)

If this sounds overwhelming, it is. But I'm glad you're already looking into as an M1 because as you're going through training, you'll have your eyes open to see what's going on, what you like, and what doesn't make any sense.

I'll give you a tip: If you're curious about some of these locations you're looking at for NHSC, either for scholarship or loan repayment, you can call them up and say, "hey, I'm a med student (or resident), and I'd like to do an elective rotation." It can be a day, or 2 weeks, or a month. Whatever. And most will open their doors to you to go check out what they do & how, etc. Every practice knows that when they take med students & residents to do elective rotations, it becomes an audition or sorts for recruiting. So that's one way to check out some of these places.

NHSC offers something called the SEARCH, provides a travel grant for med students to rotate in one of these sites. There's no obligation. They pay for your travel, housing, meals, etc. I did it & went to Alaska for 1 month. It was pretty bad ass.

You never know where these places will take you. One former grad at my program was an ultramarathoner. Took a position in Arizona on an Indian reservation for the very reason that he can run all year long. I personally have always thought that the Pacific Islands would be a cool place to work (on the beach) for a couple of years. So, it's whatever.
 
lowbudget said:
I'll give you a tip: If you're curious about some of these locations you're looking at for NHSC, either for scholarship or loan repayment, you can call them up and say, "hey, I'm a med student (or resident), and I'd like to do an elective rotation." It can be a day, or 2 weeks, or a month. Whatever. And most will open their doors to you to go check out what they do & how, etc. Every practice knows that when they take med students & residents to do elective rotations, it becomes an audition or sorts for recruiting. So that's one way to check out some of these places.

NHSC offers something called the SEARCH, provides a travel grant for med students to rotate in one of these sites. There's no obligation. They pay for your travel, housing, meals, etc. I did it & went to Alaska for 1 month. It was pretty bad ass.

You never know where these places will take you. One former grad at my program was an ultramarathoner. Took a position in Arizona on an Indian reservation for the very reason that he can run all year long. I personally have always thought that the Pacific Islands would be a cool place to work (on the beach) for a couple of years. So, it's whatever.

Wow...that info is invaluable. Thx.

Funny you mention the Pacific Islands in the NHS site shows openings w/ loan repayment/scholarship in American Samoa as well as the Virgins. I'm with you in that it might be a sweet 2 year gig and get 50K knocked off your tab to boot.
 
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Wow...that info is invaluable. Thx.

Funny you mention the Pacific Islands in the NHS site shows openings w/ loan repayment/scholarship in American Samoa as well as the Virgins. I'm with you in that it might be a sweet 2 year gig and get 50K knocked off your tab to boot.

Oh yea. You can go out to Guam, if you wanted. Frickin' Guam! Ever been there? It's beautiful. Tropical island. Bilingual English & Japanese. Easy flight to Hong Kong & Japan. Make your way to Thailand/Singapore, New Zealand/Australia on your week off.

Some of those NHSC places are in just beautiful places where you can go snowboarding/skiing all you want, mountain biking.

The guy I know took a place north of Tampa/St. Pete. It's near the water. He owns an apartment on South Beach, Miami and likes to go down there on his days off.

My friend's dad did NHSC loan repayment back in the day. Came down from Philly to the middle of Texas. Did his 2 years. Liked it so much he ended up staying, met someone, started a family. Started a practice. Small town back then but today, it's one of the coolest places to be: Austin, TX. Doctors can't find jobs in Austin these days because it's so trendy to want to live there.

So you just never know.

I don't know how the Pediatric Neuro-otolaryngologists do it. But FM can be pretty cool if you're into this kind of stuff. And, we've only been talking about NHSC. We haven't even talked about the other (regular) jobs out there. You just have to find them and make them yours.
 
Man, you are right. There are two jobs posted on the site right now for FP docs in Guam. That might be a really sweet deal.

Well I am going to graduate with about 260K indebtedness. But for the obvious reasons you mention above I really, really want to do family practice. So do a lot of the kids at my school but they really don't think that they can afford it considering the loans (tuition at my school is 48K per year for OOS). So they end up matching into EM or Anesthesiology even though they pretty much don't like doing it, which is insane.
 
Man, you are right. There are two jobs posted on the site right now for FP docs in Guam. That might be a really sweet deal.

Well I am going to graduate with about 260K indebtedness. But for the obvious reasons you mention above I really, really want to do family practice. So do a lot of the kids at my school but they really don't think that they can afford it considering the loans (tuition at my school is 48K per year for OOS). So they end up matching into EM or Anesthesiology even though they pretty much don't like doing it, which is insane.

NHSC loan repayment program gives 50K for the 1st 2 years, then increases each year up to 35K. If you do this for 5 years and are frugal, you should be out of debt fairly quickly.
 
NHSC loan repayment program gives 50K for the 1st 2 years, then increases each year up to 35K. If you do this for 5 years and are frugal, you should be out of debt fairly quickly.

Thought I'd chime in on this one. I just graduated from a DO FM program in Texas. I am from rural Alaska and wanted to get back into the rural setting - my goal all along going to medical school. As soon as I put out my wishes, I used MDjobs.com and just put feelers out there my phone did not stop ringing 24/7 and I received 50-100 emails a day. I finally had to unplug my phone and go through the emails and picked the top 50 possible choices. I had to decide base on my families needs, geopraghic region, loan repayment, etc. I didn't realize how popular it was to be FP at this point and you really have your pick of where to go. The recruiters worked together and fly me and my entire family up to Montana so I interviewed at 5 locations during that week. I chose to go to Montana since it had the school system I wanted for my kids, it was a lot like Alaska with snow, skiing, mtns, etc, there are multiple small towns to choose from since I wanted out of the city, and Montana qualifies for both federal and state loan repayment. I just finished my NHSC loan application (a major undertaking, it's about 80pgs of paperwork all said and done) plus my Montana state loan paperwork. You get to the point where most rural locations are about equal in what they offer you and as a resident you can't possible visit them all. I ended up doing about 30 phones interviews and had to pick from the vibe of those calls to decided where to fly to. If you look on the NHSC site it will give you the regions that are greatly in need of physicians and there are many like Guam and Alaska who will bend over backwards to get you to come there. My goal is to be debt free in 4 years, put in my time and then do what I want after that. It's a great deal to me. I also had to look at my age (40) and decide whether I wanted to pay my loans off in 20 yrs or 4? A no brainer there. I didn't go back to Alaska because I have a special needs child who needs extra assistance that the Alaska school systems struggle to provide services for and I didn't want that battle since I am a product of it. I do plan to go back to Alaska but not until my kids are off to college. I hope that answers a lot of your questions.
 
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