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it's not..... these numbers are reported by the AMA and med schools who want to sign up more clueless lemmings
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How is average debt ONLY $150,000 after graduating...
- Thread starter UAAWolf
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I don't understand how the average debt makes much difference! If you have to borrow $50k a year to pay for school and live, then your debt figure is going to be around $225K with interest.
So you are going to have to worry about that.. not what your classmates owe.
[FONT=ARIAL, HELVETICA]Loan Calculator.
You will bring home $3,000 a month during your residency or there abouts. You aren't going to be living high on the hog. This payment is going to be high, bc I think they limit payment size based on income.
So you are going to have to worry about that.. not what your classmates owe.
[FONT=ARIAL, HELVETICA]Loan Calculator.
[FONT=ARIAL, HELVETICA] Loan Balance: .[FONT=ARIAL, HELVETICA] $225,000.00 . [FONT=ARIAL, HELVETICA] Adjusted Loan Balance: .[FONT=ARIAL, HELVETICA] $225,000.00 . [FONT=ARIAL, HELVETICA] Loan Interest Rate: .[FONT=ARIAL, HELVETICA] 6.80%. [FONT=ARIAL, HELVETICA] Loan Fees: .[FONT=ARIAL, HELVETICA] 0.00%. [FONT=ARIAL, HELVETICA] Loan Term: .[FONT=ARIAL, HELVETICA] 20 years. [FONT=ARIAL, HELVETICA] Minimum Payment: .[FONT=ARIAL, HELVETICA] $0.00 . [FONT=ARIAL, HELVETICA]
. [FONT=ARIAL, HELVETICA]Monthly Loan Payment:.[FONT=ARIAL, HELVETICA] $1,717.51 . [FONT=ARIAL, HELVETICA] Number of Payments: .[FONT=ARIAL, HELVETICA] 241. [FONT=ARIAL, HELVETICA]
. [FONT=ARIAL, HELVETICA] Cumulative Payments: .[FONT=ARIAL, HELVETICA] $412,204.42 . [FONT=ARIAL, HELVETICA] Total Interest Paid: .[FONT=ARIAL, HELVETICA] $187,204.42 .
[FONT=ARIAL, HELVETICA]Note: The monthly loan payment was calculated at 240 payments of $1,717.51 plus a final payment of $2.02... [FONT=ARIAL, HELVETICA]Monthly Loan Payment:.[FONT=ARIAL, HELVETICA] $1,717.51 . [FONT=ARIAL, HELVETICA] Number of Payments: .[FONT=ARIAL, HELVETICA] 241. [FONT=ARIAL, HELVETICA]
. [FONT=ARIAL, HELVETICA] Cumulative Payments: .[FONT=ARIAL, HELVETICA] $412,204.42 . [FONT=ARIAL, HELVETICA] Total Interest Paid: .[FONT=ARIAL, HELVETICA] $187,204.42 .
You will bring home $3,000 a month during your residency or there abouts. You aren't going to be living high on the hog. This payment is going to be high, bc I think they limit payment size based on income.
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That was not my point at all. The point is that the figures make med school appear cheaper than it actually is due to the people having daddy pay and the MD/PhDs....I don't care what you or anyone pays. I care that the average debt reported is significantly less than my debt will be
Also I won't take 20 yrs to pay it off- although I realize some will. I think anyone can be much smarter than to take 20 yrs....15 max IMO
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I believe the current rule is that you can't have your minimum payment be more than 15% of your monthly income, so during residency it would be more like $450 per month (assuming ~36k/year). You can also defer for financial hardship but it will be accruing interest during that deferment (there is no more forbearance during residency).
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I meant that we've established that average debt is calculated by including near-zero (or maybe zero in some cases) numbers with big numbers.
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If you're grateful for what they're doing, and you don't rub it into other people's faces who are $250,000 in debt for what you got for free, then no, there isn't.
If you're a spoiled brat, then yes.
For the OP - there are quite a few people in my class who are married, including myself. My loans are only for my tuition, because my wife pays all my other bills. I owe a lot less than people who took out money for living expenses.
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Debt on graduation is a mere factoid. The key concern is how much debt you'll be in when you finish residency. You can generally bump your graduation debt by about 7.5% per year, compounded annually, to get a rough idea how much you will start paying on.🙂
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The loan terms matter, too. Interest rate, etc. The more you borrow, the more you have to enter the "private" lending system where interest rates and all related terms are far less favorable...not all debt is created equal.
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So much animosity. I brought it up because a lot of people have a default attitude that getting school paid for automatically = spoiled brat. I don't make it known that it's paid for, but I do have a problem when people begrudge others about this sort of thing.
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a 150K???? dang, i wish that was it. i'm gonna have a helluva lot more than that when I'm done with school
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When classmates flaunt pictures of their 4th trip abroad in the past year on facebook, I can't help but get a bit peeved. I'm not talking Mexico or Canada here either. These are exotic trips.
Often times, these are the same kids that like to complain about how hard they're working in class and how much med school sucks. I know it's none of my business, but I get annoyed when it's obvious that these kids don't want to be there, are barely passing, and are getting a free ride + extra benefits while the rest of us work really hard.
/rant
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I must be oblivious, but what does one have to do with the other? Outside of failing, do you risk losing your loans if you don't work "really hard?" Do people who are better off generally work any less hard? Do people who take out loans never slack off? Everyone complains about how much med school sucks, regardless of financial position. If they are better off financially, those complaints aren't any less valid.
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It doesn't. Two behaviors that are coincident in the same group. 🙂 It seems like some (NOT ALL) people take for granted what an awesome gift it is to have their parents pay for everything and not have to worry about things. If my parents were financing my education, I'd take med school very seriously (not that I don't now).
It's not unilateral. There is only a small subset of students whose parents pay that behave like this. I'm not trying to generalize anything.
And not everyone bitches constantly about med school. I don't. I just get my work done and move on. If you hate everything about it, why are you here? That's the attitude I was talking about.
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Again, what's the association b/t bitching constantly and ability to pay for school? People will complain, rich or poor.
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i'm w/ b-real
bitching about med school comes from everyone
and i don't even know why the photos from trips abroad thing even matters.
bitching about med school comes from everyone
and i don't even know why the photos from trips abroad thing even matters.
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One of the many reasons the average reported debt is lower than would be expected is that schools include MSTP students - who receive a stipend - in their average indebtedness figures. Since mean is a calculation that isn't very good at resisting outliers the numbers can become extremely skewed, and have, depending on the number of MSTP students at any given school.
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Yea, I never said there was causation.
Flaunting money and bitching constantly are two behaviors that annoy me more than anything. I know some people that do both. There is no correlation, just unfortunate coincidence that they can occur in the same folks. Period. That is all I was saying.
If you'd like to show me where I said that one causes the other, feel free. I have no pony in this race as I'm not on loans nor do my parents pay for my education. I freely admitted that they aren't related. In any case, this has become an off topic discussion and I'll let this thread get back on track now.
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There's only animosity if you deserve the animosity. If my parents had millions of dollars and paid my tuition, I'd take it. I'd also keep that fact on the down low. It's just not polite to point out your good fortune when others didn't get it simply because they were born in a different family.
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What are you talking about? This is an anonymous forum, is it not? You're telling me that you feel bad because someone whom you don't know and will never come into contact with has his tuition paid for? It's one thing if I ran into you in class and said something, but this is a random forum.
I will admit I'm a little jealous of the people whose parents pay for their med school...but honestly- at this point you are at least 22-23 years old...graduating at 25-26 yrs old.
Who the hell depends on daddy til they're 26? My dad is rich and could easily put me through med school...but he doesn't pay for my ****. I am thankful for this...as it's made me that much harder of a worker. I know several rich kids at school whose parents buy them $60,000 cars, $400 dollar jeans, etc anything they want. Ironically...they don't do as good in school. Perhaps because they weren't pushed hard enough?
Who the hell depends on daddy til they're 26? My dad is rich and could easily put me through med school...but he doesn't pay for my ****. I am thankful for this...as it's made me that much harder of a worker. I know several rich kids at school whose parents buy them $60,000 cars, $400 dollar jeans, etc anything they want. Ironically...they don't do as good in school. Perhaps because they weren't pushed hard enough?
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who would take a loan when they don't need to? does paying even MORE money for med school make sense?
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I have to disagree with this. Getting into medical school requires hard work, so I don't think it's quite fair to say that they weren't "pushed hard enough." And tell me, how is it responsible, financially or otherwise, to take on debt voluntarily, when you don't need to? I think that if parents or whomever want to pay, you thank them, tell them you are appreciative, and take the money. You'll be much happier 4 years down the line and won't feel compelled to go into any specific residency based solely on money. That lack of freedom makes some people miserable.
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i don't know why people care so much about who is funding their schooling or the clothes they wear or the cars they drive
At MOST- I would take a loan from my Dad so I could save interest rate, and then pay him back. I would never take a free handout for the cost of med school from tuition...I believe in hard work and effort. I take pride in doing things myself and earning things the hard way. It's much more satisfying for me that way rather than someone giving it to me. People can do what they want but I'm conservative and don't want/need any free handouts from my parents.. not to bash anyone who got med school paid for by their parents- my approval should mean nothing to you (and vice versa)
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To each his own, I can live with that.
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I was obviously talking about real life. We all have Lamborghinis and Ferraris on SDN.
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Or instead of just viewing it as a handout, you could see it as someone in a strong earning position helping someone who is in a non-income generating portion of their lives. After graduating medical school debt free you could then use your extra salary to help your parents in retirement or pay for your own kids education. That way its always the person who can afford to spend money that is paying it, and you avoid paying ~150k in interest to the banks.
Obviously not everyone is lucky enough to be in this situation, and it would be pretty classless to rub it in peoples faces, but i don't think you're less of a "hard worker" or value your education less because you're not taking loans for it.
I'm not trying to bash anyone- I see where you're coming from and can agree with the above...although with that being said the students I know in this situation are NOTHING like this.
-They brag about how their parents are so rich
-They drive BMW's etc, one even came up to me and asked me what kind of jeans I had one, then proceded to tell me his outfit cost over $800 at Nordstrom (serious..)
-One guy said "HOW COULD YOU POSSIBLY AFFORD TO PAY FOR YOUR OWN MED SCHOOL APPS!"...I simply told him..."I work all summer. Hard."
-I could go on and on, but its to the extent where they walk around with their nose in the air showing off their possessions and putting down people who don't have the same status.
I have not been fortunate enough to meet the well mannered students you described...but I did not mean to offend anyone here. I obviously have bias from a few people I've met, and it doesn't mean everyone is like that.
And I don't look down on someone simply because their parents pay- I look down on people if they use that as a reason to slack off...
I know kids who literally are like "Uh..well it's my parents money. Who cares if I do bad!"
I know kids who literally are like "Uh..well it's my parents money. Who cares if I do bad!"
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If you think you can invest at a rate of return higher than 6.8%, you should take as much time as possible to pay off the loans and instead put the money into your investments. Stocks have had a rate of return around 7-10% historically.
(Anyone who wants to dispute this, please try doing some calculations before replying - thanks)
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JMO, but I wouldn't do this. I'd "play it safe" and try to pay off my loans ASAP.
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Apparently, neither were you.
Cus haters gonna hate.
Who cares? Worry about yourself and don't concern yourself with the affairs of others.
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I generally used to think that way UAA and still do when people become braggarts. But, going through undergrad and amassing a lot of debt and now taking on about $60,000 a year for the next four years there is nothing more that I could have hoped for than my parents being able to put a little more forward for me. They can't, I understand that, but a little jealousy is definitely coming from me.
People can be hard workers and understand the value of a dollar even if their parents help them out, a little or a lot.
People can be hard workers and understand the value of a dollar even if their parents help them out, a little or a lot.
Sorry
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Are they not making it my concern when they are distracting me? Asking me what brand clothes I'm wearing or why my car isn't as nice as their car? I was just minding my own business...
I guess the point is that it's not black and white at all. Some are just spoiled rich kids who will slack off. Others will work their ass off either way. I apologize for coming off sounding like everyone who gets money from their folks is slacking- that was not my intent
