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mymouthsmells

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I'm a Canadian and I want to help you. Applying to that many schools in 2006 suggests that you're not that confident in your stats. So tell me what are you stats?

Also, I didn't know that many schools (45) accepted Canadian students.
 

reapply2007

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Sorry to hear things are so bad. I hope things work out for you this year. My $0.02-not in a real order of priority. Good luck.

1. Declare bankruptcy
2. Get a job. Maintain some form of lifestyle.
3. Apply for the MS program make arrangements to attend.
4. Reapply to dental school
 
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45 school!??!?! that costs you 10k?!! wow that's stiff!!! What are your stats, if you don't mind answering.
By the way, do canadians get same treatment as international students? How can you establish residenty, if you have a canadian citizenship.
 

mymouthsmells

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spshl k, your DAT scores are good; however, your QR score is on the low side. Unfortunately, your cumulative GPA is on the low side as well. That being said, you still have other avenues to take in order to get into d-school. There is no question but to do a masters (non-thesis perferred). That way, you can up your GPA and perhaps even contemplate on retaking the DAT.

What's done is done. You applied to too many schools two cycles back, and you applied too late this cycle. As for your debt, certain science Masters programs in Canada will give you a stipend over the 2 years that should help you minimize your cc debt. And now is the perfect time to apply for your Masters.

Don't give up or be discouraged with your debt. If you get into a Masters program at a major university (especially if you're in Ontario) then you'll definitely be able to resolve your debt problems. Also, you'll have the chance to increase your GPA and perhaps your DAT score.

All the best bud.
 

toothy85

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UofT and Mcgill both have M.Sc Dental Science programs. I'm considering applying to those. They are 2-years thesis-based though. I wish canada had the so-called special master's/non-thesis based programs like the states.
 

spshl k

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whats the difference? I know one is research based and the other isnt.
 

mymouthsmells

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That's basically the difference. Masters that are thesis-based require research. Non-thesis Masters require you to take a bunch of courses. You may want to check the Universities in your province to see what types of Masters program is available. I would recommend you stay at home and communte as oppose to travelling out of province to do your Masters. Reason being is that you will invoke living expenses which will not help you in terms of resolving your debt.

Thesis based Masters are a little risky in Ontario in that they may take just over 2 years to finish depending on the type of project and lab you participate. Keep that in mind when applying as that could mess up the timing of when you apply as most d-schools would need you to finish in August at the latest.

In terms of school and your situation, a lot of factors have to be considered. Do you want to focus on lowering your debt? Then stay away from UofT as living expenses in the city can be expensive. You may wish to live outside the city and commute but take travelling costs into account. Smaller universities like McMaster and Western provide excellent research and graduate programs and they're located in smaller, less expensive towns.

Undoubtly, UofT has the best research facilities but in your case, that shouldn't matter as you really want to increase your marks.

Program-wise, I'm not sure what your undergrad major is, you'll have to fill us in on that detail.
 

mymouthsmells

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Oh that clears things up and makes your life a bit easier. You definitely should do your Masters in the states since they offer non-thesis Masters. For that, other members can help you out since I'm Canadian.

It may be enticing to go for the good programs, but I'd stay way from good and challenging and go for something good and 'easy'. You're using your Masters as a stepping stone to get into d-school. Go in, do your time, get good grades, and get out.

Research based Masters doesn't have as many required credit courses as non-thesis based for obvious reasons. In Ontario, you need more or less 3 credits for the entire 2 years of your stay, which is nothing. It may be risky as each course has more weight to your avg GPA- another thing to keep in mind.

Reapplying this summer wouldn't be the best thing as you'd be repeating what you did 2 cycles back. You're not in grad school yet and thus there is no change in your GPA. I would apply in the summer of 2008, after you have completed some courses in your Masters, that way the d-schools see that not only you're in grad school, but you're doing well.
 
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armorshell

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It might be worth it to study your butt off and tackle the DAT again. A good DAT (Think 23+ all sections) can do wonders for a low GPA.
 

OregonDent

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Sorry to hear things are so bad. I hope things work out for you this year. My $0.02-not in a real order of priority. Good luck.

1. Declare bankruptcy
2. Get a job. Maintain some form of lifestyle.
3. Apply for the MS program make arrangements to attend.
4. Reapply to dental school


Do not file for bankrupcy; it would be the stupidest decision of your life; think about it. To pay for school you are going to have to take out $150,000+ in loans. Most of that will be in Federal Aid, however if that does not cover it, then you going to have to take out private loans, which will increase your rates because you are a liability. Also, remember that after you graduate you will need to take hundreds of thousands of dollars more in loans for a practice and a house, amongst other things. Now if you in your twenties with $150,000 in school loans and a bankruptcy on your record, what kind of an interest rate are you going to get on any new loans? It is not worth it. What you need to do as far as the money issue goes, is to take out a private loan to pay off your credit card bill. The interest on credit cards is usually 20% where a loan will only be approx. 8.5%. Once you are in dental school take out extra school loans, and pay off the private loan, as it will inevitably have better interest rates. Re-apply if dentistry is what you want to do, but work any job you can in the meantime.
 

Nasem

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not trying to talk down to you or anything, but how in the hell would someone apply to 45 schools and still not get accepted to AT LEAST one?


Cause, honestly, your stats are not bad at all, your science GPA is pretty good and your last 2 years , you said you had like a 3.7 (shows total improvement) and your DAT is so-so (more on the above average side).

Do you have much shadowing experiences?

There has got to be something turning them away from you.....
 

diane07

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I agree with OregonDent . . . don't declare bankruptcy & get a job.

Bankruptcy affects your credit score. And bankruptcy laws have tightened meaning that often you still have to pay back the debt.

Most people who apply to dental school are either in school full-time or are working full-time. You can definitely do both - work and apply. And unless someone else is footing your bills, you'll probably need to find a job to support yourself financially.
 

spshl k

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Do not file for bankrupcy; it would be the stupidest decision of your life; think about it. To pay for school you are going to have to take out $150,000+ in loans. Most of that will be in Federal Aid, however if that does not cover it, then you going to have to take out private loans, which will increase your rates because you are a liability. Also, remember that after you graduate you will need to take hundreds of thousands of dollars more in loans for a practice and a house, amongst other things. Now if you in your twenties with $150,000 in school loans and a bankruptcy on your record, what kind of an interest rate are you going to get on any new loans? It is not worth it. What you need to do as far as the money issue goes, is to take out a private loan to pay off your credit card bill. The interest on credit cards is usually 20% where a loan will only be approx. 8.5%. Once you are in dental school take out extra school loans, and pay off the private loan, as it will inevitably have better interest rates. Re-apply if dentistry is what you want to do, but work any job you can in the meantime.

I think he meant it as a joke, or atleast thats how I took it. The interest isnt bed 7-8% (i have one of those low interest rate jobs). About the job, this is where the dillema comes in, cant work in the states (international student). And there doesnt seem to be any good programs for post-bacc here
 

armorshell

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I wondered the same thing.. I worked in a clinical setting for 4 yrs and did research in dentistry.. I came to the conclusion that I was out of state.. and that it was just a numbers game (w/3000 applications who can blame them) they saw the overall and went NEXTTTT.. and didnt look into closely enough to see the trend.

That's what you need the big, flashy DAT score for, or a good post-bacc program. My GPA is almost the same situation as yours (2.7 first two years, 3.7-4.0 second two) and I got into 4 schools december first.

It's a numbers game, and one way or the other you have to play.
 

reapply2007

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I agree the whole admissions process in mostly about numbers. Numbers allow an appearance of consistency and fairness into the admissions process. Then again, if it were all about numbers they wouldn't ask in/out of state questions, ask if you know any alumni of the school, interview, and wouldn't need a personal statement.

I was half joking about the bankruptcy. It may or may not prevent private loans in the future. If your school has an office that gives students legal advice, this seems like a good question to ask. If not, check the yellow pages for a bankruptcy attorney and get a free consult. My attorney has really saved me some headaches.

I agree with Armorshell- balling the DAT can only make you look good. Doing graduate level science courses can also make you look good but costs more.
 
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