I can't get a job!

[bdunwood]

I am in my second fellowship and can't get a job! Help?

There are no jobs out there worth a hill of beans. I am not a researcher. I just want to sign out cases and raise my family. I was told there were plenty of jobs out there when I went into the field and that is a big fat lie. I send out my CV to all job advertisements and am getting nowhere. They all say that I am a good candidate but they had many good candidates.

Anyone have a job out there for me or know of a group hiring? Anyone know or heard of a group that can't find anyone?

---

Members don't see this ad.

 

[2121115]

I was told there were plenty of jobs out there when I went into the field and that is a big fat lie. I send out my CV to all job advertisements and am getting nowhere. They all say that I am a good candidate but they had many good candidates.

When they tell you that there are plenty of jobs out there they are including academics. There are not plenty of good private practice jobs out there- that isn't what they mean.

 

[Parts Unknown]

I am in my second fellowship and can't get a job! Help?

There are no jobs out there worth a hill of beans. I am not a researcher. I just want to sign out cases and raise my family. I was told there were plenty of jobs out there when I went into the field and that is a big fat lie. I send out my CV to all job advertisements and am getting nowhere. They all say that I am a good candidate but they had many good candidates.

Anyone have a job out there for me or know of a group hiring? Anyone know or heard of a group that can't find anyone?

What fellowships do you have? Are you board certified? Where did you do residency?

 

[pathstudent]

I am in my second fellowship and can't get a job! Help?

There are no jobs out there worth a hill of beans. I am not a researcher. I just want to sign out cases and raise my family. I was told there were plenty of jobs out there when I went into the field and that is a big fat lie. I send out my CV to all job advertisements and am getting nowhere. They all say that I am a good candidate but they had many good candidates.

Anyone have a job out there for me or know of a group hiring? Anyone know or heard of a group that can't find anyone?

There are loads of academic jobs where you are almost entirely dedicated to signing cases out. Research doesn't mean having a lab. It can include overseeing a resident's project or collaborating with other clinicians.

 

[path24]

I am in my second fellowship and can't get a job! Help?

There are no jobs out there worth a hill of beans. I am not a researcher. I just want to sign out cases and raise my family. I was told there were plenty of jobs out there when I went into the field and that is a big fat lie. I send out my CV to all job advertisements and am getting nowhere. They all say that I am a good candidate but they had many good candidates.

Anyone have a job out there for me or know of a group hiring? Anyone know or heard of a group that can't find anyone?

Welcome to pathology! There is a lot of people out there just like you...unfortunately. (As you know hence the job market)

Contact Dr. McKenna and Dr. Silva they travel the US claiming there is a shortage.

 

[mrjames]

they are big liars, they just want cheap labors

Welcome to pathology! There is a lot of people out there just like you...unfortunately. (As you know hence the job market)

Contact Dr. McKenna and Dr. Silva they travel the US claiming there is a shortage.

 

[lipomas]

Contact Dr. McKenna and Dr. Silva they travel the US claiming there is a shortage.

No one claims there is a shortage. Use your brain and actually look at what they said. In some talks they have used data to try to predict workforce needs in the distant future, but nowhere does anyone say there is a shortage of pathologists currently. I think, unfortunately, that you are taking data which is basically irrelevant to your argument (your argument is in regards to the current job market) and stretching to make it relevant. It makes your argument weaker as a result, which is unfortunate because it is an argument that needs to be made.


I'm curious about what the OP means by "No job worth a hill of beans." Does that mean you found jobs but they sucked? Or did you not apply to those jobs and you assume they suck? Or are you totally not considering any academic jobs or reference lab jobs? Healthcare as a career has been changing rapidly over the past few years - what is a "good job" to you? It's sadly getting harder to find any physician these days who likes their job.

 

[lipomas]

they are big liars, they just want cheap labors

You guys have such one track minds. They are not "liars." They are presenting data which is not disputable (because it is population based data and specimen data). Their conclusions and extrapolations may be disputable but attempting to dispute them by calling them "liars" is pretty much the most pathetic thing I have seen on this forum. It implies a total lack of common sense as well as personal responsibility. Grow up and put your brain back in your head. The job market in pathology is a vitally important issue and it doesn't do anyone ANY GOOD to attempt to pass off this problem on figurehead leaders who have very little to do with residency funding and the current job market woes. That is intellectually lazy. This whole "conspiracy" thing is *****ic. It's probably not a coincidence at all that most of the weaker anti-job market posts on this forum (there are some good ones, which are important to have) are grammatically poor and contain numerous errors that competent individuals should be able to routinely avoid.

Now go ahead and slander me and distort how what I posted above makes me an apologist or a denialist about the job market woes.

 

[path24]

I guess I wasn't in the audience then. When the statement was made I was apparently hearing things.

Grammar and spelling....its an internet forum.

bdunwood....check out all of the great jobs for your graduating pathologist on the new thread. 2010 positions up above.

 

[bdunwood]

No one claims there is a shortage. Use your brain and actually look at what they said. In some talks they have used data to try to predict workforce needs in the distant future, but nowhere does anyone say there is a shortage of pathologists currently. I think, unfortunately, that you are taking data which is basically irrelevant to your argument (your argument is in regards to the current job market) and stretching to make it relevant. It makes your argument weaker as a result, which is unfortunate because it is an argument that needs to be made.


I'm curious about what the OP means by "No job worth a hill of beans." Does that mean you found jobs but they sucked? Or did you not apply to those jobs and you assume they suck? Or are you totally not considering any academic jobs or reference lab jobs? Healthcare as a career has been changing rapidly over the past few years - what is a "good job" to you? It's sadly getting harder to find any physician these days who likes their job.

I was told there were plenty of jobs out there especially if I was not interested in a big city. I have applied to big cities and small cities across the country and can't get a job.

The jobs not worth a hill of beans are those that either there is not enough work for you to do, or you get stuck doing work that does not pay -- Or someone scalps most of your salary off the top. Why can't I just get a job where I can reap what I sow? All other fields of medicine are begging for doctors -- I have friends from my medical school class that were getting recruited their first year in residency for great positions.

This is horsesh8t. I only see it getting worse too.

Does anyone have a connection here for a good private practice job? Of course I am not posting my personal stuff on an internet forum. Why don't I just post my phone number to get on some calling list.

If you have a good job I will send a CV though to your email.

(Also why does some idiot always have to be the grammar/spelling police on internet boards)

 

[2121115]

The jobs not worth a hill of beans are those that either there is not enough work for you to do, or you get stuck doing work that does not pay -- Or someone scalps most of your salary off the top.

Are you talking about part time positions?

Have you applied to the innumerable clinical-track academic positions posted on pathologyoutlines.com? There are several VA jobs and many academic jobs in great cities posted there that are not going to get 50+ applications like the private gig in rural Minnesota. You will make primary care $$ but you'll have a nice job in a great city.

 

[green mantis]

What fellowships do you have? Are you board certified? Where did you do residency?

I don't think telling us this information is considered personal. We're not asking for your name, social security number, etc. However, it does give the other members of this forum a better idea about your situation.

I'm guessing you probably didn't do a highly sought after fellowship (GI, DP, or HP). Also, are you still in training? If you are, you still have 3+ months left to find something. Who knows what could turn up during that period.

On a more personal note, I finished fellowship in Jun 2009, & I didn't get a full time position until Nov. I didn't search very broadly, but there are very few places where I'd be willing to live.


----- Antony

 

[Entgegen]

On a more personal note, I finished fellowship in Jun 2009, & I didn't get a full time position until Nov. I didn't search very broadly, but there are very few places where I'd be willing to live.

Just out of curiosity, did you end up in private practice or academics?

 

[Milky Way]

I am having the same problem, bdunwood. Granted, I haven't done the most competitive of fellowships (cyto and BB), but I am AP/CP board certified and subspecialty certified in one of the fields. It's been very hard to even get a response from groups, even though geography hasn't factored into my search. My residency program has consistently been labeled as one of the best here on this forum (for what that's worth) and I'm very confident about my references, so I don't think there is anything wrong with my training or me per se (yeah, yeah, go for the cheap hit...). The job market is just really tough. I'm not really sure what I'm going to do next year, although thankfully my spouse has a good job. I'm also worried that if I don't find anything now, it's going to get worse with the questions about what I was doing during that time I "took off" after training.

 

[2121115]

I am having the same problem, bdunwood. Granted, I haven't done the most competitive of fellowships (cyto and BB), but I am AP/CP board certified and subspecialty certified in one of the fields. It's been very hard to even get a response from groups, even though geography hasn't factored into my search. My residency program has consistently been labeled as one of the best here on this forum (for what that's worth) and I'm very confident about my references, so I don't think there is anything wrong with my training or me per se (yeah, yeah, go for the cheap hit...). The job market is just really tough. I'm not really sure what I'm going to do next year, although thankfully my spouse has a good job. I'm also worried that if I don't find anything now, it's going to get worse with the questions about what I was doing during that time I "took off" after training.

That is really unfortunate to hear. AP/CP/Cyto/transfusion and there isn't a practice that could use someone like that? That just seems wrong. I don't know what the answer is, but there is something wrong here.

 

[lipomas]

I was told there were plenty of jobs out there especially if I was not interested in a big city. I have applied to big cities and small cities across the country and can't get a job.

The jobs not worth a hill of beans are those that either there is not enough work for you to do, or you get stuck doing work that does not pay -- Or someone scalps most of your salary off the top. Why can't I just get a job where I can reap what I sow? All other fields of medicine are begging for doctors -- I have friends from my medical school class that were getting recruited their first year in residency for great positions.

This is horsesh8t. I only see it getting worse too.

Does anyone have a connection here for a good private practice job? Of course I am not posting my personal stuff on an internet forum. Why don't I just post my phone number to get on some calling list.

If you have a good job I will send a CV though to your email.

(Also why does some idiot always have to be the grammar/spelling police on internet boards)

Someone is always the grammar police because there are always people who underestimate its importance.

I am not sure if it will get worse or not. This is a particularly bad year for the economy as it relates to hospitals and physicians. Pathology depends on hospital business and hospital growth more than any other field - in most other fields you hang out a shingle and people will come to you. The uncertainty in health care business is NOT helpful at all. The job market has significantly tightened for radiologists as well, although I'm sure people on this forum will deny that (it is all relative, after all). Radiology is still a good job market but I know a few graduating residents who are more than a little perturbed at the lack of desirable offers they are getting. In other fields there may be a lot of jobs but they aren't always great jobs either. It's easy to sit back from the perspective of a different field and say that all the other fields have it great, but it simply isn't true. If you talk to anyone in other fields you will realize it is not all peaches and cream. We do ourselves a disservice by inflating other fields and having a "grass is always greener on the other side" type of perspective.

The job application process in pathology often includes more than simply sending your CV out and hoping that people bite on it. That's a good way to be ignored. Groups do not want to go out on a limb and hire someone from 500 miles away if the only contact they have from them is a CV without anything else. Would you? Groups don't want to hire someone who just wants to take any job they can get and will probably bail as soon as that job back home opens up for them. On the other hand, if attending X at your program knows someone at that program and calls and puts in a good word for you, this can take you a long way. Unfortunately what happens when someone brings this up on this forum is that people jump on that as "proof that the job market sucks" when that is not the point, even if it is true. People on this forum are OBSESSED with "proving that the job market sucks" as opposed to actually trying to do something about it or working with what the situation currently is. Very few people seem to be interested in providing helpful advice.

The good jobs in pathology are obtained by connections and playing politics, for better or for worse. Whether you want to say this is proof of a bad job market or whatever is not really pertinent because that isn't going to immediately change. Many people get lucky in their job hunt with timing or connections. Many work their butt off and have little to show for it. This sucks but it is what it is. What is also unfortunate is that many programs do a woeful job of preparation for practice and finding a job. When the advice you get during residency is basically, "there are good jobs out there" and, "you can pass the boards by studying!" and that's it, that frankly sucks. This is part of the reason why finding an academic job is not quite so hair-raising. It is easier to find an advisor who can target you towards appropriate positions and contact the appropriate people.

 

[2121115]

What is also unfortunate is that many programs do a woeful job of preparation for practice and finding a job. When the advice you get during residency is basically, "there are good jobs out there" and, "you can pass the boards by studying!" and that's it, that frankly sucks.

I found this to be the biggest weakness of my program. There is no job hunt preparation. No mention of how to find a non-academic position and asking someone is like yelling into the abyss.

 

[bdunwood]

Ha Ha. Work for the VA? Are you kidding? Those places are horrid!

I want a private practice job like my medical school buddies in all other professions. They were getting offers from year 1 in residency. Here I am after 6 years of training and TWO FELLOWSHIPS and I can't get one. I have tried banging down doors and that doesn't work. (My classmates in other fields did not have to do this).

I have a family to feed. I am not qualified for an academic job. I don't do and never have done research. They don't even do much research where I trained at.

Guys I have a family. What should I do? Go back to another specialty? Try the match? Its too late for the match!

 

[bdunwood]

Besides, where is a VA job anyway? I don't see any advertised.

 

[2121115]

There are two VA jobs on the CAP and pathoutlines websites.

Don't turn your nose up at the VA or academic work. Those pathologists are making more money than you are right now and I wouldn't turn my nose up at any job when I don't have one at all.

I understand your frustration and I think many of us would like to land that old-school private practice partnership track position. Those positions are becoming more and more uncommon these days though (although I'm keeping my fingers crossed).

If you didn't do much research in residency and you trained at a community program where the attendings didn't do research then I guess academic positions are going to be tougher to land also. Research and academic presentations at meetings also help to fill out a CV. On the other hand, if the attendings where you trained didn't do much research then it must not be required for the job so if you applied to a similar type institution why would they care if you don't have a research background?

I don't know what the answer is though. Pathology is a peculiar specialty.

I don't know about training in another field. You are already 6 years in and adding another specialist residency (probably 5 years) would be a lot. Maybe primary care? But then you would make the same money that you would make at the VA as a pathologist. I don't know.

 

[SLUsagar]

Ha Ha. Work for the VA? Are you kidding? Those places are horrid!

I want a private practice job like my medical school buddies in all other professions. They were getting offers from year 1 in residency. Here I am after 6 years of training and TWO FELLOWSHIPS and I can't get one. I have tried banging down doors and that doesn't work. (My classmates in other fields did not have to do this).

I have a family to feed. I am not qualified for an academic job. I don't do and never have done research. They don't even do much research where I trained at.

Guys I have a family. What should I do? Go back to another specialty? Try the match? Its too late for the match!

if your even CONSIDERING going into another specialty, you're not meant for pathology. I suggest keep up your diligent searching, something will come up, perhaps not in your ideal geographic location, but trust me, decent jobs are out there. Make a lot of phone calls. Call up folks from your residency/medschool, ask who all they know. Play your favor cards. Now's not the time to act the role of the typical nerdy, quite, shy, secluded pathologist. Obama up yourself and play the politician.

 

[JPR22]

if your even CONSIDERING going into another specialty, you're not meant for pathology. I suggest keep up your diligent searching, something will come up, perhaps not in your ideal geographic location, but trust me, decent jobs are out there. Make a lot of phone calls. Call up folks from your residency/medschool, ask who all they know. Play your favor cards. Now's not the time to act the role of the typical nerdy, quite, shy, secluded pathologist. Obama up yourself and play the politician.

He/she has a family to feed, it may be better now to find a primary care residency, and pay the bills. I also think one should jump at any job one can get.

 

[BrainPathology]

Ha Ha. Work for the VA? Are you kidding? Those places are horrid!

I have a family to feed. I am not qualified for an academic job. I don't do and never have done research. They don't even do much research where I trained at.

Guys I have a family. What should I do? Go back to another specialty? Try the match? Its too late for the match!

If my family was really hungry I'd probably look into a VA job..I imagine the food that my salary would buy tastes the same as the job with the great looking office and shiny new buildings that all your medical school classmates have. You might even consider looking into the armed forces as a medical officer, the benefits almost make up for the decreased earning potential according to some who are in there.

Or a third fellowship til something comes along. That would really make me resent my situation too but having gone 6 years into training what makes more sense between that and just bailing to another specialty?

It does suck though that we are all certain that we are entitled to more than what we are getting and nobody but us seem to realize it. Just make sure you keep that in mind during your search .... *I'm entitled to more than what I'm getting,I'm entitled to more than what I'm getting,I'm entitled to more than what I'm getting,I'm entitled to more than what I'm getting,I'm entitled to more than what I'm getting*

 

[pathstudent]

if your even CONSIDERING going into another specialty, you're not meant for pathology.

huh? I an meant for pathology and I considered other specialties. What a ridiculous thing to say.

 

[yaah]

The good jobs in pathology are obtained by connections and playing politics, for better or for worse. Whether you want to say this is proof of a bad job market or whatever is not really pertinent because that isn't going to immediately change. Many people get lucky in their job hunt with timing or connections. Many work their butt off and have little to show for it. This sucks but it is what it is. What is also unfortunate is that many programs do a woeful job of preparation for practice and finding a job. When the advice you get during residency is basically, "there are good jobs out there" and, "you can pass the boards by studying!" and that's it, that frankly sucks. This is part of the reason why finding an academic job is not quite so hair-raising. It is easier to find an advisor who can target you towards appropriate positions and contact the appropriate people.

Excellent post - I agree with what you said above also about these threads often devolving into screaming about how the job market is bad, which is not helpful. Good to see a lot of the recent posts are actually more helpful. And I agree that a major weakness of many programs these days is poor preparation (and advice) for private practice-seekers. Many programs focus too much on the research-inclined individuals. But academic programs are beginning to focus more (it seems to me) on hiring individuals who are good teachers and diagnosticians and who may not have much if any interest in research. So perhaps things will improve.

But yes - the above points about landing a job are quite valid. As 2121115 said the classic private partnership-type jobs are becoming more scarce than in the past, but this is in part because of how healthcare is changing. Many practices have been bought out by hospital systems or large reference labs. Many other specialties are experiencing the same thing. A lot of physicians, not just pathologists, now work for corporations or are hospital employees. Jobs are not going to come to you unless you have grant-funded research - just sending out CVs is not satisfactory for the most part. We can complain until we are blue in the face about how unfair this is, how it isn't like other specialties, but that doesn't help anyone in that situation - it only makes it feel more hopeless (which it isn't).

I also would not discount a VA job - government benefits are nothing to shake your fist at, especially when it comes to family support and retirement issues. The lifestyle is often better and your job may be more flexible.

 

[2121115]

Besides, where is a VA job anyway? I don't see any advertised.

Are you looking in the right places?


http://www.healthecareers.com/jobs/physician-pathologist/1040726.htm


http://www.pathologyoutlines.com/jobs.html#vanj1

 

[wild0ne]

I agree - it would be helpful (and lend more sympathy [and credibility]) to your situation if you gave more information about your credentials.

What fellowships have you done? Certainly, this is not asking too much information.

A strong desire to just "feed your family" is not usually compatible with an equally strong inability to compromise and sense of entitlement (which are hinted at from your posts).

 

[2121115]

Two fellowships, regardless of what they are in, should qualify the OP for something. There should be a job somewhere right?

But I agree. I bet that some people on the board could offer advice on what to do if they knew what your specific qualifications were. Did you do SP plus a subspecialty? That would be more marketable than say, neuropath and clinical chemistry. You could at least give that much information.

 

[pathstudent]

Excellent post - I agree with what you said above also about these threads often devolving into screaming about how the job market is bad, which is not helpful. Good to see a lot of the recent posts are actually more helpful. And I agree that a major weakness of many programs these days is poor preparation (and advice) for private practice-seekers. Many programs focus too much on the research-inclined individuals. But academic programs are beginning to focus more (it seems to me) on hiring individuals who are good teachers and diagnosticians and who may not have much if any interest in research. So perhaps things will improve.

But yes - the above points about landing a job are quite valid. As 2121115 said the classic private partnership-type jobs are becoming more scarce than in the past, but this is in part because of how healthcare is changing. Many practices have been bought out by hospital systems or large reference labs. Many other specialties are experiencing the same thing. A lot of physicians, not just pathologists, now work for corporations or are hospital employees. Jobs are not going to come to you unless you have grant-funded research - just sending out CVs is not satisfactory for the most part. We can complain until we are blue in the face about how unfair this is, how it isn't like other specialties, but that doesn't help anyone in that situation - it only makes it feel more hopeless (which it isn't).

I also would not discount a VA job - government benefits are nothing to shake your fist at, especially when it comes to family support and retirement issues. The lifestyle is often better and your job may be more flexible.

That is true about the evaporation of true private practice jobs. The last 10 years the reference labs have been buying groups up like crazy. I remember when I interviewed at Oregon, the PD who ran the blood bank was an ex-community practice pathologist who went to academics after his group sold-out to a reference lab. He said it was a horrible corporate work environment after that. He also said that there wasn't a truly independent group left in portland. All the groups had sold out. I found that kind of depressing but it is what it is.

It is important to realize this prior to going into pathology. Pathology is under the same issues of decreasing reimbursements as all of medicine. However, it is has also been ravaged by other entities who figured out how to take a cut out of private practice (gastros, uros, reference labs, etc...)

It is completely different in other specialties. I know a gastro who works at an elite comm practice hospital in the Bay Area who went 12 months unable to find a new partner as the cost of living was so high. They ended up having to put 250K housing down payment down for their new partner to get him to work there. If you are a random grad, good luck finding a job with an elite pathology group in the Bay Area private practice.

Also I had a gasto friend who interviewed at a private group in Atlanta that had their own biopsy center, their own nurse anesthetists, their own histo lab and their own pathologist and he told me that they told him that partner salary was in the range of 3million a year. That is sick. THat is almost like professional athlete or b-list actor.

Even if you love pathology, could you at least like or tolerate gastro making 3 million a year. These are the things you need to consider.

Another reason to choose academics, it is the best job left in pathology. You don't have to worry about any of this.

 

[path24]

Medical Students I hope you are getting the message......stay away from pathology. (I wish I had.....I'm invested now)

 

[2121115]

Medical Students I hope you are getting the message......stay away from pathology. (I wish I had.....I'm invested now)

Wow.

 

[green mantis]

Are you looking in the right places?


http://www.healthecareers.com/jobs/physician-pathologist/1040726.htm


http://www.pathologyoutlines.com/jobs.html#vanj1

You forgot to mention the government's own site:

www.usajob.gov


----- Antony

 

[GG1853]

Medical Students I hope you are getting the message......stay away from pathology. (I wish I had.....I'm invested now)

I think its hard for medical students to get much out of these conversations regarding jobs because we don't have all of the information. When an individual posts here to essentially complain about the job market, I can't evaluate his complaint. Rarely to never do people say where they trained or provide other pertinent information. And if they do say where they trained it is usually something like, "I'm at a good program." That doesn't mean anything to me because there are 5 or so elite programs and then the vast middle.

If people spent half the time they did posting to these boards either improving their CV or looking for a job, it might not be such a problem. Some of you probably have 100 posts bitching about a bad job market. I think people get the message already. But this isn't a forum where you are going to change it.

 

[Milky Way]

As much as we all would like all the information possible to help us evaluate if someone's complaints are real, it is just not reasonable to expect that someone will provide their program's identity on a forum like this. Many programs are so small that if you know any additional demographic info, such as what fellowships someone has done and that they can't find a job, you might as well just list your full name.

I'm not trying to say the job market universally sucks and paint the usual black and white picture, but it's also wrong for people on here to keep assuming that if someone can't find a job it's because there's something wrong with them, i.e. they're lazy and just send their CVs without followup, they don't speak English, they have no people skills, they're not willing to move to less desirable areas, etc, etc, etc. I'm just so sick and tired of people here making it out to be the candidates' faults that they can't find jobs, just because they may not be the elite MD/PhD types on here that have lined their jobs up by word of mouth even before they started their residency.

There, rant is over.

 

[raider]

OK THIS PISSES ME OFF BIG TIME!

ANY *****/NINCOMPOOP/******//IMBECILE/DIMWIT/DOLT/DULLARD WHO IS MAKING AN ARGUMENT THAT IT IS JUSTIFIED THAT SOME CANDIDATES CANNOT FIND JOBS BEACUSE THEY ARE "MARGINAL" FOR SOME REASON OR OTHER, NEED TO GET THEIR HEADS OUT OF THEIR ASS-S (WHAT MAKES YOU A SUPERSTAR?). IF SOMEONE HAS COMPLETED THE RESIDENCY REQUIREMENTS AND PASSED THE AP/CP BOARDS IT IS THE RESPONSIBILITY OF ABP AND PDS TO ENSURE THAT THE MARKET DYNAMICS ALLOW THEM TO CHOOSE A JOB OF THEIR LIKING. IF THEY ARE NOT DOING THIS, THEY ARE FAILING THEIR RESPONSIBILITY.

AS LONG AS SUCH IS THE CASE, WE NEED TO BERATE EVERY ORGANIZED POWER IN PATHOLOGY ON FORMS (INTERNET OR OTHERWISE) AND NOT OFFER LAME ARGUMENTS (MARGINAL CANDIDATES) FOR THE REAL PROBLEM.

HORRIBLE JOB MARKET.

 

[rollwithit]

AS LONG AS SUCH IS THE CASE, WE NEED TO BERATE EVERY ORGANIZED POWER IN PATHOLOGY ON FORMS (INTERNET OR OTHERWISE) AND NOT OFFER LAME ARGUMENTS (MARGINAL CANDIDATES) FOR THE REAL PROBLEM.

Sounds like we have a volunteer to lead the revolution?! WHAT ARE THE NEXT STEPS RAIDER????????????

 

[Parts Unknown]

Many programs are so small that if you know any additional demographic info, such as what fellowships someone has done and that they can't find a job, you might as well just list your full name.

Fine, the party in question can simply omit where he/she did residency and instead list the fellowships. Problem solved.

You may be interested to know that Sante Consulting emailed me about a job opening in the northeast that requires blood banking. If you are interested you should call them and get in touch with Clark Meyers.

Edit: In addition, there is a partnership job listed with Merritt Hawkins in the southeast with cytology preference.

 

[earmuff]

VA has 8 jobs listed on their website... One in Tucson.

 

[lipomas]

Sounds like we have a volunteer to lead the revolution?! WHAT ARE THE NEXT STEPS RAIDER????????????

Raider's solution is apparently to keep posting on here and (I am guessing here) send hate mail to organizations and their leaders. I also presume that the latter is also anonymous. It would be laughable if it wasn't about something so serious.

It's like that south park episode. Step 1: Collect underpants. Step 2: ________ Step 3: Profit.

Raider's version is: Step 1: Complain anonymously and use hateful speech. Step 2 _______. Step 3: Profit.

Raider - in all seriousness, you are really off the wall here. Maybe you are portraying yourself on the forums as something you are not, and in real life you are a reasonable individual. I hope that is the truth and at the very worst you are just having some fun on the forums. But your tactics are pathetic and your delivery is MASSIVELY COUNTERPRODUCTIVE. You are turning people away from your argument, which by using colorful text and hateful, dismissive comments you are turning into a joke which can easily be ignored.

Do you not see this at all? Anyone with any power to change things who reads your comments here is going to dismiss your arguments because they are poorly worded, poorly thought out, and frankly hostile. You may think that is their problem but it is not their problem. It is yours, and of course it is everyone else's problem who agrees with you since your "arguments" also trivialize their perspective. I mean really, man, get a clue. At least exPCM posted some realistic data and had a reasonably professional attitude most of the time - you are like some sort of caricature.

I am on your side here, but you make it very difficult. I hope to God that you are not firing off anonymous hate-filled diatribes to hard working academic pathologists accusing them of some shadow conspiracy and destroying the field. Because if you are then God help us all.

 

[raider]

RAIDER:

NITWITS:

 

[Parts Unknown]

RAIDER:

NITWITS:

 

[smallcat]

Ha Ha. Work for the VA? Are you kidding? Those places are horrid!

I want a private practice job like my medical school buddies in all other professions. They were getting offers from year 1 in residency. Here I am after 6 years of training and TWO FELLOWSHIPS and I can't get one. I have tried banging down doors and that doesn't work. (My classmates in other fields did not have to do this).

I have a family to feed. I am not qualified for an academic job. I don't do and never have done research. They don't even do much research where I trained at.

Yes, the job market sucks. People here have given you some good advice about how to work with what you've got. Honestly, you sound a little like my 5-year-old whining about how it's not fair that his brother got a bigger piece of cake. I'm not downplaying the seriousness of the job market, but I'm wondering if a bit of arrogance and/or a sense of entitlement comes through when you're applying for jobs. Watch how you present yourself.

 

[pathstudent]

Ha Ha. Work for the VA? Are you kidding? Those places are horrid!

I want a private practice job like my medical school buddies in all other professions. They were getting offers from year 1 in residency. Here I am after 6 years of training and TWO FELLOWSHIPS and I can't get one. I have tried banging down doors and that doesn't work. (My classmates in other fields did not have to do this).

I have a family to feed. I am not qualified for an academic job. I don't do and never have done research. They don't even do much research where I trained at.

Guys I have a family. What should I do? Go back to another specialty? Try the match? Its too late for the match!

You don't seem to hear me. There are academic jobs where you primarily sign-out cases. in general departments just require you to be involved in some scholarly acitivity and that can be broadly defined and doesn't mean only doing "research". You just have to display some willingness/interest in doing more than just beating your meat in the gross room and slapping your glass in the office.

If nothing else, you will be making 4 times what you are now and get you so more experience.

 

[jackypath]

One just needs to be realistic. And one only needs one job. You choose a job, and a job will have to choose you. Who wouldn't want a job in a desirable location, just sign-out biopsies, working 6 hours a day, and getting paid $200k or above? But so do other people. This creates competition. But there are jobs elsewhere. You just need to be flexible. Academic jobs are not that bad. Sure you don't have to do a lot of research. If you are satisfied with just looking at cases and make a living, you don't have to do research. Nobody will force you. But don't complain when others get promotion and you don't.

 

[Patho2009]

Do a third fellowship.



"I just want to sign out cases and raise my family"

I don't know why I stopped at this sentence for a while..

 

[APCPBBNP]

Are you talking about part time positions?

Have you applied to the innumerable clinical-track academic positions posted on pathologyoutlines.com? There are several VA jobs and many academic jobs in great cities posted there that are not going to get 50+ applications like the private gig in rural Minnesota. You will make primary care $$ but you'll have a nice job in a great city.

For those who claim that getting job at VA is piece of cake, please read the following response to an application for VA pathology job opening (exact location omitted for obvious purposes);

"Thank you for your interest as applicant for staff pathologist at the (exact location) VA Healthcare System. We are seeking an individual with excellent surgical pathology skills and demonstrated achievement or strong potential in basic or translational research, especially in molecular pathology. Strong candidates will have experience or special training in a subspecialty of anatomic or clinical pathology that supports our molecular genetics fellowship program. Your application and CV are being evaluated and I will contact you again soon to explore this professional opportunity in greater depth if it is determined that your qualifications are a good fit for the academic goals and service requirements of our department. Thank you again for your interest and application."

 

[adenosis]

I think there are too many trainees in pathology. Some program with average of <50K specimen have similar # of trainees as those with 100K specimen. I sometimes find that resident and fellows are there to ease the work load of attendings and do the job that hired PA can do. Simple supply and demand.

 

[path24]

The VA can be picky about what pathologist they hire.....the VA can't be picky about any other type of doctor they hire.

Too many pathologists.....they are a dime a dozen. Clinicians will continue to use us because they can.

 

[APCPBBNP]

Programs that have less than 25000 specimens/year should be closed. Period.

 

[path24]

Tons of jobs at this site

http://www.doctorschoiceplacement.com/Listings.asp?Specialty=All&State=All&Region=All&Submit=Search

Talk about a long list of open positions. Is there a pathology position on there? Nope!! No jobs in pathology.