I just wish there were better fellowships/exit strategies from EM

[miacomet]

Also sports isn’t really needed there isn’t much more a FM can’t do and for bad stuff you need Ortho anyway

You have to have a specific setup for sports like being the Lakers Doctor and this is a formality if you don’t plan to do academics

Or you can see the non op stuff in an ortho office, but that's boring.
My previous system had a lot of sports docs, and they seemed happy, I thought it was super boring aside from injections. Patients do just as well self-referring to PT.

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[bravotwozero]

Or you can see the non op stuff in an ortho office, but that's boring.
My previous system had a lot of sports docs, and they seemed happy, I thought it was super boring aside from injections. Patients do just as well self-referring to PT.

As far as ‘need’ is concerned, there’s a lot of specialties or goods and services people don’t strictly ‘need’, but they still want and go for it. It just boils down to the doc and how good he/she is at marketing. Sports med is definitely in that category. I don’t think that should stop anyone from pursuing a line of work they like.

 

[GonnaBeADoc2222]

There's a "grass is greener" phenomenon in this thread that pervades most threads in this subforum.

I don't think @miacomet would be happy doing anything. He literally wants to be a nurse over an EM doc. This whole thread is people presenting options and him shooting all of them down.

We all know this job mostly sucks. We're paid pretty well to eat the **** sandwich 13 days a month. If you don't want to eat the **** anymore, theres options. Some require risk, others time, others a paycut, but they are there. No, no one will come knocking on your door and offer you a stellar paying and fulfilling nonclinical job.

Personally, ive chosen to keep eating the **** as the **** to pay ratio is still favorable for me. Eating the **** for 13 days allows me to do the other things I want to do in life like lift, play w my daughter, and travel.

It's called work for a reason, they have to pay you to do it.

 

[miacomet]

There's a "grass is greener" phenomenon in this thread that pervades most threads in this subforum.

I don't think @miacomet would be happy doing anything. He literally wants to be a nurse over an EM doc. This whole thread is people presenting options and him shooting all of them down.

We all know this job mostly sucks. We're paid pretty well to eat the **** sandwich 13 days a month. If you don't want to eat the **** anymore, theres options. Some require risk, others time, others a paycut, but they are there. No, no one will come knocking on your door and offer you a stellar paying and fulfilling nonclinical job.

Personally, ive chosen to keep eating the **** as the **** to pay ratio is still favorable for me. Eating the **** for 13 days allows me to do the other things I want to do in life like lift, play w my daughter, and travel.

It's called work for a reason, they have to pay you to do it.

Totally fair. I made the wrong bargain with EM- I would have done better in a field that I enjoyed more and had better longevity than EM. It was a poor choice, I can live with that choice by leaving medicine entirely, but still wish for options I would actually enjoy/tolerate better. I'd be happy to work clinically, just not the nights/weekends/traumatic life of EM, a la @Birdstrike if I were allowed to switch to a different specialty.

So I guess I'm done? I can be mostly OK with that, it just seems like a waste of a doc.

 

[Splenda88]

Exactly.

For example, I’ve also had thoughts of leaving the pit. But moved to be closer to family and cost of living is higher. I’m hesitant to kill the golden? goose that is an EM career and take a risk if my family isn’t cared for. So instead of taking 50k and starting something new, I’ll keep making 200+/hr and grinding to FI while trying to stay responsible with my money.

But even then, if I have, say, 3M invested and a paid off house, would I rather take another risk or keep making that sweet EM salary?

So there’s your risk aversion and your opportunity cost of an EM salary.

Medicine is a golden handcuff.

As much as people in SDN would tell you making 300k+ is easy if you put the same effort you put into medicine into something else, we all know that is not the case.

Making 300k+/yr in a job that you know what to do 99% of the time is sweet.

 

[Brigade4Radiant]

Yes I love to complain but when I think about it I can work more and get paid my gf in finance if they have a big project they can stay until 11 sure they have the weekend but I have the weekdays to get stuff done.

Plus the lifestyle a 400k job for 13 shifts provides is just great

 

[johhnybgood]

Maybe my favorite post I’ve read in long time.

Well said gonnabeadoc222

 

[cyanide12345678]

Totally fair. I made the wrong bargain with EM- I would have done better in a field that I enjoyed more and had better longevity than EM. It was a poor choice, I can live with that choice by leaving medicine entirely, but still wish for options I would actually enjoy/tolerate better. I'd be happy to work clinically, just not the nights/weekends/traumatic life of EM, a la @Birdstrike if I were allowed to switch to a different specialty.

So I guess I'm done? I can be mostly OK with that, it just seems like a waste of a doc.

You're FIRE. You shouldn't have guilt in moving on.

Yeah that's it. It's not a waste of a doc, it's just that you have better things to do in your life than to slay away and get abused in the ER. Congratulations you've made it out.

 

[cyanide12345678]

I haven't read the whole thread, but making some assumptions based on a few posts that I've read. You honestly sound like me @miacomet. I know there are options, but none of them are good enough. Going back to another residency just sounds so excruciating and terrible. Even a year of fellowship sounds terrible. Heck even the application process sounds cumbersome -_-

I'll tell you what both of us are experiencing - Lack of drive essentially. You've made it. There's no reason for you to slave away in training. You've made it already. You've got the money. You can walk away. Then why would you bother with these inferior options of training and working > 40 hrs a week again. You've made it already. Doing anything else requires effort, time, and who in this world wants to do that when you can be living a good life since money isn't your biggest motivator anymore - you want money, I do too, but i want it with minimal effort. If I have to do a lot of work for it, I have enough money already where the effort isn't worth it. Sounds like you're in that same boat. It's a good boat to be in. Enjoy. Congratulations.

 

[cyanide12345678]

Medicine is a golden handcuff.

As much as people in SDN would tell you making 300k+ is easy if you put the same effort you put into medicine into something else, we all know that is not the case.

Making 300k+/yr in a job that you know what to do 99% of the time is sweet.

I will re-iterate this sentiment, making 300k doing something else and starting from scratch is years of effort before something may (or may not) come to fruition. It took us 7 years of effort to get through med school and residency to make this money. Even 6 figures starting from scratch is difficult to do.

People starting their own independent clinics barely make any money for 1-2 years. Most things in life are a grind.

 

[emergentmd]

No wonder the middle class hates the upper class. Make 300K, work 30 hrs/wk in an AC environment, sipping coffee/checking stocks periodically. Yeah EM has some suckiness but I doubt many on here would trade it for a 300K roofer, plumber, garbage man, lawn guy, line cook job.

Even if 300K isn't worth it, docs are smart. There are lots of non medicine options available. Work 4 dys/mo and make 100K then pursue your 2nd career. I am about to start my 4th career and money is not even the driver. I am already thinking about my 5th and final.

 

[miacomet]

I haven't read the whole thread, but making some assumptions based on a few posts that I've read. You honestly sound like me @miacomet. I know there are options, but none of them are good enough. Going back to another residency just sounds so excruciating and terrible. Even a year of fellowship sounds terrible. Heck even the application process sounds cumbersome -_-

I'll tell you what both of us are experiencing - Lack of drive essentially. You've made it. There's no reason for you to slave away in training. You've made it already. You've got the money. You can walk away. Then why would you bother with these inferior options of training and working > 40 hrs a week again. You've made it already. Doing anything else requires effort, time, and who in this world wants to do that when you can be living a good life since money isn't your biggest motivator anymore - you want money, I do too, but i want it with minimal effort. If I have to do a lot of work for it, I have enough money already where the effort isn't worth it. Sounds like you're in that same boat. It's a good boat to be in. Enjoy. Congratulations.

Wisdom. This is EXACTLY it. I would strongly prefer to have more money (I tire of living in a townhouse, but it's paid off), but it's not worth the aggravations of EM- my previous job was great until it wasn't, and I quit. I looked at locums, it's all a pain- overnights only, or just medmal hells, so I moved on. I looked a fellowships and doing a second residency. Also not worth it. It's a shame- I'd like to work, but medical work (and much work in the US in particular) is based on the premise that you have tons of debt and are desperate. If that's not the case, it's simply...not worth it. Not worth the circadian disruption, the humiliations, the stress, the lawsuits, the nasty. The juice is just not worth the squeeze. And that's a shame, because society loses a fantastic doc such as myself. I'd be happy to retrain in psych, or sleep, or something else, but it's simply not worth it, or more likely and more tragically, not available at all, as ABEM made sure to tell me re: Sleep.

It just seems like a loss- society loses a doc, I lose money and purpose, yet not working or working minimally (a shift here or there at the VA) is the logical place I find myself.

 

[Kryptocoin]

Actors vs. AI: Strike brings focus to emerging use of advanced tech

SAG-AFTRA has joined the Writer’s Guild of America in demanding a contract that explicitly demands AI regulations to protect writers and the works they create.

www.nbcnews.com

I didn't think I'd see the day when Hollywood actors are scared for their jobs. When your job mainly involves reading lines and looking good, I guess a machine can easily replace that.

EM will almost always be a physical job, so I don't see AI/machines replacing us. So in a way, the job sucks, but at least we still have a good-paying job for now.

 

[miacomet]

Actors vs. AI: Strike brings focus to emerging use of advanced tech

SAG-AFTRA has joined the Writer’s Guild of America in demanding a contract that explicitly demands AI regulations to protect writers and the works they create.

www.nbcnews.com

I didn't think I'd see the day when Hollywood actors are scared for their jobs. When your job mainly involves reading lines and looking good, I guess a machine can easily replace that.

EM will almost always be a physical job, so I don't see AI/machines replacing us. So in a way, the job sucks, but at least we still have a good-paying job for now.

Midlevels are largely replacing us

 

[CoolDoc1729]

Midlevels are largely replacing us

Our experience at both sites (decent sized high acuity community hospital and FSED) is that the midlevels cannot remotely replace us. We have two solid ones who id trust to take care of my family (but not to manage the department , at all!)
and the rest (a rotating cast of 8 or so)
A) are super lazy/see 0.6 pph/want to stop seeing patients 3 hours before the end of a 10 hour shift
B) do nonsensical things (one ordered a Ddimer for a patient who came in for an actively bleeding varicose vein; the ct ordering patterns boggle the mind)
C) seem to graduate terrified of litigation; notes are approximately the length of Crime and Punishment
D) sloooooow at procedures
E) unable to sense which patients need urgent treatment
F) don’t effectively communicate with nursing
G) only think of the most common few things
H) shoddy exams /sucks to find shingles at the end of the $20k workup /better to find a dead leg before Doppler goes home
In short it’s not like most midlevels would be capable of managing a department unless they have 10-15 years’ experience and manage to not burn out.

There are definitely good midlevels out there but there sure aren’t enough of them to replace residency trained EPs. On the whole I think it costs less to have EPs order the right tests and treatment even though we are paid more, and I suspect that payors and even our employers will realize this at some point.

 

[Kryptocoin]

Midlevels are largely replacing us

That's true, but I think it's a problem unique to medicine. Also, the attrition rate among mid-levels is pretty high. In 2 years, 80% of my midlevels have left for outpatient clinics or botox work. They get paid $75/hr for ER work. A lot of them can make the same pay for less work in the clinics.

 

[miacomet]

That's true, but I think it's a problem unique to medicine. Also, the attrition rate among mid-levels is pretty high. In 2 years, 80% of my midlevels have left for outpatient clinics or botox work. They get paid $75/hr for ER work. A lot of them can make the same pay for less work in the clinics.

Yep, they have better job opportunities than we do and are valued more by administrators, patients, and the healthcare system in general. They don't have to deal with EM forever and can retrain at a moment's notice.

 

[Siggy]

That's true, but I think it's a problem unique to medicine. Also, the attrition rate among mid-levels is pretty high. In 2 years, 80% of my midlevels have left for outpatient clinics or botox work. They get paid $75/hr for ER work. A lot of them can make the same pay for less work in the clinics.

A) are super lazy/see 0.6 pph/want to stop seeing patients 3 hours before the end of a 10 hour shift

So... 4 NPs are 2.4 patients per hour at $300/hr with less liability risk since they're judged at the level of a nurse not at the level of a physician.

What's the administrative issue here?

 

[Kryptocoin]

So... 4 NPs are 2.4 patients per hour at $300/hr with less liability risk since they're judged at the level of a nurse not at the level of a physician.

What's the administrative issue here?

I guess in states without independent practice rights, the liability falls on the supervising physician and the hospital.

 

[BoardingDoc]

On the whole I think it costs less to have EPs order the right tests and treatment even though we are paid more, and I suspect that payors and even our employers will realize this at some point.

This has already been proven. The problem is that the cost is to the healthcare system as a whole. In the case of the VA, where they not only see the patient but also absorb the cost of treatment, it makes sense to curtail costs. The biller and payor are the same.

In a regular ED, the hospital has no incentive to lower billing to the payor as the cost of the unnecessary testing is borne by someone else.

The Productivity of Professions: Evidence from the Emergency Department

Founded in 1920, the NBER is a private, non-profit, non-partisan organization dedicated to conducting economic research and to disseminating research findings among academics, public policy makers, and business professionals.

www.nber.org

 

[GonnaBeADoc2222]

Yep, they have better job opportunities than we do and are valued more by administrators, patients, and the healthcare system in general. They don't have to deal with EM forever and can retrain at a moment's notice.

This defeatist nonsense again.

No, midlevels don't have better opportunities and are not more valued than physicians. Just because you keep saying it, doesn't make it true.

You can start up your own thing in cosmetics, obesity, own urgent cares, own surgi centers, etc etc. You just don't want to.

You can retrain. you just don't want to.

"It's hard."

My friend had enough. He just started 2nd residency in derm. Time and money sacrifice.

No, no one is gonna let you retrain in psych for 1 year at attending salary.

 

[Waterlover]

This defeatist nonsense again.

No, midlevels don't have better opportunities and are not more valued than physicians. Just because you keep saying it, doesn't make it true.

You can start up your own thing in cosmetics, obesity, own urgent cares, own surgi centers, etc etc. You just don't want to.

You can retrain. you just don't want to.

"It's hard."

My friend had enough. He just started 2nd residency in derm. Time and money sacrifice.

No, no one is gonna let you retrain in psych for 1 year at attending salary.

Right, I just finished fellowship, I'm looking into cosmetic courses to do in the next several months. You can make the same or more depending on how you swing it. Not a guarantee but it is realistic. The options are there. If you want to and how you go about it is another thing

 

[Birdstrike]

I lose money and purpose

You’ve said a lot here ^^^. You feel like you’ve lost your purpose.

 

[TooMuchResearch]

No wonder the middle class hates the upper class. Make 300K, work 30 hrs/wk in an AC environment, sipping coffee/checking stocks periodically. Yeah EM has some suckiness but I doubt many on here would trade it for a 300K roofer, plumber, garbage man, lawn guy, line cook job.

Even if 300K isn't worth it, docs are smart. There are lots of non medicine options available. Work 4 dys/mo and make 100K then pursue your 2nd career. I am about to start my 4th career and money is not even the driver. I am already thinking about my 5th and final.

Unless I own the lawn service companies, hard pass.

 

[miacomet]

This defeatist nonsense again.

No, midlevels don't have better opportunities and are not more valued than physicians. Just because you keep saying it, doesn't make it true.

You can start up your own thing in cosmetics, obesity, own urgent cares, own surgi centers, etc etc. You just don't want to.

You can retrain. you just don't want to.

"It's hard."

My friend had enough. He just started 2nd residency in derm. Time and money sacrifice.

No, no one is gonna let you retrain in psych for 1 year at attending salary.

I'm OK with a resident salary. I'm somewhat less okay with...three or four more years.

 

[Fox800]

WOW. 47% of EM programs did not fill this year!

18.4% of total positions (554) went unfilled, up from 7.9% (219) last year.

Medical students are listening...wisely.

 

[miacomet]

WOW. 47% of EM programs did not fill this year!

18.4% of total positions (554) went unfilled, up from 7.9% (219) last year.

Medical students are listening...wisely.

View attachment 374432

Programs, ACGME and HCA could not care less since IMGs and FMGs were happy to scramble into these slots.

 

[Brigade4Radiant]

Programs, ACGME and HCA could not care less since IMGs and FMGs were happy to scramble into these slots.

That’s true but oh how we have fallen now FM has surpassed us and it will likely be permenant

 

[miacomet]

That’s true but oh how we have fallen now FM has surpassed us and it will likely be permenant

Yep, unless ABEM allows more fellowships (which they don't want to do), then EM is toast. Everyone is fleeing to non CMS specialties, as they should be.

 

[Brigade4Radiant]

Yep, unless ABEM allows more fellowships (which they don't want to do), then EM is toast. Everyone is fleeing to non CMS specialties, as they should be.

Yeah especially after trying to make EM the only one who can work EM a lot of other fields which run critical care and sports even if they open up other specialties it doesn’t mean much

 

[xaelia]

Had dinner with a couple anesthesiologists yesterday.

They are also stressing about folks quitting their private group – because they can't hire to replace them, and their contracts require them to staff various hospitals surgical operations. They're making $600k but getting burned out from the extra cases and on-call.

So folks are quitting to do locums to set their schedule, not take call, and still make the same as the guys left in the group. And the group suffers further, and the exodus accelerates.

Some hospitals are getting rid of the groups and trying the hospital-employed model, but are trying to cut the salaries – since most hospitals are in the red. And it's not working out for them – since anesthesia enables the high-revenue procedures, anesthesia has all the leverage.

Interestingly, one hospital they cover is making up the shortfall by having EM docs come do outpatient procedural sedation days – think outpatient cardioversions – and the EM docs love the easy money and slow-paced day.

 

[RustedFox]

Had dinner with a couple anesthesiologists yesterday.

They are also stressing about folks quitting their private group – because they can't hire to replace them, and their contracts require them to staff various hospitals surgical operations. They're making $600k but getting burned out from the extra cases and on-call.

So folks are quitting to do locums to set their schedule, not take call, and still make the same as the guys left in the group. And the group suffers further, and the exodus accelerates.

Some hospitals are getting rid of the groups and trying the hospital-employed model, but are trying to cut the salaries – since most hospitals are in the red. And it's not working out for them – since anesthesia enables the high-revenue procedures, anesthesia has all the leverage.

Interestingly, one hospital they cover is making up the shortfall by having EM docs come do outpatient procedural sedation days – think outpatient cardioversions – and the EM docs love the easy money and slow-paced day.

My my my, how the turn tables.

 

[miacomet]

Had dinner with a couple anesthesiologists yesterday.

They are also stressing about folks quitting their private group – because they can't hire to replace them, and their contracts require them to staff various hospitals surgical operations. They're making $600k but getting burned out from the extra cases and on-call.

So folks are quitting to do locums to set their schedule, not take call, and still make the same as the guys left in the group. And the group suffers further, and the exodus accelerates.

Some hospitals are getting rid of the groups and trying the hospital-employed model, but are trying to cut the salaries – since most hospitals are in the red. And it's not working out for them – since anesthesia enables the high-revenue procedures, anesthesia has all the leverage.

Interestingly, one hospital they cover is making up the shortfall by having EM docs come do outpatient procedural sedation days – think outpatient cardioversions – and the EM docs love the easy money and slow-paced day.

OMG sign me up, and we are way more liberal about fasting!

Anesthesia, like all CMS specialties, is going to have irreparable, unsolvable issues. They are somewhat protected by being a surgical-oriented specialty, which is a money maker, as you noted. Surprised anesthesia has leverage- why hasn't the hospital replaced them, and the ER docs doing sedations, with midlevels? Aren't CRNAs the answer to everything?

Anesthesia is still a far better bet than EM for all the reasons you listed. EM is dead, and anyone who doesn't realize it is a serious fool.

 

[RustedFox]

OMG sign me up, and we are way more liberal about fasting!

Anesthesia, like all CMS specialties, is going to have irreparable, unsolvable issues. They are somewhat protected by being a surgical-oriented specialty, which is a money maker, as you noted. Surprised anesthesia has leverage- why hasn't the hospital replaced them, and the ER docs doing sedations, with midlevels? Aren't CRNAs the answer to everything?

Anesthesia is still a far better bet than EM for all the reasons you listed. EM is dead, and anyone who doesn't realize it is a serious fool.

Bolded for emphasis and agreement.

 

[miacomet]

Bolded for emphasis and agreement.

And what the hell happens to those of us who happen to have to practice EM, I have no idea. Because there are no jobs, certainly no decent jobs, and the exit strategies are not great. My guess is we will see more and more doing a second residency. It's a nightmare.

 

[Groove]

FIRE is the ultimate exit strategy. Nothing else allows us to make this level of income and aggressively contribute to savings. The absolute best thing someone can do is to try to learn more about investing and understanding the market. Currently sitting on CAGR (improved) of 106% with only about 1-1.5 hours of market research "work" a day, maybe 3-4 on my days off. If I can keep this up, I'll be able to eject from this field far earlier than I anticipated.

I do know a lot of people that go the whole...massive leverage, multiple properties route and I suppose that's also an option but I don't care for real estate for reasons I've already mentioned.

All these concierge / cosmetic businesses sound like way too much work for me.

We have terrible fellowship options. I wish we had one called "outpatient medicine" that would allows us to set up FM/IM type outpatient gigs. I'd actually consider doing one of those just for the variety and new experience. I also think the gig someone described as EM docs doing sedation for minor procedures sounds really fun or at least a breath of fresh air. I'd do something like that.

As it stands, it's just a job and one that allows me to save far more than I'd be able to do with most "normal" jobs with much less financial risk and much more job security. For that, I'm very grateful and will continue to plug away at my 140-160h/mo until I can cash out.

 

[miacomet]

FIRE is the ultimate exit strategy. Nothing else allows us to make this level of income and aggressively contribute to savings. The absolute best thing someone can do is to try to learn more about investing and understanding the market. Currently sitting on CAGR (improved) of 106% with only about 1-1.5 hours of market research "work" a day, maybe 3-4 on my days off. If I can keep this up, I'll be able to eject from this field far earlier than I anticipated.

I do know a lot of people that go the whole...massive leverage, multiple properties route and I suppose that's also an option but I don't care for real estate for reasons I've already mentioned.

All these concierge / cosmetic businesses sound like way too much work for me.

We have terrible fellowship options. I wish we had one called "outpatient medicine" that would allows us to set up FM/IM type outpatient gigs. I'd actually consider doing one of those just for the variety and new experience. I also think the gig someone described as EM docs doing sedation for minor procedures sounds really fun or at least a breath of fresh air. I'd do something like that.

As it stands, it's just a job and one that allows me to save far more than I'd be able to do with most "normal" jobs with much less financial risk and much more job security. For that, I'm very grateful and will continue to plug away at my 140-160h/mo until I can cash out.

I'm moderate FIRE...I miss clinical medicine, but it's a PITA. Just nothing for us.

 

[Groove]

I'm moderate FIRE...I miss clinical medicine, but it's a PITA. Just nothing for us.

I envy you buddy. I'm sure there is some grass is greener effect but I truly can't imagine missing this work if I was able to retire fully right now. I think once I'm there....I'll severely cut it down to a handful of shifts a month just to scratch the itch and stay active. Maybe like....3 or 4.

 

[miacomet]

I envy you buddy. I'm sure there is some grass is greener effect but I truly can't imagine missing this work if I was able to retire fully right now. I think once I'm there....I'll severely cut it down to a handful of shifts a month just to scratch the itch and stay active. Maybe like....3 or 4.

I don't miss this work, I miss clinical medicine that is not EM that we can't do any fellowships for or that require three years of retraining.

If I were less than a few years from residency, I would 100% retrain in something else- psych, anesthesia, whatever. Because EM is hell, and we all quit, and our skills are wasted, and it's terrible.

 

[Splenda88]

I'm moderate FIRE...I miss clinical medicine, but it's a PITA. Just nothing for us.

What's your net worth right now?

 

[Splenda88]

I don't miss this work, I miss clinical medicine that is not EM that we can't do any fellowships for or that require three years of retraining.

If I were less than a few years from residency, I would 100% retrain in something else- psych, anesthesia, whatever. Because EM is hell, and we all quit, and our skills are wasted, and it's terrible.

I still don't get why EM can't do outpatient and hospital medicine... Again, they will be somewhat rusty at the beginning but should be good after a year. Just like it would take most IM docs 6+ months to be good at doing outpatient

 

[miacomet]

What's your net worth right now?

Enough that I don't have to work, that the juice isn't worth the squeeze. Of course I'd like more.

 

[Splenda88]

Enough that I don't have to work, that the juice isn't worth the squeeze. Of course I'd like more.

Can't wait to get to that point. Unlike most people here, 2.5+ mil plus a paid off home will be enough for me to work 7-8 days/month.

 

[miacomet]

Can't wait to get to that point. Unlike most people here, 2.5+ mil plus a paid off home will be enough for me to work 7-8 days/month.

What I discovered was that 7-8 days a month wasn't much better than 10-12 days a month. Same admin phone calls. Same patient satisfaction issues.

 

[bravotwozero]

What I discovered was that 7-8 days a month wasn't much better than 10-12 days a month. Same admin phone calls. Same patient satisfaction issues.

Depends on the job. You don’t have to worry about that as a locums or PRN doc. I get that stuff at my prn gig, I just ignore it! They need me, not the other way around.

 

[Brigade4Radiant]

Anesthesia still has a great job market they can make 600k and even if you go on the forum they say that the field is wide open. EM other than family medicine has the worst fellowship job prospects.

FM you can do rural EM and you can do sleep,

FM though you can do whatever outpatient medicine you feel comfortable with only seeing adults or just doing depression

 

[DeadCactus]

Anastasia still has a great job market they can make 600k and even if you go on the forum they say that the field is wide open. EM other than family medicine has the worst fellowship job prospects.

FM you can do rural EM and you can do sleep,

FM though you can do whatever outpatient medicine you feel comfortable with only seeing adults or just doing depression

Yea, but the match rate into the Russian monarchy is pretty low and the burn out is terrible.

 

[RustedFox]

Yea, but the match rate into the Russian monarchy is pretty low and the burn out is terrible.

Someone explain the joke to me.

 

[Fox800]

And what the hell happens to those of us who happen to have to practice EM, I have no idea. Because there are no jobs, certainly no decent jobs, and the exit strategies are not great. My guess is we will see more and more doing a second residency. It's a nightmare.

There are LOTS of jobs right now, my e-mail inbox is blowing up every day. They just aren't that great.

 

[Mount Asclepius]

Someone explain the joke to me.

Anastasia still has a great job market they can make 600k and even if you go on the forum they say that the field is wide open.

Anesthesia still has a great job market they can make 600k and even if you go on the forum they say that the field is wide open.

Yea, but the match rate into the Russian monarchy is pretty low and the burn out is terrible.

Original post with typo/dictation error that is now fixed.