I was just rejected from 2 of my 3 safety schools

[FutureClinPhD]

I just received emails from 2 of my 3 safety schools. One was a rejection, and one was to inform me that they've already sent out invites and I wasn't selected to interview (so it might as well have been a rejection). My stats are well above the past years average for both these schools, and I had good matches with my previous and planned research. I thought I would get interviews AT LEAST at these schools, even if everything else is up in the air.

I don't know what to do. I don't have any other interviews yet, and some of my other schools have already given out invites. I'm so discouraged by this - I feel like I should just go through with my backup plan now. This is a nightmare.

Sorry to post such a dismal thread, but I really needed to vent. I've invested so much into this process, and I have this horrible feeling in my gut that it was all just a waste. Why does this have to be so hard?

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[psychanon]

There's no such thing as a "safety school" in clinical psych Ph.D. admissions. That's a mentality left over from undergrad applications, but this is a whole different ballgame. It's all about what is a good match for you. You could apply to a school ranked #60th with awesome stats and get rejected outright (because you are a poor match), and at the same time be accepted to a top ten school that you are a good match for. I was rejected from some schools that I thought were "safeties," but then was accepted to some "reaches." Also, you should not think that you will get in somewhere because your GREs and GPA are higher than the mean, because those are relatively low considerations, compared to research experience.

The bottom line is that you shouldn't use this as evidence that you won't get in.

PS- I'm getting the sense that a lot of people assume that if programs like you at all they'll at least give you an interview. Most places interview about 1 out of 15 of their applicants. So a lot of really good people get cut before the interview stage. On the flipside, if you do get an interview, you should be really proud, because it's a huge accomplishment!! And it means that you have about a 1 in 3 chance of being accepted. That's a victory!!

 

[FutureClinPhD]

There's no such thing as a "safety school" in clinical psych Ph.D. admissions.

I know there are no real "safety" schools here. But these were schools where I had EXCELLENT research matches (or at least thought I did I guess), had emailed my POIs, confirmed that they are looking for students, etc. In other words, this should have been a best case scenario for me, whereas at some of the other places I applied, there are various things that could go wrong (such as, maybe my GREs weren't competitive enough here, or that this POI is in very high demand, etc). So if I got the early-reject of death at these schools, it leaves me very nervous about the all my other applications.

These 2 I really thought I had it in the bag. I guess in this process, you never really do.

 

[socialcog]

I think we all have those schools that we believe we are better suited for and hence believe we will, at least, make the short list. Speaking for myself, I know there are about 4 of my 11 that I think I am a stong applicant for, 3 that are total long shots, and the remaining 4...somewhere in the middle. If I was rejected from the 4 I felt I was a strong match for, then I would be quite deflated.

Don't loose hope. Hang in there! You never know what will happen unless you can see the future.

 

[JackD]

What do your stats look like, just out of curiosity?

 

[Hain Adam]

Maybe more people than ever applied to those programs this year. Clinical Phd programs tend to have extremely small acceptance rates. I heard that some programs admit only like 5 people out of 400 applicants.

 

[JockNerd]

I got rejected pretty fast from my one backup. A site would be a backup if it doesn't give much for funding and generally has fewer applications. If you're a solid applicant, you can be rejected if you have research interests that can obviously be met at a dozen other schools that would give you better funding.

Did you check to make sure your POIs at those schools are even taking people this year?

 

[FutureClinPhD]

I think we all have those schools that we believe we are better suited for and hence believe we will, at least, make the short list. Speaking for myself, I know there are about 4 of my 11 that I think I am a stong applicant for, 3 that are total long shots, and the remaining 4...somewhere in the middle. If I was rejected from the 4 I felt I was a strong match for, then I would be quite deflated.

Don't loose hope. Hang in there! You never know what will happen unless you can see the future.

Thanks for the kind words, I'm trying to stay open minded about this whole thing, but you all know how hard it is.

What do your stats look like, just out of curiosity?

GRE is high 1400's (low 700's V and high 700's Q). 3.8 GPA, 4.0 in Psych classes, lots of relevant research experience and conferences, but no pubs. For both schools I was rejected from, the average has been around 1150, 3.6 for the past several years.

 

[JackD]

Maybe more people than ever applied to those programs this year. Clinical Phd programs tend to have extremely small acceptance rates. I heard that some programs admit only like 5 people out of 400 applicants.

That is how my current university is, which seemed weird the first time i saw how many people they let in. For undergrads, if you have a high school diploma, you have a spot as an undergrad. Even though i have known for a long time that getting into a clinical programs is difficult, i thought my school would be an easy one. No, i was quite wrong. The acceptance rate for my school's clinical psychology program is about as close to 0% as you can get. I think it would be 0% if they weren't forced to actually let someone in.

I know i am about to commit the sins of all sins here. FutureClinPhD, if you have great stats but you can't seem to get into a traditional program, why not....here it comes....try a professional school? Oh my god, JackD said it

Sure it aint anywhere close to being free but if you are willing to pay $85,000, you can greatly increase your chances of getting into a program. I'm just throwing it out there.

 

[FutureClinPhD]

Did you check to make sure your POIs at those schools are even taking people this year?

Yep, had communicated with my POIs early in the fall semester, and both seemed enthusiastic about my app.


What worries me the most about this is to think that maybe I've made some sort of horrible auto-reject mistake that I don't even realize. I rechecked my PS, no typos or professing my love for the wrong school, or anything like that.

 

[FutureClinPhD]

Maybe more people than ever applied to those programs this year. Clinical Phd programs tend to have extremely small acceptance rates. I heard that some programs admit only like 5 people out of 400 applicants.

I thought about that too. That may be the case at the first school, but the second school was kind enough to include in their email exactly how many applications they received (around 100) and how many invites they extended (around 30)!!! What did I do wrong to miss a 30% cut?

why not....here it comes....try a professional school? Oh my god, JackD said it

I don't think a professional program would be for me. I don't really want to practice, I want to work in academia and do clinical research (truthfully!).

 

[Therapist4Chnge]

With those stats you should have been seriously considered for interviews, I'm guessing you weren't a good research fit. Maybe they had people with multiple publications and/or a stronger fit with the POI. Unfortunately GRE/GPA only get you so far.

-t

 

[JockNerd]

I agree with T4C, something else was happening there.

Those are good stats, I'd be confident.

And it's still early, by the way! My adviser hasn't even looked at applications yet. I think my this time last year I'd had one phone interview.

 

[Hain Adam]

I don't think a professional program would be for me. I don't really want to practice, I want to work in academia and do clinical research (truthfully!).

Maybe those two programs' focus was more on clinical/applied side than the academic/research side. Some programs are more research oriented while some are more clinical oriented.

 

[RayneeDeigh]

Those are very similar to what my stats were last year and I was flat-out rejected from 10 schools, at least five of which were a great fit for me. Why, I have no idea (I figured it was based on age).

Sometimes there's no rhyme or reason so try not to get discouraged. I got an acceptance at the last possible second (I mean like, April 13th) so just hang in there.

 

[joetro]

Just wanted to add that sometimes politics can be in play, as in people who planned to take can't or don't because other (junior) faculty need the spots, or funding issues happen, etc. I'm sorry that this has happened to you, but best of luck along the way. Also, keep in mind that you can always hold out for next year if what you want doesn't come along. I did.

 

[deleted176373]

Thanks for the kind words, I'm trying to stay open minded about this whole thing, but you all know how hard it is.



GRE is high 1400's (low 700's V and high 700's Q). 3.8 GPA, 4.0 in Psych classes, lots of relevant research experience and conferences, but no pubs. For both schools I was rejected from, the average has been around 1150, 3.6 for the past several years.

You probably got rejected because they most likely thought you would not bother with them... It happened to me as well with a few programs, I wasn't too surprised. You would be the elephant in the room with those stats. I know when I interviewed at Oklahoma State University a few people admitted to wanting to kill for my scores when they found that I had a 1300 GRE (which isn't that high.) and a 4.0 GPA. The average GRE was rolling in the 1100's there.

And no, I didn't get in! Just as well, I got into a far better program one year later. Sad thing is that I would have accepted OSU if they had offered because I was feeling pretty down after only getting 2 interviews and not being able to attend one for weather. I know this is a PITA to do twice, but really the match is so important that it's better if you don't get into a "safety school."

Having been there and done that, unless you desperately need to be in school (which is a bad thing itself) then you should not apply to ANY safety schools! Only apply to those schools that you would go to that are reasonable for your credentials. Safety schools will just leave you feeling like you compromised.

It would be different if you were rocking a low GPA, low GRE, no pubs, etc. You are NOT in that boat, so focus on the match.

Just a little 20/20 hindsight.

Mark

 

[layleh]

That is how my current university is, which seemed weird the first time i saw how many people they let in. For undergrads, if you have a high school diploma, you have a spot as an undergrad. Even though i have known for a long time that getting into a clinical programs is difficult, i thought my school would be an easy one. No, i was quite wrong. The acceptance rate for my school's clinical psychology program is about as close to 0% as you can get. I think it would be 0% if they weren't forced to actually let someone in.

I know i am about to commit the sins of all sins here. FutureClinPhD, if you have great stats but you can't seem to get into a traditional program, why not....here it comes....try a professional school? Oh my god, JackD said it

Sure it aint anywhere close to being free but if you are willing to pay $85,000, you can greatly increase your chances of getting into a program. I'm just throwing it out there.

I think I just fainted, JackD suggested a professional school

 

[xlittlemissalix]

I agree with Markp. You shouldn't apply to a school that you wouldn't seriously want to attend. Yes, I have somewhat ranked the schools I've applied to, but I would not consider ANY of them safety schools [also because I don't think any PhD program is a safety school haha]. Out of curiousity, why do you consider these schools to be safety schools if you think the research match is a great fit? Honestly, that's my number 1 criteria in deciding which schools are my top choices.

I wouldn't get too discouraged right now. [This coming from someone who has been freaking out over the past month and been quite discouraged, haha.] If they weren't schools you would genuinely be intersted in attending, it's no real loss to have been rejected. Just focus on the schools you really do want to attend.

 

[EquestriAnn]

Question- how old are you? I have heard that very few people get accepted into Clinical Psyc PhD programs right out of undergrad. If there were people with as amazing stats (kudos!) but 2+ years of research after undergrad, maybe they just had to pick them? I didn't apply for Clinical and I am no expert, but I have a lot of friends who are who keep me informed. I've never heard of schools turning down applicants because they are too good, but I am definitely going to start using that as my excuse

 

[paramour]

Question- how old are you? I have heard that very few people get accepted into Clinical Psyc PhD programs right out of undergrad. If there were people with as amazing stats (kudos!) but 2+ years of research after undergrad, maybe they just had to pick them? I didn't apply for Clinical and I am no expert, but I have a lot of friends who are who keep me informed. I've never heard of schools turning down applicants because they are too good, but I am definitely going to start using that as my excuse

Other people get sick of hearing about the GRE. I personally get tired of hearing about how so few people straight out of undergrad get into PhD programs, particularly when the majority of the applicants I met on interviews were finishing up their undergrad careers. Oh, wait, that doesn't mean they were actually accepted by anyone. No, I agree it doesn't, but just over half my class is most definitely straight out of undergrad and my cohort does not appear to be abnormal for the program. I honestly think people spread that bit of nonsense around to make younger applicants feel better about themselves when they don't get accepted somewhere. But, then again, perhaps I'm simply bitter.

 

[GiantSteps]

FutureClinPhD,

I just thought of another hypthetical scenario as to why you and others with superb credentials may run into acceptance trouble. Psychology schools can not realistically accept all of their students from any one school for diversity sake. Therefore, if let's say three or more stellar candidates from the same school apply to one program, they would be in competition more with each other than with other candidates from different schools. For example, if four top students from Univ. of Minnesota apply to Long Island University as their supposed safety school, most probably, one to two of these students would be eliminated by their own classmates rather than by a lone student who applies from Cleveland State Univ. with slightly lesser credentials. I can not state this for certain but I was once at an interview and there were several students from the same school who had introduced themeselves to the group. The professor said that the program did not usually invite that many students from the same school but made an unusual exception. In conclusion, you or others may be being beat out by the other top students at your own school.

 

[EquestriAnn]

Do they know where else you have applied? Because that would definitely change things up a bit... And PS Paramour, I did say that I have heard that most people don't get accepted right out of undergrad, and I added the qualifier that this isn't my area of expertise anyway Its ok to be bitter though, I certainly am haha.

 

[layleh]

There's no such thing as a "safety school" in clinical psych Ph.D. admissions. That's a mentality left over from undergrad applications, but this is a whole different ballgame. It's all about what is a good match for you. You could apply to a school ranked #60th with awesome stats and get rejected outright (because you are a poor match), and at the same time be accepted to a top ten school that you are a good match for. I was rejected from some schools that I thought were "safeties," but then was accepted to some "reaches." Also, you should not think that you will get in somewhere because your GREs and GPA are higher than the mean, because those are relatively low considerations, compared to research experience.

The bottom line is that you shouldn't use this as evidence that you won't get in.

PS- I'm getting the sense that a lot of people assume that if programs like you at all they'll at least give you an interview. Most places interview about 1 out of 15 of their applicants. So a lot of really good people get cut before the interview stage. On the flipside, if you do get an interview, you should be really proud, because it's a huge accomplishment!! And it means that you have about a 1 in 3 chance of being accepted. That's a victory!!

I remember my undergraduate advisor stressing this repeatedly to me every year after the admissions committee meetings and interviews...and the subsequent phone calls (especially from those with high GPA's and GRE's) demanding to know why THEY didn't get in. Answers usually included: crappy personal statements, poor match, being poorly prepared for interviews, overconfidence (to the point of being egotistical) due to GPA/GRE scores (as evidenced by meetings with the professors/current graduate students), lack of research experience, poor attitude, etc. I've always been told that the myth of rejection because of scores that are too high (and the subsequent thought that the university thinks "Why bother because my scores are soooo good that I wouldn't WANT to go there") is a bunch of bologna.

 

[FutureClinPhD]

To address some of the questions that have been raised:

In conclusion, you or others may be being beat out by the other top students at your own school.

I attend a smallish school and I know for certain that I am the only Clinical PhD applicant from here (and probably the only one from the past 5 years)

Do they know where else you have applied?

Not that I know of.

I agree with Markp. You shouldn't apply to a school that you wouldn't seriously want to attend. Yes, I have somewhat ranked the schools I've applied to, but I would not consider ANY of them safety schools [also because I don't think any PhD program is a safety school haha]. Out of curiousity, why do you consider these schools to be safety schools if you think the research match is a great fit?

I didn't apply to any program that I wouldn't love to attend. I considered them a "safety" because my research fit the program so well, and because my gpa/gre was well above their averages for the past several years. I don't think I'm overqualified and I don't have any airs of elitism, I just thought I was an excellent match for these programs. These were places where, if I get in anywhere, I thought for sure it would be here.

 

[JockNerd]

That is how my current university is, which seemed weird the first time i saw how many people they let in. For undergrads, if you have a high school diploma, you have a spot as an undergrad. Even though i have known for a long time that getting into a clinical programs is difficult, i thought my school would be an easy one. No, i was quite wrong. The acceptance rate for my school's clinical psychology program is about as close to 0% as you can get. I think it would be 0% if they weren't forced to actually let someone in.

I know i am about to commit the sins of all sins here. FutureClinPhD, if you have great stats but you can't seem to get into a traditional program, why not....here it comes....try a professional school? Oh my god, JackD said it

Sure it aint anywhere close to being free but if you are willing to pay $85,000, you can greatly increase your chances of getting into a program. I'm just throwing it out there.

Not getting into a PhD program your first time through apps seems to me to be insufficient reason by itself to apply to a professional school. PhD programs are competitive, but some of us DO get in. As well, while the acceptance rate of individual schools is about 4%, people apply to about a dozen schools. So, it's not as if only 4% *of all applicants* get in each year.

Since the degrees have significantly different training models, I think it's unwise to view the PsyD as a backup; the training models are not equivalent in what they train a person to do. Particularly if a person has a desire to move into academia. I also think that a year spent training and repackaging application material is preferable to accruing massive debt.