IMG Internal Medicine Applicants - Match 2020

[DocSpy332]

Hello everyone... Does frieda enlist all the programs or there are programs which aren't mentioned in frieda??

Hello there! Freida enlists all the acgme accredited programs

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[Wildflower7]

My step 1 is 212 and step 2 is 221. Programs have requirement 220 on both. so if I have one score above 220, should I apply to those programs?

Where do you find which programs have what cut off score ?

 

[Virgo32]

Where do you find which programs have what cut off score ?

FREIDA

 

[Applicant019]

Good luck everyone!

 

[Bobbbyyyy]

1. Are you able to update your ERAS CV by adding observership experiences after application submission?
2. Are you able to update your ERAS CV by adding a research publications after application submission?

TIA

 

[Bobbbyyyy]

Where do you find which programs have what cut off score ?

FREIDA

Yep, FREIDA is good, and also you can go to their website, usually they have a section called "applicant info" or "how to apply" sometimes it's in their FAQ section.
You gotta take this info with a grain of salt, many programs list the standard IM 220+ min req but filter at a higher score, while other times they list the standard 220+ but still look at the application more holistically and don't filter lower scoring applicants right off the bat.
At the end of the day, how strongly the program adheres to their score req depends program to program.
Same applies to YOG, USCE, step attempts, etc etc.
They can be more lenient depending on whether you're from their geographical location, or if you have any ties to the program; did rotations there or know people there etc. etc.

 

[rokshana]

1. Are you able to update your ERAS CV by adding observership experiences after application submission?
2. Are you able to update your ERAS CV by adding a research publications after application submission?

TIA

I don’t think so

 

[thenoonemedicineman]

Hey guys, ready to join the party

Step 1 248
Step 2 268
Step 2 CS pass 2nd attempt red flag
Step 3 257
6 months USCE
2 research experience
YOG 2017
No publications.
No Visa needed

Last year applied in late October to 98 IM programs and got 3 IVs, applying to more programs maybe 150 ish. Good luck to us

 

[Asa17]

I am happy to join the fiesta this year .
Here are my credentials
Yog 2015 (red flag)
Step 1 227
Step 2 ck 244
Step cs passed on 2nd attempt , biggest red flag.
USCE externships and shadowing for several months .
I am very fluent in both Spanish and English , not sure how much that helps, but i hope it adds some value to my app.

 

[Asa17]

I just filed to get my green card through my spouse so I am not sure whether to say I am visa requiring or no. Any ideas??

 

[gutonc]

1. Are you able to update your ERAS CV by adding observership experiences after application submission?
2. Are you able to update your ERAS CV by adding a research publications after application submission?

TIA

No. The only things you can update after submission are LORs, scores and personal statements.

 

[gutonc]

Hey guys, ready to join the party

Step 1 248
Step 2 268
Step 2 CS pass 2nd attempt red flag
Step 3 working on that
6 months USCE
2 research experience
YOG 2017
No publications.
No Visa needed

Last year applied in late October to 98 IM programs and got 3 IVs, applying to more programs maybe 150 ish. Good luck to us

What changed between this year and last to make your application better?

 

[thenoonemedicineman]

What changed between this year and last to make your application better?

4 more months of USCE,
Step 3 and no Visa requirement

 

[thenoonemedicineman]

How could you get USCE??

I got it through agencies

 

[Virgo32]

So, if we do rotations in the hospital and do well in the interview but the program has active residents score around 226-235 step 1, does it happen the program takes someone with a lower score than their active residents?

 

[batmanisreal88]

So, if we do rotations in the hospital and do well in the interview but the program has active residents score around 226-235 step 1, does it happen the program takes someone with a lower score than their active residents?

Absolutely. Programs generally prefer prospective residents who they have worked with and prefer working with (you in this case). So yeah. Build connection and after you apply, make sure you use those contacts and hopefully they can pull your application.

 

[il pani]

Hi everyone,
First of all, I wish all of this year's applicants good luck! I was in your shoes last year and it was a stressful but very rewarding experience. I applied to many many programs (175) because I was very sure I wanted to train in the US, regardless of the program. However, I had a great response rate in terms of interview invitations (~20%), which I think was attributed to the fact that I reached out to EVERYONE I knew. Even if it was a friend of a friend I made sure to reach out to them as soon as my application was submitted. Many people vouched for me with their programs and I got many invitations this way. Not saying this was the only reason of course, I had a good CV to back it up. Many times programs don't look at IMG applications but will definitely do so if someone is talking on your behalf. If there was one thing I would recommend, it would be that! Networking, networking, networking!

Feel free to send any questions via DM and I would be happy to help!

 

[Animalcules]

This is kind of off topic, but how involved are USCE’s usually? Are you seeing patients and presenting the way a medical student or resident would?

We recently had an IMG Rotating on our service who was very smart but didn’t have medical record access or anything so she was effectively just shadowing and not actively involved in patient care. She was talking about getting a Rec letter from our staff, which was quite surprising to me as I felt there wasn’t much she could be evaluated on. Is this a typical experience?

No. They should act like any of your final year med students and be evaluated as such. You can't write a meaningful letter in the case you described.

 

[Lostinmedicine2020]

Hey guys, second time match here too. Hoping for the best.

YOG: Dec 2016
USIMG
Step 1/CS/CK: 215/pass/239 all taken once
USCE: 9 months
Research: 4 experiences
Pubs: 14 + 4 posters

Going all out here guys. any feedback would be appreciated, I just want to get into a program at this point.

 

[micromd]

I got it through agencies

Can you please share which agency was it?

 

[batmanisreal88]

Can you please share which agency was it?

There's so many but the famous ones are

1. American Clerkship
2. AMO Opportunities
3. IMG Prep
4. Chicago something
5. FMG Portal

There are others but I cannot remember

 

[Virgo32]

hey, how to tell programs about your visa status for green card update or citizenship status? should I write that in my Personal statement or submit a copy of gc in documents list?

 

[rokshana]

Non US-IMG

Step 1: Low 240s
Step 2CK: Mid 250s
Step 2CS: Pass
(All first attempts)

YOG: 2016
USCE: 5 months of observerships (3 LORS (2 IM + 1IM sub-speciality) from those + 1 from medical school dept chair)
No research or pubs but I will join a research position soon on a J-1 (will mention that in my personal statement I guess)

Was planning to apply to less than 150 programs but seeing some people above applying to much more is freaking me out. Should I be applying to more programs?

Yes...it’s the visa requirement

 

[takotsubo13]

Yes...it’s the visa requirement

The J1 is sponsored by ECFMG though, should make no difference to them

 

[rokshana]

The J1 is sponsored by ECFMG though, should make no difference to them

have you been involved in the interview season?

programs are less likely to want to be involved with worries that come with getting a visa...there is no guarantee that the visa will come through in time for a july start...read through last years thread and you will see that visa requiring students get a lot less interviews than those that do not have a need for a visa.

you also have a YOG of 2016- that's 4 years out and that too will decrease the number of invites you will get.

your scores are decent, but overall your application doesn't stand out...you want at least 15 interviews to feel comfortable that you have a high chance of matching...

 

[JAH2022]

Can you please share which agency was it?

Under NNNOOOO circumstances use Americlerkship. They will convince you to pay for expensive subinternship for $4000 a month (does NOT include airfare, travel, food, accommodation) at a hospital to get US clinical experience and a great LOR. Then you hear that the program director at this place you paid so much money per month gets arrested yesterday for extortion, operating an illegal ALF and ?abuse of the elderly - making an elderly man sign a DNR (the man's house she was using to operate the ALF). So you can no longer use this LOR and can forget using that US clinical experience on your application. And you sit here and realize life is about to end and you are screwed over and can kiss your dreams goodbye.

 

[takotsubo13]

have you been involved in the interview season?

programs are less likely to want to be involved with worries that come with getting a visa...there is no guarantee that the visa will come through in time for a july start...read through last years thread and you will see that visa requiring students get a lot less interviews than those that do not have a need for a visa.

you also have a YOG of 2016- that's 4 years out and that too will decrease the number of invites you will get.

your scores are decent, but overall your application doesn't stand out...you want at least 15 interviews to feel comfortable that you have a high chance of matching...

Well the interview season hasn't started yet, so no. I have not been involved yet. Also I thought the year of grad is taken from when you apply, not from when you start. I graduated september 2016, which should be only considered 3 years out. Or at least so I was told.

 

[rokshana]

Well the interview season hasn't started yet, so no. I have not been involved yet. Also I thought the year of grad is taken from when you apply, not from when you start. I graduated september 2016, which should be only considered 3 years out. Or at least so I was told.

there are 2 years of IMG threads...go review them and see how many of the visa requiring applicants had few interviews...those that did require visas and got a significant number of interviews are the one with outstanding applications...and if they didn't need a visa, well...

3,4...still a lot of years out...the most competitive student is the 4th year USMD student...a big part of that is the 4th year part.

better you apply to far more programs than you need and have to the pare down the number of interviews, then end up not having enough interviews and worry you won't match.

 

[Bobbbyyyy]

agreed with Rokshana, I'm not reapplying this cycle with high hopes, building connections thru rotations/research positions at programs may be the only way people like me will get noticed tbh

this isn't aimed at takotsubo13, your scores put you in a much better position than me

 

[batmanisreal88]

Under NNNOOOO circumstances use Americlerkship. They will convince you to pay for expensive subinternship for $4000 a month (does NOT include airfare, travel, food, accommodation) at a hospital to get US clinical experience and a great LOR. Then you hear that the program director at this place you paid so much money per month gets arrested yesterday for extortion, operating an illegal ALF and ?abuse of the elderly - making an elderly man sign a DNR (the man's house she was using to operate the ALF). So you can no longer use this LOR and can forget using that US clinical experience on your application. And you sit here and realize life is about to end and you are screwed over and can kiss your dreams goodbye.

I completely agree with you with regards to AmericanClerkship extorting money from helpless IMGs. But to generalize the entire team (at hospital) that worked under her (PD) is a bit immature (in my opinion). Everyone working there (hospital) (including the residents/sub I/nurses/janitors) are hard working individuals and to claim any association with the establishment as "kissing your dreams goodbye" is a bit premature at this stage.

Everyone is entitled to their opinion (so are you). This is how I perceive this situation. I am not here to argue with you. Just posting my views on this situation. Have an awesome day everyone and to those who have worked at Larkin. It's okay, do not panic about it (that's my take on it).

Another piece of advice to everyone new here. Listen to Rokshana. He/She knows what they he/she is talking about.

 

[worthyimg]

Step1: 217
Step2: 216
Step2CS: Pass
All of them first attempt
YOG 2016
2 observerships 4 weeks each, 2 good LORs, one from a faculty profesor
IMG visa needed,
applied last year to 70 programs, no interviews
Should I stay or should I go?

 

[azetronam]

Step1: 217
Step2: 216
Step2CS: Pass
All of them first attempt
YOG 2016
2 observerships 4 weeks each, 2 good LORs, one from a faculty profesor
IMG visa needed,
applied last year to 70 programs, no interviews
Should I stay or should I go?

give step 3, get more usce(preferably externships), research

 

[batmanisreal88]

give step 3, get more usce(preferably externships), research

and definitely apply to a lot more programs.

 

[Bobbbyyyy]

Step1: 217
Step2: 216
Step2CS: Pass
All of them first attempt
YOG 2016
2 observerships 4 weeks each, 2 good LORs, one from a faculty profesor
IMG visa needed,
applied last year to 70 programs, no interviews
Should I stay or should I go?

as mentioned above, + connections; doing observerships/research at hospitals with IM programs, tell people that you know to contact PD's for you

 

[Virgo32]

as mentioned above, + connections; doing observerships/research at hospitals with IM programs, tell people that you know to contact PD's for you

And, you know what how hard it is to get connections. I tried a lot but it's not easy. I was reading that yesterday, so if someone applies from overseas and they don't have a connection. means the dream is over. I know connections are important but again it's hard to get into the program. And LORs, I called and emailed every doctor I worked with, no one responded back. I know they are super busy. But they said yes to me about LOR, and now no answer. Really worried.

 

[batmanisreal88]

And, you know what how hard it is to get connections. I tried a lot but it's not easy. I was reading that yesterday, so if someone applies from overseas and they don't have a connection. means the dream is over. I know connections are important but again it's hard to get into the program. And LORs, I called and emailed every doctor I worked with, no one responded back. I know they are super busy. But they said yes to me about LOR, and now no answer. Really worried.

Connections are built during the observership/externship one does. It helps to have residents on your side (thats my take on it). Even with good scores and no US clinical experience, things may get choppy.

If Dr s who have pledged to write you a LOR but are not responding now. I highly recommended to seek their attention a bit more ......... vigorously.

The above advice in no way means you (Virgo) are not doing it nor am I insinuating anything. I am generalizing it for everyone.

 

[Bobbbyyyy]

I've gotten shafted on LORs on more than one occasion, even this cycle, LORs will be my weak point once again, unfortunately, other than reminding the docs, not much more one can do
the way i see it, if you're VISA requiring you need either strong scores or good connections, there's just too much competition otherwise
I'm not sure how difficult it is to get green book rotations, I'm applying to one obs position atm with my fingers crossed, we'll see

sorry, my past few posts have been a bit gloomy, just trynna keep it real, we need to be pro-active

 

[rokshana]

That’s why you have to ask a number of people for LoRs...that way if someone flakes on you, you still have enough to meet the requirements

I think I asked 8 people, got 6 , and used 4. Back then, they were written letters and I did everything to make it as easy a process as possible...had a paired fed ex envelope, letterhead paper...heck I even gave them a blue pen!
And I check back with them on a regular basis...be nice and not too pushy about it.

And bobbbyyy is right , you have to be pro active...all through the season.

 

[likeplum]

Hey guys first time posting here
Visa requiring IMG (1st red flag)
YOG Dec 2019 applying this cycle
One remediation exam preclinical year with subsequent pass, otherwise academic history is ok, 1st quartile (2nd red flag)
Step 1 245
Step 2 257
Step 2 cs pass
Step 3 not taken
All 1st attempt
4 months hands on US elective
4 US LORS (1 is strong, others unsure)
Average volunteering and work experience
2 years of research in med school, no publication but has submitted peer review journal as co-author, also one case report submitted
Planning to apply to around 190 programs

Should I address my remediation exam in my PS?
What are your opinions on how this might adversely affect my application (e.g being screened out)?
Would appreciate your feedbacks!

 

[Newonehere]

Hi, non US IMG here, my credentials are:
Step 1 : 240
Step 2 : 261
Cs : pass , first attempt
Step 3 not taken but gonna take in sep
YOG : 2017
4 pubs, 1 pubmed indexed. And also 1 pending,
2 IM lors- US
1 FM lor- US
1 IM home country lor
applying for IM, can anyone please tell me what are my chances of matching? I am applying widely but preference is texas programs :| too high a dream?
Any help will be appreciated.
Also, my budget is limited.so applying in upto 110-120 prog.

 

[rokshana]

Hey guys first time posting here
Visa requiring IMG (1st red flag)
YOG Dec 2019 applying this cycle
One remediation exam preclinical year with subsequent pass, otherwise academic history is ok, 1st quartile (2nd red flag)
Step 1 245
Step 2 257
Step 2 cs pass
Step 3 not taken
All 1st attempt
4 months hands on US elective
4 US LORS (1 is strong, others unsure)
Average volunteering and work experience
2 years of research in med school, no publication but has submitted peer review journal as co-author, also one case report submitted
Planning to apply to around 190 programs

Should I address my remediation exam in my PS?
What are your opinions on how this might adversely affect my application (e.g being screened out)?
Would appreciate your feedbacks!

Pre clinical...I wouldn’t worry about it.

 

[rokshana]

Hi, non US IMG here, my credentials are:
Step 1 : 240
Step 2 : 261
Cs : pass , first attempt
Step 3 not taken but gonna take in sep
YOG : 2017
4 pubs, 1 pubmed indexed. And also 1 pending,
2 IM lors- US
1 FM lor- US
1 IM home country lor
applying for IM, can anyone please tell me what are my chances of matching? I am applying widely but preference is texas programs :| too high a dream?
Any help will be appreciated.
Also, my budget is limited.so applying in upto 110-120 prog.

Texas is not that I/fmg friendly...apply to all the programs, esp the ones that have IMGs but make sure you have others as back up... would up applications to at least 150... if you get a 10% return then you have a safe number of interviews

 

[rickgrimes]

How important is ECFMG certification at the time of application? Is your application considered incomplete and do some programs just filter you out if you’re not ECFMG certified at the time of application?
I just graduated but ECFMG says the process for verification of my diploma and certification will take a while, and I’m likely to not be ECFMG certified by September 15.
Also ERAS website says that they will update any changes in ECFMG status automatically. Is there any point in emailing programs about the change in status. Any help on this matter will be appreciated.

 

[Bobbbyyyy]

How important is ECFMG certification at the time of application? Is your application considered incomplete and do some programs just filter you out if you’re not ECFMG certified at the time of application?
I just graduated but ECFMG says the process for verification of my diploma and certification will take a while, and I’m likely to not be ECFMG certified by September 15.
Also ERAS website says that they will update any changes in ECFMG status automatically. Is there any point in emailing programs about the change in status. Any help on this matter will be appreciated.

I had this concern last year as I didn't get my ECFMG cert. till Nov. I think most programs don't care, their websites state: applicant must be ECFMG cert by "x date" usually by like Feb - June is what I've seen most often.
A minority of programs I think do care about ECFMG cert. by application submission time, I called one program coordinator last year she said their filter criteria sometimes excludes all who are not ECFMG currently cert'ed.
But I believe most programs don't care, as long as you've got your CS and CK results before applying, which is more important.

I wouldn't email programs once you get ECFMG cert'ed because it usually doesn't play a huge factor when one gets cert'ed for most programs.

 

[rokshana]

This comes up every year...

Realize that if I/FMGs had to be certified to participate in the match, then no current 4 th year would be able to participate since Ecfmg certification requires a medical diploma...and they won’t have it until well after March.

To participate in the match, you must have steps 1,ck, and cs passed by ROL otherwise you will be withdrawn from the match. Many programs will want these done before offering an interview so it is best to have these done by the time eras opens.

Frankly if a program truly wants Ecfmg certification done before offering an interview, they aren’t really interested in having I/FMGs at their program and this is there way of filtering them out.

Maybe search first then ask these types of questions?

 

[yurtboat]

Hi guys

Wishing everyone the very best of luck this year, particularly the people on here that I know from last year. So may ups and downs, I ended up matching to my third choice after being in my opinion slightly hard-done-by by my #1 (politics, politics). Right now I couldn’t be happier and think I dodged a bullet with my original choices. I have to pinch myself at times, I’m so in love with my program and my classmates. It’s been a really fun 3 months!


I’ve been getting a lot of DMs asking for advice - so here’s everything I know!
I’m writing this on my phone so please forgive the many errors and rambling structure. Make sure your application is literally flawless, not a single typo, also get a professional headshot taken, submit your application as early as possible. Please get an American to read your PS, don’t use any European, Indian or any other terms about your background that aren’t easily understood by Americans.

The bad news is a lot of programs are becoming less visa friendly, I saw some pretty bad visa “discrimination” last year, some stellar applicants going down to their 4th and 5th choices, and in one case not matching. If you’re a greencard holder or you’re a US IMG I think it’s good times for you.

Organize your interviews as early as you can - the weather gets worse and worse, causing flight cancellations etc. January is pretty horrific for travel. Also you might get some last minute interview offers - I got my biggest name in mid January, it was a 100% IMG interview day and clearly a way of them insuring themselves, one girl did actually match from that day though which was great! Don’t underestimate how bad living in a bad location is, really can make for a sucky 3 years, and if a program has a bad rep be cautious, there are some nasty programs out there, particularly on the east coast.

Fly on Southwest or Delta, avoid spirit, allegiant etc unless you’ve no choice. For your big international flight to the US, see if you can use a frequent flier number from a US airline - this equals a lot of points. Fork out a few extra dollars to stay near the interview spot, often you’ll save money this way, especially if they have an airport shuttle, instead of cheaping out and getting stung with a steep Uber bill. Call hotels and ask if they have an iron and ironing board in the room, you’ll need that! Ideally use booking.com and you’ll get every 11th night free, or look for other loyalty programs. Staying loyal to airlines also pays off. Never set foot on American soil without travel insurance. Don’t eat crap on the road - you will look and feel like it.

Know about the program before your interview, tell the PD why you think you’re a good fit and what you love about them. Tell them how you’re going to leverage their program to get into x fellowship. Go to the pre-interview dinners if possible, don’t talk about your other interviews at these events - there’s always someone blowing on about how they just interviewed at such and such, not a likable trait.

Dress better than you’ve ever dressed in your life. Bring a small shoe polishing kit. Blue shirts are better than white shirts. If you have a suit you should bring it to a tailor and ask them if they can fit it better - fit is everything, and a refitting is reasonably cheap.

My step 1 score was lower but I’d a decent step 2. I had good success targeting programs that had a low step 1 cutoff and a higher step 2 cutoff. For example cutoffs of 200 for step 1 and 220 or 230 for step 2..... there’s only a handful, do your research.

That’s all I have. Best of luck! There’s one user on here who posts every year being nasty to people and it seems to be no different this year - best to ignore (honestly get a life).

 

[Virgo32]

@
yurtboat
very helpful post. Thank you so much. I have similar scores. if you don't mind, can you please share your YOG? did you require a visa and what about USCE?

 

[rickgrimes]

I had this concern last year as I didn't get my ECFMG cert. till Nov. I think most programs don't care, their websites state: applicant must be ECFMG cert by "x date" usually by like Feb - June is what I've seen most often.
A minority of programs I think do care about ECFMG cert. by application submission time, I called one program coordinator last year she said their filter criteria sometimes excludes all who are not ECFMG currently cert'ed.
But I believe most programs don't care, as long as you've got your CS and CK results before applying, which is more important.

I wouldn't email programs once you get ECFMG cert'ed because it usually doesn't play a huge factor when one gets cert'ed for most programs.

Thanks!

 

[micromd]

In case you all missed it, links to interview spreadsheets here

 

[Koronerarter]

Hi Guys,

Good luck to everytone applying this year...

I am also applying IM,

USIMG
YOG 2015
Step 1 212
Step 2 236
CS 1st attempt pass
Step 3 221

I was previously an ER physician...

thinking about applying 200 places to be sure... very nervous about the process...

I have about 5 letters from US physicians, cardiology, pulmonology, rheumatology, only IM...