Internship interview question - is disclosing you are a parent the kiss of death?

[iheartbacon]

I realize that there are many traditional students and admitting you have children has been seen as somewhat taboo for job interviews. This question is for past internship applicants and anyone at training sites who are involved in selecting applicants: For past applicants, did you disclose that you are a parent? If so, did you see any disadvantage in doing so? For those that select interns, are people considered less desirable candidates if they are parents?

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[WisNeuro]

I realize that there are many traditional students and admitting you have children has been seen as somewhat taboo for job interviews. This question is for past internship applicants and anyone at training sites who are involved in selecting applicants: For past applicants, did you disclose that you are a parent? If so, did you see any disadvantage in doing so? For those that select interns, are people considered less desirable candidates if they are parents?

Honestly can't remember parental status ever coming up in a ranking meeting. Shoe choice, yes. Being a parent or not, no. Not saying it doesn't happen, just that I haven't seen it in a decade-ish of intern and postdoc selection meetings.

 

[R. Matey]

I realize that there are many traditional students and admitting you have children has been seen as somewhat taboo for job interviews. This question is for past internship applicants and anyone at training sites who are involved in selecting applicants: For past applicants, did you disclose that you are a parent? If so, did you see any disadvantage in doing so? For those that select interns, are people considered less desirable candidates if they are parents?

I made a reference to it in my autobiographical statement. During interviews, the TD for one particular site went on a rant about how hard of a time I would have finding childcare. I didn't rank them and I still got my first choice.

 

[Big5Club]

I realize that there are many traditional students and admitting you have children has been seen as somewhat taboo for job interviews. This question is for past internship applicants and anyone at training sites who are involved in selecting applicants: For past applicants, did you disclose that you are a parent? If so, did you see any disadvantage in doing so? For those that select interns, are people considered less desirable candidates if they are parents?

I knew several folks who were parents and/or were pregnant during internship interviews. None of them had any difficulty matching. In fact, they all matched at their 1st or 2nd ranked site. One of my friends even brought it up during interviews to assess their attitudes towards women with children. Keep in mind that yes you want to match, but you also want to work with folks who are going to be supportive and understanding.

 

[erg923]

I realize that there are many traditional students and admitting you have children has been seen as somewhat taboo for job interviews. This question is for past internship applicants and anyone at training sites who are involved in selecting applicants: For past applicants, did you disclose that you are a parent? If so, did you see any disadvantage in doing so? For those that select interns, are people considered less desirable candidates if they are parents?

This would be grossly unethical, and I imagine most psychologist TDs and committee members would realize this basic fact and are indeed decent humans.

This is just part of people management in the normal world. It is just how life works, obviously, so it would be ridiculous (not to mention borderline illegal) to entertain a denial for this reason. Even the US military bends backwards to accommodate parenthood.. and their sole mission is to maintain "a ready and effective war-fighting force." I think this kind of thinking mostly went out years and years ago.

 

[Mama Bear]

I remember being concerned about this issue. I’ve always been the sort of person, though, who enters interviews with an “it’s none of their business “ stance. So I did not disclose that I had a kid during internship interviews. When I interviewed for jobs the following year, I had a baby and was nursing. I had to disclose that I needed scheduled breaks for pumping. I reframed it as “if they don’t like it, I wouldn’t want to work for them anyway.” I like this stance better, but it’s a personal choice. Several people have replied that it’s not a huge deal, which is encouraging. Considering the sheer number of people who have children, it seems asinine to discriminate based on this. Stranger things have happened though.

 

[bluecolourskies]

I wasn't ever asked if I was a parent, but I was asked "if you were to break an ethical standard, which one would you most likely break" lol and an intern in the group before me had a baby during internship, and took like 2 months off, and my site was accomodating in making sure she still finished. I couldn't imagine them not being supportive of someone, and it was a top notch site!

 

[Psychchick09]

I realize that there are many traditional students and admitting you have children has been seen as somewhat taboo for job interviews. This question is for past internship applicants and anyone at training sites who are involved in selecting applicants: For past applicants, did you disclose that you are a parent? If so, did you see any disadvantage in doing so? For those that select interns, are people considered less desirable candidates if they are parents?

I was very open about being a parent during interviews, because I needed time/space to pump. I matched at my #2 but none of the places I interviewed at seemed to have any problem with it. Honestly, if it had been the kiss of death at a place, I wouldn’t have wanted to work at that place!

 

[Newropsych]

I wasn't ever asked if I was a parent, but I was asked "if you were to break an ethical standard, which one would you most likely break" lol and an intern in the group before me had a baby during internship, and took like 2 months off, and my site was accomodating in making sure she still finished. I couldn't imagine them not being supportive of someone, and it was a top notch site!

This is similar to someone in my intern cohort when I was on internship. This person was pregnant and had her baby like 3 weeks before we started internship. Our TD/site was very accommodating and let her start a couple months later and finish them with the next intern cohort. There were also parents in our cohort who would talk about it openly and it never seemed to be a problem.

 

[beantownpsych]

Several applicants have mentioned they are parents during interviews/in their application. I like it when this happens because then I can discuss the resources we have available for parents and the ways in which we struggle (e.g., we typically have onsite daycare availability, pumping facilities, but cannot offer insurance coverage for significant others/dependents during the internship year w/o significant expense to the intern). Parenthood has never been part of the discussion at ranking meetings-- I honestly can't remember a time when this has even been raised. We have had several parents in our internship program.

 

[Indiana_Jane]

I disclosed I am parent in my interview with my top site. Ended up matching there! It’s also a government site and they’ve been very accommodating. I’m glad I talked about it in my interview.

 

[Justanothergrad]

I think its less of a matter about it being a 'kiss of death' in terms of how you are viewed and more of a kiss of death for internship sites if/when they show themselves not to be accommodating. Everyone I've known with kids didn't rank sites that showed less humanity in this area, but still did great. Personally, I'd be open and make sure YOU get what YOU need during YOUR training year

I was asked "if you were to break an ethical standard, which one would you most likely break"

Oh man. That's a hell of a question.

 

[WisNeuro]

I think its less of a matter about it being a 'kiss of death' in terms of how you are viewed and more of a kiss of death for internship sites if/when they show themselves not to be accommodating. Everyone I've known with kids didn't rank sites that showed less humanity in this area, but still did great. Personally, I'd be open and make sure YOU get what YOU need during YOUR training year


Oh man. That's a hell of a question.

1.01 Misuse of psychologists work. In a broader sense, it happens often, especially if you have a decent amount of publications. I've seen more than a handful of places where my work has been cited, where it was clear that they did not read, and/or completely misinterpreted the paper. Early in my career, I wrote a few notes to the journal editors. Nothing ever comes from it, and no one has the time to police it when they have multiple publications with decent citation counts.

 

[PsyDr]

1) The ONLY unique thing in internship is getting the signature that allows you to graduate. That is the point. The remaining factors co-occur in practica.

2) In weighing the options of self disclosure, it would seem that the risks outweigh the benefits. The affinity research has taught us that people like factors that are similar to them, or factors that benefit them. We also assume that people project their own assumptions, in ambiguous situations. If you have information that the interviewer is similar to you or would benefit from your situation, then disclosure is in your interest. If you don't, then ambiguity is your friend. There is a reason that analysts avoided self disclosure.

 

[CheetahGirl]

I have four children and have had them all before & during my training. ❤️

I actually never disclosed that I had them (and one internship supervisor only learned I had kids upon my exit interview). It was no one's business, never got in the way of me doing my job, and was also not going to be an obstacle in the workplace if I never disclosed. So, this was my choice. However, everyone who works with me now, knows of my big, ornery but happy family, and I am now more comfortable sharing bits of personal life versus when I was in training. BTW: I matched at my first choice for internship, but I think it's because I was hyper-focused on being their ideal candidate (so a good, solid match!) & I scheduled that interview last and treated all before as 'dress rehearsals.' It was a VA, which was an incredible training experience, and I had very little problems (outside of normative coping & the exponential growth curve of internship & parenting) to maintain my caseload and home-life, with a ton of help, of course.

 

[Justanothergrad]

1.01 Misuse of psychologists work. In a broader sense, it happens often, especially if you have a decent amount of publications. I've seen more than a handful of places where my work has been cited, where it was clear that they did not read, and/or completely misinterpreted the paper. Early in my career, I wrote a few notes to the journal editors. Nothing ever comes from it, and no one has the time to police it when they have multiple publications with decent citation counts.

Not sleeping with clients? 😉

 

[WisNeuro]

Not sleeping with clients? 😉

My average clinical patient is like 70-something with a host of health conditions. If I am going to break ethical guidelines as well as state law, I'm going to make it worth it. And that ain't worth it. 🙂

 

[Sanman]

My average clinical patient is like 70-something with a host of health conditions. If I am going to break ethical guidelines as well as state law, I'm going to make it worth it. And that ain't worth it. 🙂

 

[forensic13]

Agreed with what most of the others have said. I disclosed being a parent during internship interviews, mostly because part of what I was looking for was a program/group of supervisors who were supportive of interns who were parents and an area that was family friendly. I told almost all of my sites, and matched with my number 1. FWIW, I also told postdoc sites about being a parent.

 

[iheartbacon]

I wasn't ever asked if I was a parent, but I was asked "if you were to break an ethical standard, which one would you most likely break" lol and an intern in the group before me had a baby during internship, and took like 2 months off, and my site was accomodating in making sure she still finished. I couldn't imagine them not being supportive of someone, and it was a top notch site!

Oh man! That is definitely not a question I would like to have to answer 😆 Thank you for sharing all of this!

 

[iheartbacon]

I have four children and have had them all before & during my training. ❤️

I actually never disclosed that I had them (and one internship supervisor only learned I had kids upon my exit interview). It was no one's business, never got in the way of me doing my job, and was also not going to be an obstacle in the workplace if I never disclosed. So, this was my choice. However, everyone who works with me now, knows of my big, ornery but happy family, and I am now more comfortable sharing bits of personal life versus when I was in training. BTW: I matched at my first choice for internship, but I think it's because I was hyper-focused on being their ideal candidate (so a good, solid match!) & I scheduled that interview last and treated all before as 'dress rehearsals.' It was a VA, which was an incredible training experience, and I had very little problems (outside of normative coping & the exponential growth curve of internship & parenting) to maintain my caseload and home-life, with a ton of help, of course.

This is amazing to hear! I have four kids too - all born during grad school. Big families are great! So glad to hear about your positive experience at the VA - I have applied to three myself. Thanks for sharing!

 

[iheartbacon]

Thank you, everyone, for your input about this. I do realize this is an ethical/legal issue too, but so many women I have known have experienced this in their lives that it was definitely on my mind. So glad to hear it is not generally a concern at present with matching. To all who celebrate, I hope you have a wonderful Thanksgiving (and to all who don't, have a wonderful week!)!

 

[iheartbacon]

I remember being concerned about this issue. I’ve always been the sort of person, though, who enters interviews with an “it’s none of their business “ stance. So I did not disclose that I had a kid during internship interviews. When I interviewed for jobs the following year, I had a baby and was nursing. I had to disclose that I needed scheduled breaks for pumping. I reframed it as “if they don’t like it, I wouldn’t want to work for them anyway.” I like this stance better, but it’s a personal choice. Several people have replied that it’s not a huge deal, which is encouraging. Considering the sheer number of people who have children, it seems asinine to discriminate based on this. Stranger things have happened though.

That is such a good point - that if a site would look at me differently as a parent that maybe that is not the site for me. Thank you for sharing!

 

[SCallergydoc]

As the hiring partner for my practice, I am not allowed to ask if someone has kids---illegal. Not sure about school interviews but residency is a job so think the same would apply. If they applicant mentions it I document this clearly in my notes and go from there.

 

[WisNeuro]

As the hiring partner for my practice, I am not allowed to ask if someone has kids---illegal. Not sure about school interviews but residency is a job so think the same would apply. If they applicant mentions it I document this clearly in my notes and go from there.

Actually, at least as of several years ago, interns did not meet FLSA criteria for "employees" under DoL rules. Unless that's changed, I wonder if they have the same protections from a technical sense.

 

[InternMama]

In case it is of use, here is a thread I created where something similar was discussed earlier this year: Giving birth shortly before internship - seeking interview/ranking advice. Best wishes in this process!! Feel free to DM if I can be of help.

 

[iheartbacon]

In case it is of use, here is a thread I created where something similar was discussed earlier this year: Giving birth shortly before internship - seeking interview/ranking advice. Best wishes in this process!! Feel free to DM if I can be of help.

Thank you so much for sharing this! I found it incredibly helpful. I will be sending you a message. Thanks again!

 

[Dr_Bee]

I had all 3 of my kids while in grad school. Although folks have cited ethics/legal issues etc. with altering ranks orders lists based on parenthood/pregnancy etc. we also know that we all have implicit biases. I chose not to risk it and intentionally delayed applying for internship because I did not want to be visibly pregnant during interviews (this was pre covid, so it may be less of an issue now). I did allude to having children in my autobiographical essay, but did not indicate how many or their ages (all 4 and under during the internship application process) as I thought that may play a role in how folks viewed me. As others have mentioned I did not want to be in a place that did not respect work/life balance, but was also encouraged by multiple mentors to mention having children in a subtle way, and not overly gush about my kids. Without getting on a soap box, I think this of raises lots of issues surrounding perception of women as parents in the workforce vs. men and how they are perceived. I had a great experience on internship and once I matched was able to be very open about having kids, but I was similarly careful during post doc interviews and am still careful in how I talk about my children during interviews for jobs etc. For all the folks that have said "it's not an issue," I appreciate their confidence. I am perhaps less confident in human nature and didn't want to leave to chance.