Internships and Low GPA

[pirateslayme]

Hey I have a question regarding applying for internships. I am going back and forth about whether I should apply for one. I really like the idea of an extra year of mentorship esp since I feel like I am not going to be one of those super confident new grads. I don't like the idea of lower pay but I am willing to put up with it for the right fit. I honestly think this wouldn't be as much of a question at this point if it wasn't for my super low GPA.

I am going into small animal and have no intention of specializing. My GPA is very low. Full disclosure is it is a 2.72. I did not do great my first two years and part of that is because I am just a bad test taker. I studied a lot but could never get more than a B or C on tests. I started to improve last year once I hit clinics and I think my last semester GPA was around a 3.2ish (still not great but better).

Right now I am rotating at a place I could see myself doing an internship. I think the doctor I am with would write me a recommendation if I asked. This doctor also helps with the match process and I know she will rank me low based on GPA but I am hoping of I have good letters of rec that will help me.

My question is is it even worth applying with this GPA? Again I have no intention of specializing and I would be totally fine applying to less competitive internships if I get good mentorship and wouldn't be doing slave labor. Please be honest...I can take it lol.

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[JaynaAli]

I personally think that if you don't plan to specialize, internship is a waste of time. The kind of cases I saw as an intern were so vastly different than those my friends in GP managed. I think if you are careful about where you apply and really find a good GP fit with a good mentor, that's just as good or more likely even better than being paid peanuts to work up complex specialty cases and see ER patients. All that is beside the point of your GPA...which as much as I hate to say I feel would be prohibitive to the internship anyway. I struggled to pull my GPA up to a 3.2 and I got very few interviews. The vast majority of places would just toss my application because I was under their arbitrary 3.5 cutoff. That's not to say it is impossible, but if you have that low of a GPA and are on the fence about internship anyway, I wouldn't bother and focus your efforts on finding the right GP. I know at my current academic institution they don't even bother reviewing applicants with a GPA lower than their cutoff, so they wouldn't even get to your letters of rec. They have so many applicants they have to start making cuts somewhere, which sucks for those of us who had/have lower GPAs.

 

[pinkpuppy9]

Hey I have a question regarding applying for internships. I am going back and forth about whether I should apply for one. I really like the idea of an extra year of mentorship esp since I feel like I am not going to be one of those super confident new grads. I don't like the idea of lower pay but I am willing to put up with it for the right fit. I honestly think this wouldn't be as much of a question at this point if it wasn't for my super low GPA.

I am going into small animal and have no intention of specializing. My GPA is very low. Full disclosure is it is a 2.72. I did not do great my first two years and part of that is because I am just a bad test taker. I studied a lot but could never get more than a B or C on tests. I started to improve last year once I hit clinics and I think my last semester GPA was around a 3.2ish (still not great but better).

Right now I am rotating at a place I could see myself doing an internship. I think the doctor I am with would write me a recommendation if I asked. This doctor also helps with the match process and I know she will rank me low based on GPA but I am hoping of I have good letters of rec that will help me.

My question is is it even worth applying with this GPA? Again I have no intention of specializing and I would be totally fine applying to less competitive internships if I get good mentorship and wouldn't be doing slave labor. Please be honest...I can take it lol.

I also have a low GPA (disclaimer: Illinois has a vastly different grading system than any other school and we are very much deflated here, but my number is still low) so I get your concerns. I'm planning to try the match myself. As long as you're realistic with your expectations/goals, you'll be okay. Typically the top 50% of any class will match no problem, so knowing your class rank will tell you where you stand. Last year, the internship match was 64%. Not too bad, especially if you rank smart.

Taking Jayna's advice into account re: whether you should bother with an internship or not...:

With your GPA, I wouldn't expect to get ranked/waste a rank on an academic rotating internship or the super competitive private practice spots. I've known a few people with GPAs similar to ours, and they have had to scramble since they ranked all academic institutions/popular internships. Others with lower GPAs have matched no problem. Private practices will probably be your best bet, but you run the risk of jumping into a lesser known program that treats their interns like crap (not to say a popular program wouldn't, but you're more likely to be able to find that out beforehand). Most places favor applicants that have visited, too.

 

[pirateslayme]

Thank you both for your responses. I have heard from people that even if you are going into GP an internship will make you a better doctor. On the other hand I have seen people not do an internship and they are just fine. I definitely have no intention of applying to an academic institution since I don't plan to specialize. This is a lot to think over.

 

[DVMDream]

Thank you both for your responses. I have heard from people that even if you are going into GP an internship will make you a better doctor. On the other hand I have seen people not do an internship and they are just fine. I definitely have no intention of applying to an academic institution since I don't plan to specialize. This is a lot to think over.

If you are going into GP, your best bet is to start in GP. An internship will get you comfortable with ER and let you rotate through all the specialties again but isn't going to do jack crap for how to monitor that Cushing's dog, how to monitor/manage the fractious diabetic cat without breaking the bank, what flea/tick prevention is available and best for each patient (seriously they add a new one of these every 3 months or so it seems), how to examine/diagnose/treat for $25 or less, probably won't help you much with basic dental prophylaxis and simple extractions, etc. GP is unique in itself and the best way to experience it is by working in GP.

Trust me, you will learn just fine jumping straight into things and you will be no less of a doctor than those who did an internship. And you will make significantly more than going through an internship. Don't waste possibly $70k in salary to do an internship prior to working GP.

 

[VetMedSurvivalGuide]

Having a low GPA doesn't mean that you won't match. The single most important factor is having great letters of recommendation. I've seen many students with GPAs of 4 that could not function in clinics. I've also seen many students with low GPAs that are amazing doctors. If you have great letters your GPA might not even be looked at. This obviously depends on the institution, and some definitely have a random GPA cut off. One of the rationales is that some of these individuals will have a much harder time passing boards.

 

[DPolaris]

Sorry for tagging onto this/"hijacking" - if I am unsure of specializing, but through volunteering, shadowing, rotations and visits think I'd enjoy working as an ER vet for at least a few years until perhaps starting a family makes the ER schedule/lifestyle not as ideal, would an internship be beneficial? I know there are emerg/specialty hospitals that hire fresh grads to work ER right out the gates, but also some hospitals where you must have an internship (not ECC, just a rotating) in order to work as an ER doctor for them. Thanks!

 

[pinkpuppy9]

Sorry for tagging onto this/"hijacking" - if I am unsure of specializing, but through volunteering, shadowing, rotations and visits think I'd enjoy working as an ER vet for at least a few years until perhaps starting a family makes the ER schedule/lifestyle not as ideal, would an internship be beneficial? I know there are emerg/specialty hospitals that hire fresh grads to work ER right out the gates, but also some hospitals where you must have an internship (not ECC, just a rotating) in order to work as an ER doctor for them. Thanks!

It would probably depend on the internship. If you're wanting an internship solely to get ER experience before being an ER practitioner, not all rotatings get you that much ER time. Illinois as their interns on ER a lot, other places might just have you on for a few weeks out of the year.

@LetItSnow talked to me about this a while back because I had a similar question regarding starting out in ER as a new grad vs. internship (he's an ER doc). He may have more input.

 

[Packen]

Sorry for tagging onto this/"hijacking" - if I am unsure of specializing, but through volunteering, shadowing, rotations and visits think I'd enjoy working as an ER vet for at least a few years until perhaps starting a family makes the ER schedule/lifestyle not as ideal, would an internship be beneficial? I know there are emerg/specialty hospitals that hire fresh grads to work ER right out the gates, but also some hospitals where you must have an internship (not ECC, just a rotating) in order to work as an ER doctor for them. Thanks!

I was actually on SDN looking for some other resources and came across this. I did a private practice internship that turned out to be 75% ER (supposed to be 50%). My plan was to do ER if I didn't match to a residency. I really do think it would have helped me be a better ER doc if I went that route. I don't know where you are located, but there are ER internship-type programs out there where they pay more but you get better mentorship (PM me if you want more info, I'm studying for boards right now so may not respond super quick). My SO is working at an ER where there is ZERO mentorship and new grads get lost a bit. Yet, when they are brought on they are promised lots of help/guidance/etc. In hindsight there were some red flags: high vet turnover (surprisingly low tech turnover), seasoned vets staying on average 3-5 hours after their shifts, things like that. One of my internmates actually left a very similar toxic situation to replace another internmate when she was a new grad. My advice would be that you can find a good ER for a new grad with mentorship, but be very careful. Internships, especially established ones, may have better support. And there are in between options too like I mentioned above. Good luck!

 

[DPolaris]

Thanks for the help @pinkpuppy9 and @Packen, I will PM you Packen and LetItSnow so I don't clutter up this thread! Thanks again

 

[VetMedSurvivalGuide]

Sorry for tagging onto this/"hijacking" - if I am unsure of specializing, but through volunteering, shadowing, rotations and visits think I'd enjoy working as an ER vet for at least a few years until perhaps starting a family makes the ER schedule/lifestyle not as ideal, would an internship be beneficial? I know there are emerg/specialty hospitals that hire fresh grads to work ER right out the gates, but also some hospitals where you must have an internship (not ECC, just a rotating) in order to work as an ER doctor for them. Thanks!

As it was mentioned above, it really will depend on the internship. Anyone considering an internship and looking at programs should contact the current interns. They will tell you the good, bad and ugly of the program! Simply contact the internship program director if you can't find the emails on the institution's website.

 

[mpc2wv]

As it was mentioned above, it really will depend on the internship. Anyone considering an internship and looking at programs should contact the current interns. They will tell you the good, bad and ugly of the program! Simply contact the internship program director if you can't find the emails on the institution's website.

This is a slight tangent, but do you have an idea where to find out who the internship program directors are? I have not been able to find it on the VIRMP website or certain school's websites and would like to schedule meetings with them for the programs I am visiting in person before the match.

 

[VIN-Foundation]

This is a slight tangent, but do you have an idea where to find out who the internship program directors are?

The contact information is in the program description on the VIRMP site. I think it's called something like "Authorized Adminsitration Offiical". That's who you contact for any interviews and so on. Realize at this point, not all programs are listed yet. So if you are looking for a program that you can't find, they may not have uploaded their program description yet.

 

[mpc2wv]

Thank you for your help, that explains it!

 

[VetMedSurvivalGuide]

This is a slight tangent, but do you have an idea where to find out who the internship program directors are? I have not been able to find it on the VIRMP website or certain school's websites and would like to schedule meetings with them for the programs I am visiting in person before the match.

As mentioned above, every program has an email contact listed. If you can't find the current intern emails, this is your backup plan.

 

[Dirk.]

So update? Did you apply and did you get in? I’ll be in the same situation as you this year. And I’m kind of scared because I want to specialize. I just dont know if my GPA will let me.

Hey I have a question regarding applying for internships. I am going back and forth about whether I should apply for one. I really like the idea of an extra year of mentorship esp since I feel like I am not going to be one of those super confident new grads. I don't like the idea of lower pay but I am willing to put up with it for the right fit. I honestly think this wouldn't be as much of a question at this point if it wasn't for my super low GPA.

I am going into small animal and have no intention of specializing. My GPA is very low. Full disclosure is it is a 2.72. I did not do great my first two years and part of that is because I am just a bad test taker. I studied a lot but could never get more than a B or C on tests. I started to improve last year once I hit clinics and I think my last semester GPA was around a 3.2ish (still not great but better).

Right now I am rotating at a place I could see myself doing an internship. I think the doctor I am with would write me a recommendation if I asked. This doctor also helps with the match process and I know she will rank me low based on GPA but I am hoping of I have good letters of rec that will help me.

My question is is it even worth applying with this GPA? Again I have no intention of specializing and I would be totally fine applying to less competitive internships if I get good mentorship and wouldn't be doing slave labor. Please be honest...I can take it lol.

D