Introducing yourself to patients on rotations...

[Quix]

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I've been hanging out in the non-trad forum, and there are a few of us who have earned Ph.D.'s before applying to medical school. Clearly we aren't M.D.'s, but we aren't Mr.'s or Ms.'s, either. Further, we don't want to confuse patients, or waste their time explaining the situation, so...

On the off chance that we're admitted, what is the etiquette when rounding, introducing yourself to patients, etc.?

EDIT: To complicate matters a bit, my Ph.D. (Health Care Ethics) had two years of clinical rotations, so we aren't talking about a Ph.D. in English or Musicology, here.

 

[efex101]

You introduce yoursel as Hi, I am so and so a third year medical student.

 

[Quix]

Hey, that works. 😉

 

[Mr. McDuck]

Um...why aren't you a Mr. or a Ms.? Last time I checked, those are valid salutations in the US.

 

[velo]

"doctor" from a person in a white coat, with a stethoscope around their neck, in a hospital= doctor of medicine. period.

if you're not yet an MD, just say, "Hi, I'm [first name, last name] I'm the medical student on the team"

 

[Dr JPH]

"doctor" from a person in a white coat, with a stethoscope around their neck, in a hospital= doctor of medicine. period.

if you're not yet an MD, just say, "Hi, I'm [first name, last name] I'm the medical student on the team"

I agree.

 

[Mr. McDuck]

I still don't understand why Mr. or Ms. X is unacceptable, even if you want to qualify it with the obligatory "the 3rd year medical student".

 

[Nerdoscience]

I think people are neglecting the fact that, even though there is reason to reserve the term, "Doctor" for medical doctors (MDs AND DOs), people who have PhDs DID EARN A DOCTORATE!!!! I feel this gets forgotten. I always used my first name to introduce myself, and am having a really hard time getting used to introducing myself as Dr. so-and-so.

 

[MattD]

Sure, a Ph.D. earned a doctorate, so yes, they've earned the right to be called Dr. That's fine at the grocery store if your ego is so inclined to insist on it. However, in the clinic, introducing yourself as Dr. So-and-so is equivalent to introducing yourself as So-and-so, M.D. If you're not an M.D., you're lying to your patient, because you KNOW that's what they think you mean. I have a lot of respect for Ph.D.'s, I know they've worked hard, but frankly I find it amazingly arrogant for someone to think that because they CAN be called Dr., they're somehow above being called Mr. or Mrs. My response would probably be to tell someone to get over themselves. If you're a male, you're a Mr. If you're a female, you're a Mrs. (or a Ms.). If you're in the clinic, and you're not an M.D., leave the Dr. affectation at the door. This is just my opinion, of course.

 

[KaukaEllsworth]

I think people are neglecting the fact that, even though there is reason to reserve the term, "Doctor" for medical doctors (MDs AND DOs), people who have PhDs DID EARN A DOCTORATE!!!! I feel this gets forgotten. I always used my first name to introduce myself, and am having a really hard time getting used to introducing myself as Dr. so-and-so.

Maybe "doctor" should be reserved only for PATIENT settings. In all other settings, PhDs are entitled to it. After all, they have spent over seven years trying to earn the title, after their name.

 

[Mr. McDuck]

This is what we're talking about--patient care settings. If you introduce yourself to the chief of surgery as Dr. So-and-so and you're a PhD, it won't hurt anything really (although, you might get talked about later). If you introduce yourself as Dr. So-and-so to a patient, you are most likely violating a hospital/clinic rule, misleading the patient, and opening yourself up for a lawsuit--no joke.

If you want to introduce yourself to patients as Dr. with a PhD, get it in psychology and open your own practice.

 

[KaukaEllsworth]

This is what we're talking about--patient care settings. If you introduce yourself to the chief of surgery as Dr. So-and-so and you're a PhD, it won't hurt anything really (although, you might get talked about later). If you introduce yourself as Dr. So-and-so to a patient, you are most likely violating a hospital/clinic rule, misleading the patient, and opening yourself up for a lawsuit--no joke.

If you want to introduce yourself to patients as Dr. with a PhD, get it in psychology and open your own practice.

To introduce yourself to a chief of surgery, it would be more than fine. This individual is not a patient and you are entitled to do so. We are talking about two doctorate level professionals. Even in medical school, the admissions officers and professors referred to our Phd classmates as "doctor." Reality check. We are not the only individuals entitled to the title.

 

[Mr. McDuck]

Uh...I said that if you introduce yourself to the chief of surgery, nothing would happen; I used that as a contrast to what would happen if you introduced yourself like that to a patient. You're debating something that isn't an issue. Get over yourself.

 

[Mr. McDuck]

Obviously, I'm not about to check every state's laws, but I'm sure most--if not all--states have a law similar to this:

45:9-18. Who regarded as practitioners

Any person shall be regarded as practicing medicine and surgery, within the meaning of this chapter, who shall use the words or letters "Dr." , "doctor" , "professor" , "M. D." , or "M. B." in connection with his name...

If you want to introduce yourself as Dr. So-and-so to patients, go to medical school.

 

[efex101]

At my school we do not introduce ourselves are Mr./Mrs./Ms. we go by our first name and make sure they know whe are X year medical students in X or Y team.

 

[Sean2tall]

Ah, this is an interesting question. As far as the PhD goes, I can't think of anything more than what's been said. It would be deceptive to just say "Hi, I'm Dr. Smith," and leave it at that.

So far on my rotations, I have been introducing myself as Sean and not thinking much of it. Recently some of the chief residents have been introducing me as "student doctor Last Name," which I am starting to think is the best situation. Going by only a first name, while all the doctors are known mainly by last names seems less professional, as though you were just shadowing or something along those lines. I seem to recall having read somewhere that patients (particularly older ones) feel more comfortable with a "student doctor" rather than a "med(ical) student."

 

[Nerdoscience]

Whoa, I'm shocked at the lack of respect from some people at the long-standing tradition and hard work involved in PhDs and other people with doctorates earning the title doctor. I agree that it is confusing and therefore inappropriate to use the term in a hospital, but come on guys.

And that's not a law saying you can't be called a doctor if you're not a physician. It's a clarification of terminology within a law equivalent to saying, "Bob Smith, a single man, is the buyer of this property, and will henceforth be referred to as, 'the buyer'" in a deed to a house. That doesn't mean that there is a law forbidding you from calling yourself a buyer. Nice try.

 

[Nerdoscience]

Here's another question: What if you are a PhD, and you are actually there in the role of a PhD? Say you are a specialist in some disease, and are there to talk to the patient and family. Then, what do you call yourself? Mr/Ms/Mrs is obviously wrong, but Dr. is still confusing. In med school, using your first name flies, but not in this circumstance.

And on an unrelated note, who the ---- calls themself a doctor in a grocery store????

 

[velo]

Whoa, I'm shocked at the lack of respect from some people at the long-standing tradition and hard work involved in PhDs and other people with doctorates earning the title doctor. I agree that it is confusing and therefore inappropriate to use the term in a hospital, but come on guys.

And that's not a law saying you can't be called a doctor if you're not a physician. It's a clarification of terminology within a law equivalent to saying, "Bob Smith, a single man, is the buyer of this property, and will henceforth be referred to as, 'the buyer'" in a deed to a house. That doesn't mean that there is a law forbidding you from calling yourself a buyer. Nice try.

No one has disrespect for PhDs, what in god's name are you talking about???

Is it unreasonable to say that a patient should be able to safely assume that if they're in the hospital and someone in a white coat walks in their room and introduces themselves as "doctor" they mean doctor of medicine? jeez...

its moot anyway, most of the time patients don't understand and call you doctor anyway and even residents and interns regularly refer to you as anything from "med student" to "student doctor" to "another doctor." Still though, as a matter of semantic principle, in a clinical setting doctor=doctor of medicine. end of story

 

[Mr. McDuck]

Finally, someone with some goddamn sense. Velo has just said what I've been trying to say. No one is arguing that PhDs cannot call themselves doctor or haven't earned the title. We're saying that it is unethical/deceptive/illegal to use the title Dr. or Doctor in a patient care setting where you would be mistaken for an MD/DO. Christ.

 

[efex101]

I agree with the two above posts....from reading this thread NOBODY has been disrespectul of those holding a Ph.D. I am not sure where you got that notion from? All the posters were driving at is that in a hospital setting it is best to leave the "doctor" for those with an MD so as not to confuse patients.

 

[loveumms]

How about not worrying about what you will introduce yourself as during clinical rotations until you get into medical school.

Wow, before I got in all I was worried about was where I was going to get accepted. Then, I was worried about getting through first year - then second - then boards .... so on so forth. No sense in getting all worked up about something that is still a long ways off (since your applying for the 2007 admission).

 

[fab4fan]

I don't see what's wrong with a psychologist who has a PhD being referred to as "Dr." in the clinical setting.

 

[KaukaEllsworth]

Psychologists are doctors because they have earned a doctorate. A Psyd or a PhD is no less of a doctorate than an MD. It takes longer to get a PhD (more than four years) than it does an MD. In clinical psych, a residency after obtaining the doctorate is necessary to obtain a license.

I know about the PhD. I have gotten one before going to medical school.

 

[KaukaEllsworth]

Here's another question: What if you are a PhD, and you are actually there in the role of a PhD? Say you are a specialist in some disease, and are there to talk to the patient and family. Then, what do you call yourself? Mr/Ms/Mrs is obviously wrong, but Dr. is still confusing. In med school, using your first name flies, but not in this circumstance.

And on an unrelated note, who the ---- calls themself a doctor in a grocery store????

This is interesting. You really have a point here.

 

[Chronic Student]

First off, no one wrote anything derogatory about PhD's and I did not even detect a tone of disrespect.

Secondly, most people would be confused with a PhD calling themselves doctor. Not many people in this forum would, but Joe Blow might have a much harder time.

If you are there in a clinical capacity it might be more acceptable. However, it still may confuse the patient and could become a legal issue if the patient decides to sue for some reason and I would think that the risk management people at your hospital would go bananas if they found out you were doing it.

-Mike

 

[Quix]

How about not worrying about what you will introduce yourself as during clinical rotations until you get into medical school.

Wow, before I got in all I was worried about was where I was going to get accepted. Then, I was worried about getting through first year - then second - then boards .... so on so forth. No sense in getting all worked up about something that is still a long ways off (since your applying for the 2007 admission).

First, I did note that this was a hypothetical, dependent upon admission before it came up. Second, this isn't causing worry or anxiety - I just think it's an interesting question. I think it makes eminent sense to be introduced as "student doctor" or some other iteration thereof. Last, I'm just as panicked about Saturday's MCAT and worried about admissions as everyone else clamoring to get in.

 

[Mr. McDuck]

I don't see what's wrong with a psychologist who has a PhD being referred to as "Dr." in the clinical setting.

Depends on the clinical setting. Are you seeing a patient in your office? That isn't a problem. If you are in a hospital where there are MDs and DOs running around, however, most patients will assume you are an MD/DO if you just say Dr. So-and-so. If you use the qualifier "psychologist" as in "I'm Dr. So-and-so, the psychologist", then you don't have a problem.

Psychologists are doctors because they have earned a doctorate. A Psyd or a PhD is no less of a doctorate than an MD. It takes longer to get a PhD (more than four years) than it does an MD. In clinical psych, a residency after obtaining the doctorate is necessary to obtain a license.

I know about the PhD. I have gotten one before going to medical school.

I'm happy for you. However, that doesn't change the fact that A) it's illegal unless you qualify it with "...the psychologist" or something along those lines, and B) misleading and opening you up for a potential lawsuit.

 

[Nerdoscience]

Ok, I just don't get how I can agree with everyone in bold, and still get posts saying I'm not agreeing with them. Should I have tried something else?

All I'm saying is that some of you are bringing up supposed laws, or saying the people with doctorates should introduce themselves as Mr or Ms. If you were an MD, and you were at a University lecturing where everyone is called Doctor because they have PhDs and are professors, would you obligatorily introduce yourself as Mr or Ms? I seriously doubt that these same people would do that.

So, out of curiousity, when is it ok to be called Doctor in the health care setting?
1) MD in a clinical role
2) DO acting as an allopathic provider
3) DDS general practice dentist
4) DDS maxillofacial surgeon
5) PsyD or PhD psychologist
6) PhD expert with clinical duties
7) PhD expert with non-clinical role
8) MD with non-clinical role
9) DO acting as on osteopathic provider
10) Chiropractor
11) NP with a PhD in health sciences

Where do you draw the line? And did you know that surgeons in many countries under the British medical system are referred to as Mr and Ms?

 

[Nerdoscience]

Depends on the clinical setting. Are you seeing a patient in your office? That isn't a problem. If you are in a hospital where there are MDs and DOs running around, however, most patients will assume you are an MD/DO if you just say Dr. So-and-so. If you use the qualifier "psychologist" as in "I'm Dr. So-and-so, the psychologist", then you don't have a problem.



I'm happy for you. However, that doesn't change the fact that A) it's illegal unless you qualify it with "...the psychologist" or something along those lines, and B) misleading and opening you up for a potential lawsuit.

Dude, it's not illegal. You are totally misreading that. For someone who has a doctorate to call themselves Dr. So-and-so is NOT illegal in any state that I know of. What you're missing in that statute is the phrase, "within the meaning of this chapter." It's a freakin' clarification of legal terminology, not a law saying what you think it is.

What it's saying is that, in that statute, which you only gave a short snippet of, they will use the word "Doctor" to mean a physician who is a practicing medical doctor of some sort as defined in the paragraph

 

[Chronic Student]

I think that most people on this thread have tried to be very civil about the OP's question and some posts have been very argumentative with most of what the posters have stated.

Is this thread supposed to be for honest feedback or not?

Anyway, thats just my opinion, yours may differ.

-Mike

 

[Nerdoscience]

Okay, this thread is getting too heated. Maybe everyone, especially myself, should step back and try some low-dose Diastat to calm down. I know it doesn't have an indication for that, but hey, it might displace this d--- stick I seem to have up my... up there... too.

Deep breath.... Ahhhhhhh

 

[Mr. McDuck]

First of all, I think you're the only one that needs to calm down.

Secondly, I never said it was illegal to call yourself Dr. in general. Obviously if you want to write that on your checks or start an office with Dr. Blah on the shingle, that's fine.

I said that it was a violation of state statute (and yes, I used the term "illegal", perhaps improperly) to use the title Dr. or Doctor without a qualifier such as "chiropractor" or "psychologist".

But, the point I was trying to get across was that it opens you up for a lawsuit because it is misleading patients. This isn't some willy-nilly thing; in fact, I believe most hospitals actually have a bylaw/rule/code/whatever regarding this very thing.

As far as the "snippet" goes, the statute isn't much longer than that, and it just goes into detail as to what representing yourself as an MD/DO means (i.e., you're asserting that you can perform surgery, diagnose medical conditions, treat said conditions, etc.). I wasn't about to post all that stuff, since it wasn't important.

 

[Nerdoscience]

I just can't seem to help myself. I really just wanted to drop this one, but I couldn't. I apologize to all the people who are aggravated by this, or don't give a ----. Yes, this is a few steps too far.

I found the statute for the state of NJ. It's a state board of medical examiner's statute, to begin with, and simply states that if you claim to be a physician and to practice medicine, you must actually be one.

Emphasis mine, weird punctuation theirs.

Any person shall be regarded as practicing medicine and surgery, within the meaning of this chapter, who shall use the words or letters '"Dr.", "doctor", ""professor", ""M.D.", or ""M.B." in connection with his name, or any other title intending to imply or designate him as a practitioner of medicine or surgery in any of its branches, and who, in connection with such title or titles, or without the use of such titles, or any of them, holds himself out as being able to diagnose, treat, operate or prescribe for any human diseases, pain, injury, deformity or physical conduction, or who shall either offer or undertake by any means or methods to diagnose, treat, operate or prescribe..."

Paraphrased: Anyone who calls themselves something that sounds like a physician AND (this is important) either tries to treat or says they are able to treat an illness as a physician, must actually be a physician. The intent of this statute is crystal clear if you read the whole thing: to prevent faith healers and other "practitioners" from calling themselves physicians if they are not.

If your reading were right, it would be "illegal" or whatever you want to call it, to call yourself a professor unless you were a medical doctor, too.

My opinion on the whole matter, and my final word, and then I'm getting back to my life, and not this trivial sh--:

Introduce yourself as whatever you want. It would be confusing to call yourself Doctor if you are not a medical doctor or dentist, so probably a bad idea. You can go by Mr or Ms, but I know of few people who are comfortable with that after they have their doctorates. How many MDs would go by Mr or Ms at a University? You've got to figure out what you are comfortable with. In the end, it's your call. Anyone who says anything different is either a lawyer, or shouldn't matter to you.

Now, can't we all just get along?

 

[Chronic Student]

I'm a little confused as to exactly who you are fighting and/or disagreeing with.

Are you stating that you should be able to introduce yourself as doctor?

Are you stating that it is not illegal to do so in a clinical setting?

Are you frustrated because you feel you should be accorded some extra respect over and above what any other medical student would get?

I'm not saying that you're coming off as egomaniacal, but some might read it that way.

I fully understand that you are very proud of your degree and the hardwork you have done to get there.

The points that people were bringing up were that is might be confusing, may or may not be illegal, would surely give a lawyer something to sink their teeth into and could certainly be against institutional policy.

It's a free country and you can do what you want, we were just voicing our opinions.

-Mike

 

[KaukaEllsworth]

I'm a little confused as to exactly who you are fighting and/or disagreeing with.

Are you stating that you should be able to introduce yourself as doctor?

Are you stating that it is not illegal to do so in a clinical setting?

Are you frustrated because you feel you should be accorded some extra respect over and above what any other medical student would get?

I'm not saying that you're coming off as egomaniacal, but some might read it that way.

I fully understand that you are very proud of your degree and the hardwork you have done to get there.

The points that people were bringing up were that is might be confusing, may or may not be illegal, would surely give a lawyer something to sink their teeth into and could certainly be against institutional policy.

It's a free country and you can do what you want, we were just voicing our opinions.

-Mike

It is not considered extra respect. It is a respect that is well deserved. We went to school double the time it takes to get an MD. It is the same respect that you would want when you become an MD.

When I was a medical student, those of us that earned phd's were referred to as "doctor." Although, the admissions advisor and faculty members referred to us in this manner, we still went by our first names. But, the point is that we were respected for our hard work.

 

[Chronic Student]

What is with you people?

You have obviously not read what I wrote. I would think that if you have a PhD than you should be able to read.

Please show me where I said you were not entitled to respect. I seem to remember that I mentioned "I fully understand that you are proud of your degree and the hardwork you've done to get there."

I think I did mention the thing about respect over and above any other medical student as a question for nerdoscience.

There is a difference in-between asking a question and making a statement, don't you agree?

Your ego is showing!

-Mike

 

[dara678]

I think when people get accepted to med school everyone is given a fresh start, a blank slate. It's great that some people got more education before the rest of us did, but that doesn't make them superior to other students in terms of being part of the health care team. As such, on clinical rotations I think it might behoove you to show yourself as a team player and call yourself by your name like the rest of us lowly third years. Not to mention the fact that saying you're a doctor to your patient is wholly misleading, as they will think that you are their medical doctor, and saying that "Hi, my name is dr. so and so but i'm not an md i'm a phd, i got it before med school" is wholly a waste of time.

 

[MattD]

And on an unrelated note, who the ---- calls themself a doctor in a grocery store????

My point exactly 🙂

 

[MattD]

Ok, I just don't get how I can agree with everyone in bold, and still get posts saying I'm not agreeing with them. Should I have tried something else?

All I'm saying is that some of you are bringing up supposed laws, or saying the people with doctorates should introduce themselves as Mr or Ms. If you were an MD, and you were at a University lecturing where everyone is called Doctor because they have PhDs and are professors, would you obligatorily introduce yourself as Mr or Ms? I seriously doubt that these same people would do that.

So, out of curiousity, when is it ok to be called Doctor in the health care setting?
1) MD in a clinical role
2) DO acting as an allopathic provider
3) DDS general practice dentist
4) DDS maxillofacial surgeon
5) PsyD or PhD psychologist
6) PhD expert with clinical duties
7) PhD expert with non-clinical role
8) MD with non-clinical role
9) DO acting as on osteopathic provider
10) Chiropractor
11) NP with a PhD in health sciences

Where do you draw the line? And did you know that surgeons in many countries under the British medical system are referred to as Mr and Ms?

I think the key difference in thinking among some of the posters here is that some are concerned with the title of Dr. as an indicator of prestige, or respect, or something they deserve, while the others are concerned with the title of Dr. from the standpoint of how it's use in a clinical setting affects the patient. In other words, people arguing that anyone with a Ph.D. should be able to go by that title anywhere they are, even in patient care settings (and I'm not saying anyone on here has made that extreme of a statement), are concerned with their own rights and prestige. The ones arguing against it are concerned with keeping down patient confusion. As far as the question about the psychologist with the clinically based Ph.D., the dividing line is on what the individual is doing. If they are seeing a patient as a psychologist, Dr. is perfectly acceptable. If they are a med student who just happens to have the Ph.D., they shouldn't be using Dr. while on rounds, as it misleads the patient into thinking you have a role that you don't really have. Remember, the patient doesn't think of the title Dr. as an academic distinction, they see it as an indicator of the person who knows how to diagnose and treat their disease.

 

[efex101]

I do not think that anyone here is concerned about prestige, trust me, that went out the window after year one of medical school. Nobody here has stated that Ph.D have NOT earned their hard earned right be called Dr., and I DO call any Ph.D that I know of as Doctor but NOT in clinical settings. There are Ph.D's here at my hospital ranging from psychologists to doctors in pharmacy so we are used to this situation. Most introduce themselves by their first name in the IN-PATIENT CLINICAL SETTING. Now, I am not sure how they go about this in their "area" where they usually work at aka the pharmacy or seeing patients as out-patients. So again to reiterate what I have gathered from ALL the posts.....Ph.D's have certainly earned every bit the right just as
we have to be called doctors, all of us have the utmost respect for all of our colleagues to include anyone with a Ph.D or not, in in-patient clinical setting so as not to confuse our patients we reserve the doctors for physicians....

 

[NY Musicologist]

EDIT: To complicate matters a bit, my Ph.D. (Health Care Ethics) had two years of clinical rotations, so we aren't talking about a Ph.D. in English or Musicology, here.

I certainly don't want to provoke additional vitriol on this thread, but I have to say--as perhaps the only musicologist on SDN--that I laughed at the (likely unintentional) insinuation that Ph.D.s in English or Musicology (or any other humanities discipline) are somehow less challenging to earn or less meritorious of an accomplishment than a Ph.D. with any number of years of clinical rotations attached...

As a Ph.D. musicologist, I will never expect to be addressed as "Dr." by anyone but my undergraduate students. (And even this is considered old-fashioned by some.) (Not that I'm planning on continuing to teach after becoming an MD!)

As a medical student, I will introduce myself as "[first name, last name], [x]-year medical student"...

 

[Quix]

No denigration implied - my friends who've earned Ph.D.'s in English and Musicology would lynch me for that suggestion. I was simply noting that so that it was clear there was a significant clinical component to the degree.

 

[NY Musicologist]

No denigration implied - my friends who've earned Ph.D.'s in English and Musicology would lynch me for that suggestion. I was simply noting that so that it was clear there was a significant clinical component to the degree.

And no genuine offense taken. But my dad is a chemistry prof and I've heard him make so many disparaging remarks about people who specialize in anything other than the "hard sciences" (and biologists too, for that matter) that I'm always on guard against similar prejudice from other science types! 🙄

 

[KaukaEllsworth]

As a former med student, I always went by my first name.

We have psychologists employed at our hospital and they are always referred to as "doctor" by everyone. Patients do know, well maybe not all the low functioning ones, that clinical psychologists conduct psychological testing, make diagnoses and provide treatment. Even in outpatient settings, whether or not in front of patients, we've always referred to psychologists as doctors.

 

[Quix]

And no genuine offense taken. But my dad is a chemistry prof and I've heard him make so many disparaging remarks about people who specialize in anything other than the "hard sciences" (and biologists too, for that matter) that I'm always on guard against similar prejudice from other science types! 🙄

I think it's really interesting to be in the humanities first and then go into the sciences - I've found I have an entirely different attitude towards them and towards medicine. Have you had a similar experience?

 

[ANCAdoc]

You know, quite a few patients also don't understand why we get paid so much. Perhaps we should cut our pay.

I find the "patients dont understand" argument to be less than appealing.

 

[Hard24Get]

Argh, this thread is making me crazy! I am a MD-PhD student returning to clinics, and I don't feel like a 'doctor'. My attending friends who are MDs go by the first name and only use the term "doctor" for their patient's sake (now I know why most MDs and PhDs say, 'call me [first name]". Truth be told, after all the trouble one goes through to become a doctor, it is quite embarassing to be CALLED "doctor" for most of us.

If you are stuck-up and want to be called "doctor", introduce yourself as "Doctor [last name], the medical student". Later you will be "Dr.[last name], the resident, or attending". The important thing is to state your role in the hospital when you introduce yourself, what title you go by is up to you. The only people OBLIGATED to go by Dr are MDs and DOs, as many patients are anxiously waiting to see the doctor. Patients are confused, anyway, and even if you never call youself doctor, over half of them will call you doctor, no matter how much you protest 😕 .

The end. Can't this thread just die???

I think the key difference in thinking among some of the posters here is that some are concerned with the title of Dr. as an indicator of prestige, or respect, or something they deserve, while the others are concerned with the title of Dr. from the standpoint of how it's use in a clinical setting affects the patient. In other words, people arguing that anyone with a Ph.D. should be able to go by that title anywhere they are, even in patient care settings (and I'm not saying anyone on here has made that extreme of a statement), are concerned with their own rights and prestige. The ones arguing against it are concerned with keeping down patient confusion. As far as the question about the psychologist with the clinically based Ph.D., the dividing line is on what the individual is doing. If they are seeing a patient as a psychologist, Dr. is perfectly acceptable. If they are a med student who just happens to have the Ph.D., they shouldn't be using Dr. while on rounds, as it misleads the patient into thinking you have a role that you don't really have. Remember, the patient doesn't think of the title Dr. as an academic distinction, they see it as an indicator of the person who knows how to diagnose and treat their disease.

 

[Nerdoscience]

I'm a little confused as to exactly who you are fighting and/or disagreeing with.

Are you stating that you should be able to introduce yourself as doctor?

Are you stating that it is not illegal to do so in a clinical setting?

Are you frustrated because you feel you should be accorded some extra respect over and above what any other medical student would get?

I'm not saying that you're coming off as egomaniacal, but some might read it that way.

I fully understand that you are very proud of your degree and the hardwork you have done to get there.

The points that people were bringing up were that is might be confusing, may or may not be illegal, would surely give a lawyer something to sink their teeth into and could certainly be against institutional policy.

It's a free country and you can do what you want, we were just voicing our opinions.

-Mike

Well, I, as an MD, do go by Doctor. It took a few weeks to get introducing myself by my first name out of my system, but I did it. I mean in the hospital by the way, not the grocery. As someone who never considered getting a PhD, except maybe in Linguistics, I certainly don't think I'm showing excessive pride for this non-existant degree. Note I never claimed otherwise, and have done nothing but state how I feel, and give evidence toward or against the claims made and opinions expressed on this page.

And amen to your last line. As nasty as this thread got, that's exactly what most of us did. Voice our opinions. And I feel all the better for seeing what other people thought about the matter.

 

[Nerdoscience]

My point exactly 🙂

I got called, "Doctor" at Walgreens the other day, and did a double-take.

Reaction 1: Who the he11 were they talking to?
Reaction 2: How did they find out I was a doctor? It's like they know my secret identity.
Reaction 3: Oh, it says I'm a doctor on my insurance card. Damn
Reaction 4: Okay, now I'm a doctor, so don't say anything dumb.

Very sad.