Is anyone else besides me just applying to DO schools?

[Kuba]

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Interesting..we'll have to test that theory....I tend to not believe it.

🙂

 

[Orthodoc40]

👍 don't be ashamed of that. I also like OMM (i would say "philosophy", but thats kind of bogus) but there are more factors in a med school than that, and each school has to be evaluated individually. People here get really defensive, but don't let that influence you.

True enough, Dr K! And thanks for that!
One thing I really like about the DO forums is for the most part, I think people posting here are more reasonable and down to earth. 🙂

 

[jkhamlin]

Chiropractic is not an illegitmate offshoot of osteopathic medicine.

I was originally going to use the term bastard, but I thought that would be taken too harshly.

The fact is that Chiro is an illegitimate offshoot of Osteopathy. The founder of Chiropractic, Daniel David Palmer, was a magnetic healer and snake oil salesman. He became a patient of AT Still and shortly thereafter somehow pulled the idea of skeletal manipulation out of nowhere if we are to believe the revisionist histories on Chiro web sites.

I'm not going to say it never happens, but largely, DO's don't send patients to Chiros. They just don't need to.

 

[MJB]

Test currently in progress! 🙂

My wife and I made the decision to apply to each of the schools I've applied to for unique and specific reasons.

There are others that I'd love to apply to (DO), but they wouldn't be best for the both of us.

 

[jkhamlin]

Test currently in progress! 🙂

My wife and I made the decision to apply to each of the schools I've applied to for unique and specific reasons.

There are others that I'd love to apply to (DO), but they wouldn't be best for the both of us.

So I take that to mean that you are applying to Mizzou, and you don't have anything going for you other than a pulse and ability to cast a shadow. 😛

 

[czanetti]

Why not SUNY Buffalo?

SUNY Buffalo is not a DO school now is it????

There lies the reason

How is anyone able to tell if someone is geniuine about anything? Most people lie on a daily basis its part of human nature to make yourself look better than you really are. Honestly I don't care what others think because usually those that are so judgmental are those that are the most insecure. Yet they hide there insecurity by being errogant jerks. I choose to be a DO I could have done either My stats would allow me to have a better chance of getting into DO but what pushed me over to DO was OMM and the premise of a different school of thought. I liked that it was a minority in the healthcare system. Read Osteopathic Medicine a reformation in progress and I think you might understand my reasoning a little better.

 

[MJB]

So I take that to mean that you are applying to Mizzou, and you don't have anything going for you other than a pulse and ability to cast a shadow. 😛

Applied
MCAT less than 30
GPA less than 3.5
Cast a much bigger shadow than I care to
I have a pulse and am breathing
I have the "pleasure" of living in this state.

We'll see.

 

[DropkickMurphy]

Applied
MCAT less than 30
GPA less than 3.5
Cast a much bigger shadow than I care to
I have a pulse and am breathing
I have the "pleasure" of living in this state.

We'll see.

I used to work at Mizzou.....luckily I decided to put myself out of my Missouri.

 

[jkhamlin]

Applied
MCAT less than 30
GPA less than 3.5
Cast a much bigger shadow than I care to
I have a pulse and am breathing
I have the "pleasure" of living in this state.

We'll see.

You'll probably get in. They automatically interview if your MCAT is above 26, and they have no minimum GPA or MCAT requirement. Also, their grading is pass/fail. I have seen them accept people with pretty shakey stats. Good luck.

 

[jkhamlin]

I used to work at Mizzou.....luckily I decided to put myself out of my Missouri.

🙄 Funny.

 

[jkhamlin]

Well, the MD vs DO flamers managed to hijack this thread off topic, and I have been as guilty as anyone of feeding the trolls, so I will try to return it to the orginal topic.

I am only applying DO. Not as a second option, but the only option for me. For those that want to be MD's, more power to you, it's just not for me. I want to be a doctor as much as anyone (and I will be), but to me being a doctor means being a DO.

 

[DO 4 life]

Well, the MD vs DO flamers managed to hijack this thread off topic, and I have been as guilty as anyone of feeding the trolls, so I will try to return it to the orginal topic.

I am only applying DO. Not as a second option, but the only option for me. For those that want to be MD's, more power to you, it's just not for me. I want to be a doctor as much as anyone (and I will be), but to me being a doctor means being a DO.

I totally agree. For me I can't another way of healing. The philosophy and OMM instantly sold me. Southwestern Medical school in Dallas, TX is a competitive Texas M.D. school. Recently they started offering OMM, but not to the degree it is taught in DO schools. The DO I shadowed said that he went to an MD residency. His attending eventually asked him to teach him OMM. I think soon people will begin to see the positive benefits of DO and OMM on a larger scale.🙂

 

[Kuba]

Well, the MD vs DO flamers managed to hijack this thread off topic, and I have been as guilty as anyone of feeding the trolls, so I will try to return it to the orginal topic.

I am only applying DO. Not as a second option, but the only option for me. For those that want to be MD's, more power to you, it's just not for me. I want to be a doctor as much as anyone (and I will be), but to me being a doctor means being a DO.

i dont think theres been much flaming at all...
it's just a misunderstanding I think between the people that applied to both and the ones who only applied DO

 

[Yes_I_DO]

Quote:
Originally Posted by slb
Umm... just so you know, Catholics are Christians.

Umm... just so you know, DO's are physicians. I think the analogy works well.

Oh yeah! I was right...don't confuse me, lol 😎

 

[Yes_I_DO]

I applied to both MD and DO schools from the beginning. Truthfully, the reason I began to look at osteopathic medicine was because of my MCAT score. However, after researching it extensively I fell in love with the philosophy. I spent some time talking with DOs and decided that this is what I wanted to do with my life. For years I have wanted to go into neurology and follow in my father's footsteps, but over the last year or so of my life I have decided that my true calling is rural family medicine. I am happy that I got the MCAT score I did because I honestly don't know that I would have looked in osteopathic medicine if I had not. I feel that it was fate. I am not trying to offend anyone by this statement, but the truth is that I had not looked at osteopathic medicine because I had not been educated about what it has to offer. My whole life I have been surrounded by MDs and knew very little about osteopathy. That said, I did apply to some MD schools based on their location. But, I truly would choose osteopathic medicine over allopathic anyday and will definitely take DCOM over everything else! (I love that school and I want to practice in Appalachia because I was born there, my mother is from there, I still have family there, and I know that I will make a difference to the people there.) I have no doubt in my mind that I could retake the MCAT and get at least a 30. There were a lot of things going on in my life that affected my academic and MCAT performance. I have four children and at the time I took the MCAT I had a 3 month old baby and was sleep deprived and nursing her while trying to study, go to classes, and take care of the rest of my family. I had not taken organic chemistry before taking the MCAT. I also had chronic Lyme disease with neurocognitive involvement to the point I was almost disabled. (Seriously, it was REALLY bad! I could't remember what side of the car my gas tank was on, etc.) Anyway, I believe that things happen for a reason and I believe that everything that has occured over the last few years has been to direct me towards becoming a DO and practicing rural family medicine. I hope this does not offend anyone who has been hardcore DO from the start. It is not meant to. It is only meant to reply to the above comment. I wish everyone the best of luck and truthfully believe that it does not matter whether a person is an MD or a DO or where they went to medical school. Those are not the things that make people a great doctor, but only a difference of opinion and individual preferences. What makes someone a great doctor is what is in their heart and how they treat their patients. If someone attends a medical school and does well and gets into a decent residency program, then they can be the doctor they want to be in the end. I wish everyone the best of luck in whatever path they choose to follow!

Thank you. I think that is beautifully stated. I never said that I expected people to always have been DO or bust from the beginning. I also never said that you shouldn't apply to both MD and DO at the same time. I only wish that IF you are going to apply DO, even if you dont agree with everything in the "philosophy" (maybe thats too touchy-feely for you), AT LEAST respect what it is, where it comes from, and what it stands for.

 

[Kuba]

Thank you. I think that is beautifully stated. I never said that I expected people to always have been DO or bust from the beginning. I also never said that you shouldn't apply to both MD and DO at the same time. I only wish that IF you are going to apply DO, even if you dont agree with everything in the "philosophy" (maybe thats too touchy-feely for you), AT LEAST respect what it is, where it comes from, and what it stands for.

👍 i like that statement

 

[DropkickMurphy]

Well, the MD vs DO flamers managed to hijack this thread off topic, and I have been as guilty as anyone of feeding the trolls, so I will try to return it to the orginal topic.

I am only applying DO. Not as a second option, but the only option for me. For those that want to be MD's, more power to you, it's just not for me. I want to be a doctor as much as anyone (and I will be), but to me being a doctor means being a DO.

What exactly do you mean by that? Most of the "off topic" posts were simply disagreeing with the "Isn't the philosophy of actually thinking of the patient as a person great!?" circle jerk you all seem to want to engage in. Now for all you ladies and gentlemen who haven't noticed, allopathic schools also reinforce this point to a great extent now.

 

[jkhamlin]

What exactly do you mean by that? Most of the "off topic" posts were simply disagreeing with the "Isn't the philosophy of actually thinking of the patient as a person great!?" circle jerk you all seem to want to engage in. Now for all you ladies and gentlemen who haven't noticed, allopathic schools also reinforce this point to a great extent now.

Key word: "now."

 

[DropkickMurphy]

And your point being? All organizations should be willing to change and adapt....that's not "selling out" or anything but a good practice. Hopefully you'll learn about the application of this to medicine: it's called evidence based practice.

Need I remind you that the AOA still largely embraces practices ( *cough* cranial *cough* ) that are extremely questionable at best and more likely tantamount to the snake oil referenced earlier.

Oh, and by the way, you do need to remember Still wasn't wandering around outside Kirksville one day and suddenly have the revelation that we should treat our patients as a person, not a transport and support mechanism for the particular system affected by the disease in question. It harkens back to the ancient days of medicine- Hippocrates, Galen, and the other great Greek and Roman physicians nearly all wrote and embraced this philosophy....as did William Osler, who (the last time I checked) was an MD. *looks over at bookshelf for one of Osler's books* Yup, that he was.

 

[jkhamlin]

Blah blah blah blah screed screed BS BS BS...
It harkens back to the ancient days of medicine- Hippocrates, Galen, and the other great Greek and Roman physicians nearly all wrote and embraced this philosophy....as did William Osler, who (the last time I checked) was an MD. *looks over at bookshelf for one of Osler's books* Yup, that he was.

So was AT Still, what's your point?
You are quite ignorant of the history of medicine.

 

[czanetti]

Instead of concentraiting on the differences respect the fact that there are differences but realize what are overall purpose is. Why are there doctors. Each person is different regardless of there degree and percieve the best approach to medicine a little bit differently but we are here to help people, we care, and we want to make a productive difference to improve the livelyhood of those in this world. Lets look at that as appose to what the differences are. Some are Osteopathic Some are Allopathic we are all here to help. No one should look down upon either sect. If they are applying to both so what, if you applying to one or the other you may have your reasons for doing it but there isn't a point to preach why one is right becuase one isn't more right than the other it is based on individual preference. Concentrate on figuring out how you are going to deal with the stresses of medical school not on your pride.

 

[DropkickMurphy]

So he didn't really originate anything did he? (Other than manipulation, which I'm not 100% he came up with that himself, but then again, I honestly give two ****s about WHO thought of it, so long as it works) *NOTE: Sarcasm since you seem to not be able to detect it* 🙄 He simply stood on the shoulders of original thinkers and slapped a new title on it

 

[DropkickMurphy]

Instead of concentraiting on the differences respect the fact that there are differences but realize what are overall purpose is. Why are there doctors. Each person is different regardless of there degree and percieve the best approach to medicine a little bit differently but we are here to help people, we care, and we want to make a productive difference to improve the livelyhood of those in this world. Lets look at that as appose to what the differences are. Some are Osteopathic Some are Allopathic we are all here to help. No one should look down upon either sect. If they are applying to both so what, if you applying to one or the other you may have your reasons for doing it but there isn't a point to preach why one is right becuase one isn't more right than the other it is based on individual preference. Concentrate on figuring out how you are going to deal with the stresses of medical school not on your pride.

Well said.

 

[leviathan]

Something to ponder:

The DO physicians that frequent the EM boards have reported that they rarely, if ever, use OMM or any other unique training they got from their DO schools.

 

[DropkickMurphy]

Something to ponder:

The DO physicians that frequent the EM boards have reported that they rarely, if ever, use OMM or any other unique training they got from their DO schools.

Then they aren't true osteopaths then are they!

 

[leviathan]

I wouldn't be surprised if on average, you would find more difference in philosophy between two randomly chosen MD schools than there are between MD and DO schools as a whole.

 

[leviathan]

You can see how useful that "DO" training really is when you ask DOs how much they actually use that training in practice. It really is just an alternative pathway to being a physician and anyone who thinks they will get some magnificent and innovative training from DO schools is delusional. Don't get me wrong, I have an equal amount of respect for either DO or MD physicians, and I just think they are two different ways to get to the same endpoint. It sounds like a lot of people in here have some sort of inferiority complex because of the public perception of DOs, so they try to overcompensate and blow up DO school to be some fantastic alternative. Relax, guys, we'll all be colleagues in the end.

 

[czanetti]

I agree with you there are many aspects of Osteopathic medicine in which I think agree with me It doesn't mean I'm going to critisize allopathic or shove what drives me to become a DO down anyone else's throat. I think it is a load of **** to think that one is better than the other. THere are differences between the two and they are lagitamit. Weather those that have become DOs decided to utilize those differences is up to the individual some use it as a backdoor but not all. the infiriority complex will create some un needed tension here but it will be a plus when it comes to critisizing one technique or aspect of healthcare compared to another. Aka both ends will keep eachother in check. That I think is good. But otherwise the bull**** in between regarding the differences should not be shoved down anyones throat and no one should feel bad if they applied to both. No bashing should occur on either end its useless it only makes the ass that is trying to defend there argument seem even more like an ass. If you want to be a doctor realize that your job is not all about you.

 

[Taus]

Something to ponder:

The DO physicians that frequent the EM boards have reported that they rarely, if ever, use OMM or any other unique training they got from their DO schools.

Its pretty specialty dependant......talk to DO PM&R, FP, and Sports Medicine docs...there's a reason why many DO's gravitate towards those fields. Whether you want to use OMM or not, some fields just aren't conducive to it.

 

[MJB]

Its pretty specialty dependant......talk to DO PM&R, FP, and Sports Medicine docs...there's a reason why many DO's are gravitate towards those fields. Whether you want to use OMM or not, some fields just aren't conducive to it.

You just listed my biggest reason for applying DO, not to mention I live in the heart of some of the best DO schools around. I've loved what I've seen in the local schools, and would be proud to go to any of them, but one in particular, as I have the most experience with it.

 

[leviathan]

Its pretty specialty dependant......talk to DO PM&R, FP, and Sports Medicine docs...there's a reason why many DO's gravitate towards those fields. Whether you want to use OMM or not, some fields just aren't conducive to it.

No argument here.

 

[czanetti]

Yawn😴

 

[DoctorMom78]

Thank you. I think that is beautifully stated. I never said that I expected people to always have been DO or bust from the beginning. I also never said that you shouldn't apply to both MD and DO at the same time. I only wish that IF you are going to apply DO, even if you dont agree with everything in the "philosophy" (maybe thats too touchy-feely for you), AT LEAST respect what it is, where it comes from, and what it stands for.

I totally agree!!!😀 😀 😀
Can't we all just get along...

 

[brookliner7]

Something to ponder:

The DO physicians that frequent the EM boards have reported that they rarely, if ever, use OMM or any other unique training they got from their DO schools.

yup, these are the MD rejects that got into DO schools.


😛


seriously though, some people actually feel that the osteopathic philosophy and OMT are important in their ability to perform the duties of a great physician.
This is space for people to express that.

 

[Rock Solid]

Has anyone ever considered the following...
What I have been telling people about the DO profession besides the holistic, multi-dimensional aproach to patient care is that ALL DO physicians are trained in the US...in US medical schools.
There is no such thing as The University of Antigua or Samoa for DO medical students . Some of these foreign schools allow for certain individuals (PA, NP, chiropractor, etc) to obtain their MD degree from simply learning the medical school curriculum solely online.
As a current PA, I have to tell you that there are many other options out there for me if I only cared about obtaining the "cherrished" MD title. However, there is more to it than that. I feel strongly about being trained in the US medical schools and residency programs...especially after working with some but not all of the FMGs.
Keep that in your back pocket the next time somene tries to hammer you on the relevance to obtaining a DO degree.

 

[TXLawDOC]

Instead of concentraiting on the differences respect the fact that there are differences but realize what are overall purpose is. Why are there doctors. Each person is different regardless of there degree and percieve the best approach to medicine a little bit differently but we are here to help people, we care, and we want to make a productive difference to improve the livelyhood of those in this world. Lets look at that as appose to what the differences are. Some are Osteopathic Some are Allopathic we are all here to help. No one should look down upon either sect. If they are applying to both so what, if you applying to one or the other you may have your reasons for doing it but there isn't a point to preach why one is right becuase one isn't more right than the other it is based on individual preference. Concentrate on figuring out how you are going to deal with the stresses of medical school not on your pride.

Extremely well said. I am applying exclusively to DO schools. This is not because I don't have the numbers (33R, 3.65 gpa) or because I believe that osteopathy is inherently superior to allopathy. I t is simply because I feel that an osteopathic education is a better "fit" for my goal of practicing rural medicine. I have shadowed/spoken with both primary care DOs and MDs and the DOs (almost unanimously) described an educational pathway that seems designed to produce the kind of physician I want to be. The MDs, on the other hand, described being made to feel like a red-headed step-child (no offense intedned to any actual red-headed step-children 🙂 ) when they informed their classmates of their decison to enter primary care. I know its anecdotal and not all MD schools are like that, but I felt why to worry about that kind of stuff as well as having to put up with the normal pressures of a medical education. Just my 2 cents (or at my current billing rates my $75 😛 )

 

[DragonWell]

I think its great that so many people are all about going only DO, but I don't understand the "heartbreak", "dissapointment", etc that people express when they see people like myself applying to both MD and DO programs. There are distinct advantages to both types of degrees.

To me the problem occurs when a certain segment of people who view DO as "just another way to become a physician" suddenly find themselves sitting in an OMM classroom for 4 hours a week for 2 years. Give this situation about two weeks and it begins, "OMM isn't based on research...why do we have to learn something that isn't proven?" and "I want to do such and such specialty where I'll never use it; why do I have to learn all this?".

Most premeds will say or do almost anything to get that acceptance letter (reference the famous "foot-long" thread in pre-allo if you don't believe me), but once you are actually in school things can start to look a little different. That "learning OMM" part of being a DO which didn't seem like a big deal can start to seem like a pain. That's too bad, because there are people out there - ie many of the people who applied DO only, who would greatly appreciate the opportunity to be sitting in that OMM lab.

Anyone that is applying should do their homework enough to have some realistic expectations: by and large OMM is unproven; you will spend a significant amount of time over two years learning something that statistically speaking, you are likely not to ever use; and whatever philosophical differences exist between MD/DO are debatable. If you know DO is a good fit for you, go for it. Probably anyone savvy enought to be reading this thread already knows this stuff.

Now granted, if you have the interest, learning basic OMM is not that hard (actually it's lot of fun), nor does it require that much time, but if you honestly have zero interest in it and are not open to learning anything about it, then please don't go to one of the relatively few medical schools in the US where it is taught.

/End Tirade 😀

 

[jkhamlin]

To me the problem occurs when a certain segment of people who view DO as "just another way to become a physician" suddenly find themselves sitting in an OMM classroom for 4 hours a week for 2 years. Give this situation about two weeks and it begins, "OMM isn't based on research...why do we have to learn something that isn't proven?" and "I want to do such and such specialty where I'll never use it; why do I have to learn all this?".

Most premeds will say or do almost anything to get that acceptance letter (reference the famous "foot-long" thread in pre-allo if you don't believe me), but once you are actually in school things can start to look a little different. That "learning OMM" part of being a DO which didn't seem like a big deal can start to seem like a pain. That's too bad, because there are people out there - ie many of the people who applied DO only, who would greatly appreciate the opportunity to be sitting in that OMM lab.

Anyone that is applying should do their homework enough to have some realistic expectations: by and large OMM is unproven; you will spend a significant amount of time over two years learning something that statistically speaking, you are likely not to ever use; and whatever philosophical differences exist between MD/DO are debatable. If you know DO is a good fit for you, go for it. Probably anyone savvy enought to be reading this thread already knows this stuff.

Now granted, if you have the interest, learning basic OMM is not that hard (actually it's lot of fun), nor does it require that much time, but if you honestly have zero interest in it and are not open to learning anything about it, then please don't go to one of the relatively few medical schools in the US where it is taught.

/End Tirade 😀

👍 Except for paragraph 3, first sentence, you are right on.