Is going into medicine worth it?

[Hawaiiandoc04]

With physicians making less than they have ever made, there autonomy stripped from them by insurance companies, more and more paper work than ever before, lawsuits left and right, and $150,000+ in debt.... why go into medicine? Besides, medicine really doesn't do much... we have by FAR the most amount of healthcare spending yet one of the LOWEST life expectancies and overall health compared to the other developed countries...And ask one of the 40,000,000 uninsured if they think our health care system is so hot....

-on a side note, I need to get in that amcas app asap!

---

Members don't see this ad.

 

[IndyZX]

"we have by FAR the most amount of healthcare spending yet one of the LOWEST life expectancies and overall health compared to the other developed countries..."

our life exp. is around 77 years, that's not totally awful.


"With physicians making less than they have ever made"

also... people have this misconception that physicians dont make enough money. they are still the highest paid profession in america, and nowhere else in the world are doctors as wealthy.

 

[gramcracker]

Originally posted by Hawaiiandoc04
Is going into medicine worth it?

I sure hope so, or I'm pretty screwed.

 

[nirvana23]

Originally posted by Hawaiiandoc04
Re: Is going into medicine worth it?

Depends on what you wanna go into besides medicine.

If you are a "traditional" applicant, then you probably majored in bio/biochem/chem of some variety.

You could work right out of college at some sort of biotech or chemical company. At a bachelor's level, you would start at about $30-$40K per year, depending on your grades. Unless you get into management (rare for BS holders), you will top out at about $50-$60K.

You could go to grad school and get a MS in about 2-3 years (if you want a decent job, you have to do a thesis) or a PhD in about 6-7 years. An MS will land you a starting position of about $40-$50K, topping out at about $70-$75. A PhD w/ a post-doc (another 2-3 years) will get you about $60-65K starting topping out at about $85K.

On the flip side (from what I understand), medicine (after residency)will get you >$100K starting + any debt you incur (with consolidation, etc. and a 20-25 year repayment period, you're looking at a <$1000 a month repayment). After a couple years of practice, you could get up to $180K or more, depending on your specialty.

I think monetarily, it would be worth it.

Plus, the job security is unparalleled. The biotech and chemical industries are very volatile, so if you do work for one, work for a big company (from which you will probably be laid off when times are tough).

Now, as far as the other crap that physicians have to put up with, I dunno.

In summary, I hope medicine will be worth it. Forget about the pay. Seeing people regain health under your care is certainly worth it. The money is just a fortunate by-product.

I sure as heck know that chemistry is not worth going into (unless you LOVE it). Then it is.

edit - If you're looking for a lot of money RIGHT NOW, go into law or business

 

[batman123]

In the end you've gotta answer that question for yourself

 

[md2banthony]

It is, without a doubt! This is all I have ever wanted to do...

Anthony

Texas A&M University College of Medicine
Class of 2007

 

[SunnyS81]

If you want a purely accounting answer to the question, it is yes. Consider your starting income (for me $50k/year in engineering) and that rate at which that income will grow (10% will be a gross overestimate). Do the calculation for however long you will be in school plus consider the difference income during residence plus the internal rate of return. Don't forget how much you spent to go to medical school......I calculated I'll be $2 million behind by the time I finish a 3 year residency. Of course, income doesn't grow linearly in any profession (including medicine). Unless you shoot up the corporate ladder, you'll never make more than an average doctor. Let's say an average doctor makes $200k......only all the VP's and CEO's in the country can match that. Not too many people. In a deflationary economy, good luck beating medicine (probably the only growth sector of the economy).


From a personal side.....you'll have to decide.

 

[Hawaiiandoc04]

"Was it worth it? For my husbnd to have the ability to help people who are very sick have a chance at recovery...yes. To achieve financial stability. Hell No...we are 33 and 38 and don't have a penny in retirement, we owe more money than God....and my husband's car is falling apart. "

Yikes! so depressing... I think you have just shattered a whole lot of pre-meds' faith in medicine. I really think a majority of talented pre-meds go into it for the money. If thats the case, they could easily use there talents elsewhere to make more money with less sacrifice. And they might actually enjoy there young adult life rather than slave away during medical training as they watch there best years go by manually disimpacting Mr. Old Man so and so who hadn't taken a S($&%^ T in days..

I think the statistic is like the median income of doctors is $166,000... Meaning HALF of alll doctors make less than this!!!!

 

[dakotaman]

Why do doctors complain all the time? What about all the other struggling people out there? Some people can barely make ends meet...this while living in a trailer or a tiny house or an apartment. They may be working three jobs, too. It seems to me that doctors have job security, stability, respect, and decent pay. A lot of training, yes, but you only live once. Might as well do something worthwhile!

But, yes, I wouldn't advise anyone to do it for money. You'd be miserable. Do it because you enjoy knowledge and learning and want to do something to truly benefit mankind! (Even if it's a small benefit!)

 

[SunnyS81]

Let's use the $125k as the average physicians salary. I've heard of pediatricians in the Bay area being offered $86k, but everyone I know is either in ER or a specialty and is making around $200k. STILL, I'll use the $125k, and I'll ask you which other professions average that high. AVERAGE. The average dentist doesn't break $100k. Maybe a specialist in dentistry, but not the average chump. The average lawyer's salary is around $70k in this country. Yeah, there are a lot of high paid lawyers, but the AVERAGE is still low. I don't know anything about insurance.

Remember, if you are good at whatever you do, be it a dentistry practice or in law, you'll make a lot. I'm sorry your budget is tight, but then again the average doctor pays off his med school debt in 7 years. That's pretty dang quick considering it is an extra payment to make for a person starting a real life (house, cars, kids) etc.

Again there is no training track to be a CEO. CEO's who are not in a Fortune 1000 company don't make that much. So what if 1000 people in america make on average more than a doctor. How statistically insignificant is that population in determining, "oh, you're better off as an MBA." Everyone and their grandmother has an MBA.

I'm sure someone else on the board can find the stats, but radiologists in the US are doing just dandy. I don't know what $450k Canadian is, but if you are a partner in a radiology practrice in the US, you're probably close. Yes, residents are underpaid. Isn't there a class action lawsuit on that regard?

 

[DarkChild]

kris - thanks for keeping it real. i think they're are a number of legitimate beefs with medicine today and your post hit on almost all of them. it showed us the personal effect of "decreasing physician compensation" and "increasing debt load" - words which doe-eyed pre-meds are too easy to dismiss. much appreciated!!

 

[OB1🤙]

Originally posted by Hawaiiandoc04
Yikes! so depressing... I think you have just shattered a whole lot of pre-meds' faith in medicine. I really think a majority of talented pre-meds go into it for the money. If thats the case, they could easily use there talents elsewhere to make more money with less sacrifice. And they might actually enjoy there young adult life rather than slave away during medical training as they watch there best years go by manually disimpacting Mr. Old Man so and so who hadn't taken a S($&%^ T in days..

I think the statistic is like the median income of doctors is $166,000... Meaning HALF of alll doctors make less than this!!!!

A couple things...

I don't know if you've been away from home too long or what brah, but one day you'll be "Mr. Old Man," and at that point, you'll appreciate the people that will be caring for you.

If you want to enjoy your young adult years, take a couple of years off before applying and have fun. Or apply to Tulane...

I think you'll find that you're wrong, that the majority of those that are going into medicine are not doing it for the money. If you're $$ driven, you'll know to go into business or something else. Most of us are truly interested in medicine for altruistic reasons, and the (sometimes questionable) financial security is just a bonus.

And jeez, heaven forbid you make less than 166K! How will you ever scrape by on 150K?? Better go pick out your cardboard box at A'ala Park while you still have time!

 

[klinzou]

Sunny,

You are incorrect on the dentist fact. Most dentist's don't clear 100k?? That is in no way true. I know 4 of them and 2 make over 300k and I live in Tennessee in a rural setting (one of the lowest income places around)

You may want to check your stats, but many dentists make very good money. Maybe not your basic do nothing dentistes, but if you have and kind of advanced training at all and work 50 hours a week, you are almost guaranteed 150k.

With that said, to all the people that say if you want money now go into business, just shut up. Rarely do people in business make over 50k for their first 5 years out of college. Lawyer's sure, but business? I think not, we aern't in a boom economy anymore, and it's just not happening.

I am an engineer though, so I can make better money the most people doing what I do, but I want to be a doctor. Noone will change my mind either, so there.

 

[Biodude]

Hawaiian Bruin - nice job letting the OP know about that


mommd2b - I'm glad to see that you're keeping it real as well, along with DarkChild. I've talked to many medical students and physicians, and they're pretty much in the same situations as well, in terms of debt repayment, buying homes/cars and such. I'm well aware that if I really wanted to, I could go to another profession without such a large debtload to pay off.

Of course, nothing really interests me more than medicine at this point.

 

[OB1🤙]

mommd2b-

I am fully aware of the financial implications of what I'm getting into. And my debt will probably be closer to 200K than to 150. Ouch! But the way I see it-

I've made an average of about 13K per year the three years that I've been independent. And I've gotten by. I don't need fancy stuff to be happy- just give me a modest house, modest car, some food and a happy family and I'll be set. If people can make 30K, 40K per year and still have happy lives, I'm sure I'll do fine on the 100-150K scale.

I know it won't be a picnic. 200K in debt will suck and blow. But I just can't imagine being happy in any other profession (besides a paramedic), and that's just the way it is. Bring on the Cup O Noodles!

 

[gibna]

so if the average physician income is 160 G's does that mean you make 100 Gs after you take the taxes away.
So by the time you pay off your student loans you will be retired!

 

[UrSexyLatinDr21]

Is going into medicine worth it?

Is medicine all about money? Is money what makes medicine worth? It sure looks like it for many people in here. It's sad to know how many people just go into this field for the money.

Eduardo

 

[IndyZX]

Originally posted by UrSexyLatinDr21
Is going into medicine worth it?

Is medicine all about money? Is money what makes medicine worth? It sure looks like it for many people in here. It's sad to know how many people just go into this field for the money.

Eduardo

I'll tell you what, if I was going to have to go through 10 more years of school + training, and not make a lot more than I would if I just entered the job market, I wouldn't go into medicine.

Medicine is great, I have my own reasons for wanted to be a physician, but if I am coming out of med school with around a 100K in debt and looking forward to just an average salary - I wouldn't do it. Sorry, I don't want to live under that kind of financial stress.

 

[IndyZX]

Originally posted by mommd2b
Other professionals that earn more..most company CEOs, Insurance brokers (our neighbor has his BA and earns 10k more than my husband), attorneys, dentists (we know several who earn twice my dh's salary)...can anyone come up with a few more?

most company CEOs dont make more than 150K
most insurance brokers dont make more than 150K
most attorneys dont make more than 150K
most dentists dont make more than 150K

you can name individial examples easily, but on average, as a group, physicians are the highest paid people in america.

"Despite the decline in inflation-adjusted net income, medicine remains one of the highest paid professions in America. More than half of all physicians earned more than $150,000 in 1999, while average physician net income was about $187,000, the study found. Specialists typically earned considerably more than primary care physicians, with specialists earning an average $219,000 in 1999, compared with $138,000 for primary care physicians." - http://www.hschange.org/CONTENT/548/

 

[mellotron]

Going to try to add some perspective here. A household with an internist as the only income-maker is say $160k before taxes. The reality is there are fewer families with only one working adult anymore. $160k is also a 20 year engineer with no big promotions and a school teacher. Not exactly your caviar/country club people. In addition, this couple has no school debt.

My point is, it's easy for two bachelor degreed people to match one doctor's salary. However, my guess is that a doctor with a college educated spouse will easily make over $200k together. Still, not caviar & country clubs, but that add'l income will sure help out any situation.

As for is is worth it, search for the "who's giving up 6 figures for medicine?" thread. It's basically a bunch of people who were successful in business, but still hated getting out of bed every morning. I certainly didn't fit the monetary requirements, but my reasoning is the same. You only get one shot at this - I want to do something that matters.

 

[Help]

Originally posted by Hawaiiandoc04
With physicians making less than they have ever made, there autonomy stripped from them by insurance companies, more and more paper work than ever before, lawsuits left and right, and $150,000+ in debt.... why go into medicine? Besides, medicine really doesn't do much... we have by FAR the most amount of healthcare spending yet one of the LOWEST life expectancies and overall health compared to the other developed countries...And ask one of the 40,000,000 uninsured if they think our health care system is so hot....

-on a side note, I need to get in that amcas app asap!

Yes, but there will always be sick people so you will always have consumers.

As for money, be a dermatologist and stop worrying!!!!

Go into medicine for medicine- docs should do it for the ideal, as for the practical choose your specialty accordingly- I dont know of any starving urologists do you?

 

[fun8stuff]

Originally posted by mommd2b
Average attorney salary is 120,625/year

Average CEO salary (nationwide) 524,621 WRONG

Average pilot salary (American, United,...) 100-200k WRONG

Average base salary for advertising managers is 72,062: NOT FAR OFF, BUT WRONG

Average base salary for a business bank manager is 86,848: WRONG

Average CFO salary: 253,083: WRONG

Chief Credit Officer: 138,929: WRONG

Tax Officer: 151,737: WRONG

VP of sales and marketing: 210,653: CORRECT... AMAZING!


I could go on and on...many of these professions require a bachelor's degree

Unfortunately most of those stats are wrong. You must be pulling them out of your butt.... lol.... anyways, try checking: http://www.bls.gov

first of all, i would even consider being a CEO. They work way too much and are always overly stressed. More so than doctors. Also, the chances of actually being able to land a job as a CEO are slim to none, unless you take over for your dad, etc. Their salaries are among the best, but are highly variable. They range anywhere from 38,000 to 450k+, most within the 70k to 140k region, which is still far less than the average doctor. salary.com does state between 450k and 700k. however, i would be mroe likely to trust the government's site , although it seems nowadays most CEOs probably cover up a lot of the money that they actually make....

avg. commercial pilots:
"Median annual earnings of commercial pilots were $43,300 in 2000. The middle 50 percent earned between $31,500 and $61,230. The lowest 10 percent earned less than $24,290, and the highest 10 percent earned more than $92,000. "


advertising manger, etc:
Median annual earnings in 2000 for advertising and promotions managers were $53,360; marketing managers, $71,240; sales managers, $68,520; and public relations managers, $54,540. Earnings ranged from less than $27,840 for the lowest 10 percent of advertising and promotions managers, to more than $137,780 for the highest 10 percent of sales managers.

bank manager:
55,960 for commercial banks. less specifically: Median annual earnings of financial managers were $67,020 in 2000. The middle 50 percent earned between $48,150 and $91,580. The lowest 10 percent had earnings of less than $36,050, while the top 10 percent earned over $131,120

CFO:
avg is high 100k

Tax officer:
A typical Top Tax Executive working in the United States earns a median base salary of $151,737, according to our analysis of data reported by corporate HR departments. Half of the people in this job earn between $123,038 and $184,283 (salary.com)

VP of marketing & sales:
A typical Top Sales and Marketing Executive working in the United States earns a median base salary of $210,653, according to our analysis of data reported by corporate HR departments. Half of the people in this job earn between $169,666 and $274,075(salary.com)



-one of my biggest pet peeves are people that just talk bull**** and have no idea what they are talking about. just because you know of one person who makes a certain amount, does not mean that is representative of the average. you should really try and consult sources before just blabbing off numbers. i am guessing since you made this up, you probably made up or exaggerated everything else you said.

--it is true that some of these people do make more than doctors, but do you have any idea what percent of people in the US actually have these jobs and make more than the doctor's avg? probably very few. It is true that some may just have bachelors and/or MBAs, however, THIS DOES NOT MEAN that anyone with a bachelors and MBA can attain one of these positions. In most cases, you are going to have to have very good connections: as in, take over for your uncle or dad.

*all info from www.bls.gov, unless otherwise cited.

edit: forget to look up lawyers....
lawyers:
In 2000, the median annual earnings of all lawyers was $88,280. The middle half of the occupation earned between $60,700 and $130,170. The lowest paid 10 percent earned less than $44,590; at least 10 percent earned more than $145,600. Median annual earnings in the industries employing the largest numbers of lawyers in 2000 are shown below:
Legal services $96,610
Federal government 87,080
Fire, marine, and casualty insurance 82,170
Local Government 66,280
State Government 64,190

 

[IndyZX]

thats exactly what i was trying to get at, thanks for posting that gov info.

 

[Hawaiiandoc04]

All I know is if one were to take the $160,000+ in medical school expenses and invest this instead in a mutual fund and pursue a lucrative profession right out of college, then one would be much wealthier than the average doctor.
Those talented, driven, motivated enough to end up in medical school will most likely be equally able to land some fancy job in finance, or law, or engineering and rake it in!
Doctors are not paid enough for what they have to go through and what they have to do day in and day out. . .

 

[fun8stuff]

Originally posted by mommd2b
Kiss my butt..try salary.com

And..my dad is an airline pilot for American airlines...once he got through the initial training and 1 year as a navigator and 6 months as a co-pilot, he was boosted up to $150k. He has been with the airlines now for 10 years and earns 289k/annually after the recent 25% paycut. In addition, his retirement package is already a cool million...

First of all, i did use salary.com for the ones that i could not find on the site that the government publishes, which I cited.

Ok... maybe you should go back and read what I said toward the bottom of my last post: Just because you know one person who makes a certain amount in a profession, does not mean you can base an average off from that! DUH!

Anyways, I'm just going by the averages that the government lists. It is true 15 to 20 yrs ago pilots made great money, however, their salary has been decreasing.






"Do you? We live in a nice neighborhood and there are very few docs here.......there are homes ranging from 80-400k and very, very few doctors live in the homes that are above 250-300k...so who is buying them? Non-doctors. Those 'rare' birds in your eyes that manage to miraculously get popped up to the top thanks to their connections "
--that is like living in beverly hills and assuming every where else in the US is made up the same way. again, you cannot look at your situation and assume it is representative of the average. HOwver, because you made up those other stats, i am willing to bet you are making up most of what you are saying.

I'm not saying that all doctors make awesome money and that no one makes more money than them. I just noticed that there were many errors in your numbers and logic and wanted to correct you on them.


"For every high earning specialist that you can pull out of your little butt to balance off the lower earning FPs and pediatricians it is possible to find executives, real estate agent, investors, pilots, etc earning the same and MORE>"

many real estate agents make very, very, very little. Now if you look at the averages that are posted by the government, you would see that many of these people on average earn less than doctors. **you cannot assume your situation is representative of the average, take a high school stats class for crying out loud**

"So get off of your "we earn the most" high horse"
--I'm not saying that doctors earn most, I'm saying that doctors have AMONG the highest earnings of any profession. Above all, I am pointing out that your numbers are wrong and not reliable.

I do agree, people should not go into medicine for the money. THere is a lot of cost involved, as has already been pointed out by many people. My only real point was that your numbers were incorrect.





**you cannot assume your situation is representative of the average, take a high school stats class for crying out loud**

 

[fun8stuff]

Originally posted by mommd2b
Oh...for info on pilot's salaries:

http://www.powersupplies.net/Career/Articles/compare-salaries.htm



blah, blah, blah...if you would agree that Physician average salary isn't 100,920 then we can probably agree that it is possible to find a wide range of sources online..

kris

I would agree that there are many sources that have a wide range available online, which was my reason for using the source that government publishes. I believe that to be most correct. I'm pretty sure when it comes to money and people's income, big brother has a fairly good grasp on all of this.

As for pilots, I'm sure they make good money. I'm sure some make excellent $$$. However, not all of them do. blah, blah...

 

[fun8stuff]

Originally posted by mommd2b
The BLS also just samples diff. establishments and reports from these interviews about the positions and salaries...

I would love to find an IRS website that would shed some 'real' light on the salary issue.

kris

me too... i would also like to find out how many specialists there are compared to primary care doctors...... so you find that it is hard to get by and make ends meet being a doctor?

 

[nirvana23]

Originally posted by mommd2b

taxes (all together including our local and state taxes) 42%..that is now a takehome of about 58,000.

What state do you live in? My fiance makes ~$80K/year, and her take home is about $60K. You're meaning to tell me that someone who makes $100K takes home less than someone who makes $80K?

Factor a loan payment of ~1800/month. That brings you to around 36,400$ after taxes....

WTF?!?!? How long is your repayment period? And how much do you owe? You know you can reconsolidate your loans to a 25-30 year repayment period, making your payments less than $1000 a month, especially now with the low interest rates.

You have about $3000 after taxes to spend on your car payment, house payment, groceries, etc....
kris

I don't believe this at all. My fiance makes $80K, and she has almost $4.5K a month at her disposal. I made $60K awhile back, and I had about $3K after all was said and done. I think you're exaggerating a bit. I think you need to check you math (or your spending habits).

 

[Rev. Horace]

Who really cares who makes the most money and yadda yadda yadda. I know it's been said a few times on here before, but this isn't the reason why you should do anything. If you're money driven it's never going to be enough. You could be doing a high dollar specialty and making $600K/yr. and still be upset b/c you're not making $700K/yr.

Medicine makes me happy, I enjoy it to the utmost and I could give a rat's a$$ if I'm not going to be able to afford to get a bentley or a $300K house. All careers have their highs and lows and for me medicine's highs outweigh it's lows by a significant amount. Besides, if you want cash and alot of it with little to no investment start a drug cartel.*

* sarcasm intended

 

[HamOnWholeWheat]

Originally posted by mommd2b
And..my dad is an airline pilot for American airlines...once he got through the initial training and 1 year as a navigator and 6 months as a co-pilot, he was boosted up to $150k. He has been with the airlines now for 10 years and earns 289k/annually after the recent 25% paycut. In addition, his retirement package is already a cool million...

Why is it that everyone seems to know a commercial pilot with a net worth of a bazillion dollars when I never met one? I know a bunch of guys who hang out at the airport for 16 hrs./day to get their 6-8 hrs. of flight time in so they can bring home their whopping $600/month paycheck.

Let me guess, your dad was former military (10 yrs mandatory commitment)? If so, he didn't exactly walk into a 300k/yr job fresh out of school. Airlines don't hire FO's with less than 1000 hours (now its more like 3000 with all the furloughs). To get that 1000 hours takes most people 2-3 yrs if they're REALLY on the ball. You don't have enough seniority to make captain at a major until you have closer to 4-5,000. I think you'll find most of the big earners at the airlines (>150k/yr) have well over 6-7,000 hours of flight time, which is AT LEAST 8-10 yrs. of experience, most of which comes at much more modest wages. Oh, and I forgot to mention, unless the military pays for it, you have to foot the bill for your first 250-300 hours of flight time (which costs roughly $130/hr. for the plane and the instructor).

So lets see:

Airline job:
$30,000 minimum education cost (if no military)
150k/yr avg after 8-10 yrs. (subject to economy)
Living on ramen noodles in the meantime.

Medical School:
$40,000 minimum education cost (if no military, CA schools)
150k/yr avg after 8-10 yrs school + residency (not subject to economy)
Living on ramen noodles in the meantime.

Looks like a wash to me. I flew commercially for 2 yrs and realized if I was going to have to wait 6-8 yrs for the big payoff, I might as well go to medical school and do a job that's somewhat more interesting than flying a bus on the same route day in and day out (Cursed MLI->ORD!!!!!!!).


I'm not trying to jump on your case. Just thought I'd throw out some more worthless data to fight over.


HamOn
Former Regional Pilot in IL

 

[Joe Joe on da Radio]

what other profession will pay you to take a knife to someone, cut them open, and not get you tried for attempted murder!?

 

[UCLAMAN]

mommd2b,

what exactly are all your debts? you make it seem as though being a physician will cause one to live hand to mouth for quite some time.

What are you paying for every month? Is it just your husband that is working? If so, where exactly is his $125k going? Whats he pulling in a month and how much of that is going towards paying off debts? And why so much debt? I mean aside form the necessary things like school loans, house loans, monthly bills, etc...where is the rest of your debt coming from?

I'm not trying to get on your case or anything. Rather, I was just wondering if you could give a clearer picture of the situation. You make it seem as though the financial outlook for a physician is very grim.

 

[Nefertari]

Arguing which profession makes more or less is really not the point. You need to decide "Is it worth it for my situation?" Putting the question in perspective of all the complexities that make up your life will help you decide. It's hard to generalize this question for everyone. Also, worth what? Are you talking $$, happiness, your health and well-being, how much time you'll have to spend w/ your family?

For myself, I thought @ this question almost everyday for the past year while applying, and had to think really hard @ it again upon deciding to reapply. The 1st question you should ask is: "Do I love practicing medicine?" If not sure, then you'll most likely be disillusioned w/ the realities that some of the previous posters have discussed. If yes, you still might be disillusioned, but it'll keep you going.

As an acupuncturist, I've treated many doctors. Almost all of them have crazy lifestyles & stress-related illnesses--they're always in a hurry! Many of the female docs come to acupuncture b/c they have trouble getting pregnant when they finally decide the time is right. The ones who seem to fare well emotionally/mentally are not necessarily the ones making the most $, but rather the ones who love their work, in spite of the drawbacks.

The 2nd question: "How much are you willing to sacrifice to practice medicine?" (deterioration of your health, crazy stress level, limited time to spend w/ family, weird hours depending on your specialty/area) You need to decide this for yourself. If you don't have a clear idea of how much you're willing to sacrifice, then you might end up resentful @ some point.

 

[Hawaiiandoc04]

I would like to add that it seems as if pre-meds have all of these idealistic, altruistic ambitions( i.e. caring for ones' patients, giving the best available medicine, showing compassion etc.), but what I find is that all of these ideals go out the window after years of practicing medicine. It seems like most of the doctors I have shadowed dehumanize patients, look for shortcuts, worry more about costs than care, are desensitized, jaded, and perhaps put on only a perfunctory smile and countenance of caring to either fool patients or to delude themselves that they indeed are the next saviors... after all, doctoring is still just a job.... Am I too cynical?

 

[IndyZX]

im not going into medicine because i have grandiose dreams of saving people left and right. im not a saint, im not here to selflessly give away my hard work.

im going into it because i think i would really enjoy it, and as an added bonus, i think im helping other people out in the way that i personally would be most capable.

as an aside, i dont get why this whole totally selfless ideal is driven through us by medical schools. most doctors ive met are just normal people; they are not all working at soup kitchens and hosting story time for disadvantaged kids in their free time

im not a total heartless bastard. when i think about how i want to help this world become a better place, i immediately get my head straight and think on a micro level: the best way i, personally, can improve the world is to help provide excellent healthcare to others. but i dont harbor fantasy notions of being perfect.

i dont know

 

[Hawaiiandoc04]

"i dont get why this whole totally selfless ideal is driven through us by medical schools. most doctors ive met are just normal people; they are not all working at soup kitchens and hosting story time for disadvantaged kids in their free time."



My sentiments exactly!! Doctors ARE just normal people...Go into medicine cause you think its challenging and fun ...helping people is a bonus!
Bottom line: I'm doing medicine for myself, not for others....

 

[OB1🤙]

Originally posted by Hawaiiandoc04
Bottom line: I'm doing medicine for myself, not for others....

Make sure you emphasize that in your personal statement and interviews.

 

[monkeyarms]

it is worth going into medicine if you wish to be involved in a profession that allows you to conitnue to expand spiritually and intellectually for your whole life. there are certainly many people for whom this is not the case, and those are the ones who end up burned out and complaining about money. lots of doctors don't realize what they're getting into, find out how hard it is, and then spend lots of energy feeling sorry for themselves. then they end up worrying about money and prestige because it is what they have to hang on to (just as we see people on this website boasting about scores and gpas etc). conversely, i know plenty of perfectly happy and truly amazing people who handle the downsides of medicine with effortless grace. these are people who love what they do; who have gone into medicine for the "right" reasons. the truth of the matter is that sometimes you just have to suck it up, get your work done, and have faith that in the end you will look back on your life and be satisfied. perhaps there isn't any way to know ahead of time whether or not medicine will be for you, and that is precisely why getting into med school is such a grueling process.

as far as the money issues are concerned: an american md is never going to starve. if give a **** about who makes $10k more than you, that's just too bad. mommd2b is not "keeping it real." she's just bitching.

i could ramble on for several pages like this, i guess.
bottom line is that there are lots of ways to make a living, but none of the other options has quite the same mixture of purpose and challenge. the greatest rewards of a medical career are not monetary. they are spiritual. the things that you do to help people that they cannot do for themselves will remain your greatest achievements for all of your life. sure there are some sacrifices to make, but medicine has got soul .
is medicine worth it?
go damn right it is.

 

[Kovox]

Originally posted by Joe Joe on da Radio
what other profession will pay you to take a knife to someone, cut them open, and not get you tried for attempted murder!?

Working for the mafia?

 

[IndyZX]

Originally posted by Hawaiian Bruin
Make sure you emphasize that in your personal statement and interviews.

I think that's the point we were trying to make. Med school admissions is such a game its not even funny.

 

[Joe Joe on da Radio]

Originally posted by Kovox
Working for the mafia?

you and your deductive reasoning...

 

[desi flava]

im in it for the money and the bitches

 

[kito]

Here's the ladder at any major investment bank:

years out of college job salary/year

0-2 analyst 50k
3-4 MBA student -40k
5-8 Associate 100-200k
9-15 Vice President 300-500k
16+ Managing Director 1M+

the caveat is that very few make it to the last step.

 

[ItsGavinC]

Actually, very few make it to the VP step.

You ought to post the hours required next to each of those positions. And the fact that the work is mind-numbing. And the fact that those stats were valid in 1999, but anymore, and especially not in 2003.

MBA/Invest banking is simply NOT the way to make money. The bubble broke, remember?