Is it time to stock-up on assault rifles?

[nlax30]

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The world is moving forward, you don't see it because you are limited by your rotten backward mentality.
Look around you, read things other than right wing propaganda and science fiction.

If some of these liberal views on government and its role in my life is what you mean by "moving forward" then I am all for going back.

And in what way do you think the world is moving forward?

 

[Planktonmd]

Again **** you plank.

 

[Planktonmd]

If some of these liberal views on government and its role in my life is what you mean by "moving forward" then I am all for going back.

And in what way do you think the world is moving forward?

The world is moving forward because humanity is progressing, science is advancing and the number of people who feel threatened by progress is shrinking.
The world has been moving forward faster than us for a number of years now but I am confident that we will cathch up and assume our indisputable role in the progress of the human race.

 

[surrender903]

For those of you who have never:

- gotten your boots soiled in hostile sand
- spent months and years away from your family...not knowing when you're going to see them again.
- slept next to a bulkhead in a closet with 5 other ship mates
- taken care of these fu cking terrorist rag heads in a godforsaken sh it hole.
- spent time with our soldiers and sailors who have been wounded or killed.

I would say....you shouldn't have a say in this. You don't know jack, but what the liberal media has told you....and what your safe and sheltered life has allowed you to believe.

If you really want to spout your "democracy is for EVERYONE" bs, spend some time in service to your country first....then spout it.....

wow you re really classy arent you?

 

[militarymd]

wow you re really classy arent you?

yep...and you're no doubt one of those who shouldn't have the right to say anything.

and if you're a rag head or rag head sympathizer....I spent months away from my family taking care of your friends who were trying to kill our citizens.

 

[surrender903]

yep...and you're no doubt one of those who shouldn't have the right to say anything.

and if you're a rag head or rag head sympathizer....I spent months away from my family taking care of your friends who were trying to kill our citizens.

actually I had a 4 year army ROTC scholarship but was medically dq'ed.

you may be a doctor, but the venn diagram does not exclude you from being ignorant. i think you need to step away from this conversation as you just started with personal insults and a forced vacation would not be as fun.

im sorry you have such hatred, and i m even more sorry that you see Islam as just "rag heads and terrorists." I do not see that Iraq was a necessary conflict to engage ourselves in, you may disagree and Ill be happy to have a civil conversation with you regarding such if you wish.

 

[militarymd]

actually I had a 4 year army ROTC scholarship but was medically dq'ed.

you may be a doctor, but the venn diagram does not exclude you from being ignorant. i think you need to step away from this conversation as you just started with personal insults and a forced vacation would not be as fun.

im sorry you have such hatred, and i m even more sorry that you see Islam as just "rag heads and terrorists." I do not see that Iraq was a necessary conflict to engage ourselves in, you may disagree and Ill be happy to have a civil conversation with you regarding such if you wish.

Let's see here...Who started the personal insults? Do I need to show you your own post?

My reference the "rag head terrorists" is not hatred.....it is the way OUR LINE military refers to them....If you spent any time with the pointy tip of our spear....you would know.....Do you really think that our PC portrayal of our military forces is what it is really like?

Probably a good thing that you got DQ'ed.

You would probably wind up like Niedermeyer...

 

[proman]

Well, let's examine specifically how it violates the Constitution...

Amendment 4:
...
It's a bad law.

-copro

I had planned a point by point response but I just switched to cardiac and the hours are killing me.

It seems the arguments about the act are very Chicken Little. Exceedingly few people have actually read the thing. I've read portions, and it really doesn't sound as bad as the people screaming how we're living in one giant interment camp now. The parts that have been challenged in court and found unconstitutional (a few) were found to be vague and easily remedied through subsequent legislation. The librarian argument is an example of reductio ad absurdem, has never been used and is simple hysterics.

The act does ease access to voicemail (warrant instead of wiretap) and allow for roving wiretaps (a person instead of a device) which I'm all for. I know 90% of SDN won't agree with me, but the Patriot Act really is no big deal.

 

[militarymd]

actually I had a 4 year army ROTC scholarship but was medically dq'ed.

you may be a doctor, but the venn diagram does not exclude you from being ignorant. i think you need to step away from this conversation as you just started with personal insults and a forced vacation would not be as fun.

im sorry you have such hatred, and i m even more sorry that you see Islam as just "rag heads and terrorists." I do not see that Iraq was a necessary conflict to engage ourselves in, you may disagree and Ill be happy to have a civil conversation with you regarding such if you wish.

Is that a threat???? That would be a violation of the SDN TOC.

 

[surrender903]

Let's see here...Who started the personal insults? Do I need to show you your own post?

My reference the "rag head terrorists" is not hatred.....it is the way OUR LINE military refers to them....If you spent any time with the pointy tip of our spear....you would know.....Do you really think that our PC portrayal of our military forces is what it is really like?

Probably a good thing that you got DQ'ed.

You would probably wind up like Niedermeyer...

referring to them as rag heads among civilians isnt exactly classy. Im sorry that you feel that me saying your verbiage was less than apropos, but I feel that among mixed company it appears ignorant.

i actually have several friends in the military and in our discussions they dont refer to the terrorists as "rag heads."

really? id end up like niedermeyer? dude seriously. you have some anger issues.

 

[surrender903]

Is that a threat???? That would be a violation of the SDN TOC.

you really need to relax. take a deep breath or something. if you perceive that as a threat that im not sure what else to tell you

 

[militarymd]

referring to them as rag heads among civilians isnt exactly classy. Im sorry that you feel that me saying your verbiage was less than apropos, but I feel that among mixed company it appears ignorant.

i actually have several friends in the military and in our discussions they dont refer to the terrorists as "rag heads."

really? id end up like niedermeyer? dude seriously. you have some anger issues.

For some one whose posted here ...what 2 times??? You're telling me what is "ignorant" or not to post here?????

Sort of like the moderators who swoop in here to "fix" issues...and then have to get bounced????

uhh...ok.

Yeah...I know a bunch of clip board commandoes too in the military who would agree with you.

 

[surrender903]

For some one whose posted here ...what 2 times??? You're telling me what is "ignorant" or not to post here?????

Sort of like the moderators who swoop in here to "fix" issues...and then have to get bounced????

uhh...ok.

Yeah...I know a bunch of clip board commandoes too in the military who would agree with you.

so it matters how many times i post now? do you need to compare numbers to make your argument sound?

 

[militarymd]

so it matters how many times i post now? do you need to compare numbers to make your argument sound?

You made an insult based on the "verbiage" used among "mixed company".......

You are not part of the "company" here....You do not participate here....do I need to explain further?

 

[surrender903]

You made an insult based on the "verbage" used among "mixed company".......

You are not part of the "company" here....You do not participate here....do I need to explain further?

i think you do. im just as much of this company here as any other paying (or non paying)member of this forum. i have an interest in anesthesiology and politics just as much as you do.

i dont need to post in every thread to make my presence known. i took offense to your slur because its quite frankly ignorant. the fact that the military uses it to refer to op4 does not make it any more acceptable.

 

[jetproppilot]

actually I had a 4 year army ROTC scholarship but was medically dq'ed.

you may be a doctor, but the venn diagram does not exclude you from being ignorant. i think you need to step away from this conversation as you just started with personal insults and a forced vacation would not be as fun.

im sorry you have such hatred, and i m even more sorry that you see Islam as just "rag heads and terrorists." I do not see that Iraq was a necessary conflict to engage ourselves in, you may disagree and Ill be happy to have a civil conversation with you regarding such if you wish.

I still struggle with all of this that is being mentioned, Surrender.

Reflecting a little, though:

KABOOM.

KABOOM.

KABOOM.

KABOOM.

Yeah, that sounds about right.

Four really loud sounds from four hijacked United States airliners becoming LAWN DARTS at the hands of terrorists.

Terrorists who were all Muslim.

Not being judgmental.

Just stating facts.

We can all recite tragedies caused by every race, I'm sure.

The Muslim one just happens to be one of the most recent and catastrophic in this violent-mess-we-call-home......planet earth and the human race.

 

[Trisomy13]

Do you want to add something to that?

No, I think your statement speaks for itself.

 

[Trisomy13]

Yes, really. Every single last one of them. And you know what? In a battle, unfortunately there are some innocent lives that are lost. I'd rather an innocent couple people spend a few years at gitmo than 3000 more americans die at the hands of barbarians. see, everything comes with a cost. everything. if you set them free, there will be a cost. if you try them in federal courts, there will be a cost. nothing is free. in this case, we're dealing with flesh, blood, and LIFE. how much is it worth?

So if all Muslims are evil barbarians, what does that make Christians, considering their own bloody history?

(feel free to argue or not, my mind is made up on the role religion - all religions - have played in the history of war, and you won't be changing it with any amount of cliche...)

 

[surrender903]

I still struggle with all of this that is being mentioned, Surrender.

Reflecting a little, though:

KABOOM.

KABOOM.

KABOOM.

KABOOM.

Yeah, that sounds about right.

Four really loud sounds from four hijacked United States airliners becoming LAWN DARTS at the hands of terrorists.

Terrorists who were all Muslim.

Not being judgmental.

Just stating facts.

We can all recite tragedies caused by every race, I'm sure.

The Muslim one just happens to be one of the most recent and catastrophic in this violent-mess-we-call-home......planet earth and the human race.

im not really seeing your point, i apologize if what im missing is blatantly obvious.

Does 9/11 some how allow military to use slurs like that on a public forum? i called him on it and he said i was insulting him and that i deserved to be a friendly fire casualty. then he stated that because i dont post alot here i should not be criticizing the vernacular of the "regulars."

again, im all for having a civil discussion.

 

[Trisomy13]

What does that mean??
They are muslim and you think they comitted crimes against humanity because some guy interogated them and thought so?
They are Muslim and that's why they commited crimes against humanity?
They are Muslim and that's why it's enough for anyone to say they are gulity to be found guilty?
They are Muslim and that makes them less human?
What did you mean?

I think this deserves a better explanation that just "*** you Plank".

The reason I initially responded with "Wow, really?" because the only way I saw to interpret your statement was one of the above, and I was surprised because I hadn't heard that degree of blind bigotry (if indeed that was the case) in a while.

 

[Trisomy13]

For those of you who have never:

- gotten your boots soiled in hostile sand
- spent months and years away from your family...not knowing when you're going to see them again.
- slept next to a bulkhead in a closet with 5 other ship mates
- taken care of these fu cking terrorist rag heads in a godforsaken sh it hole.
- spent time with our soldiers and sailors who have been wounded or killed.

I would say....you shouldn't have a say in this. You don't know jack, but what the liberal media has told you....and what your safe and sheltered life has allowed you to believe.

If you really want to spout your "democracy is for EVERYONE" bs, spend some time in service to your country first....then spout it.....

With all due respect Mil, and I mean that sincerely, I think one can argue that while it is difficult for someone without these experiences to understand the microcosm of war and all of it's accompanying emotions and indescribable situations, it is likewise difficult for someone so affected and entrenched in the military ideology to step back and see the world from a broader perspective. And one can similarly argue that the liberal media influencing the former group is balanced by the military propaganda influencing the latter. I don't pretend to understand a fraction of why the military does what it does overseas, and I would wager that the brave men and women carrying out their orders are likewise largely in the dark regarding true motivations.

 

[jetproppilot]

I think this deserves a better explanation that just "*** you Plank".
.

Nahhhh.

Think it summed up the incessant IF YOU SAY A I'M GONNA SAY B pretty nicely.

 

[Trisomy13]

Nahhhh.

Think it summed up the incessant IF YOU SAY A I'M GONNA SAY B pretty nicely.

hahaha 😀 fair enough, Jet. fair enough.

 

[surrender903]

Nahhhh.

Think it summed up the incessant IF YOU SAY A I'M GONNA SAY B pretty nicely.

nice diffusing of the situation.

👍

 

[Southpaw]

I think this deserves a better explanation that just "*** you Plank".

The reason I initially responded with "Wow, really?" because the only way I saw to interpret your statement was one of the above, and I was surprised because I hadn't heard that degree of blind bigotry (if indeed that was the case) in a while.

From reading the last couple pages it's interesting that both you and Plank continue to read posts as "all Muslims are terrorists"......when what I've taken from the posts are "the terrorists who've attacked this country were all Muslim"....do you not see the difference?

 

[pgg]

pgg, I agree with the general sentiment of your post, but I do take issue with this paragraph. Why are these people excluded from the Geneva Convention? The Geneva Convention specifically addresses the treatment of non-combatants and prisoners of war. This seems spot on to me.

I would guess that the reason it seems spot on to you is because you've never actually read the Geneva Conventions.

A. Prisoners of war, in the sense of the present Convention, are persons belonging to one of the following categories, who have fallen into the power of the enemy:

1. Members of the armed forces of a Party to the conflict as well as members of militias or volunteer corps forming part of such armed forces.

2. Members of other militias and members of other volunteer corps, including those of organized resistance movements, belonging to a Party to the conflict and operating in or outside their own territory, even if this territory is occupied, provided that such militias or volunteer corps, including such organized resistance movements, fulfil the following conditions:

(a) That of being commanded by a person responsible for his subordinates;

(b) That of having a fixed distinctive sign recognizable at a distance;

(c) That of carrying arms openly;

(d) That of conducting their operations in accordance with the laws and customs of war.

Subsection 1 doesn't include these people because they're not members of a nation's armed forces, either as regulars or reservists (referred to as "militia" or "volunteers").

Subsection 2 though ... "organized resistance movements" seems to cover those guys ... until you actually read the four conditions that must be met: 0 for 4. They don't meet a single one of the four specifically enumerated requirements for a combatant to qualify as a POW if captured.

I didn't quote subsections 3-6 because they're irrelevant to this discussion - they address things like camp followers, merchant marines, etc.

The Geneva Conventions specifically and deliberately exclude these people from protection because their actions increase the risk to civilians. Even way back in the dark ages of 1949, they had the uncanny prescient vision to understand that fighters who concealed their movements among civilians, used civilians as human shields, dressed like civilians, and pretended to be civilians in the moments immediately before and after engaging in combat, put civilians at risk. The Geneva Conventions are all about reducing the human suffering caused by war, particularly to civilians.

Second, by saying that we have no obligation other than to line them up and shoot them, we again move toward this idea that if some other nation would do it, then so can we. But, that should never be an acceptable sentiment in the U.S. We should by head and shoulders above what they would do in a Taliban regime or an Iranian regime.

Lining them up and shooting them would be inappropriate and counterproductive. But this doesn't imply that we should or must go 180 degrees the other way and provide lawyers and speedy trials by juries of their peers.

Maybe the best thing to do with an insurgent who is caught with a weapons cache or supply of bomb-making materials is to detain them until the conflict is over, providing appropriate food, shelter, medical care, and the opportunity to pray in whichever direction they feel like.

The devil's in the details, and we haven't handled it perfectly, but that's exactly what we've got at Gitmo. Gitmo is a failure not because it is an immoral construct of evil, but because it's fertile propaganda for our enemies in a conflict that first and foremost is about hearts and minds.

 

[usnavdoc]

I think this deserves a better explanation that just "*** you Plank".

The reason I initially responded with "Wow, really?" because the only way I saw to interpret your statement was one of the above, and I was surprised because I hadn't heard that degree of blind bigotry (if indeed that was the case) in a while.

The reason for my comment to plank is that I am tired of his arrogance and his misrepresentation of what I have stated. He has openly called me a racist, extremist, and a ******. With my background I have come to take any disparagement against my character very seriously. I think Plank is a POS example of how a moderator of this forum should act. So I told him to **** off. If he/you bothered to actually read my posts you should have concluded not that I hate Muslims but that I hate the terrorists who pushed us down this path.

The truth of the matter is that through my time spent over there (have any of you been there?) I actually loved many aspects of the culture and the time i spent with the people. I also found things I was repulsed by. Just as I am sure that they would find with our culture.

There are many things that go into creating the terrorist mindset just as there are with creating the mindset of any criminal. But by and large being Muslim is a factor. That doesn’t mean all Muslims are terrorists, but it is a fairly obvious fact. Unless you are plank that is and you want to twist someone’s words to your own benefit.

 

[Trisomy13]

The reason for my comment to plank is that I am tired of his arrogance and his misrepresentation of what I have stated. He has openly called me a racist, extremist, and a ******. With my background I have come to take any disparagement against my character very seriously. I think Plank is a POS example of how a moderator of this forum should act. So I told him to **** off. If he/you bothered to actually read my posts you should have concluded not that I hate Muslims but that I hate the terrorists who pushed us down this path.

The truth of the matter is that through my time spent over there (have any of you been there?) I actually loved many aspects of the culture and the time i spent with the people. I also found things I was repulsed by. Just as I am sure that they would find with our culture.

There are many things that go into creating the terrorist mindset just as there are with creating the mindset of any criminal. But by and large being Muslim is a factor. That doesn’t mean all Muslims are terrorists, but it is a fairly obvious fact. Unless you are plank that is and you want to twist someone’s words to your own benefit.

Thank you.

 

[Trisomy13]

From reading the last couple pages it's interesting that both you and Plank continue to read posts as "all Muslims are terrorists"......when what I've taken from the posts are "the terrorists who've attacked this country were all Muslim"....do you not see the difference?

I don't know what you are reading, but I only chimed in on the one post that frankly stated, perhaps due to poor wording, that they were terrorists because they were Muslim... and "every last one of them". The posts were fairly clear, and I asked for clarification, and usnavdoc kindly obliged. Don't be victim to your own accusations and place words in MY mouth. I don't play those games.

 

[usnavdoc]

I don't know what you are reading, but I only chimed in on the one post that frankly stated, perhaps due to poor wording, that they were terrorists because they were Muslim... and "every last one of them". The posts were fairly clear, and I asked for clarification, and usnavdoc kindly obliged. Don't be victim to your own accusations and place words in MY mouth. I don't play those games.

I dod not say they are terrorist b/c they are muslim. And it is not worded that way. You and plank seem to want to spin everything however you feel.
This is the verbatim of what was said:

Plank stated "Establishing a concentration camp for people who fit a certain racial or ideological profile goes against the very foundation of this country.
In the United States people are assumed innocent until proven guilty even if they are of a different color or different religion.
This great country was built on the principles of liberty and equality we should not change that to fit the agenda of the extreme right."

I stated: "The key part of your statement is "In the United States." These are not people that were captured robbing a bank downtown or doing a driveby in south central LA. This is in a foreign country on the battlefield. The bottom line is that the terrorist ideological profile is that they are Muslim. They by there own volition commited these offenses against humanity. "

The word terrorist precedes the word muslim. Not the other way around. I have never made any disparaging remarks to that faith or any other, that culture or any other, that race or any other. I also did not use the phrase "every last one of them"

I will not be wasting any more of my vacation on this thread. Sorry to the OP that I participated in derailing this thread. But yes I think if you dont have a certain type of rifle and you want one. Now would be a good time to go get it. Actually the time was 6 months ago b/c they are going to be a bit more expensive now.

 

[Trisomy13]

I dod not say they are terrorist b/c they are muslim. And it is not worded that way. You and plank seem to want to spin everything however you feel.
This is the verbatim of what was said:

Plank stated "Establishing a concentration camp for people who fit a certain racial or ideological profile goes against the very foundation of this country.
In the United States people are assumed innocent until proven guilty even if they are of a different color or different religion.
This great country was built on the principles of liberty and equality we should not change that to fit the agenda of the extreme right."

I stated: "The key part of your statement is "In the United States." These are not people that were captured robbing a bank downtown or doing a driveby in south central LA. This is in a foreign country on the battlefield. The bottom line is that the terrorist ideological profile is that they are Muslim. They by there own volition commited these offenses against humanity. "

The word terrorist precedes the word muslim. Not the other way around. I have never made any disparaging remarks to that faith or any other, that culture or any other, that race or any other. I also did not use the phrase "every last one of them"

I will not be wasting any more of my vacation on this thread. Sorry to the OP that I participated in derailing this thread. But yes I think if you dont have a certain type of rifle and you want one. Now would be a good time to go get it. Actually the time was 6 months ago b/c they are going to be a bit more expensive now.

I guess the subtlety is lost in the text, but this sentence is the one that raised my eyebrow. My intent was not to spin anything, just find some clarification for what I thought was a gross generalization. Again, I appreciate your clarification and would rather you did not, as were the case, spin my take on your post to be more than what it was. Enjoy your vacation.

 

[Josh L.Ac.]

This thread totally sucks without pics or video:


[YOUTUBE]Vt_tv7t79WY[/YOUTUBE]

 

[militarymd]

Christians usually just try to kill each other and convert the rest....On the other hand, the Muslims want to kill all Christians.

I'm sure someone will correct me

So if all Muslims are evil barbarians, what does that make Christians, considering their own bloody history?

(feel free to argue or not, my mind is made up on the role religion - all religions - have played in the history of war, and you won't be changing it with any amount of cliche...)

 

[militarymd]

actually I had a 4 year army ROTC scholarship but was medically dq'ed.

you may be a doctor, but the venn diagram does not exclude you from being ignorant. i think you need to step away from this conversation as you just started with personal insults and a forced vacation would not be as fun.

im sorry you have such hatred, and i m even more sorry that you see Islam as just "rag heads and terrorists." I do not see that Iraq was a necessary conflict to engage ourselves in, you may disagree and Ill be happy to have a civil conversation with you regarding such if you wish.

Let's see here...Who started the personal insults? Do I need to show you your own post?

My reference the "rag head terrorists" is not hatred.....it is the way OUR LINE military refers to them....If you spent any time with the pointy tip of our spear....you would know.....Do you really think that our PC portrayal of our military forces is what it is really like?

Probably a good thing that you got DQ'ed.

You would probably wind up like Niedermeyer...

im not really seeing your point, i apologize if what im missing is blatantly obvious.

Does 9/11 some how allow military to use slurs like that on a public forum? i called him on it and he said i was insulting him and that i deserved to be a friendly fire casualty. then he stated that because i dont post alot here i should not be criticizing the vernacular of the "regulars."

again, im all for having a civil discussion.

You don't read too good...do you? Even stuff that you post your self.

That is an insult. I didn't just say you insulted me....you insulted me....plain as day....I even highlighted it for you....

And, I didn't say that you "deserved to be a ff casualty".....I made a prediction on what might happen to you if you were in the military....once again I highlighted it for you...because obviously you skip lines as you read.

And, yes, I don't believe people who never post here should be criticizing our language here....the regulars.


And as for a civil discussion....typical liberal flip flop....if you want a civil discussion....start by being civil.....didn't your mamma teach you anything.

 

[militarymd]

With all due respect Mil, and I mean that sincerely, I think one can argue that while it is difficult for someone without these experiences to understand the microcosm of war and all of it's accompanying emotions and indescribable situations, it is likewise difficult for someone so affected and entrenched in the military ideology to step back and see the world from a broader perspective. And one can similarly argue that the liberal media influencing the former group is balanced by the military propaganda influencing the latter. I don't pretend to understand a fraction of why the military does what it does overseas, and I would wager that the brave men and women carrying out their orders are likewise largely in the dark regarding true motivations.

orders given by the military's civilian leadership.....that's you....

 

[Southpaw]

Don't be victim to your own accusations and place words in MY mouth. I don't play those games.

Look dude...I was being nice and instead of responding appropriately you give me this crap. The text you bolded from usnavdoc's docs post clearly states that 'the terrorists were Muslim' and not that 'all Muslims are terrorist'. Again I ask, do you not see the difference?

Frankly I think both you and Plank owe usnavdoc a HUGE HUGE apology for completely bastardizing the intent of his posts. But you won't give it. I'm not putting words in your mouth or accusing you of anything other than clearly misinterpreting a post and jumping to completely unwarranted conclusions.

 

[Southpaw]

I guess the subtlety is lost in the text, but this sentence is the one that raised my eyebrow. My intent was not to spin anything, just find some clarification for what I thought was a gross generalization. Again, I appreciate your clarification and would rather you did not, as were the case, spin my take on your post to be more than what it was. Enjoy your vacation.

Give me a break. That text clearly states the terrorists being Muslim and he then further explains that terrorist precedes Muslim and not the other way around. You dudes are so friggin' quick to the trigger on this BS. I'm not putting any words in your mouth, just trying to give clarification to a post which you originally CLEARLY misinterpreted.

 

[Southpaw]

I don't know what you are reading, but I only chimed in on the one post that frankly stated, perhaps due to poor wording, that they were terrorists because they were Muslim

which post? and what poor wording?

here is usnavdoc's post

The key part of your statement is "In the United States." These are not people that were captured robbing a bank downtown or doing a driveby in south central LA. This is in a foreign country on the battlefield. The bottom line is that the terrorist ideological profile is that they are Muslim. They by there own volition commited these offenses against humanity. How many countless lives must be ended before you would be willing to react? Do you know what would happen if some of our citizens went over there and were caught commiting the same attrocities that they have commited? What laws would they be tried under?

to this post you responded:

Wow.

Really?

Clearly, the wording states the terrorists are Muslim, and not the inverse. You continually state you read a post that stated 'all Muslims are terrorists'. Perhaps I'm looking at the wrong post, so can you please show me that post?

 

[Planktonmd]

There are many things that go into creating the terrorist mindset just as there are with creating the mindset of any criminal. But by and large being Muslim is a factor.

This is where you prove all my previous points.
Thank you!
You spent sometime fighting in the middle east and you claim that you understand a culture and a religion enough to come to such a conclusion??
You could say that they are terrorists because they are religious fanatics and then you would be correct.
It's not a certain religion my friend, its being a fanatic to a certain religion or a certain idea that makes you a terrorist especially when some one (some intelligence agency) spends big money training you to fight the Russians then does not want to deal with the results.

 

[Southpaw]

This is where you prove all my previous points.
Thank you!
You spent sometime fighting in the middle east and you claim that you understand a culture and a religion enough to come to such a conclusion??
You could say that they are terrorists because they are religious fanatics and then you would be correct.
It's not a certain religion my friend, its being a fanatic to a certain religion or a certain idea that makes you a terrorist especially when some one (some intelligence agency) spends big money training you to fight the Russians then does not want to deal with the results.

How does the US assisting the Taliban when they fought the Russians effect fanaticism?

 

[Planktonmd]

How does the US assisting the Taliban when they fought the Russians effect fanaticism?

All the fighters who volunteered to fight that war where Muslim fanatics who came from all over the world motivated by one thing: religious fanaticism and that was not seen as a problem at that time, it was actually encouraged.
Then the fight ended and all these trained killers started looking for a new target.
Bin Laden himself is one of these guys.

 

[177983]

I would guess that the reason it seems spot on to you is because you've never actually read the Geneva Conventions.

pgg,

Touche. pgg 1, weldon 0. I had in fact read through parts of the Geneva Conventions, but in my haste, I mistook the first, second, third, and fourth as revisions instead of being aimed at different populations affected by war. I was reading the Fourth Convention aimed at civilian populations, so the qualifications there are obviously broader than for combatants. My bad.

Maybe the best thing to do with an insurgent who is caught with a weapons cache or supply of bomb-making materials is to detain them until the conflict is over, providing appropriate food, shelter, medical care, and the opportunity to pray in whichever direction they feel like.

I completely agree with statement, but you'll probably be completely unsurprised to know that my overall feelings haven't significantly changed. Yes, you're absolutely correct that the legitimate insurgent combatants aren't covered by the Geneva Conventions as I read them. And what you suggest does sound eminently fair to them. However, you speak as if you firmly believe that all the Gitmo detainees were combatants. I simply don't believe that.

According to an analysis of the information released by the DoD, only about 5-10% of the detainees were captured by American forces. Many (perhaps as high as 85%) were turned in by bounty hunters for $5,000. To me, this immediately calls into question the process of detaining people. So, if these people are random citizens pulled in by dishonest bounty hunters, the Geneva Conventions most certainly apply (as stated in the Fourth Convention, Part I, Article 4). In which case the provisions at Gitmo are borderline, at best.

pgg, if you'll allow me to wax philosophic for a moment, I think our differences really come down to individual rights vs. the good of the group. I wouldn't argue for a minute that some of the folks in Gitmo don't deserve to be there. I don't remember his name, but I remember one detainee's testimony being that as soon as he was freed he would go back to Afganistan and keep fighting the Americans. Sure, we can't let people like that go.

But I also strongly believe we have at least a handful, maybe more, of innocent people in Gitmo that have been locked up for going on 4-5 years now. To me it's unconscionable that we're detaining these people, even if their sacrifice is keeping others safe. So, I side with individual rights on this one. I think many of the military folk here (not sure if you're included or not), would side with the group good. They've lived and fought and seen friends die in situations where the individual may need to be sacrificed to help the group good, and even further, they were willing to be that individual if necessary. I have huge respect for that because it's a situation I will probably never be in, and it's a situation where I couldn't truly tell you if I'd be willing to be that individual. I understand as best I can where they're coming from, and I respect it. However, I won't agree with that viewpoint when it's used to unfairly detain people and otherwise remove their rights. That's what I think is happening to a unknown extent at Gitmo, and that's why I'm largely against the detentions there.

So, anyhow, it's been fun chatting. Feel free to respond with any thoughts.

 

[surrender903]

You don't read too good...do you? Even stuff that you post your self.

That is an insult. I didn't just say you insulted me....you insulted me....plain as day....I even highlighted it for you....

And, I didn't say that you "deserved to be a ff casualty".....I made a prediction on what might happen to you if you were in the military....once again I highlighted it for you...because obviously you skip lines as you read.

And, yes, I don't believe people who never post here should be criticizing our language here....the regulars.


And as for a civil discussion....typical liberal flip flop....if you want a civil discussion....start by being civil.....didn't your mamma teach you anything.

so calling muslims "rag heads" makes you intelligent then? what about calling vietnamese "gooks?" or japanese "japs"? how about black people N******? what about white people honkeys? how about in every political discussion we have from now on i start referring to caucasians as honkeys or cracker?

i started out by you werent very classy by calling a group of people an ethnic slur. where do you live that its alright to be in a public forum to make such a reference?

 

[usnavdoc]

This is where you prove all my previous points.
Thank you!
You spent sometime fighting in the middle east and you claim that you understand a culture and a religion enough to come to such a conclusion??
You could say that they are terrorists because they are religious fanatics and then you would be correct.
It's not a certain religion my friend, its being a fanatic to a certain religion or a certain idea that makes you a terrorist especially when some one (some intelligence agency) spends big money training you to fight the Russians then does not want to deal with the results.

There you go still misrepresenting what I have said. So again **** you plank! There is no sense talking to you since you have the mindset of a toddler.

 

[Planktonmd]

There you go still misrepresenting what I have said. So again **** you plank! There is no sense talking to you since you have the mindset of a toddler.

You already said all you that have to say (which isn't much to start with) so I am not expecting anything of value from you.
You could disagree with me without using cuss words and infantile behavior but if that's all you know then you are excused.

 

[usnavdoc]

You already said all you that have to say (which isn't much to start with) so I am not expecting anything of value from you.
You could disagree with me without using cuss words and infantile behavior but if that's all you know then you are excused.

More of your arrogance. We clearly value different things in this world so why would you expect anything of value from me. I likewise expect nothing from you.

 

[Trisomy13]

which post? and what poor wording?

here is usnavdoc's post



to this post you responded:



Clearly, the wording states the terrorists are Muslim, and not the inverse. You continually state you read a post that stated 'all Muslims are terrorists'. Perhaps I'm looking at the wrong post, so can you please show me that post?

sorry, but i stand by my initial assertion that "the..profile is that they are Muslim" can really only be interpreted one way. maybe it was intended another way, in which case we should be arguing about poor grammar and sentence structure.

and i am satisfied with the clarification i received, and don't intend to argue about grammar anymore, so i'm done with this.

have a good one, stud. 😉

 

[Arch Guillotti]

My reference the "rag head terrorists" is not hatred.....it is the way OUR LINE military refers to them

So because others use a particular slur means that it is ok for everyone to use it?

 

[Arch Guillotti]

so it matters how many times i post now? do you need to compare numbers to make your argument sound?

You are welcome to post in here, just like everyone else.

However, the forum culture (for better or for worse) is that you can't roll in here like a tumbleweed for the first time and not get some grief for it.

 

[militarymd]

So because others use a particular slur means that it is ok for everyone to use it?

did I say that?

I used that slur because others who I identify with used it.....did I say that there fore it is "ok" for everyone to use it???

if you don't want to use it....don't.....just like ...if you don't want to see porn don't go and see it....but don't tell me what to do.....or judge me for doing it.