Is there a way to learn pathology without reading big robbins?

[ghiblijiang]

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I'm a first year and we're about to start pathology. My school doesn't teach pathology and makes us read big robbins. Lectures are basically outlines of how to read robbins and are sparse in between. I don't learn well reading and I read slowly. I'm a visual learner so I learn better from drawing road maps and doing questions. I plan on using pathoma, sketchy path, and robbins review book but I need something that can teach me the concepts and big pictures in pathology as a first pass. I'm wondering what resources should I use? Also, for boards, when should I start using goljan's audios?

 

[trs88]

Pathoma, for real. I never read robbins and did just my school lectures. Pathoma makes it all so much easier. Or you could try Boards and Beyond. For Goljan, it's probably a good idea to start now since each audio lecture is around an hour long. So I would just do one a day and focus the rest of your day on UFAP and extras.

 

[WedgeDawg]

pathoma

that dude is a wizard or something

 

[ghiblijiang]

Pathoma, for real. I never read robbins and did just my school lectures. Pathoma makes it all so much easier. Or you could try Boards and Beyond. For Goljan, it's probably a good idea to start now since each audio lecture is around an hour long. So I would just do one a day and focus the rest of your day on UFAP and extras.

Thanks! Our lectures don't teach much though and there are few lectures in between, we're basically forced to learn by reading robbins so we're on our own. Are pathoma, boards and beyond, and goljan enough to give me a complete picture and the logic behind diseases?

 

[WedgeDawg]

Thanks! Our lectures don't teach much though and there are few lectures in between, we're basically forced to learn by reading robbins so we're on our own. Are pathoma, boards and beyond, and goljan enough to give me a complete picture and the logic behind diseases?

I would say doing the basic Step 1 prep work (UWorld, Pathoma, FA, Sketchy) + being an engaged and active learner in your clinical years (reading about your patients, reading pertinent/landmark trials and guidelines, and being engaged on rounds, particularly when other more senior people are presenting their assessments and plans) is going to give you an excellent foundation for learning about disease and how that incorporates itself into a clinical setting. It's going to be impossible to know everything, and so setting yourself up with a foundational framework is the most efficient use of your time that will lend itself to learning more deeply when you start to specialize.

I have never touched boards and beyond, goljan, or robbins so I can't comment on any of those things. I will say that learning for step 1 and doing your clinical year really augment each other in terms of learning and I feel more secure in my knowledge (though I think most people probably know a lot more than me) and application after having done both compared to how I have/would have felt doing either one individually.

 

[Stagg737]

I'm going to give a differing opinion on Pathoma. It's a great boards review resource, and also a great way to get an intro feel for whatever subject you're about to study before diving into another resource. However, it is in no way comprehensive and doesn't hold a candle to Robbins or Goljan in terms of depth of the subject or even topics covered. Imo there were a lot of things I read in Robbins (both big and baby) which weren't in Pathoma at all. If you don't want to read big Robbins I understand that and I think baby Robbins is probably adequate to cover all the topics necessary, but imo pathoma alone is lacking and I would not consider it a comprehensive enough resource to legitimately learn pathology.

In short, Pathoma is a fantastic review resource and the guy is great at condensing a lot of material into a relatively short time-frame. So absolutely worth it as a review source for boards and right before exams. Just not the primary source I'd ever recommend to initially learn pathology.

 

[Skiiiiiing]

I'm a first year and we're about to start pathology. My school doesn't teach pathology and makes us read big robbins. Lectures are basically outlines of how to read robbins and are sparse in between. I don't learn well reading and I read slowly. I'm a visual learner so I learn better from drawing road maps and doing questions. I plan on using pathoma, sketchy path, and robbins review book but I need something that can teach me the concepts and big pictures in pathology as a first pass. I'm wondering what resources should I use? Also, for boards, when should I start using goljan's audios?

Pathoma is gold as a starting place and for board prep for a mid-range score.

Robbins is always rigorous, but some of the chapters are very poorly written while others are brilliant. The extent of engangement with Robbins should be governed by the demands of your program, because it's level of detail is overkill for boards and the quality of writing is inconsistent

 

[Skiiiiiing]

I'm going to give a differing opinion on Pathoma. It's a great boards review resource, and also a great way to get an intro feel for whatever subject you're about to study before diving into another resource. However, it is in no way comprehensive and doesn't hold a candle to Robbins or Goljan in terms of depth of the subject or even topics covered. Imo there were a lot of things I read in Robbins (both big and baby) which weren't in Pathoma at all. If you don't want to read big Robbins I understand that and I think baby Robbins is probably adequate to cover all the topics necessary, but imo pathoma alone is lacking and I would not consider it a comprehensive enough resource to legitimately learn pathology.

In short, Pathoma is a fantastic review resource and the guy is great at condensing a lot of material into a relatively short time-frame. So absolutely worth it as a review source for boards and right before exams. Just not the primary source I'd ever recommend to initially learn pathology.

While I agree with most of this, big Robbins is clearly overkill in some areas. Infectious diseases is the worst, where they have some they give over 1500 words to that are lightly tested - if tested at all - and where incidence is below 10k per year in developed

 

[libertyyne]

I'm going to give a differing opinion on Pathoma. It's a great boards review resource, and also a great way to get an intro feel for whatever subject you're about to study before diving into another resource. However, it is in no way comprehensive and doesn't hold a candle to Robbins or Goljan in terms of depth of the subject or even topics covered. Imo there were a lot of things I read in Robbins (both big and baby) which weren't in Pathoma at all. If you don't want to read big Robbins I understand that and I think baby Robbins is probably adequate to cover all the topics necessary, but imo pathoma alone is lacking and I would not consider it a comprehensive enough resource to legitimately learn pathology.

In short, Pathoma is a fantastic review resource and the guy is great at condensing a lot of material into a relatively short time-frame. So absolutely worth it as a review source for boards and right before exams. Just not the primary source I'd ever recommend to initially learn pathology.

Do you think goljan covers more topics compared to pathoma? I always thought goljan was for the reasoning associated with conditions compared to comprehensive coverage of topics.

 

[Oso]

I think I read one paragraph and the description of two images from Robbins before I donated the book to some random lounge at my school.

Read pathoma.

Is it as “good” as Robbins? Obviously it’s not as in depth or detailed, but for the typical med student pathoma is more than enough and will set you up well for boards. After step 1, you really don’t learn much pathology anyways (unless you do path rotations), so I would learn what you need to pass your curricular exams and do well on boards, and no more. If you want to learn stuff in great detail I would focus on pathophys and meds instead because those things will keep coming up in clinical years.

$0.02

 

[Skiiiiiing]

Do you think goljan covers more topics compared to pathoma? I always thought goljan was for the reasoning associated with conditions compared to comprehensive coverage of topics.

Goljan is more comprehensive, but more brute force than intuitive. I found its reasoning weaker than Pathoma and much weaker than Robbins.

 

[theonlytycrane]

Pathoma SOM

 

[libertyyne]

Goljan is more comprehensive, but more brute force than intuitive. I found its reasoning weaker than Pathoma and much weaker than Robbins.

What did you score on the step?

 

[ClinPathDO]

I'm a first year and we're about to start pathology. My school doesn't teach pathology and makes us read big robbins. Lectures are basically outlines of how to read robbins and are sparse in between. I don't learn well reading and I read slowly. I'm a visual learner so I learn better from drawing road maps and doing questions. I plan on using pathoma, sketchy path, and robbins review book but I need something that can teach me the concepts and big pictures in pathology as a first pass. I'm wondering what resources should I use? Also, for boards, when should I start using goljan's audios?

I watched pathoma, read rapid review pathology by Goodwin and read Robbins.

 

[Stagg737]

While I agree with most of this, big Robbins is clearly overkill in some areas. Infectious diseases is the worst, where they have some they give over 1500 words to that are lightly tested - if tested at all - and where incidence is below 10k per year in developed

Definitely agree that big Robbins is overkill at times. Personally I'd rather read too much than not see something at all though, which I felt was the case on the tests/sections I where I only used Pathoma. I think baby Robbins is a solid medium between the two as it keeps the important parts of big Robbins without getting too wordy. I would personally recommend Pathoma + Baby Robbins for those trying to learn path, and annotating your pathoma book with stuff that is missing so you can just review that during dedicated time.

Do you think goljan covers more topics compared to pathoma? I always thought goljan was for the reasoning associated with conditions compared to comprehensive coverage of topics.

I honestly don't know as I used Pathoma + big Robbins and path was my strongest section of my boards breakdown next to biochem. I had several classmates who used Pathoma + Goljan and loved it. They all felt very confident about path and liked the resource, but I can't really say much more than that other than I believe it's a valid comprehensive source based on everyone I've talked to. Sorry I can't be more helpful there.


Personal advice for those wanting to use only Pathoma would be to supplement it with baby Robbins. It's comprehensive enough that you fill in the gaps that Pathoma has but short enough that it's still much more manageable that big Robbins.

 

[deleted645092]

+1 to Pathoma being great to get down enough to pass classes. I have used Pathoma for all of Path as the starting point for each system, since it is so condensed and really covers the "high-yield" stuff. Then I'll go onto the professor's lectures and fit in Robbins whenever I can. The benefit to doing Pathoma first is that you get the framework, and then some of the more confusing details of Robbins actually make sense the first time around. For the first few blocks of Path I did Robbins and our lectures first, then Pathoma, and realized that I was making weird notes that didn't really make sense because I didn't really know what some things meant from just Robbins/ lectures, but finally clicked after listening to Pathoma.

However, I don't have the Pathoma text, just the videos, and have never used Goljan but my roommate swears by him. I will probably listen to 1 a day during dedicated.

 

[jcve34]

Yeah knowing what program you are in there is no way around it. You have to read Robbins to pass. For those that don’t know which program this is the prof will test on minutiae (like information that is only in the caption of a figure).

Pathoma will give you a framework for what concepts are important. Sattar actually is following Robbins and using the exact same examples Robbins does.

Watch a section of Pathoma then read the corresponding section of Robbins. It’s like a combined 1st and 2nd pass.

Go back through and outline for your 3rd pass.

4+ passes will be reviewing your outline and doing questions. It’s a lot I know.

 

[Mr. D.O.five]

Yeah knowing what program you are in there is no way around it. You have to read Robbins to pass. For those that don’t know which program this is the prof will test on minutiae (like information that is only in the caption of a figure).

Pathoma will give you a framework for what concepts are important. Sattar actually is following Robbins and using the exact same examples Robbins does.

Watch a section of Pathoma then read the corresponding section of Robbins. It’s like a combined 1st and 2nd pass.

Go back through and outline for your 3rd pass.

4+ passes will be reviewing your outline and doing questions. It’s a lot I know.

That's exactly what I've been doing + Anki'ing minutiae.

 

[ghiblijiang]

Thanks for your replies everyone! I think I'll take some risk and experiment with this combo: pathoma, goljan rapid review, robbins review book, and pocket robbins. If I can pass with this combo I might stick with this because I'd have time for repetition and re-reading. If I do big robbins my reading speed will limit how many times I can go through the book for retention. Will report back when I start failing exams!

 

[Skiiiiiing]

Yeah knowing what program you are in there is no way around it. You have to read Robbins to pass. For those that don’t know which program this is the prof will test on minutiae (like information that is only in the caption of a figure).

Pathoma will give you a framework for what concepts are important. Sattar actually is following Robbins and using the exact same examples Robbins does.

Watch a section of Pathoma then read the corresponding section of Robbins. It’s like a combined 1st and 2nd pass.

Go back through and outline for your 3rd pass.

4+ passes will be reviewing your outline and doing questions. It’s a lot I know.

I think this is clearly the best method described.

The minutiae in big Robbins probably isn't worth hitting super hard unless you are aiming for over 250

 

[mcloaf]

The minutiae in big Robbins probably isn't worth hitting super hard unless you are aiming for over 250

I don't think anyone I know who scored over 250 ever even opened big robbins