is there any disadvantage of not taking upper class ?

[yoonyang]

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Is there any disadvantage of not taking upper class when applying ?
I am a transfer student, and I just finished to take the pre-required classes. And I am trying to apply this year but one of my friends says that I need higher GPA than others since I have not taken any upper division class besides pre-required class.
is this true ?

 

[ddsnotdmd]

Is there any disadvantage of not taking upper class when applying ?
I am a transfer student, and I just finished to take the pre-required classes. And I am trying to apply this year but one of my friends says that I need higher GPA than others since I have not taken any upper division class besides pre-required class.
is this true ?

Not really. Some schools require prerequisite courses like A&P, Biochem, Microbio. But others just want the bare minimum. As long as your GPA is high and your DAT is acceptable you will be fine.

 

[Seamonkey Doc]

Is there any disadvantage of not taking upper class when applying ?
I am a transfer student, and I just finished to take the pre-required classes. And I am trying to apply this year but one of my friends says that I need higher GPA than others since I have not taken any upper division class besides pre-required class.
is this true ?

There is a disadvantage.

Even if you have a 4.0 GPA from your pre-requisites, it's still encouraged that you take a few upper level science classes. Plenty of applicants take other biology classes like microbiology, biochemistry, etc even if they are not science majors.

 

[Bis-GMA111]

i mean, it is highly recommended if you want to be competitive (you need to do well of course)

but not required (in most schools)

 

[wired202808]

Is there any disadvantage of not taking upper class when applying ?
I am a transfer student, and I just finished to take the pre-required classes. And I am trying to apply this year but one of my friends says that I need higher GPA than others since I have not taken any upper division class besides pre-required class.
is this true ?

As long as you meet all the prereqs necessary for school X then you will be OK. Upper level is necessary for some schools but otherwise it wont make you a better candidate. Overall sGPA matters a lot more than having a few extra classes.

 

[Seamonkey Doc]

i mean, it is highly recommended if you want to be competitive (you need to do well of course)

but not required (in most schools)

This sums it up pretty well.

Just wanted to clarify....

Taking extra science classes (upper biology) will good for your transcript and will help your sci/BCP GPA if you do well. It can even help you out for the DAT (lots of cell bio/microbiology on there). Some schools have extra classes as prerequisites (usually biochemistry or microbiology or anatomy/physiology). So since most applicants go beyond the bare minimum, it would be advantageous to consider taking at least one or two more upper science courses.

Or you can save all the upper science for dental school 🙂

 

[wired202808]

so ye dont worry you'll be fine with no upper level courses.

 

[pk62281]

so ye dont worry you'll be fine with no upper level courses.

Wired.. I sometimes wonder if you're just trolling. It's the way you so confidently give incorrect or knee jerk blanket statements that make me wonder if you're serious or not.

To the OP. Will the lack of upper level science courses hurt you? I think it depends. I know one guy with a 3.95 GPA in engineering that got into almost all the schools he applied to. He only took the 2 intro Bio courses, 2 semesters of Gen Chem, and one Orgo class, and he took them all at a community college. He had a bunch of research experience in engineering and rocked the DAT. He had no problem convincing the schools that he is a rockstar student even without upper level science courses.

If you're like me and have a lower GPA (3.3) and didn't major in a natural Science (I majored in engineering), it might be a good idea to plan to take some upper level science courses beyond the prereqs. I've talked to several adcoms about my application, and they specially told me that one of their reservations was that I didn't have a lot of upper level Biology courses. Temple told me that they like to see at least 55 hours of bio/chem/phys. One adcom at UIC thought it was silly that I was even applying with only the intro to bio courses and microbio. They still gave me an interview though because of my high DAT, but I think I got rejected.

Anyways, the answer is complicated. It depends on your situation.

 

[pk62281]

As long as you meet all the prereqs necessary for school X then you will be OK. Upper level is necessary for some schools but otherwise it wont make you a better candidate. Overall sGPA matters a lot more than having a few extra classes.

The statement above is false.

 

[wired202808]

Wired.. I sometimes wonder if you're just trolling. It's the way you so confidently give incorrect or knee jerk blanket statements that make me wonder if you're serious or not.

To the OP. Will the lack of upper level science courses hurt you? I think it depends. I know one guy with a 3.95 GPA in engineering that got into almost all the schools he applied to. He only took the 2 intro Bio courses, 2 semesters of Gen Chem, and one Orgo class, and he took them all at a community college. He had a bunch of research experience in engineering and rocked the DAT. He had no problem convincing the schools that he is a rockstar student even without upper level science courses.

If you're like me and have a lower GPA (3.3) and didn't major in a natural Science (I majored in engineering), it might be a good idea to plan to take some upper level science courses beyond the prereqs. I've talked to several adcoms about my application, and they specially told me that one of their reservations was that I didn't have a lot of upper level Biology courses. Temple told me that they like to see at least 55 hours of bio/chem/phys. One adcom at UIC thought it was silly that I was even applying with only the intro to bio courses and microbio. They still gave me an interview though because of my high DAT, but I think I got rejected.

Anyways, the answer is complicated. It depends on your situation.

Read your own statement before you call others a troll. You CANT take all necessary prereqs at a CC and expect to be viewed as a serious candidate. Quite a few schools have policies that prevent you taking majority of classes in a CC.

Some schools list on their websites that taking upper level courses is recommended, so for those schools it might or might not help. However, quite a lot of schools offer no guidance on their site past the basic prereqs. Will upper levels help? Maybe or maybe not, But the point is that not having upper level courses for certain schools will cause your chance to be exactly the same as they were.

 

[wired202808]

The statement above is false.

Its not false, its not inline with your expectation, The answer is maybe or maybe not. What a few adcoms answered at certain schools should not be used as the majority factor for all schools. Upper level bio courses look good on paper and yes theyre good to take for general knowledge. But its not wise to assume that you will get into school X because you have a few extra courses that they dont require.

 

[pk62281]

As long as you meet all the prereqs necessary for school X then you will be OK. Upper level is necessary for some schools but otherwise it wont make you a better candidate. Overall sGPA matters a lot more than having a few extra classes.

This statement is contradicting the statement below

Its not false, its not inline with your expectation, The answer is maybe or maybe not. What a few adcoms answered at certain schools should not be used as the majority factor for all schools. Upper level bio courses look good on paper and yes theyre good to take for general knowledge. But its not wise to assume that you will get into school X because you have a few extra courses that they dont require.

Btw wired, I hope you don't take offense to all this. It's fun debating with you

 

[Longcatislong]

My situation my be different, as I am in a post-bacc program for career changers.

Anyway, our program director told us a guy who applied to med school two cycles ago. He "graduated" our post-bacc program having taken all the pre-med (pre-dental) requisite courses and had a 4.00 GPA. He didn't get into any med schools because (according to the director), he didn't take any upper div sciences. This guy did end up getting off of a waitlist at a school something like that day after classes started -- lucky guy.

Anyway, the point is, you should probably take at least 1 or 2 upper division sciences. Plus, dont' most dental school require biochem and physio at the very least?

 

[Seamonkey Doc]

My situation my be different, as I am in a post-bacc program for career changers.

Anyway, our program director told us a guy who applied to med school two cycles ago. He "graduated" our post-bacc program having taken all the pre-med (pre-dental) requisite courses and had a 4.00 GPA. He didn't get into any med schools because (according to the director), he didn't take any upper div sciences. This guy did end up getting off of a waitlist at a school something like that day after classes started -- lucky guy.

Anyway, the point is, you should probably take at least 1 or 2 upper division sciences. Plus, dont' most dental school require biochem and physio at the very least?

I've heard something along the lines of: With the way schools look at Biochem, it should practically be a requirement. You'll see plenty of schools say something like "upper level sciences like (insert course or courses) are strongly recommended".

What I'm wondering is... Let's say the OP has a 3.7 overall/sci/BCP GPA right now. It's pretty competitive for dental school. He also has a nice DAT score, whatever that is. Now there's candidate 2. Candidate 2 also has a 3.7 overfall/sci/BCP GPA and the same DAT score. However candidate 2 has taken classes like Biochem, Microbiology, and Anatomy and Physiology.
Who is going to look more competitive? Real question here.

 

[wired202808]

This statement is contradicting the statement below



Btw wired, I hope you don't take offense to all this. It's fun debating with you

I stick with my opinion. I took upper level courses because I applied to schools that required them, they did increase my sGPA so they probably helped in that area. But otherwise I doubt I wouldn't get into schools.

 

[wired202808]

My situation my be different, as I am in a post-bacc program for career changers.

Anyway, our program director told us a guy who applied to med school two cycles ago. He "graduated" our post-bacc program having taken all the pre-med (pre-dental) requisite courses and had a 4.00 GPA. He didn't get into any med schools because (according to the director), he didn't take any upper div sciences. This guy did end up getting off of a waitlist at a school something like that day after classes started -- lucky guy.

Anyway, the point is, you should probably take at least 1 or 2 upper division sciences. Plus, dont' most dental school require biochem and physio at the very least?

Not all schools require Biochem and AP. A good majority of them do hence it makes sense to take the classes. I took upper level courses because I applied to schools that required them. But I dont think a school will choose to admit you simply because you took 2 extra classes 😉 think about it logically.

 

[pk62281]

Not all schools require Biochem and AP. A good majority of them do hence it makes sense to take the classes. I took upper level courses because I applied to schools that required them. But I dont think a school will choose to admit you simply because you took 2 extra classes 😉 think about it logically.

I'm being serious, wired. Are you trolling? When did anyone say anything even close to that?

 

[wired202808]

I'm being serious, wired. Are you trolling? When did anyone say anything even close to that?

Im offering my opinion. Please stop harassing me. Thanks 🙂

 

[pk62281]

Im offering my opinion. Please stop harassing me. Thanks 🙂

Ok, fair enough. I won't accuse of you trolling anymore, but if I disagree with your advice I'll state my opinion as well.

Sorry about that..

 

[iralex801]

As long as you meet all the prereqs necessary for school X then you will be OK. Upper level is necessary for some schools but otherwise it wont make you a better candidate. Overall sGPA matters a lot more than having a few extra classes.

This statement is false. Upper level bios aren't required by some schools, but it still makes you a better candidate if you do well in them.

I know I'm getting technical haha and I know what you probably meant to say, but I just wanted to prove that the infamous, genius Wired was wrong in one of his statements 🙂.

 

[Seamonkey Doc]

This statement is false. Upper level bios aren't required by some schools, but it still makes you a better candidate if you do well in them.

Agreed. It seems pretty obvious.

 

[tothepark]

To make it simple:
It can ONLY help if you take upper division classes AND do well in them. Obviously, if you bomb the upper division classes it will raise atleast 2 flags:
1) sGPA goes down
2) ADCOM thinks "is this guy going to be able to handle the 1st 2 years of d-school.

However, if you do well:
1) sGPA goes up
2) ADCOM sees that you will be able to handle 1st 2 years of lectures.

Talking to current d-schools, most students say that taking upper-divison classes like microbio and biochem (even if they didnt do so well) definitely helped them when they took these classes at d-school.

 

[iralex801]

To make it simple:
It can ONLY help if you take upper division classes AND do well in them. Obviously, if you bomb the upper division classes it will raise atleast 2 flags:
1) sGPA goes down
2) ADCOM thinks "is this guy going to be able to handle the 1st 2 years of d-school.

However, if you do well:
1) sGPA goes up
2) ADCOM sees that you will be able to handle 1st 2 years of lectures.

Talking to current d-schools, most students say that taking upper-divison classes like microbio and biochem (even if they didnt do so well) definitely helped them when they took these classes at d-school.

👍 I agree with this. This is probably what Wired meant to say, but I was just getting technical because that's not what his statement implied.

Cmon Wired. When you're a celebrity, you know everyone's watching your every move! I suggest you proofread 3x to keep the critics from harassing you .

 

[wired202808]

👍 I agree with this. This is probably what Wired meant to say, but I was just getting technical because that's not what his statement implied.

Cmon Wired. When you're a celebrity, you know everyone's watching your every move! I suggest you proofread 3x to keep the critics from harassing you .

haters gonna hate. What can I say 🙂 Obv you can get cute and say well 2 extra classes will def make the ADCOMS appreciate me more. but we all know thats not true. I can see 5 to 6 upper level courses providing use for schools that require them and as park said it makes sense if they raise your GPA. But the point is its not IMPOSSIBLE to get into a school that doesnt require upper level courses if you dont have them.

Since you wanna be technical 😉 you should also go back and read my post on why I think you should have upper level bio courses but thats really for the schools that require them.

 

[Seamonkey Doc]

To make it simple:
It can ONLY help if you take upper division classes AND do well in them. Obviously, if you bomb the upper division classes it will raise atleast 2 flags:
1) sGPA goes down
2) ADCOM thinks "is this guy going to be able to handle the 1st 2 years of d-school.

However, if you do well:
1) sGPA goes up
2) ADCOM sees that you will be able to handle 1st 2 years of lectures.

Talking to current d-schools, most students say that taking upper-divison classes like microbio and biochem (even if they didnt do so well) definitely helped them when they took these classes at d-school.

👍
That's what I was trying to say as well. If it's helps, that great, you'll be more competitive. If it doesn't, well....that's something to think about.

Definitely agree that OP should talk to current dental school students and see how/if these upper level courses helped them.

 

[iralex801]

haters gonna hate. What can I say 🙂 Obv you can get cute and say well 2 extra classes will def make the ADCOMS appreciate me more. but we all know thats not true. I can see 5 to 6 upper level courses providing use for schools that require them and as park said it makes sense if they raise your GPA. But the point is its not IMPOSSIBLE to get into a school that doesnt require upper level courses if you dont have them.

Since you wanna be technical 😉 you should also go back and read my post on why I think you should have upper level bio courses but thats really for the schools that require them.

Oh my dear friend, Wired. I don't see where anyone put a specific number (where did anyone say 2?) to how many upper level bios you need to take in order for ADCOMs to be impressed. I and others have just said that if you take upper level bios and do well it will help. In your previous post, you stated that taking any upper level bios won't make you a better candidate. Now you're saying 5-6 upper level bios may help lol. Also, I don't see anyone saying that it's not possible to get into a school without upper level bios. It seems you are putting words into people's mouths lol.

I think you should re-edit your post 1 more time you might get it right 😛. It should be like, "Sorry. You're right iralex801. My original post didn't clarify what I meant to say. But this is what I meant to say .... (then you can write what you meant)."

Based on technicality, I win! Admit you are wrong Wired. Concede to me! 😀

 

[ddsnotdmd]

this is funny

 

[wired202808]

Oh my dear friend, Wired. I don't see where anyone put a specific number (where did anyone say 2?) to how many upper level bios you need to take in order for ADCOMs to be impressed. I and others have just said that if you take upper level bios and do well it will help. In your previous post, you stated that taking any upper level bios won't make you a better candidate. Now you're saying 5-6 upper level bios may help lol. Also, I don't see anyone saying that it's not possible to get into a school without upper level bios. It seems you are putting words into people's mouths lol.

I think you should re-edit your post 1 more time you might get it right 😛. It should be like, "Sorry. You're right iralex801. My original post didn't clarify what I meant to say. But this is what I meant to say .... (then you can write what you meant)."

Based on technicality, I win! Admit you are wrong Wired. Concede to me! 😀

not even in your wildest dreams. 😉

 

[omnipoDent]

Oh my dear friend, Wired. I don't see where anyone put a specific number (where did anyone say 2?) to how many upper level bios you need to take in order for ADCOMs to be impressed. I and others have just said that if you take upper level bios and do well it will help. In your previous post, you stated that taking any upper level bios won't make you a better candidate. Now you're saying 5-6 upper level bios may help lol. Also, I don't see anyone saying that it's not possible to get into a school without upper level bios. It seems you are putting words into people's mouths lol.

I think you should re-edit your post 1 more time you might get it right 😛. It should be like, "Sorry. You're right iralex801. My original post didn't clarify what I meant to say. But this is what I meant to say .... (then you can write what you meant)."

Based on technicality, I win! Admit you are wrong Wired. Concede to me! 😀

 

[wired202808]

😛

 

[Seamonkey Doc]

Oh my dear friend, Wired. I don't see where anyone put a specific number (where did anyone say 2?) to how many upper level bios you need to take in order for ADCOMs to be impressed. I and others have just said that if you take upper level bios and do well it will help. In your previous post, you stated that taking any upper level bios won't make you a better candidate. Now you're saying 5-6 upper level bios may help lol. Also, I don't see anyone saying that it's not possible to get into a school without upper level bios. It seems you are putting words into people's mouths lol.

I think you should re-edit your post 1 more time you might get it right 😛. It should be like, "Sorry. You're right iralex801. My original post didn't clarify what I meant to say. But this is what I meant to say .... (then you can write what you meant)."

Based on technicality, I win! Admit you are wrong Wired. Concede to me! 😀

Nicely written, I like the humour