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Leaving two volatile careers for one even worse is a foolish move.
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All of those comments are directly in opposition to each other. Building stability, security and a future for your family and dependents does not mean going to school for 4 - 8 years when you have two viable careers that have a lot of flexibility within them already. You can chase your purpose, for sure, but don't do it under the guise of financial stability.
As far as age goes, I'm not too far from you (a couple of years), so that angle won't work for me because I am in a better position to judge our field than you. I have been in this field for nearly two decades full time. I know exactly what the field entails on multiple levels. I KNOW the field, and i KNOW the responsibilities intimately, and I still weighed the decision heavily. I don't have dependents either. I would not be doing this at this age without (a) knowing beyond a shadow of a doubt what my actual day to day job looks like in the nitty gritty, and (b) without being a team with my spouse (who works full time).
This entire thread reads back like a troll, or someone who is ignorant enough about the realities of the field to call nursing and IT volatile but want to jump ship to veterinary medicine.
You presume much. I think this has moved well past a productive exchange. You’ve assigned intent - such as believing I think I’m smarter than others, dismissing people in the field, or assuming my situation is uniquely incomparable - none of which I’ve explicitly stated. That’s your interpretation, not my position. I am here for discussion, not to debate the validity of experience or make comparison shots.
It’s a bit contradictory to criticize me for making assumptions while simultaneously doing the same. If we’re going to have a fair discussion, it has to be grounded in what’s actually being said, not inferred or projected.
You’re attributing positions and intent to me that I haven’t stated, particularly around claiming superiority, dismissing others’ experiences, or believing my situation is uniquely exempt. That’s not what I’ve said, and continuing to frame it that way isn’t constructive.
I’ve clearly acknowledged throughout the thread the downsides to veterinary medicine - that this field is volatile, financially complex, and emotionally demanding. The fact that I’m still evaluating it doesn’t mean I’m ignoring those points; it means I’m weighing them against my own goals, background, and tolerance for risk.
At the same time, this has shifted from a discussion into something more adversarial with you. I am not going to be a punching bag for your vet school woes. You are on my feed, and if you have nothing more to contribute, so be it. Nonetheless, I’ve received and continue (despite another assumption) to receive a range of thoughtful, helpful perspectives from others, even when they disagreed with me. This exchange, however, feels more focused on arguing with someone who has perceived a slight than sharing insight.
I’m not interested in debating character or continuing a back-and-forth that isn’t adding value. So I’m going to step away from this part of the conversation.
I do appreciate the time you’ve taken to respond, and I wish you the best moving forward.
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Great information with stats.
1) I am right at the 200k border after running the numbers. Now, I do have the option of leveraging the military HPSP, and other loan forgiveness programs. Which makes it more appealing per say. No private loans.
2) This is what I a little concerned about - is slipping into a unforgiving role with another boot on the neck. I realize that at the bottom of the totem pole, one has to learn of course, but is this standard for all veterinarian clinics nationally, private or chains?
3) You would think with only 30 schools for DVM (if that is correct) vs 180 for MD/DO...that this was be more gate kept. What are your thoughts about declining a seat and reattempting to apply later with the same college? I feel this would effectively black list me from future admissions decisions.
First, I’m not framing veterinary medicine as a path to financial stability in the short term. I agree with you, that would be unrealistic given the time and cost involved. What I am evaluating is whether the long-term outcome, financially, professionally, and personally, aligns better with what I’m looking for than my current trajectory. Those are two different conversations.
Second, I don’t think it’s accurate to suggest that pursuing this path is incompatible with building stability for a family. It changes the timeline and risk profile, absolutely, but people do make these transitions later in life, with dependents, by planning intentionally. Whether that tradeoff is worth it is exactly what I’m working through. Likewise I have seen veterinarians that have done well for themselves, especially specialists.
On the experience side, I don’t doubt that you know the field well, and I respect that. But I think there’s an assumption being made about me that I don’t have relevant exposure or understanding because I’m asking questions or pushing back on certain points. Of course there are many who have become detached or disenchanted with the field. I’ve spent time on the technician side and remain involved, including in telemedicine. I’m not coming into this blind either, I’m trying to reconcile what I’ve seen firsthand with what’s being shared here.
As for volatility, my point isn’t that one field is “safe” and another isn’t. It’s that volatility exists across multiple professions, just in different forms. Healthcare, emergency services, and even IT leadership all carry instability, whether that’s burnout, organizational risk, or external pressures. So the question for me isn’t how to avoid volatility entirely, but which type of risk, workload, and fulfillment tradeoffs I’m more willing to accept long-term.
I’m not here to dismiss your experience, and I don’t think we actually disagree on many of the underlying realities. Where we differ is in how those realities are interpreted and applied to an individual decision.
It is consistently reiterated on this forum that nobody should be banking on loan forgiveness programs as those change with each new administration. The dwindling of repayment plans is also of concern. If you take home $6k a month as a new grad, and half of that is paid to your loans, is $3,000 a month enough to support your four dependents?
Many of us are not detached or disenchanted, we are open and honest about the realities of the job of the profession we love so much. To insinuate that we are less than reliable sources of information about the field we are actively working in and have been for years is borderline insulting.
I really appreciate you taking the time to lay this out the way you did, this is the kind of perspective that’s actually helpful.
I don’t disagree with the realities you’re describing. The financial burden, especially with current loan structures and interest accrual, is one of the biggest factors I’m trying to weigh. If financial was not an option - I may have little to be concerned with. I’m not looking at this through the lens of immediate financial stability, I understand that this would be a step backward financially before it ever becomes a step forward, if it does at all. That’s part of what makes this decision so heavy.
Right now, we are unable to press forward in giving our kids anything. We live check to check, and I need to find a way to reinvent myself. I tried business, IT, Nursing, consulting, etc etc. But the passion is not there, and I find myself in a circular logic, with comfort being the killer. We were dealt an unfortunate hand - my wife cannot work, I am the variable and the breadwinner, and the determination was this: either embrace 4 years of turmoil for a "potential" ROI and success in my efforts at running a clinic and boarding facility, accepting some improved income from the start - especially without significant loan debt. Or find myself subsisting in a role where I have no more ceiling in terms of progression or value, never mind the passion.
If you recall I net 68k for 5 people! It is the hope that I will be able to help the kids as they become young adults. Little can be done now. We have run the numbers, and on paper it's doable. I do have the ability to pick up around 3 PRN nursing shifts a month and press into summer with 3-4 shifts a week to supplement income during break. Never mind cash out 407b, PTO, sell a motorcycle, and take advantage of disadvantaged and HPSL loans. I can raise my COA to the maximum as well (50-65k?) which will close the 69k annual gap. Tuition is set at $34,400 a year for in-state. Years 2-4 I am weighing on the military HPSP to get a 3k monthly stipend, and alleviate the loan burdens coming out of school with a 3-year commitment in the Army active duty as a Captain (pay is decent as well). I would then return to reserve status, commit to 20 years along with my private venture, and also receive 2-3k in pension monthly, never mind the proceeds of clinical business and sell off when and if I decide to retire.
The school I was accepted to is only 30 minutes away from my home. Our house is paid off, and our cars are paid off, so we do just bills, maintenance, and taxes. I literally do all work to the house and cars, so we can offset labor. I also own a VW diesel, which, given the 100-mile round-trip commute, gets about 45 mpg on a good day. We have 3 vehicles for redundancy. I do lack a familial support system, but the family is on board with it, friends are encouraging, etc.
In regards to my response to stress and rigor, I did nursing school while working full time during COVID, and people were dying all around me while working 50 hours a week in IT, commuting for 3 hours (out of state school) 800 miles a week, and doing clinicals, and graduated with an ASN/BSN. It sucked but was temporary and I got through it. I figured there are similar tradeoffs here. I did this for 2 years.
On the nature of the work itself, I also hear what you’re saying. I don’t view veterinary medicine as just “animals” in isolation. It’s very much about people, emotions, expectations, and sometimes grief. I actually welcome this. As I mentioned, I am isolated in a room all by myself all day, and just sit behind a monitor. While the context is different, I don’t think it’s entirely disconnected from other high-stress, human-centered roles I’ve been in, but I do respect that it has its own unique intensity, especially around financial constraints and end-of-life care.
As far as experience and handling tough ones, I do have time on the technician side and continue to stay involved, including telemedicine exposure. We deal with naturapathic medicine and home-based euthanasia. I’ve seen some of those difficult situations, clients who can’t afford care, emotionally charged decisions, and the tension that comes with that. I am usually the one picked by all the girls to do paw prints, and nose prints, and bag and deep freeze our patients due to my ability to lock in to work, similar to public safety. I won’t claim to have seen everything, but I’m not coming into this without any exposure either. What I’m trying to determine is whether that reality is something I can sustainably handle long-term, not just whether I can do it, but whether it aligns with the kind of life I want to build.
I think where I land is this: I’m trying to understand whether those risks are acceptable given everything else. That’s really the core of it.
Right, I have run the numbers with disfavorable conditions. No scholarships, etc. I realize this can change for what package I can say I am getting I have the probability of getting the disadvantaged student/HPSL and COA extension. I can also work variable shifts PRN nursing. So flexing is possible.
A lot is being spoken of AGAINST the field, not in SUPPORT of it - to be fair. Especially to discourage on-trad enrollment. Honestly, if I were a new grad or someone weighing this with less aptitude, I would run based on quite a few concerns. So there is that.
Why are y’all feeding this troll? First doesn’t know the basics about doctor/tech ratio, then says they’ve spent time as a tech.
You do not need to explicitly state it.
Every single one of these is an issue in veterinary medicine and you somehow think that it will be different. Veterinary technicians, the people who will be directly supporting you, have been fighting tooth and nail for licensure recognition and unions. They are two sides of the same healthcare coin. Yet somehow vet med will be better for you.
Once again, veterinary technicians and doctors experience the same thing. You say there is less legal pursuit. That is due to how the law frames animals, not how people approach scenarios. Legal action against a veterinarian is worth the replacement cost of an animal, as animals are viewed as property. However, board complaints, harassment from disgruntled clients, and occasionally suits do still exist. Unsafe patient staffing is very much an issue. An overnight tech I worked with was routinely working a 10:1-15:1 ratio.
You and I discussed compliance. You seem fine with the fact that owners will ignore your advice and still expect you to manage things. I won't continue to argue that point.
This statement suggest that you believe you as an individual have the power to change a system that has been functioning without you for decades. It is very much a broken system, but you alone are not going to fix it. To suggest so is pompous.
This is straight up misogynistic. Woman make up 50% of practitioners and 80% of students. We do not commit suicide because we have "a higher level of empathy and a lack of self-advocacy". We commit suicide because there is little respect for veterinarians as doctors, because of access to lethal means, because of unmeetable expectations, because of 60-80 hour work weeks, and about one hundred other reasons than being women.
This is narcissistic and egotistical. Do you think a single person here doesn't want to ensure better access to care and affordability? Do you think a single veterinarian who has spoken to you doesn't dream of a world where we don't have to consider the cost of something? No matter the level of confidence you have, you are not the person who will fulfill the wishful thinking of every veterinarian. This statement alone would be enough to show you think you know better, but in the added context of everything else, it's evidence you have zero clue what being a doctor is actually like.
With little exception, every class you take, every case you see, every client you speak with, is the work. If you view vet school and additional training as disconnected, you will never find joy in vet med.
I once again bring back this quote because I find it wildly insulting and evident that you do not know the first thing of what you're getting into yet speaking on it like an expert. You've worked as a tech and shadowed. I worked in a teaching hospital who had 22 rotating interns, 15 specialty interns, and a dozen residents. You speak with authority on the struggles of a new grad without ever actually viewing what it's like to be a new grad. You are not an expert on something you have not done, public safety background be damned.
Ensuring someone knows the realities of their dream is not gatekeeping. It's making sure they come in with a healthy understanding of what to expect, including the negative. I had many people, some on this thread, make sure I knew what I was trying to do moving forward. I never viewed myself as having rose-colored glasses, but it was clear looking back that I did. If you cannot see beyond what you view as the pros to accept the reality, you are absolutely assuming that you know better. You don't need to state it.
There are a lot of overlapping skills. They all come with their unique challenges, and you are continuing to not listen to what people have said regarding vets med's unique challenges.
Intent versus impact. Read you words as others are reading them, not how you meant them.
That is what you are doing.
I know the leg I stand on, but not everything needs a rebuttal. "Thank you for the insight, I had not considered that" is sufficient. Arguing why you're right is pedantic.
I once again state that every person here that I know of who has responded was untraditional in some manner in which they applied to vet school, myself included. We all have family and financial obligations. We all have value in how we've approached our situations.
A house, 3 kids, and a career are all very good reasons not to pursue vet med as many before me have more deeply stated. We all have dead loved ones. We all have a dream. You are not unique.
Personal jab and a poorly veiled insult.
You have been heard. Loudly. And I alone am not calling that out.
We are teetering on a recession. Pets suffer first when people don't have money. That is not stability.
Insulting. You are not more heroic than any vet who chooses to volunteer their time. You can't leave vet school and buy your own clinic and make your own rules unless you have a lot of money. You will be giving yourself over to a clinic run by someone else and you will have to follow their rules. Whether you offer free services or volunteer at shelters is your own business and not a requirement of vet med. But to state that those who do are miserable is again assuming you know more than the people who actually do this for a living.
Retweet. Re: intent vs. impact.
I love my vet school. I have complaints just as everyone else does. What I don't love is someone coming on to this site for advice and instead saying "well actually" to every expert who weighs in. This is once again a personal jab that is meant to be insulting and a much clearer example of your character than mine.
The jump in specialty pay is significant, but you've already said the training is irrelevant and not worth your time.
I have said this many times now. I hope you will internalize it more now that someone you don't view as an adversary has stated it.
(This is a financial nightmare, do not do this. If you take nothing else from me do not ruin the retirement guarantee you've built for a maybe return in salary.)
(This is not a guarantee)
(More than you make as your current salary)
How in the world do you think you can support your family through vet school when you will make nothing, your cost of attendance doesn't cover the gap fully, and you're relying on loan programs that could disappear at the drop of a hat?
Interestingly, you’re quick to label someone a troll instead of engaging with the actual discussion. BTW, troll is not what you think it means, but disregard my two decades of IT experience. Throwing around terms like “doctor/tech ratio” without context doesn’t make the argument stronger it just avoids addressing the point.
You’ve also made assumptions about my background that are simply incorrect. If you’re going to contribute, do it with substance. Otherwise, this adds nothing to the conversation.
2 tech per doctor with an assistant should be standard. Whether or not it is in a specific hospital or clinic is up to that owner, private or corporate. I would say due to the support staff shortage,most are not running their hospitals this way.
Unless you own your own clinic, you're a minion. I'm fine being a minion for the right person. That's why I'm aiming for either privately owned hospital or leaving direct clinical med all together.
There were 30 when I was applying. We're slated to have 40+ in the US over the next few years unless the OBBB triggers schools to reconsider (which I hope). It wasn't until COVID that vet school admissions became as competitive as human med. Prior to that, 63%+ of vet applicants got an acceptance vs <40% for human med. I haven't looked at the most recent numbers for vet med. The difference is that a lot fewer people were applying to vet school.
Not at all. If anything,I'm sure the schools are expecting this over the next decade
Don't do it. Avoid boarding at all costs
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Affirmed.
I’m not denying those issues exist. I personally fought for unionization with Nurses, and public safety. I have advocated. I am not imagining rainbows or lollipops here. What I’m pushing back on is the idea that acknowledging them means I have to assume the exact same outcome or experience. There’s a difference between understanding systemic challenges and assuming they apply uniformly in every case. Just because I am trying to relate to the current professions I am in now - to how vet med will be makes this a challenge?
You’re arguing a point I didn’t make. I never said complaints, harassment, or staffing issues don’t exist. Did I? I pointed out that the legal framework is different and it is, which you affirmed. Acknowledging that difference doesn’t invalidate the rest of what you’re describing. I expect there to be challenges.
Overly presumptuous? That’s a mischaracterization. Understanding that noncompliance happens is not the same as approving of it. It’s part of practicing medicine in the real world. Neither will I continue to argue the merits.
You’re inflating what I said to make it easier to dismiss. I never claimed I’d fix the system alone. I said I want to contribute to improving it, like anyone entering a profession or this career would wish to do. What is the point of following your passions, career pursuits, or ambitions if there is no hope for bettering where you left off? If that were the case, you would be holding english tea and a UK birthright had people not stepped up to the plate and tried to change the "system". People do and can change systems each and every day.
Here is where I rely on my data research. That’s not an accurate representation of either the data or what I said. You just want another point or argument and to pull the misogyny card. Classic. First, this isn’t a gender-only issue, and framing it that way oversimplifies the actual drivers. The data shows women have higher rates of depression, anxiety, and suicide attempts, while men have higher completion rates.
• Historically, the majority of veterinarian suicide deaths have been male (~80% in some datasets)
• At the same time, female veterinarians have a higher relative risk compared to the general population (≈3.5x) CDC Newsroom
Both of those can be true and neither supports the idea that this is simply about gender or “misogyny.” In fact, when access to euthanasia drugs is removed from analysis, suicide rates are not significantly different from the general population. Suicide Risk for Veterinarians and Veterinary Technicians
So no, this isn’t about reducing a complex issue to gender, and it’s not accurate to label disagreement with that framing as misogyny.
Delightful personality. I do believe this is addressed in my response to leaving things better than you found them above. The repeated use of labels like “narcissistic” and “egotistical” isn’t a substitute for an argument; it loses credibility. Just an armchair diagnosis by a layman. How are you able to remain objective and not be overly emotive or deterministic as a vet grad? Can you deal with difficult humans? You’re making a lot of assumptions about what I believe and why, without actually knowing. That comes across as more presumptive than insightful from someone who has not even graduated, let alone been in clinical years or been in the field as a DVM for any length of time. Bonus, I’m here to have a discussion, not to be psychoanalyzed.
That’s not the distinction I was making. I was referring to general prerequisite coursework, and things that hold little interest...not clinical training or specialty education, which I value and understand are part of the work. You’re arguing a point for the sake of arguing.
You have a hx of bringing up things in relationships too? You have to let things rest, but I see it's not your strong suit. You’re doing a lot of diagnosing, narcissism, ego, intent...without actually knowing me. That’s a pretty confident level of analysis for someone still in training. You don’t have enough information about me to make the claims you’re making, and speaking with that level of certainty this early on is… interesting.
Are you a new grad? It appears you are the class of 2028? What experience do you presume to know over current DVMs, who are in practice in the real world? I have worked in military vet med, national chains, retail chains, private hospitals and blah blah blah...it does not really matter, does it? I have my own experiences, you have yours. Leave it there. I’ve never positioned myself as an expert. I’m asking questions, I am relating to my OWN experiences....what do you not get about this? I am challenging held beliefs...do you take everything for face value? I am evaluating the field, and applying the experience I do have to understand where I stand. That’s not the same as claiming authority; it’s how people make major career decisions. Different backgrounds don’t make a perspective invalid. I’m used to working in high-stakes environments where understanding systems before stepping into them matters and making life or death decisions on the daily...you? I’m evaluating a career decision. You’re assigning character labels. That says more about your approach than mine.
I agree that people should understand the realities—that’s exactly why I’m engaging in this discussion. My original post clearly outlined what I’m facing and what I’m trying to evaluate moving forward. You’re choosing to view that as “rose-colored glasses.” I don’t. I have a healthy level of skepticism, fear, and respect for the risks involved. At the same time, I’m also hopeful, ambitious, and determined, those things aren’t mutually exclusive. I’ve openly acknowledged the challenges more than once, even in this thread. The fact that you don’t recognize that doesn’t mean it isn’t there. What is presumptive is the idea that because I haven’t reached the same conclusion you have, I must not understand the realities. That doesn’t follow. Different perspectives don’t equal ignorance. I’ve never claimed to “know better,” nor have I dismissed what’s been shared. That interpretation is coming from you, not from anything I’ve actually said. Would you be this flippant when it comes to email communications to customers? I can only hope that when a pet owner comes to you with questions, concerns, or a perspective that challenges your own, you respond with more professionalism and grace than you’ve shown here. Take that in. This kind of rigid, dismissive posture is exactly what keeps fields like medicine, IT, and countless others stagnant. Progress does not come from silencing people who think differently. It comes from being willing to be challenged, to reflect, and to consider that your perspective may not be the only valid one.
What I’m also doing is pushing back, asking questions, and testing assumptions and that’s clearly where you, feel tested. It feels more like we’re both digging in and venting than actually moving the discussion forward. Do I have free time...sure. Venting apparently feels good to both of us.
I understand intent versus impact. What’s concerning is how confidently you’re assigning intent to someone you don’t know, based solely on a few posts. That’s a stretch. Especially over the internet...
If it makes you feel better.
I’m not interested in defaulting to agreement just to keep things agreeable. If something is worth saying, it’s worth discussing. But expecting agreement without discussion isn’t really a conversation, it’s a conclusion. I don't suppose your familiar with Frank Sinatra - "I did it my way"?
Untraditional in some manner? Is that minimizing or flattening a wide range of circumstances? Some folks certainly straddle the definition.
There’s a meaningful difference between varying levels of obligation, risk, and life complexity. Recognizing that isn’t minimizing anyone, it’s acknowledging reality. Likewise, some people may not be in the best position to provide that depth or context given their place on the spectrum. Some are deeper in the bed of "some manner".
I don’t disagree that those are serious considerations, I’ve acknowledged that repeatedly. But people with families, careers, and financial obligations make this transition every year. It’s difficult, not impossible. I have seen moms with newborns, pregnant, or having small children, and pivoting from 200-300k careers to press on. Reddit is full of them. Give me a good reason not to consider it. “It’s hard” is a valid point. “It shouldn’t be considered” is a different claim, and that’s the one I’m questioning.
Touche' - coming from your own string. The tone here has already shifted well past constructive discussion.
THIS IS LOUD. Well, textually speaking. You alone are being louder than all the others, and not providing substance. Rather, you would lean into arguing. I have gotten some good feedback from others, in many ways, and dealt with conversation in a mature provider format.
Are you assuming my ability to care for my own animals? That is a stretch. Shame on you.
These are all assumptions, you realize? What if I were to come into a windfall, or lawsuit pay out? What if I am just trying to make it work now or the next 4 years? I’m also aware that ownership and autonomy aren’t immediate or guaranteed; that is ridiculous. That’s part of the long-term consideration I’ve already acknowledged. Risking sound like a brave middle schooler: I would have to start at the bottom and work my way up. Again, this comes back to intent being assigned rather than what was actually said - I feel as if I am being viewed through the lens of decision making purely based on money vs passion. I am saying - please do not see this as a binary choice...it is a complex dichotomy. One that should be equally favored. If I did not jump to a conclusion that I couldn't care less about money, it would be a disservice to the truth and to my family. Ignoring the financial side wouldn’t make me more committed; it would make me irresponsible.
BUT, there you go again - assuming intent. Well done.
For posterity.
You’re making a lot of character judgments while engaging in the same behavior you’re criticizing. That’s a bit contradictory. Interestingly, you’re concluding my character while relying on repeated personal determinations/jabs to make your point. That doesn’t really follow. I just engaged in the folly, because frankly, it's a path towards venting and not productive.
If disagreement, questioning, or challenging assumptions is being interpreted as “well, actually,” (not my own words), and you take offense to this...that’s worth reflecting on, because those are things you will encounter regularly in real-world practice. How that’s handled matters. How will you handle a pet parent introducing experimentals, test theories, dispel or reject the good ole' ways - in favor of advancing medicinal science? I worry about this creep in a profession I would want to improve on a daily as well. Especially when it comes to having title and power. It should be irrelevant - you do the best you can do for your patients and LISTEN to others without presuming ill-gotten intent, or presuming an attack on professional abilities or character. You never know what someone is going through. I learned as a nurse from a well-respected oncologist - "you never presume intent" as it starts the conversation out in the wrong direction.
I said it was not an immediate consideration. My primary goal is to complete my DVM, simply. I may evaluate my pivot if I am confident in my abilities. IT would certainly make up for the 4 years of financial heartache for sure.
Who said you're an adversary? Our conversation is adversarial, but I still respect you as a person.
Again, another presumption here. I have minimal retirement, I just start my job as IT director 1.5 years ago - and never had previous savings or retirement - but I have close to 7k now in 407b. Again, not much to walk away with/from. I am not even vested in pension.
There is no guarantees in life. But HPSP has already asked to contract me. So the military always needs bodies.
Its not much - I net 68k yearly - with a family of 5.
I said it once, and I guess I will say it again: COA raise, loan instruments, PRN Nursing work, Years 2-4 potential HPSP or military, Summer work PRN nursing. Lets overs of PTO, 407b, and my wife's SSDI. So we have a lot of income sources but some are variable, some are constant.
Here is a break down of year 1:
| Source | Monthly ($) | Annual ($) | Notes | Payout |
| RN PRN (3 shifts/month) | 1980 | 23760 | Flexible - min 3 | |
| Summer RN (2-3 shifts a week) | 5700 | 15840 | 3 months | |
| Federal Loan (Living Portion) | 2133 | 25600 | 50k max (after tutition and 10k scholarship) | 10 days before semester start |
| HPSP Stipend (if applicable) | Possible start year 2 | ? | ||
| HSL Loan/ Disadvantaged | 416 | 5,000 | Potential from 3k-20k | ? |
| New years taxes | 416 | 5,000 | Estimated | One Time (February) |
| Motorcycle | 166 | 2,000 | Estimated | One Time |
| SSDI | 900 | 10,800 | Solid | Monthly |
| PTO | 333 | 4,000 | Estimated | August/September? |
| Fire Dept | 100 | 1,200 | Estimated | throughout the year |
| Medicaid/Medicare/Foodstamps | - | - | Nondiscretionary | throughout the year |
| Reserve Money? (20k) | ? | ? | ? | ? |
| Totals |
[td width="12.0904%"]
12144
[/td][td width="11.7514%"]
93200
[/td]So even without the 20k cushion, and taking away tuition, and maybe the 5-20k in disadvantaged or HPSL options we would still meet the 69k obligation for home support.
Regardless of OP's intentions and experience in the field (since that has been discussed ad nauseum here and I agree with all of the points made, and I'll refrain from repeating them) I'll come at it from the feasibility side - this is not, I repeat, NOT a sound financial decision given the OP's details. I understand the idea of wanting to do more and change things and also boost your own salary, but you have to separate it from what sounds like a bit of a mid-life crisis of finding meaning (and being in mid-life myself, trust me, I know the feeling). You keep saying you have run the numbers, but even with a perfect scenario there are SO many things that would have to go perfectly right for it to end up how you envision. Are you willing to take that risk? With that many dependents on me, I certainly wouldn't.
I understand the drive to feel like you are making a difference and doing something important. I wouldn't be in academia, trying to give back to future veterinarians and physicians if I didn't. But you have to be realistic about the path and not assume that you will be able to avoid all of the potholes (some of them sinkholes even) in that path, and when you have that many people depending on you its extremely important to understand that. Because if you go down, they go down with you.
I understand the drive to feel like you are making a difference and doing something important. I wouldn't be in academia, trying to give back to future veterinarians and physicians if I didn't. But you have to be realistic about the path and not assume that you will be able to avoid all of the potholes (some of them sinkholes even) in that path, and when you have that many people depending on you its extremely important to understand that. Because if you go down, they go down with you.
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supershorty
Don't look so vexed, toots.
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This thread is treading close to the line of what will be tolerated when it comes to personal commentary.
It is not appropriate to insult other users of this forum. You can disagree civilly. Everyone is free to not respond to something they don't like, regardless of their impression of the person they wish to respond to.
This is intended for all of you and should not be interpreted as being directed at any one person.
No one has to have the last word.
It is not appropriate to insult other users of this forum. You can disagree civilly. Everyone is free to not respond to something they don't like, regardless of their impression of the person they wish to respond to.
This is intended for all of you and should not be interpreted as being directed at any one person.
No one has to have the last word.
Another thought - have you considered trying to become a PA (my apologies if I missed that somewhere and this has been discussed already). I feel like that path might afford you the increased money, more autonomy than a nursing position (not full autonomy, but more - I also think you are tremendously overestimating the amount of true autonomy a veterinarian has in today's clinical environment, but that's another conversation...), and the ability to help people. I feel like that would be safer and more lucrative than veterinary medicine, if you insist on a clinical profession. The debt is there but not as much as veterinary school, the time in school in shorter, and it would still be a significant $$ boost.
Where I am currently at it varies, usually 2-3 techs only. Telemed is not determined, or when able. What is the amenable amount? What do you do if or when there were none?
I can agree as well. Being a minion is not bad. Especially for training and knowledge sharing. I would love to do private practice.
I have seen this. The contention that has been raised among work and my vet groups is the idea that the BBB is so new and so raw - schools are not getting ahead of this. Many are giving up their seats due to the reality of losing Grad Plus, and not being able to afford out-of-state tuition costs. They certainly need to get ahead of it now - or nontrads will be out of the running in masse, I can only assume.
Interesting numbers indeed. I haven't looked into it.
What is your reasoning behind not doing boarding? The value add seems appealing for private practice?
From my research the plus is a mix of direct income + built-in medical upsell + client retention. Never mind the huge profit driver for vaccinations, tests and needing records to be up to date.
My apologies - I should not have dove down the rabbit hole. I will refrain from conversing in that context.
I do not think the stability you mention looking for is going to be found in vet med. The financial aspect has been discussed ad nauseam so I won't reiterate that, but the profession is also inherently political at the moment. Basic tenets of medicine (like vaccines for disease prevention) are being challenged and labelled as a political topic rather than a scientific one. Additionally, government regulatory agencies, like state Boards of Animal Health, are being limited in what they can monitor and provide because of massive underfunding. The same is true for FARAD; while you might not intend to practice on livestock, this is a huge issue related to the profession right now. Outbreaks are not being tracked and reported on as accurately because no one is being funded to do it and there have been staff cuts. A prime example is the EHV-1 outbreak that started in Texas. Unfortunately, that probably won't be the last one.
Vet med has always been involved in trying to get regulatory changes, too. Things like attempting to increase restrictions on pharmaceutical costs to decrease owner financial burdens are inherently relevant. There are tons of vet med specific lobby groups. In Minnesota, at least, the state board also has lobbyists who represent veterinary interests in the state government.
Then we get to all the uncertainty around how existing vets and those entering vet school will pay for their loans and tuition. I don't mean you, specifically, but I mean the profession at large. That makes things inherently unstable because the future of how the profession is going to keep supplying vets is murky.
Being a vet means keeping up with best practices (and knowing how to tailor your recommendations to a client's abilities) and the laws. It is impossible to dissect from politics, and the current administration has made changes that are actively antagonistic to many vets. It's a volatile time.
Good perspective. Thank you for the insight! Would you do it over again if you could?
Considered as well. By no means would I consider this a sound financial decision now. It’s a calculated risk for a potential long-term payoff. The feasibility side is something I’ve spent a significant amount of time thinking through, and I don’t take the risk lightly, especially with a family depending on me. I have had to deal with the fear of failure, the concern of selfishness, etc. To give some context, this hasn’t been a sudden pivot or a midlife reaction. It’s been a 15-year path (yeah, I have been a lifelong student - 2 certs, 2 associates, and a bachelor's), working through prerequisites, pursuing nursing as a beneficial fallback degree or as supplemental. Slowly building toward where I am now. It’s been deliberate, even if slower than I would have liked. But hey, it may be more intensified due to the rooster coming to roost - so to speak.
I realized what I did was try to find success in all these career choices, but found that IT was a comfort food - the pay and the tradeoffs were worse moving elsewhere. Here it can variably change - I could do something I want, and get paid better... not struggle for those 10-12 hour shifts and turn the salary only netting 68k a year to something better. The IT world is oversaturated. Veterinary medicine is projecting a need or growth from the BLS over 20-30% in the next few years. Now, I am not hard-coded to just run a practice, but outside of private practice is open to me as well - whether military, lab, etc. so I will remian flexible.
One of the factors I’m weighing is that I do have an established career in IT with substantial experience. While nothing is guaranteed, that does provide a pivot to a return if all goes south. I’m not stepping into this without options; I’m trying to evaluate the risk with some degree of insulation. I could pivot back, most likely to some degree, to the same place I started or close. Which is excellent, so this helps. Also, we do have some income coming in - but the gap is there...and it needs to be filled. We have little risk of losing our home or cars (paid off), the concerns would be providing supplemental food, fuel, paying the normal bills, and trying to support our current bills with some relative degree of flexibility in pushing those down.
That said, I agree with you, this is a high-risk path, and it would require a lot to go right. The goal isn’t blind optimism; it’s making an informed decision with my family fully aligned and aware of what’s at stake. To be frank, we have lived in persistent stress, poverty, and check-to-check conditions for 15+ years. I am tired. I am unfulfilled. I am ready for a change. Coming from a place of breaking the cycle. We literally, by the grace of only the Lord himself, have dug ourselves out of all the potholes we have incurred. So I have to ask myself: what is the real difference in four years if we have to be a bit poorer and absorb the risk if it opens a door to something greater long-term?
Is the ceiling where I am now fixed, or is there a path, however difficult, that allows for growth, stability, and impact? What will this open for me? Will a veterinarian's life and salary lead me down a path of ruin? Can I only go up from here? Will I by chance, be able to make a good salary? Open my own clinic and support my family and kids more so down the road?
At the same time, part of my hesitation comes from recognizing that being overly risk-averse earlier in life limited my growth and opportunities. I don’t want to repeat that pattern if there’s a path forward that, while difficult, is still viable. The truth remains: I either subsist for the rest of my career in complacency, not being able to help my kids, grandkids, and always fretting about the minutiae of problems we cannot handle, being one check away from something cutting off - or I brave the 4 years; I do something meaningful, impactful, and potentially open the ceiling to allow us to finally live and relish in the reward or taking the risk. Comfort zones are often described as beautiful places where nothing grows, urging a move toward risk for growth, success, and fulfillment. Choosing comfort often means settling for mediocrity, while taking risks, despite fear, is essential for breakthroughs, unlocking one's true potential, and avoiding future regret. I feel regret if I turn this down.
The decision is beyond agonizing, but I realize it is mine to make, even though I want someone else to make it for me.
The thing is, you'd still have to pay tuition, even if you decided you hated it and didn't want to pursue that path. So if you went back to IT, now you're in debt and in the same position as before.
Also, I have to ask... have you spoken with people who are in vet school, or have been recently? From your posts here, I'm not sure if you're recognizing the time commitment. It's not like you're going to class forty hours a week and then going home. It is much, much more intense than an associate's, a bachelor's, or a master's. You will need to not just attend class, but also study multiple hours outside of class, do assignments, ideally go to the anatomy lab, etc. Depending on the school, your class schedule may vary from week to week, which can make it extremely difficult to make any kind of consistent work schedule.
In this case, the most logical step is NP...PA would be similar. It was a backup plan to help supplement income if a I got a denial from vet med....and as a supplemental opportunity, it's fine, but there are some concerns. We are constantly harassed by MDs and PAs alike due to scope creep, and are limited based on state laws on full practice. So, depending on where you are at (I am in a restricted state), you can never full use your education, knowledge, or abilities to progress. So the concern is you never fully can do the work you set out to do. The passion or ceiling has to be curtailed. Secondly, the pay is capped generally. Because every RN and their mom (very likely!) has found more autonomy and stability in scheduling etc as a NP, the market is absolutely flooded. It is very easy to do an online program with minimal clinical hours. Yours and see your own patients! Scary...litigous scary. With that said, I will never see more than 120k gross, with benefits - it centers me close to where I am at... never mind it's a grossly underpaid profession, which is why many hospitals or clinics are now hiring them in masse to offset the 2-300k per Physician. Most NPs see 20-40 patients daily, and it's a conveyor belt. Many are returning to bedside nursing. It is making many MD/DOs nauseated, and they are threatened by this capitalist conquest. The risk or ROI is abysmal.
Can I ask what kind of salary you're expecting from veterinary medicine?
I appreciate you laying this out. This is the kind of context that’s actually helpful.
I don’t agree with your assessment that the profession is becoming increasingly political, even from my own interactions. Of course, I feel that is where I get aggressively advocative. On my side, in nursing, we find that we have to advocate for patients not getting medical supplies, treatments, or home care often, as big insurance is a monster.
My interest is specifically in small animal practice, so while some of the agricultural and regulatory impacts may not affect me directly day-to-day, I do recognize they shape the profession as a whole. The broader instability you’re describing isn’t lost on me.
That said, I don’t necessarily see the political component as a deterrent. If anything, it’s something I feel more comfortable navigating than most. I’ve been involved in policy discussions and local-level changes where I live, and I tend to lean into those environments rather than away from them. Debate, advocacy, and systems-level change are areas I’ve operated in before and I love challenges.
I also agree with your point on stability; it’s not something I expect to “find” in vet med in a traditional sense. When I bemoan on stability, it is more on a personal side than work side. I can go with the flow when it comes to fast and shifting expectations.
For me, the question isn’t whether the field is stable, as I mentioned, it’s whether it’s something I’m willing to engage in given the broader purpose and potential long-term trajectory.
It seems everything I touch is volatile. Thanks for the insight.
I see. I guess it's confusing to me why you listed increasing politics as a reason for wanting to leave IT, but it's an incentive for vet med.
I really appreciate you taking the time to lay this out, especially around the time commitment. That’s something I’ve tried to take seriously and not underestimate. I’ve spoken with a few current students and have also reviewed the projected Class of 2030 schedule. From what I’ve seen, the didactic years appear to be fairly structured...generally weekdays with class running roughly 8–3 or 4, depending on the day. I fully understand that the real workload extends well beyond that with studying, labs, and assignments, and I’m not minimizing that at all.
That said, I do come from a background where I was balancing nursing school while working 50+ hours a week, commuting significantly (3 hours both ways), distances (upwards of 800 miles weekly at times), and completing weekend clinicals over two years. So I have been through a long-term crunch cycle. I’m not coming into it unfamiliar with sustained workload and time management under pressure. I think many would never have done what I did.
My thought process is to be very intentional with structure, prioritizing school during the week, carving out dedicated study time, and still being present with my family. On weekends, where feasible, I would plan to pick up PRN nursing shifts on select days to help supplement income, while being mindful not to overextend. That likely means limiting extracurricular commitments and being disciplined with how I allocate time.
On the tuition front, I am not too concerned - I have scholarships covering 1st year, and I would absorb the remainder. Now tuition is not horrible. It is 34,400 annually. But we would factor in the rest for living expenses. Granted, I carry no current loan debt now. I hope to also go into the Army reserves, and they will exponentially pay down any student loan debt. I can direct commission regardless if I am a veterinarian. They have offered me an IT officer position in the meantime. Not a guarantee - but in the uneventful circumstance, it's a fallback option. So the relative risk can be minimized.
Thoughts?
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I may stand corrected, but I am more concerned with pay, career growth, autonomy, and passion. Politics, I feel, comes with any position.
Coming from my state indexes and from my research I would expect:
new grad: $93k – $106k
Most experienced vets have reported earning $120-140k (Reported by glassdoor and indeed, etc) as the median across the board.
ER/Urgent: 150k-200k
Specialty: Internship pay is low at 40-60k, but after board certs 200k-350k depending.
Ownership: 180k-400k+ with boarding as a multiplier.
Would love to see what numbers you all have.
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Which is it?
To clarify I have a 10k scholarship knocking down tuition to 24,400. My anticipation in working extra PRN shifts until August fall orientation would next close to 16-20k buffer.
This is quite dependent on where in the world you work, but in general, I would NOT be expecting these numbers, especially fresh out of school. Definitely think lower.
You’re not taking into consideration:
Production
Negative accrual
CE Benefits
PTO
Healthcare
Retirement
New grads almost across the board net less than $100k a year. I know one single vet who went over $350k in a HCOL city and she was double boarded.
I did an update to the numbers; I went off my outdated sheet. Please see now. This would be for north-midwest.
I guess total comp is variable. In the civilian sector, I would consider that part of the income package. But net - I can see this being lower. I figure that even a small jump, to eventually 140-145k would put us in a good position with benefits taken. I would be opt to doing telehealth, app work etc to supplement as well. I can also do some IT consulting here and there. It can get there, but I would have to be work at it. Basically, do the grind. If I do plan on doing the military, this is moot - I will make roughly 150k without deductions - as you get BAH, BAS, incentive, and still can move up from O3 (Captain) to higher pay grades. There is a lot of benefit to be a vet in service.
As a nurse I make between 45-55/hr. not the average school job or part-time gig. I figured I would have to clear 3 shifts per month, which would net me about 1980/mo and do summers (15,840.00 total) to supplement. I would only have a 10k scholarship, but I can apply for a few more after my aid package goes through.
Have you directly been offered HPSP? Because there is a long list of people each year and who apply and many end up waitlisted or denied. There’s a thread in this forum on it and some high ranking officers did not receive it. You cannot bank on this unless you have already been given it.
2 tech per doctor with an assistant should be standard. Whether or not it is in a specific hospital or clinic is up to that owner, private or corporate.
Unless you own your own clinic, you're a minion. I'm fine being a minion for the right person. That's why I'm aiming for either privately owned hospital or leaving direct clinical med all together.
There were 30 when I was applying. We're slated to have 40+ in the US over the next few years unless the OBBB triggers schools to reconsider (which I hope). It wasn't until COVID that vet school admissions became as competitive as human med. Much less gate keeping in vet med from the academic perspective.
I expect this to become common over the next decade. In fact, I'm hoping for it
OP, I cannot help but feel like you’re looking for someone to tell you “yes, do it”. Based off of your goals, and life circumstances, this does not seem like a sustainable career for you and your family. It is not temporary financial stress, it is more than just a 4 (or longer if you specialize) year “bump in the road.” A lot can happen in 4 years. You had mentioned already you run the risk of losing your home, your cars, your assets etc. And if that does happen, where do you and your family go?
I do think you are coming from this with the intention of providing more for your family and that is very admirable, but I don’t believe this is route is the way to do it. I’m sure this is not the answer you are hoping to hear, as it can be disappointing to hear from a stranger on the internet “no, don’t do it” when this is something you’ve considered for a while (15+ years as you have stated)
The last piece of advice I can give would be to speak to a financial advisor whether at your school or an external source. Consider joining the “Debt Free Vets” page on Facebook as there are veterinary specific financial advisors you can talk to about your situation and you would get more specialized advice.
Best of luck whatever you decide!
I do think you are coming from this with the intention of providing more for your family and that is very admirable, but I don’t believe this is route is the way to do it. I’m sure this is not the answer you are hoping to hear, as it can be disappointing to hear from a stranger on the internet “no, don’t do it” when this is something you’ve considered for a while (15+ years as you have stated)
The last piece of advice I can give would be to speak to a financial advisor whether at your school or an external source. Consider joining the “Debt Free Vets” page on Facebook as there are veterinary specific financial advisors you can talk to about your situation and you would get more specialized advice.
Best of luck whatever you decide!
This entire comment is really demeaning and condescending, as are most of your other posts.
Those of us in the field currently, whether in veterinary school or having graduated from veterinary school, have given you our opinions and provided factual information on the state of our profession. We love it, that's why we are still in it and passionate about the realities of the job. You clearly do not want to hear any opinions that diverge from your own, and you want to continue to condescend because you really believe your singular perspective on the field is sufficient. We are trying to tell you that what you're envisioning does not exist and genuinely cannot and will not under the current administration, though the situation was already teetering in previous years.
The reality is, as broken as you think the human medicine system is, ours is worse. Many veterinary paraprofessionals actually leave to go to human medicine and are significantly happier with better QOL than they had in our field. Our field lags approximately twenty to thirty years behind human medicine with the clinical medicine and research itself, while our culture can lag even more than that (see title protection for veterinary technicians as a flagship issue). Clients are far less appreciative than you may think (as you think they're more receptive) when, in reality, it's not the case at all. We don't have widespread insurance, financial constraints are real and the client yells at YOU because of the prices when you don't set them.
I reiterate my previous statement that we are trying to take off your rose-colored glasses that you don't think you're wearing because you've not been in the field long enough (telemedicine doesn't quite count). You'd find far more stability, financial solvency, and security (your words) by doubling down on your RN and trying to find a path in human medicine (especially if you enjoy telemedicine) than you would by going back to school, accruing debt, and not having an income for 4-8 years to come out making 100k-120k a year as a new grad while paying back your loans. You won't singlehandledly save this field from itself (which is what it sounds like your goals are) when those who have been in it for decades cannot do so. All the things you evidently detest about human medicine are coming to us such as private equity, and worse, so this veterinary utopia you're envisioning, again, does not exist.
I’m a boarded specialist + PhD and I work both in the veterinary and human medicine side of things, graduated well over a decade ago. Woof that makes me feel old. There are parts of my job that I love, namely the diagnostics on the vet side and all the wonderful students on the med side (not that the vet students aren’t also wonderful, but I interface primarily with the former). But would I do it again? I honestly don’t think so. I would have been an engineer, and I fully believe I would have been a good one. Or I would have gone the MD route and gotten into a similar low-patient-facing specialty like radiology. The debt has been an anchor around my neck, and I don’t even have a spouse or children to worry about. To be fair my job is quite different from that of a GP, so you’d get better insight from them. They are the day to day workhorses of everything and I have such massive respect for everything they do and go through.
Sidenote - these boarded specialist who are earning 200-350k may be the average according to Indeed, but it is not the median. I would take those numbers with a big grain of salt and look at the number of responses, specialities included, and demographics provided (academia, industry, government, etc). I don’t even make the lower bounds of that. Of course academia does not pay as well as industry, but those numbers are high. 200k in some specialties sure, but 350k is rare. I would not go off of what random internet sites say. Look at actual employment reports for the specialties themselves (and even with those response rates can be low and biased).
Anyway…to be honest I do feel like you aren’t really going to truly reconsider because if you were truly on the fence I feel like you would have asked before applying. I do really worry about your confidence that you will be able to pull off nursing shifts during vet school (speaking as someone who also worked part time during it and almost broke myself mentally), and even if you somehow can in the preclinical years, you certainly won’t be able to in 4th/clinical year. Or the confidence that you will get the military stipend because as others have said it is extremely competitive. That’s a lot of eggs in one basket. What does your family think?
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First off, I am not catering to your assumptions or feelings, or your student stress. I am the OP, and I am seeking information from fine people who will not take slight. You can decide not to participate in this thread - no one is forcing you to comment. Similarly, any antagonizing will be reported as the mod already reminded you to stop, but you insist. I’m not interested in your assumptions about me, your tone, or continuing this exchange. More so, my interactions with everyone do not need to be scripted and filled with some obsolence of "knowing my place". Do better.
Is it all opinion? Or is it all or somewhat factual? From what I hear is burnout speaking, protectiveness of the ideology of why someone is stepping into the profession, and frustration from a position of catering to the less knowledgable. You’re projecting your own frustration onto me and calling it insight. I’ve heard what you’ve said, and I just don’t agree with your conclusions or your assumptions about me. Your experience is yours. It doesn’t define mine, and it doesn’t give you the authority to dismiss it. Clearly, I have engaged and had meaningful discussions with others in this forum, but I am wasting my time here. Let's move on...
I see this, just as I questioned why an AED wasn't available for a pit in vfib that was a fatal under unmonitored sedative care. There is room to improve. Healthcare...the idea that it offers better quality of life across the board isn’t consistent with what I’ve seen, more so anecdotal. Nurses and providers deal daily with insurance barriers, patients unable to afford care, noncompliance, aggression, and, at times, people who have lost the will to live. Elder abuse, child abuse, drug abuse, mental challenges, people not allowing their parents to pass while cracking ribs on a 98-year-old type of care. Nothing like getting punched in the face on a 12 hour shift, been there a few times. Compassion fatigue, burnout, and system dysfunction are not unique to veterinary medicine; we know they are deeply embedded in human medicine as well - maybe more so - as the fallout with patient noncompliance spills over to family members, and children. The one thing many MD/DOs have said when I looked into this field was if it paid less, they would be out. Their passion stemmed from resource gathering. The salary potential allowed them to unlock things to do in their personal lives. But they quickly became robotic.
On the veterinary side, I’ve also seen the opposite of what you’re describing, clients who are deeply invested in their animals, willing to go to great lengths for their care, and in many cases, animals being treated with a level of compassion that isn’t always present in human healthcare. I am not negating the challenging cases. I have seen people treat their poodles and not their diabetes. Every field has its challenges. I’m not under the impression that veterinary medicine is easier, what I’m saying the tradeoffs are different. I feel that these may align better with me.
But in the midst of all this I see something where one can shine - to do things differently, to reengage with passion, and determine for better.
I will tell you that I am officially on the fence. I have yet to accept a seat. Mostly due to the risk, fear, and unknowns. If I were a selfish individual, I would not consider my family, selling cherished assets, and arguing with a bunch of strangers who all seem burned out. I’m not wearing “rose-colored glasses”—I’m on the fence, and a big part of that is because I’m taking the risks, financial impact, and long-term implications very seriously. If anything, this process has been the opposite of idealistic. Where others would be excited, I was worried. Stepping away from stability. That’s not a casual or naive decision. I’m here asking questions because I want to understand the realities, good and bad. But what I’m hearing, more often than not, is burnout being projected as certainty. That’s useful to a point, but it’s not the full picture. I’m not looking for a utopia. I’m trying to determine whether this is a path I can realistically live with, even with its flaws. And yes, part of that is hoping to hear from someone who can tell me why it is worth it. P.S. - Stop telling my experiences do not count. Everything counts.
However, the RN path is similar to the IT path, with more pain. The pay is parity. The experience is not. Have we not been tracking my experiences?
You’re speaking confidently about human medicine as if it offers stability, solvency, and quality of life...I’ve worked in that system. I don’t have to speculate about it. I have seen enough to not enjoy it, and it is unappealing to me. I do not get to enjoy my time as I do with animals. I get shars as weapons, urine, feces, physical violence - fists, sun downers with screaming old ladies trying to stab me, women touching my genitalia, and nursing management that cares less. Discharging people to KNOWN unsafe conditions. Death, not controlled - but with families next to you. Infection risk and patient risk due to lack of supplies. People are entitled, they psychologically test you, and at the same time, you must meet rigidity and rudeness from MDs/DOs, and other providers - they dont want to do the work so we have to do this on top of it all. We are truly stuck in a position to affect change, but how do you do that while taking care of 18 beds filled with human's that need attention? How can you cure the woman's crying because I cannot stand there and talk? How can I not pass COVID and kill other patients due to a lack of supplies on the floor? The way we handled COVID and the death was a turning point for sure. High responsibility + low control + constant emotional and physical strain.
Ideally, from what I researched and heard here - I see vet med as an elevation when coming from nursing or human health. I do not see ALL of this coming to vet med due the implicit caring of humans and the mega hospitals or insurance woes. Even so, do you think it would get to the failure or depravity of human med? So when you suggest I should “double down” on that path, you’re assuming it’s something I don’t understand or haven’t experienced. That’s not the case.
Likewise, and I will repeat: I’m not trying to save veterinary medicine, and I’m not under the impression it’s perfect. I’m comparing two imperfect systems from experience, my limited veterinary experience at that - and deciding which set of problems I’m more willing to live with. Lastly, is this possible? You’re giving your perspective from where you stand. I’m doing the same from mine.
I still value all of it.
supershorty
Don't look so vexed, toots.
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In case it was unclear: this level of tone will not be tolerated. That includes you, @sfjmercado. There are not special original poster privileges that permit treating others disrespectfully.
Everyone take a deep breath before responding to others. I do not want to lock this thread, as there has been some excellent advice offered, but if the tone continues to deteriorate, I will do so.
Well, I know it's a decision I will ultimately have to make, but I feel that way. To correct you, I mentioned that we are in a position many are not....we have everything paid off, and just need to support our income needs. So house, cars etc.... safe.
Eh - I am frankly numb to it all. At the end of the day, I have heard from both sides, and in many ways equal. Just yesterday, I was speaking with a CEO and job coach who said, " Those who do not take risks only risk stagnation." She seemingly saw my heart in it, and advised that she would be at a crossroads. As you mentioned - there is an intent to provide better for the family. But nowhere else can I just reinvent the wheel and come up with 98k a year. So either I live a safe and stagnant life, since my wife cannot work, and tell my kids, sorry...it is what it is - Or I try to press forward, and explore a fulfilling career with higher potential. Or look at considerable earning potential WHILE doing something I want. I have slowly come to accept that I am just in a very small majority of non-traditional students, and there are no good answers.
I am ahead of you on that one. I have met with life/career coaches, joined pages, and have had many talks with financial aid.
Thanks for your kind guidance.
Advice for anyone: Admissions faculty, staff, and students from every vet school in the states are on this forum. Vet med is a much smaller world than many think. I would suggest ensuring everything you say on here is something you’d be comfortable re-reading aloud to an honor code committee at your school.
Indeed. Let's all try to be nice...I have a lot of anxiety in this decision-making, and I apologize if it was taken in a way that was rude or disrespectful. My path in life is in the balance.
Any other helpful information?
