Learning spanish too?

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chloejane

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Hey all- quick question...
I've been considering talking to the pharmacy school I will be attending and seeing if they will let me audit spanish classes during pharmacy school. The area of the country I'm in actually has a lot of spanish speaking people and I've always wanted to be bi-lingual. I'm thinking of auditing because I took 4 years of spanish in high school and 3 of the years I got college credit for the classes (but I graduated in '99 and don't remember much of the language). I was curious if those of you in pharmacy school think this is feasible or just plain crazy to try to do while in school. Any input would be much appreciated! Thanks!
 
No wonder why America is so split nowadays. Too many Mexicans coming to America illegally and want the rest of us to speak Spanish to them. At the rate that we are going, it looks like your kids kid's kid's kid's kids will have to speak Spanish or else they won't enter kindergarden!
 
thespoken12 said:
No wonder why America is so split nowadays. Too many Mexicans coming to America illegally and want the rest of us to speak Spanish to them. At the rate that we are going, it looks like your kids kid's kid's kid's kids will have to speak Spanish or else they won't enter kindergarden!

fosho. THEY should try to learn english, not us trying to learn their language. They get all pissy when we can't communicate to them. It's our country they're going into, so learn the language if you want to live here.
 
I think its a good idea! Just today we had a lady come in that couldn't speak English and we had to try to help her understand how to use a pregnancy test. I think being able to speak a second language would be very valuable to your future patients.

I have seen a few pharmacist/medical field specific Spanish classes that are offered online. I think they are for CE, but could be useful.
 
If you have the time to do so I would. It will be more of a refresher course for you anyhow. I am also thinking about taking Spanish. But I only took a year of it in high school.
 
even if i knew spanish fluently i would refuse to speak it to customers who could not also speak english. We do not want this country turning into a goofy dual language nation. Just another step in the politician sponsored balkanization plans.

the govt. is useless sometimes.
 
So you would refuse to counsel a patient because they couldnt speak english even if you knew Spanish? 😱 Im all for everyone learning English, but I dont know everyones situation, maybe they are new to the country?
 
...or they could be visiting/traveling thru the country and need to pick something up. That is quite an ignorant thing to say that you wouldn't try to help them if you knew their language. Just think if you were in their country and got sick and needed to pick up a med, I will place money on it you would want them to speak to you in English, your first language. Just my two cents
 
Wow, I am dumbfounded by the ignorance and insular thinking coming from people who I assume are college educated. Sounds like something you would overhear at a trailer park. This is 'merhica speek inglish er geat out! 🙄
Please don't ever travel outside the US, and if you do, tell everyone you are Canadian or something because clearly you would just reinforce the negative (and obviously deserved) opinion the rest of the world has of Americans.

To the OP, I say go for it, there is no way it will hurt you and it will be good refresher. And for sure even if you don't use it much at work, you will surely have plenty of opportunities to use it elsewhere.
 
Tyler Derden said:
Wow, I am dumbfounded by the ignorance and insular thinking coming from people who I assume are college educated. Sounds like something you would overhear at a trailer park. This is 'merhica speek inglish er geat out! 🙄
Please don't ever travel outside the US, and if you do, tell everyone you are Canadian or something because clearly you would just reinforce the negative (and obviously deserved) opinion the rest of the world has of Americans.

To the OP, I say go for it, there is no way it will hurt you and it will be good refresher. And for sure even if you don't use it much at work, you will surely have plenty of opportunities to use it elsewhere.


The worst part is that even when Americans travel abroad they expect people to speak english. Just watch the Amazing Race on NBC and you'll see instances when the participants (some) get mad at people who don't speak English. What arrogance!

With globalization and many immigrants coming to the US, it's just a matter of time before being multilingual becomes a requirement for any job especially in large cities with large # of immigrants. Many jobs even pay you extra if you are bilingual (police dept, etc)
 
aubieRx said:
even if i knew spanish fluently i would refuse to speak it to customers who could not also speak english. We do not want this country turning into a goofy dual language nation. Just another step in the politician sponsored balkanization plans.

the govt. is useless sometimes.
You have a professional obligation to fill, not a political statement to make. Refusing to give your patients (note that I didn't say customers) the best care you can because you think they need to assimilate at the speed of light is unproffesional, irresponsible, and carries a substantial legal liability.
 
meh my attitude may sound callous but in my mind it is a very fair one.

we are an english speaking country. the people who come here need to accept that and put some effort out or i won't put any effort out .

my ancestors came here speaking german but they learned english so they could cope without a translator. in my mind its rude to go to a country and expect them to service your language.

if i went to mexico i would not expect to go into a pharmacy and get something using english. why should they expect the same from the united states.

if you guys want to see every road sign in america with two languages on it keep on the sensitivity "catering" attitude cause thats wherei t will lead.

I have learned that liberal political sensitivity often makes you end up as a doormat

perhaps saying i would completely refuse to speak a language if i knew it does seem a bit extreme. maybe it was an exaggeration in order to demonstrate my point that i am concerned about a future in which bilingualism is expected because we let people march in and force it on us (because they are too apathetic to learn english and figure that a better strategy is to get the english speakers to cater to them).
 
Tyler Derden said:
Wow, I am dumbfounded by the ignorance and insular thinking coming from people who I assume are college educated. Sounds like something you would overhear at a trailer park. This is 'merhica speek inglish er geat out .

You are the one who seems ignorant to me. You jump to conclusions without even stopping to think about why i might be saying what I am saying.

The above post might clarify some of my reasoning.

Typical ignorant debater. Insult someone who believes something differently from them on the grounds that it is "not what I think"

With globalization and many immigrants coming to the US, it's just a matter of time before being multilingual becomes a requirement for any job especially in large cities with large # of immigrants. Many jobs even pay you extra if you are bilingual (police dept, etc)

So the poster who posted this obviously thinks a requirement to speak two languages is not a bad thing. I think it would become a major pain in the butt/obstacle very quickly and developments toward bilingualism should not be encouraged.

That is where i differ I guess from some of you.

IT does not make me ignorant, or bad. IT just means i have a different political outlook and am casting a cynical eye towards what all this might mean for the future of this country.
 
Caverject said:
You exemplify typical southerners very well. Intolerant to everyone else but your own kind. Being from south Florida, this is something I have grown to hate about Georgia and the rest of the south for that matter.

I am not a southerner. I was born in colorado and raised entirely in massachusetts. I have only come to alabama a year ago. So what you hate about me has less to do with geography and more to do with philosophical beliefs. 🙂

I don't recall the british learning how to speak tribal indian languages.

The british ...haha the british are a separate debate in their own right. god bless them. (but for the record I have cherokee indian blood AND mexican mixed with the european so I am no racist against indians)

Actually, almost all of them speak english. Where do you think their money comes from? The Peso? 🙄

Most mexicans speak mexican. IF you were talking about amsterdam/holland then yeah, most of them speak english and dutch . But the mexicans typically speak mexican spanish


If you are a business owner and have many spanish speaking customers, you better well believe the owner will do everything they can to cater to the language. Their money is just as good as your money.

True but my objections to bilingualism have more to do with the way the government will be run than commercial affairs. How do you educate public school kids if half of them have parents who never taught them to speak english and the others are english speakers? It will present a plethora of problems.

English is one of the forces that unites this country. IF millions of immigrants come here and are unable to talk to each other in addition to the english speakers then then that will present problems.


I've learned that republican insensitivity breeds people that already hate us to commit crimes against us. Speaking of which, "tough talk" led directly to North Korea to start up a nuclear arms race. Good going!

Again the assumptions. I am no republican. I am an objectivist in addition to being what I call a "jeffersonian".



Don't worry. I'm sure Alabama and Mississippi are the last two places an immigrant wants to go. Also, what is wrong with being bilingual? If there is a need, a market will be created, and there will be money to be made for having a bilingual catering store. Recepcion al sur donde no esta agradable cualquier persona diferente!


Thats not particualrly true because there are plenty of mexicans in alabama. There is absolutely nothing wrong with being bilingual. It is a distinction and honor to speak many languages.

The problems will rise when it becomes expected. One uniting language is more efficient than many.
 
Caverject said:
I've learned that republican insensitivity breeds people that already hate us to commit crimes against us. Speaking of which, "tough talk" led directly to North Korea to start up a nuclear arms race. Good going!



!

btw way to justify hate crimes! since when has preferring english (and other republican "insensitivities") been an excuse for global nuclear war (a far greater insensitivity than anything a republican has done) 🙄 You are getting off the subject of english vs. spanish there.

What the muslim terrorists have against america is not the fault of the republicans...its not anybody's fault. They hate us for being strong and successful. And they hate democrats and republicans. Did they ask the people on those airline flights if they were conservative or liberal? No. They were out to kill americans period.

Remember now, the 9/11 attacks occured right after 8 years of liberal clinton and just the beginning of bush's presidency. they planned it when old billy boy (a true southerner btw) was in office

actually the democrats are the ones who really would like to go over and help the muslim women "burn their bras" (so to speak) and change the culture. Something that will surely please the terrorists.
 
aubieRx said:
perhaps saying i would completely refuse to speak a language if i knew it does seem a bit extreme. maybe it was an exaggeration in order to demonstrate my point that i am concerned about a future in which bilingualism is expected because we let people march in and force it on us (because they are too apathetic to learn english and figure that a better strategy is to get the english speakers to cater to them).
I hope it is an exaggeration. If you were in my employ and I found out that you willfully and purpousefully gave any patient sub-optimal care because of this political stance, you'd be out of a job.
 
bananaface said:
I hope it is an exaggeration. If you were in my employ and I found out that you willfully and purpousefully gave any patient sub-optimal care because of this political stance, you'd be out of a job.

well fortunately i am not in your employ now am I. Someone willing to fire someone for deciding to only use their primary language professionally! talk about unprofessional.

They don't have spanish fluency as a requirment for graduation from pharmacy school. If you paid part of my salary to speak spanish as a translator then yeah you would be on the right.

but you would find that if i took you to court and sued you for firing me i would probably win (unless you had hired me as a spanish translator in addition to being a pharmacist)

Besides, if someone's spanish is substandard but fluent it might actually hurt a patient due to a communication error. ever think that there might be better reasons to use one's primary language alone when dealing with people medically? Cause there are plenty.
 
What I'm saying is that choosing not to communicate with patients is not an option. You need to counsel your patients to the best of your abilities. If you have the ability and choose not to use it, that is no different than choosing not to counsel, period. In my state, that's not acceptable, per the state board. You can't shirk your duties because you don't like the fact that a patient is not fluent in English.
 
when dealing with people medically you should only use your primary language (unless you can be considered an offical translator between languages). the potential for communication errors might be worse than handing them a directions sheet printed in spanish

IF you wanted to hire someone to speak spanish you would have to hire a translator/pharmacist who toted spanish as a job skill because I would refuse to speak a language that is not my primary one when dealing with people medically.

There is no law written anywhere that says if you speak spanish fairly well you have to use it while on the job. it is a personal choice unless it is a job req written down in your contract (which it would not be).

firing me would be a discrimination lawsuit. I would be fired for not speaking spanish while others who had my same salary also were not speaking spanish (because spanish is NOT a job req. for a pharmacist unless it is made one in a contract)

the bottom line is these people need to learn some english before they come to america to order their drugs. I know many people who came from other countries who took the trouble to speak perfect english. its not that hard and it makes their lives a lot better.
 
it would not be spoken spanish . Nor would it be spanish that i personally composed.

It would be composed by someone hired to know spanish.
 
for example:

http://www.scriptpro.com/relations/press-releases/05-30-03.shtml

http://www.ncbop.org/Item1190.asp

Walgreens uses an internally developed computer system to provide all
language translation. First, the pharmacist enters the prescription
directions in English into Walgreens Intercom Plus pharmacy computer system.
After verifying the directions for accuracy, the pharmacist then activates
translation software for the desired language and prints the directions for
the patient.
"We don't have to be multi-lingual to provide native-language
instructions," added Cosme. "The system does the work for us, and we know
that the patient will understand our instructions."

http://www.prnewswire.com/cgi-bin/stories.pl?ACCT=104&STORY=/www/story/09-16-2003/0002017643&EDATE=

The work pharmacists perform using these tools is in english. Perhaps the patients don't get as good a service as they would if their pharmacist spoke chinese/spanish/whatever but if htey want more they should learn english so they can communicate safely and effectively

In fact, I can see where botched novice attempts to communicate a foreign language would be more unprofessional/a liability than not speaking the language at all.

It would be a convincing court argument on my side.

edit: although i must add that ican see where yo uare coming from despite the fact i disagree with it
 
aubieRx said:
it would not be spoken spanish . Nor would it be spanish that i personally composed.

It would be composed by someone hired to know spanish.
Your own personal translating staff? You may have access to one of those in a hospital, but not in many other places.

Like I said above, if you would choose not to tell a patient about their medications when you have the ability, you don't deserve to care for them.

(The context of all of my comments has been a bilingual pharmacist, not a pharmacist who speaks english and an itty bit of another language. I'm talking about someone who has the abilty to speak to a patient and chooses not to, not someone who would be unable to counsel effectively in a non-English language.)
 
bananaface said:
Your own personal translating staff? You may have access to one of those in a hospital, but not in many other places.

Like I said above, if you would choose not to tell a patient about their medications when you have the ability, you don't deserve to care for them.

check out the links above. many pharmacies (or so it would seem) rely on translating machines that print the labels.
 
bananaface said:
(The context of all of my comments has been a bilingual pharmacist, not a pharmacist who speaks english and an itty bit of another language. I'm talking about someone who has the abilty to speak to a patient and chooses not to, not someone who would be unable to counsel effectively in a non-English language.)


It would still have to be in the job contract in order to qualify as part of the job.

IT would probably mean paying them an increased salary.

Besides, there ought to be some standards/tests set for what is "fluent" in a language.

Some peopel could go to mexico and ask someone out on a date perfectly and talk about their favorite movie but may not be able to efficiently translate technical drug instructions.

If you are going to have someone speak spanish (or any language) to patients there ought to be some standards in palce....such as special courses that must be passed in order to qualify as a safe speaker.

That is why one language, english, is so efficient. Everyone knows exactly what to expect and there is no need for all the bells and whistles that come with bilingualism.
 
You're both going to regret the lack of sleep tomorrow from staying up late tonight arguing about this.
 
aubieRx said:
check out the links above. many pharmacies (or so it would seem) rely on translating machines that print the labels.
I have worked with those systems. They sometimes spit out gibberish. :scared:

If you had nothing else, you may be forced to use one. But, if you speak a second language fluently, I am adimant that you need to check the label printed in that language, and counsel your patients as you would were they able to communicate in English.

I feel that if you speak a language and refuse to counsel patients in it for the political reasons you described, then you are guilty of discrimination, with reference to your patients. Staff members who don't speak a second language aren't able to discriminate in this manner, because they have no choice - they just can't counsel in the second language. It's not about what you do relative to other staff members, it's about what you do for your patients relative to what you should do. That is why I would axe someone who refused to counsel when they had the ability. I'd do the same thing if someone spoke sign language and refused to counsel a patient in that manner.
 
pharmaz88 said:
You're both going to regret the lack of sleep tomorrow from staying up late tonight arguing about this.

meh good point. my foot fell asleep.

however, i think it was a good debate. i actually learned some intersting stuff from those links i found.
 
so you don't think that tests of fluency should be required (in addition to special language courses within the context of pharmacy) to give medical advice in another language?

it could be a potential liability ....
and probably
it should all be part of a job contract in my opinion.

if i was going to italy to get my gall bladder removed you better bet i would go knowing a good deal of italian :laugh:
 
You know if you are fluent. And unless you are hiding it, so do your co-workers. Dude, when people ask you questions, you know if you can put the words together to answer them or not. It's really not that hard of a line to draw. If you are unsure, you are not fluent.

Some schools offer stuff like "Spanish for Healthcare professionals". That can help with labels and counseling. It's not so good for understanding the questions that patients ask though, just because there are so many possibilities.

If you are fluent in a language and want everyone to learn English, you can always introduce in key English words as you counsel.
 
despite that it would be hard to require that the speaker speak the language unless it was written up in the job contract.

I am no expert but i imagine that many pharmacies probably pay extra for bilingual pharmacists AND it is written into the contract so there are no surprises.

surely someone has a right to speak english only professionally unless it is written into the contract that they speak multiple languages. whats good for many is good enough for one.

it would be like firing someone you hired only to fix yoru computer for also not fixing some elecrical wires just because they ahppened to be both an electical engineer and a computer engineer.

you get what you ask for and pay for.
 
http://www.savannahnow.com/stories/052805/3062876.shtml


Hispanic community advocates say Memorial 'no habla Espanol'

Spanish-speaking patients find it difficult to navigate the system at Memorial Health; certified interpreters in short supply.


Anne Hart and Scott M. Larson
912.652.0374
[email protected]

-->
When Leticia Xotla-Herrera went to the emergency room at Memorial Health University Medical Center earlier this year, her dilemma was similar to that of an increasing number of ER patients in Savannah.

The 18-year-old was scared, sick and didn't speak English.

Having moved to the city from Mexico several months earlier, Leticia had difficulty communicating in English to the medical staff. They, in turn, had trouble understanding her Spanish.

She died in the hospital at 10 a.m. Feb. 19 of unknown causes, about 15 hours after she entered the ER for the second time.

Her father, Tomas Xotla, believes the failure of staff to communicate effectively in Spanish contributed to his youngest daughter's death. The young mother had planned to work for the Marriott Savannah Riverfront for a while before returning home to her two sons in Mexico with the money she'd saved.

Certified medical interpreters who translate for Memorial patients are more saddened than surprised by Leticia's death. The hospital, they say, lacks a formalized approach to communicating with non-English speaking patients.

"If she had had a medical interpreter there, one would hope there would have been a different outcome,'' said Marta Greenhoe Kaufman of Savannah, a certified medical interpreter, licensed social worker and spokeswoman for Savannah's Latin American Service Organization.

Whether the language barrier contributed to Leticia's death isn't known. Memorial officials declined to release details of her case citing patient privacy issues.

But Leticia's death prompted Memorial to seek input from Savannah's Hispanic community on how to improve staff communication in the face of an influx of non-English speaking Hispanic patients.

Memorial representatives met this month with LASO members, medical interpreters and other community leaders. A second meeting is set for June 7.

After the first meeting, some LASO members said Memorial continues to rely on an impersonal, inadequate national phone translation system or mostly volunteer interpreters.

The solutions they suggested include:

hire/contract paid, certified medical interpreters who'd be on-call on a 24/7 basis.

recruit more bilingual medical staff.

translate basic hospital forms and signs into Spanish or use signs with universally recognized symbols.

Making the improvements will cost Memorial money, but continuing to rely on current methods could prove even more costly, some LASO members said.

"What I would like to see here is nothing different than what they do at hospitals in Atlanta,'' said Jeannine Bonar-Dueno, medical interpreter and LASO board vice president.

"Memorial seems receptive to making those changes, but it comes down to dollars and cents,'' she said. "Many of these patients are indigent. The question is: Does Memorial value them the same?''

Changing demographics

Peter Doliber, Memorial's director of community affairs, said hospital officials will look into the requests and ready a response.

He declined to say whether Memorial will contract or hire paid medical interpreters to be on call around the clock.

"It's not something we've explored yet,'' Doliber said.

"Rather than just say 'This is the one answer,' we want to work with the Hispanic leadership to determine what is the most effective answer.''

Doliber points to Memorial's history of working with the community in general. The hospital also has a Hispanic outreach that is a part of the current dialogue with community leaders.

"We recognize the Hispanic community is growing and it behooves us to be responsive to their needs,'' Doliber said. "Our job is health care.''

St. Joseph's/Candler also has a Hispanic health care committee. That group has developed a program which plans to contract, train and pay certified interpreters in addition to relying on the national translation phone line.

The hospital system also plans to have directional signs marked with universally recognized symbols alongside the English explanation.

"They are moving on this, and hopefully Memorial will follow,'' Bonar-Dueno said.

The increase in Hispanic patients has been greatest at Memorial, particularly in its emergency room and obstetrics unit.

Bonar-Dueno says that growth has taken Memorial by surprise.

"It's not the fault of Memorial,'' said Dr. Miriam Rittmeyer, director of Community HealthCare Center. The center accepts indigent patients who don't have insurance, Medicare or Medicaid.

"It's just the demographics of Savannah are changing,'' Rittmeyer said.

"Translating all the forms, training the personnel, it's going to take a couple years.''

Overhaul needed?

Leticia went to the ER twice in February. The first time, at 11 p.m. Feb. 12, she was suffering from severe stomach pains.

She was released at 4 a.m. with a prescription for antibiotics and little understanding of what was wrong with her, aside from having a stomach infection, her father said through an interpreter.

Her symptoms then worsened.

Leticia's next ER visit came a week later.

It was her last.

Questions surrounding her death include the cause; whether the hospital had medical records of her first visit; and whether there was a medical interpreter present during her first visit.
 
Memorial has no standard protocol for communicating with non-English-speaking patients, say medical interpreters who translate at Memorial.

Each patient is treated on an individual basis depending on need and who is available to translate.

Here are the options employees have:

l Using a national phone system, Cyracom International, which Memorial employs to provide translation services 24/7. This system fulfills the hospital's legal obligation to provide interpreters for all languages.

l Communicating through a local interpreter, either via phone or in person. The interpreter usually works on a volunteer basis and is not on call.

l Finding the nearest Spanish-speaking employee or establishment.

Those options have drawbacks, say medical interpreters and LASO members.

Via the national phone system, a Hispanic patient may be asked to rate their pain on a scale of one to 10, said interpreter Mariela Orellana Nemanic of Savannah.

The problem is that facial expressions can't be conveyed, she said.

"A male will answer '2 or 3,' but you see he has tears in his eyes. You can't see those tears over the phone,'' Nemanic said. "You can't see him jump when someone touches him.''

Cyracom certifies the translators are capable and qualified, including knowledge of medical terminology.

"The process is in place. The tools and resources are available,'' said Joseph Gardner, Memorial's director for service excellence. "And they have been in place for a quite a few years now.''

Kaufman said the telephone line is designed for emergencies and not appropriate for day-to-day service or for sensitive matters "when you need to have a human being explain it to you in person.''

Gardner conceded there have been situations when the telephone is not the most personal way to communicate. Staff may opt to ask employees who speak Spanish to translate, Gardner said.

Such an outdated system requires an overhaul, said Brenda Bautista, executive director of LASO and a medical interpreter in Hinesville who translates at Memorial.

"What do you do when patients don't speak English?'' Bautista said she asked staff at the Memorial ER desk. "They throw up their arms in the air and say 'We hope for the best.' They don't know who to call."

Improvements need to begin in the ER where even the simplest forms asking for name, birthday, address are in English only, she said.

Hospital signs - including one in the ER bathroom next to an emergency cord that says "pull here for emergency'' - are in English only. So are patient take-home instructions, which explain medication use and dosage.

That opens the door for mistakes, Bautista said.

For example, the word "once" (pronounced "oon-say") means 11 in Spanish. So a patient may read "take once daily'' and interpret that to mean taking it 11 times a day.

A level of care

Knowledgeable interpreters are a must, Bautista said.

You have to have people who know the difference between the word for "kidney'' and the word for "liver.''

That's one reason Memorial should stop relying on volunteer interpreters and use full-time certified, paid medical interpreters, Bautista said.

Volunteers who trained as part of an interpretation model program set up by Eagle Scout Marshall Worsham or through college Spanish classes are not appropriate for translating in a medical environment, Bautista said. "I question whether they have the medical training and medical vocabulary,'' Bautista said.

"Medical interpretation is not a hobby. It's a profession. Just because you can quote Cervantes or other authors doesn't make you qualified to go into a medical situation and interpret.''

The Savannah area has an adequate supply of certified medical interpreters, between 35 and 40, Kaufman said. The pay ranges from $25-$40 per hour.

"It's not for a lack of interpreters that services aren't provided,'' Kaufman said. "It costs money. But our entire community is catching up with the reality that there are a lot of Hispanics here who need services.''

In response to the argument that providing Spanish interpreters would necessitate interpreters for every language, Kaufman said Spanish is a common need.

"We all have the same rights in the U.S.,'' Bonar-Dueno said. "If you are here and you get ill, you are entitled to have the optimum possible level of health care.''
 
Caverject said:
Well, I have to admit I am glad to see your not the idiotic type republican spewing hate all over the board.


She's already mentioned once that she isn't a Republican. 😉 I don't see why the label of "Republican" has to be attached here at all. I know plenty of people on both sides of the political fence that share this same ideology.
 
Caverject said:
Well, I have to admit I am glad to see your not the idiotic type republican spewing hate all over the board. (yes, there are liberals that do that too...)

LOL... such hypocrisy.

you pretty much state that conservatives or republicans are idiots. A previous poster states that those who don't appreciate forced bilingualism are ignorant, and mockingly infers that they posess only a limited grasp of the English language themselves.

I've seen just as much 'hate' being spewed forth by the obviously 'more-enlightened' liberal types on this board as by the conservatives.
 
FutureRxGal said:
She's already mentioned once that she isn't a Republican. 😉 I don't see why the label of "Republican" has to be attached here at all. I know plenty of people on both sides of the political fence that share this same ideology.
Whoops.... My mistake.
 
Most mexicans speak mexican. IF you were talking about amsterdam/holland then yeah, most of them speak english and dutch . But the mexicans typically speak mexican spanish


Sorry if this has been mentioned already, but...
Mexicans speak Spanish- NOT Mexican!!! Just like Americans speak English, NOT american.

Also, I've lived in two other countries and have many foreign friends... all of them have been required to speak more than one language!
 
I can't imagine the requirement for being fluent in a language would be necessary. I am fairly sure that the person that you are communicating with would be aware that the "other" language you are trying to communicate in is not your first language. Keep the counseling as to the point as possible and don't rely on just verbal language. The pharmacy I used to be a tech in had a large number of Thai, Vietnamese, Bosnian, Serbian, and Croatian people. I often resulted to drawing clocks and explaining how to take thru imagry and 'sign language'. I also included a very clear direction that I hoped would be easy to translate using their language-to-english dictionary. I think it is only right to try to communicate to the best of your ability.
 
chloejane said:
Sorry if this has been mentioned already, but...
Mexicans speak Spanish- NOT Mexican!!! Just like Americans speak English, NOT american.

In aubieRx's defense, in the post you quoted she did state in the next sentence that they speak Mexican Spanish, which can indeed be classified as such, since it is slightly different from the Spanish spoken in Spain.
 
aubieRx said:
The british ...haha the british are a separate debate in their own right. god bless them. (but for the record I have cherokee indian blood AND mexican mixed with the european so I am no racist against indians)

Just beacuse you are from a certain ethnic background doesn't mean you can't be racist against that ethnic background. You may very well have a hidden bias.

Go to these web sites, take the tests, and find out.

https://implicit.harvard.edu/implicit/demo/
http://www.tolerance.org/hidden_bias/index.html

Then write a three page reflection paper about it.

Got to love the service learning class! 👍
 
FutureRxGal said:
In aubieRx's defense, in the post you quoted she did state in the next sentence that they speak Mexican Spanish, which can indeed be classified as such, since it is slightly different from the Spanish spoken in Spain.

True and I apologize for missing that!
 
In Florida, we have a sizable Hispanic population. The children all learn english, but many of the adults have not. In certain areas, billboards are in spanish instead of English. Knowing spanish would be helpful for communicating with patients. We have several Hispanic patients in our pharmacy. Unfortunately, I took German in school.

I believe that people should make an effort to learn the native language when they immigrate to that country. If I moved to Norway, I would attempt to learn Norwegian. But, I'd be extremely grateful if there was someone there who spoke English until I got up to speed in Norwegian.
 
museabuse said:
Just beacuse you are from a certain ethnic background doesn't mean you can't be racist against that ethnic background. You may very well have a hidden bias.

Go to these web sites, take the tests, and find out.

https://implicit.harvard.edu/implicit/demo/
http://www.tolerance.org/hidden_bias/index.html

Then write a three page reflection paper about it.

Got to love the service learning class! 👍

so what are you saying? that i am racist against mexicans? if i am I am racist against people in my own family tree and that is certainly my own problem not anybody elses. hey i don't like the germans either they are a bunch of sausage sucking swine with horrible personalities. I hate my german ancestors /sarcasm.

some people need to look at the logs in their own eye before they start noticing the specks in the eyes of others. I think the people who focus on the race issue the most are the true racists. But that is a separate debate.

I just don't like the people who come to this country thinking we will bend over backwards to change for them rather than them putting out effort to fit in with us. It has nothing to do wtih race and everything to do with the attitude of the immigrant.


Anyway I have been thinking this over and have decided that even though people who are too apathetic to learn english are a blight on this country the medical field is not the place to challenge it. however apathetic a person is their life is still important.
 
dgroulx said:
But, I'd be extremely grateful if there was someone there who spoke English until I got up to speed in Norwegian.

I would learn the language before i left the country (if i was planning on living there for an extended time period). It would make my time there more enjoyable and the people in the country would probably appreciate the effort.

The dutch are an impressive people for most of them have managed to learn english and have not even left their own country!
 
aubieRx said:
Anyway I have been thinking this over and have decided that even though people who are too apathetic to learn english are a blight on this country the medical field is not the place to challenge it. however apathetic a person is their life is still important.

I couldn't agree with you more.
 
yeah there are other more subtle ways to deal with the language problem I suppose..... and i really do think its a problem that needs to be addressed. A country that is unified with language is a stronger country.

I know the japanese would have a heart attack if a bunch of americans moved there and refused to learn japanese.
 
aubieRx said:
I would learn the language before i left the country (if i was planning on living there for an extended time period). It would make my time there more enjoyable and the people in the country would probably appreciate the effort.
This is an unrealistic expectaion to hold others to, though.
 
bananaface said:
This is an unrealistic expectaion to hold others to, though.

not really. immigration should not be uncontrolled because something that is not controlled can quickly get out of control and cause a problem (analogy is letting water out of a dam..it has to be at a certain rate not all at once or the whole thing will go haywire). not many countries are as "Friendly" as america is towards immigrants and with good reason. You have to watch who is crossing the borders.

Australia is strictly controlled as is japan (Even canada is more tightly regulated than the united states). The french hate the english language and have gone so far as to construct government organizations whose main purpose is to find french sounding substitutes for english words that are working their way into the language.

But god, whatever the french do is a OK with everyone. they are the cultural elite. 🙄 If the americans did that to try and weed spanish words out of english we would be considered racist/xenophobic.

It is kinda like the liberals who praise tolerance but then make a point of putting down the culture of the south and southerners in general. Prejudice is only an enemy to some liberals when it is the "right" kind of prejudice in their eyes.

Anyway there is some sick compulsion many people (particularly american liberals) have that anyone who can ride on a jet plane deserves insta-citizenship.

Well, i know its gonna cause trouble (erratic immigration rates/lax policies and rules) if it keeps up and i won't have much sympathy for the crying monday morning quarterbacks who had scoffed at people who tried to predict it before it happened.


if millions of mexicans who could not speak french made their way into france we would quickly see the superior "european" attitudes of tolerance give way to a bit of fussing.
 
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