Mac or PC????

[DrYoda]

Post 50!!!!!!!!!


Edit: and macs are teh suck.

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[Kaustikos]

People are talking about "power" and PC's. Yes, you can buy a more powerful PC for less than you would pay for a Mac. But that added power won't help you when the next virus comes around (they always do) or when the operating system fails. Rebooting your computer constantly? Come on don't lie.. I've been using control alt delete since I was like seven. The mac loves to run. I rarely turn mine off. Close the lid. Done.

Again, we're going to the idiot-proof argument here. I have only had 1 virus in the past 12 years of owning a PC. Am I some messiah? Or are people really gullible and stupid that you need to say "virus-free" and "easy use" to get people to purchase something? Give me your most expensive Mac and I'll build you a PC with all of plus 2x better hardware (RAM/Processor/Videocard)

I've owned three apple laptops in the last 6 years and I can count on my left hand how many times they've frozen up - all three machines combined. They've always stayed pretty fast and have kept up with some pretty hefty software (prof recording programs).

Also, not once have I had to have someone fix my computer. Viruses? I haven't even thought about the possibility of a virus on my computers in years. Yet every PC I've ever owned I have had to whipe it clean and reinstall the OS. I've cleaned out probably 5 or 6 friends as well. Pretty brutal if you ask me.

Small sample group. Add myself, and my family of only having to reinstall windows 2 times in the past 15 years.

What? Who here would just love to waste their time "manipulating their operating system?"

You're simply proving my point that people choose macs for simplicity. Again, doesn't mean better than PC.

Software compatibility issues? Its over people. You can get a mac version for everything these days - I know there are the minute exceptions.. but I just don't care about the next version of some obscure computer game. I guess that works for me, maybe it doesn't for others. In general, if its popular enough for me to notice it, then its probably available for Mac.

Probably NOT. I can say that with every software release, you have to wait to get it on the Mac if it will come out for the Mac. Granted, most MAJOR releases will make it, but that's if the software company wants to deal with it.

Looks. They are beautiful.

They're FUN. Some cool features - magnetic power cords, backlit keyboards, great big neat trackpads (use two fingers and it scrolls for you, four fingers gets you to your dashboard - which is a whole new set of fun free things to play around with.) There's really so much more too. It would take too long.

And you pay the price for it

Let's face it people. Apple is doing it right. Ever since the beginning of the iPod era and now to the iPhone, they're awesome. And it's all because they are completely focused on the user experience, which is what you have to deal with on a daily basis as a buyer.

In the end its a matter of preference.. really no hate to the PC people out there cause everyone has there personal needs. That said, as an ex PC user, I would literally cry if someone told me my next computer had to be a PC. Real tears too, not like glistening in the eyes or anything.

I agree, they are. They're taking away the idiot demographic and placing the with a simple computer they can use. Jk - but they are with ipods and what have you. But that still doesn't necessarily prove they are "better".

 

[NickNaylor]

I think many people would buy a Mac if they just had money to blow (or at least I would), but for me, I can't justify spending $1700+ on a MacBook Pro when I can get a PC with at least equal specifications for substantially cheaper.

 

[tdittyx2x3]

I really wasn't trying to say they were better for all people out there, I was trying to say they're better for people who don't care about the detailed computer world or those that don't bother with unpopular software. I use my computer, I don't work on it like I would a car. Plenty of people are happy with their PC's, but I'm also sure those people are pretty computer savvy and keep a good eye on maintenance to keep their machine running smoothly.

Most people my age, I'm a youngin, just want to use their computer for internet, music, chat, and schoolwork. Just for me personally, I would rather my "playskool" Mac that doesn't give me problems and is very intuitive, all while being sweet to look at and fun to use, in order to accomplish these things. Of course, you must be able to look beyond the cost - I would say they are worth it. If you can't, then ya should stop reading this thread and buy a PC, right?

Kaustikos, the answer is no you are not the messiah. I am the messiah. I bring the message of playtoy computers to all of SDN.

 

[Kaustikos]

I really wasn't trying to say they were better for all people out there, I was trying to say they're better for people who don't care about the detailed computer world or those that don't bother with unpopular software. I use my computer, I don't work on it like I would a car. Plenty of people are happy with their PC's, but I'm also sure those people are pretty computer savvy and keep a good eye on maintenance to keep their machine running smoothly.

Most people my age, I'm a youngin, just want to use their computer for internet, music, chat, and schoolwork. Just for me personally, I would rather my "playskool" Mac that doesn't give me problems and is very intuitive, all while being sweet to look at and fun to use, in order to accomplish these things. Of course, you must be able to look beyond the cost - I would say they are worth it. If you can't, then ya should stop reading this thread and buy a PC, right?

Kaustikos, the answer is no you are not the messiah. I am the messiah. I bring the message of playtoy computers to all of SDN.

with that logic
**** macs and pcs

get a netbook

 

[Dr Lyss]

I really wasn't trying to say they were better for all people out there, I was trying to say they're better for people who don't care about the detailed computer world or those that don't bother with unpopular software. I use my computer, I don't work on it like I would a car. Plenty of people are happy with their PC's, but I'm also sure those people are pretty computer savvy and keep a good eye on maintenance to keep their machine running smoothly.

Most people my age, I'm a youngin, just want to use their computer for internet, music, chat, and schoolwork. Just for me personally, I would rather my "playskool" Mac that doesn't give me problems and is very intuitive, all while being sweet to look at and fun to use, in order to accomplish these things. Of course, you must be able to look beyond the cost - I would say they are worth it. If you can't, then ya should stop reading this thread and buy a PC, right?

Kaustikos, the answer is no you are not the messiah. I am the messiah. I bring the message of playtoy computers to all of SDN.

I had no problems with using a PC until I went away to college. On these college networks there are so many viruses it is ridiculous. Will that happen in medical school? I have no idea but I know very little about computers so i prefer a no muss no fuss machine. For me that's a mac but I think there are some PCs that are very user friendly and can be protected from viruses if you jack em up with enough stuff.

So moral of the story: try em both and see what YOU like

 

[ButImLETired]

Well, I have been told by a bunch of med students at various interviews that getting a Mac is an extra hassle unless you want to run Windows on it (which in my opinion entirely defeats the purpose of a Mac and REALLY doesn't make the price worth it). A lot of the proprietary software of the schools either runs only on PC or better on PC than on Macs. If you know where you're going or know what your options are, I'd ask the students there what they have seen and whether the school requires/promotes one over the other, how much of a hassle they see Macs are around the school, etc. I know Duke bypasses the whole mess by giving students a laptop at orientation (a PC), and all the other schools I've been considering told me to switch to a PC so as to avoid any headaches when trying to use the school software (I figure I'll have enough to worry about without stuff crashing).

This actually sucks for me cause I bought a Macbook Pro last year and love it. Yes, it was expensive, but I'm not a computer whiz and I find that the user experience is much simpler and more pleasant, not to mention the fact that not worrying about viruses is really quite nice. On the other hand, the MBP is heavy and since people recommend taking notes on a laptop, I figured I'll just get a small sturdy one and use that for school stuff. Anyways, to each his/her own.

 

[Dr Lyss]

with that logic
**** macs and pcs

get a netbook

 

[ButImLETired]

I had no problems with using a PC until I went away to college. On these college networks there are so many viruses it is ridiculous. Will that happen in medical school? I have no idea but I know very little about computers so i prefer a no muss no fuss machine. For me that's a mac but I think there are some PCs that are very user friendly and can be protected from viruses if you jack em up with enough stuff.

So moral of the story: try em both and see what YOU like

Hey Lyss, check with people at Weill before you get a Mac and see what they say about them and how well they work with the school's software. If you have to run Windows on it anyway, in my opinion, it's not really worth it.

 

[chessknt]

When Steve Jobs dies maybe all the mac tools will realize how ******ed they were and come back to the other 90% of the world.

Seriously, any problem you name for a PC (aside from poor sound/video editing) is easily fixed by knowing wtf you are doing. Macs are overpriced fashion hardware.

 

[Dr Lyss]

Hey Lyss, check with people at Weill before you get a Mac and see what they say about them and how well they work with the school's software. If you have to run Windows on it anyway, in my opinion, it's not really worth it.

Yea I am. I just got my lap top in May so I'm hoping it isn't an issue... but I know all of their PBL rooms are Mac computers & their library has a lot of Macs so i don't think it will be an issue.

 

[Dr Lyss]

When Steve Jobs dies maybe all the mac tools will realize how ******ed they were and come back to the other 90% of the world.

Seriously, any problem you name for a PC (aside from poor sound/video editing) is easily fixed by knowing wtf you are doing. Macs are overpriced fashion hardware.

Sorry if my ignorance offends you... I didn't know you needed a computer science degree to operate a computer and not be a tool

 

[chessknt]

Sorry if my ignorance offends you... I didn't know you needed a computer science degree to operate a computer and not be a tool

You dont, you just need to know how to use google.

 

[ButImLETired]

When Steve Jobs dies maybe all the mac tools will realize how ******ed they were and come back to the other 90% of the world.

Seriously, any problem you name for a PC (aside from poor sound/video editing) is easily fixed by knowing wtf you are doing. Macs are overpriced fashion hardware.

Funny, my MIT engineer sister and her MIT computer scientist best friend both use Macs at home because they're more pleasant and stable for basic, home stuff. I'm gonna have to tell them it must be because they dont know wtf they're doing and can't use google.

 

[pooghe]

My first post! On this issue of mac vs pc, there are many different criteria that must be addressed. I was facing such problem myself but went with a mac for several reasons.
I was tired of XP because it was high maintenance. I had to defrag every two weeks to keep things running quickly, on top of that I had to run a virus program every week overnight to scan for viruses which it invariably found. I had to run a registry editer once a month to fix the registry, which is arguably the weakest point of the windows OS. I also use my computer with high performance PC only software that requires a significant amount of horsepower. When I first bought the PC it could perform under heavy loads. Even with my constant maintance, after 1 year the PC could no longer handle the software. That is a windows problem and will follow you even if you double boot your mac with xp, but the mac did have the power to pull through on that application.
I also take my laptop everywhere with me and I needed it to be light. The MacBook Pro 17 inch is the lightest 17 inch laptop on the market. It is still heavy but it is a good bit lighter than anything else. In my experiance selling a mac is also better for you financially. They retain more of their value when sold. I bought a titanium G4 laptop in 1999 and sold it in 2005 at 50% of the original price. You just can't do that with any pc product.
In terms of medical school, I think you can't go wrong with the 13 inch macbook (white plastic model) especially if you can find a used, but factory refurbished model. These work like the new thing and are clean and in good condition but will be between 100-200 dollars cheaper than the new model. Add a student discount to that during a sale and you will find getting an apple is quite affordable for a student. It will also make your parents happy because they are paying less. Sorry for the long post.

 

[Kaustikos]

Funny, my MIT engineer sister and her MIT computer scientist best friend both use Macs at home because they're more pleasant and stable for basic, home stuff. I'm gonna have to tell them it must be because they dont know wtf they're doing and can't use google.

Call them up again in a year and see if they both don't have a netbook Yeah, but seriously, it's not a question of not knowing how to use it, because then the argument could go towards me and using macs (Still has no clue how to navigate the OS to this day)

My first post! On this issue of mac vs pc, there are many different criteria that must be addressed. I was facing such problem myself but went with a mac for several reasons.
I was tired of XP because it was high maintenance. I had to defrag every two weeks to keep things running quickly, on top of that I had to run a virus program every week overnight to scan for viruses which it invariably found. I had to run a registry editer once a month to fix the registry, which is arguably the weakest point of the windows OS. I also use my computer with high performance PC only software that requires a significant amount of horsepower. When I first bought the PC it could perform under heavy loads. Even with my constant maintance, after 1 year the PC could no longer handle the software. That is a windows problem and will follow you even if you double boot your mac with xp, but the mac did have the power to pull through on that application.
I also take my laptop everywhere with me and I needed it to be light. The MacBook Pro 17 inch is the lightest 17 inch laptop on the market. It is still heavy but it is a good bit lighter than anything else. In my experiance selling a mac is also better for you financially. They retain more of their value when sold. I bought a titanium G4 laptop in 1999 and sold it in 2005 at 50% of the original price. You just can't do that with any pc product.
In terms of medical school, I think you can't go wrong with the 13 inch macbook (white plastic model) especially if you can find a used, but factory refurbished model. These work like the new thing and are clean and in good condition but will be between 100-200 dollars cheaper than the new model. Add a student discount to that during a sale and you will find getting an apple is quite affordable for a student. It will also make your parents happy because they are paying less. Sorry for the long post.

Stop looking at porn and high-risk security sites like you're not supposed to do in the first place.
You can set your defragmentation to go off at night when you sleep on whatever schedule you want
You need to get the right hardware. Again, RIGHT HARDWARE. I cannot telly ou how many people complain about their PC's after year when they went for the cheapest parts with the "most" power and succumbed to ****ty design. That's what you'll run into. I guarantee that if more companies made "macs" we'd see the same dilemma that PC users see. If we want to compare apples to apples, get a PC made by Voodoo or Alienware (ironicallly now distributed by Dell) or any high-end PC maker and compare it to a Mac. You'd be hardpressed to find something you didn't like about those things.

 

[nick_carraway]

get a PC made by Voodoo or Alienware (ironicallly now distributed by Dell) or any high-end PC maker and compare it to a Mac. You'd be hardpressed to find something you didn't like about those things.

I think it's funny that you criticize Apple for its pricing and then bring up Alienware.

Several things I didn't like about them: WEIGHT (steel chassis? no thanks). PRICE (while you're busy saying how cheaply you can build a machine, you ignore the fact that Alienware shafts you more than Apple). BUNDLED SOFTWARE (seriously? on a gaming rig?). SIZE (the POS is massive--larger than server-grade cases from Lian Li). UPGRADABILITY (some of their components are proprietary and they're a pain to replace partially because of chassis design).

 

[pooghe]

Stop looking at porn and high-risk security sites like you're not supposed to do in the first place.
You can set your defragmentation to go off at night when you sleep on whatever schedule you want
You need to get the right hardware. Again, RIGHT HARDWARE. I cannot telly ou how many people complain about their PC's after year when they went for the cheapest parts with the "most" power and succumbed to ****ty design. That's what you'll run into. I guarantee that if more companies made "macs" we'd see the same dilemma that PC users see. If we want to compare apples to apples, get a PC made by Voodoo or Alienware (ironicallly now distributed by Dell) or any high-end PC maker and compare it to a Mac. You'd be hardpressed to find something you didn't like about those things.

Kaustikos thanks for that tip, because I really need you of all people giving me advice. Moving on. As you probably forgot, the OP is looking for a computer for medical school. MEDICAL SCHOOL. Truly interesting to see a med student lugging an alienware into lecture everyday. Ridiculous... You have forgotten the context in which we are speaking. Yes there are very well built PCs. And no they are not portable, light, or cheap. At the same price of around $800 I highly doubt that the OP could find a PC laptop from any vendor that has a similar set of capabilities. In terms of hardware yes, in terms of value no. A medical student is quite busy, hence no time to deal with the quirky behavior of a PC. A computer savvy person such as you (I assume) or me could easily work through those issues, but does a medical student truly have the time to put into something like this. The mac's record speaks for itself. Under similar conditions of wear and tear and neglect your average mac will last better and give you more value than the average PC. Notice I said "average" Obviously someone who takes great care of their computer will get better results no matter what type it is.

 

[niranjan162]

Kaustikos thanks for that tip, because I really need you of all people giving me advice. Moving on. As you probably forgot, the OP is looking for a computer for medical school. MEDICAL SCHOOL. Truly interesting to see a med student lugging an alienware into lecture everyday. Ridiculous... You have forgotten the context in which we are speaking. Yes there are very well built PCs. And no they are not portable, light, or cheap. At the same price of around $800 I highly doubt that the OP could find a PC laptop from any vendor that has a similar set of capabilities. In terms of hardware yes, in terms of value no. A medical student is quite busy, hence no time to deal with the quirky behavior of a PC. A computer savvy person such as you (I assume) or me could easily work through those issues, but does a medical student truly have the time to put into something like this. The mac's record speaks for itself. Under similar conditions of wear and tear and neglect your average mac will last better and give you more value than the average PC. Notice I said "average" Obviously someone who takes great care of their computer will get better results no matter what type it is.

He suggested an alienware cuz you said u used very intensive programs. Unless you are downloading or moving tons of files around defragging every two weeks isnt really gonna do anything. You shouldnt have to run a registry editor either unless your downloading alot of bad stuff. I dl stuff all the time and ive never had to run a registry editor or anything.

Have I gotten a virus yea, but virus software stopped it from doing anything. Dont worry as macs get more popular people will find their vulnerabilities and make viruses for them as well. Its only a matter of time.

Im not sure wut your $800 argument is refering to either. Are u saying that you wouldnt be able to find an $800 setup similar to a mac? Because if you are your are right, you could find a better one for $800

Im getting a netbook for med school, cuz i want portability and i dont wanna spend $2000 for it.

But for me why would i spend more money for less performance. Id rather have to deal with the occasional virus (which is easily taken care of by virus software), so that i can get a computer that runs faster etc. and allows me to wait less.

 

[pooghe]

niranjan please notice I wasn't asking for suggestions about what computer I should use. I acknowledge your point about macs becoming more vulnerable as they become more popular but for the time being they are infinitely more secure when compared to windows based machines. I also ran a virus program, it was cumbersome and slowed my computer's performance such that when I ran my software the computer would function at an agonizing crawl. The $800 argument states that I challenge you to find a laptop that is windows based which offeres the same value that a macbook offers for the same price. Not hardware. Value. Value is defined as many things but here it could be said that value is in a computer that is rock stable meaning it rarely if ever crashes, is fairly secure against virus threats, is low maintenace, and offers ease of use. Find me a pc laptop that offers all of these at a price lower than $800.

Netbooks are an exciting prospect and I too look forward to getting a netbook, but I'm going to be waiting a while before I replace my primary laptop with a netbook, at the moment they just don't offer enough performance or useability for anything other than simple tasks. I hope companies start offering higher performance netbooks soon.

 

[nick_carraway]

Netbooks are an exciting prospect and I too look forward to getting a netbook, but I'm going to be waiting a while before I replace my primary laptop with a netbook, at the moment they just don't offer enough performance or useability for anything other than simple tasks. I hope companies start offering higher performance netbooks soon.

What's interesting to me is that most people I've seen so far are saying that they'd use their netbooks as their mobile computer and use their primary machine at home.

The marketing from companies, however, say it's small enough to put in your pocket, in your clutch purse, etc. They seem to think that people want to augment their smart phones and not their primary computer.

Am I the only person who thinks that smart phones don't really need replacing? They meet the need of browsing the net when bored, checking email when bored, even watching some videos. Why would companies try to convince customers otherwise?

 

[Kaustikos]

niranjan please notice I wasn't asking for suggestions about what computer I should use. I acknowledge your point about macs becoming more vulnerable as they become more popular but for the time being they are infinitely more secure when compared to windows based machines. I also ran a virus program, it was cumbersome and slowed my computer's performance such that when I ran my software the computer would function at an agonizing crawl. The $800 argument states that I challenge you to find a laptop that is windows based which offeres the same value that a macbook offers for the same price. Not hardware. Value. Value is defined as many things but here it could be said that value is in a computer that is rock stable meaning it rarely if ever crashes, is fairly secure against virus threats, is low maintenace, and offers ease of use. Find me a pc laptop that offers all of these at a price lower than $800.

Netbooks are an exciting prospect and I too look forward to getting a netbook, but I'm going to be waiting a while before I replace my primary laptop with a netbook, at the moment they just don't offer enough performance or useability for anything other than simple tasks. I hope companies start offering higher performance netbooks soon.

Again, I suppose you're one of those people who was unlucky. I wouldn't lambast an entire platform because of your unfortunate circumstances as they are generally not even close to the norm. Things happen, yes, but that's not to say it wasn't an isolated incident.

Also, netbooks are not for performance. I don't think you understand the idea behind them if you're waiting for a performance minded netbook. They're portable, lightweight computing for simple tasks, not for gaming/art and design.

What's interesting to me is that most people I've seen so far are saying that they'd use their netbooks as their mobile computer and use their primary machine at home.

The marketing from companies, however, say it's small enough to put in your pocket, in your clutch purse, etc. They seem to think that people want to augment their smart phones and not their primary computer.

Am I the only person who thinks that smart phones don't really need replacing? They meet the need of browsing the net when bored, checking email when bored, even watching some videos. Why would companies try to convince customers otherwise?

I saw a vid with jimmy falon basically highlighting this from Sony's new Vaio and it was .... somewhat portable and able to go into a man's inside jacket pocket. But the idea is ridiculous, imo. I do, however, find the appeal in a portable computing device that isn't as ridiculously small as a smartphone but not as heavy/annoying as a laptop. They've found a niche market and I think it serves a lot more purpose than people are willing to admit

 

[Kaustikos]

Kaustikos thanks for that tip, because I really need you of all people giving me advice. Moving on. As you probably forgot, the OP is looking for a computer for medical school. MEDICAL SCHOOL. Truly interesting to see a med student lugging an alienware into lecture everyday. Ridiculous... You have forgotten the context in which we are speaking. Yes there are very well built PCs. And no they are not portable, light, or cheap. At the same price of around $800 I highly doubt that the OP could find a PC laptop from any vendor that has a similar set of capabilities. In terms of hardware yes, in terms of value no. A medical student is quite busy, hence no time to deal with the quirky behavior of a PC. A computer savvy person such as you (I assume) or me could easily work through those issues, but does a medical student truly have the time to put into something like this. The mac's record speaks for itself. Under similar conditions of wear and tear and neglect your average mac will last better and give you more value than the average PC. Notice I said "average" Obviously someone who takes great care of their computer will get better results no matter what type it is.

I've already voiced my opinion on what the student should get (netbook). I'm arguing Mac quality, here.

 

[nick_carraway]

I saw a vid with jimmy falon basically highlighting this from Sony's new Vaio and it was .... somewhat portable and able to go into a man's inside jacket pocket. But the idea is ridiculous, imo. I do, however, find the appeal in a portable computing device that isn't as ridiculously small as a smartphone but not as heavy/annoying as a laptop. They've found a niche market and I think it serves a lot more purpose than people are willing to admit

I agree that there's a use for netbooks, but they really need to retool the marketing to fit the demand. Nobody is demanding to replace their smartphone. They simply don't want to carry around their primary computer.

Take this marketing ad, for instance: http://i.gizmodo.com/5129585/japanese-bloggers-dont-buy-that-the-sony-vaio-p-is-pocket+sized

Since when do girls put anything in their jeans pockets except (maybe) a Razr?

I also wonder how many manufacturers they need for such a niche demographic.

 

[chessknt]

Funny, my MIT engineer sister and her MIT computer scientist best friend both use Macs at home because they're more pleasant and stable for basic, home stuff. I'm gonna have to tell them it must be because they dont know wtf they're doing and can't use google.

Vague statement, but false regardless. They either dont want to learn how to keep a PC secure (takes abt an hour tops using google starting from knowing nothing) or are too lazy to do so. Both are not legitimate reasons to pay for boutique Apple prices.

 

[Dr Lyss]

I agree that there's a use for netbooks, but they really need to retool the marketing to fit the demand. Nobody is demanding to replace their smartphone. They simply don't want to carry around their primary computer.

Take this marketing ad, for instance: http://i.gizmodo.com/5129585/japanese-bloggers-dont-buy-that-the-sony-vaio-p-is-pocket+sized

Since when do girls put anything in their jeans pockets except (maybe) a Razr?

I also wonder how many manufacturers they need for such a niche demographic.

hahaha did you see the gallery of pics making fun of that ad?

 

[JJMrK]

On these college networks there are so many viruses it is ridiculous.

What the hell are you talking about?

Rather than suffering from incompatibilities between software & hardware seen on custom built or even factory assembled PCs

Never had one of these obscure "incompatibilities" that you're talking about. I have had a few $700 PCs that performed like $1200 Macs, and one $1500 PC that performed like a $3000 Mac.

 

[nick_carraway]

hahaha did you see the gallery of pics making fun of that ad?

Hilarious, I know. Although to be fair, the ad did have merits of its own.

 

[tdittyx2x3]

Some people should think more about the typical user of a computer these days, rather than their own experience. Most people don't want to have to google how to fix their computer. Simply put, they don't want to have to fix their computer at all. Mac offers that much more so than a PC, almost certainly, and especially if you aren't a techie computer type of user.

I don't want to defrag my laptop in the night time, day time, or anytime. I don't want to watch it slow down over time, because of my neglect, the popularity of viruses, or really for any reason at all - It just shouldn't slow down. And I especially don't want to use my own time to google a problem and figure out how to fix it when it does happen - and its happened to me enough times that I'll never go back to PC.

Also, at my seven school visits, I asked the mac question at every one. Not one had issues with a student using a mac... probably because its a fairly popular computer amongst new graduates. Sure maybe 10-15% of the population uses mac, but I'd bet its significantly higher for students. I'm guessing 20-25% these days.

HAPPY BICKERING EVERYONE!

 

[Sora]

Vague statement, but false regardless. They either dont want to learn how to keep a PC secure (takes abt an hour tops using google starting from knowing nothing) or are too lazy to do so. Both are not legitimate reasons to pay for boutique Apple prices.

I own an old HP notebook, with which I spent the time to immunize from viruses and spyware. This was a monthly process that pissed the hell out of me, because of the detritus that build up in that month. As a current MacBook owner, this NEVER happens. Nor do I have to run the defrag. Among other things.

As for "boutique" Apple prices... what you are paying for is a fast processor, a large amount of memory, a compact system, and the most enjoyable notebook I've ever owned.

 

[JJMrK]

As for "boutique" Apple prices... what you are paying for is a fast processor, a large amount of memory, a compact system,

No.

That's the biggest pile of BS in the whole thread. We've already established that an equally powerful PC can be had for about 50% of the cost of a mac. What you're paying for is a prettier package, and a prettier interface. Both of which, ironically, impede customization and control.

I don't want to defrag my laptop in the night time, day time, or anytime. I don't want to watch it slow down over time, because of my neglect, the popularity of viruses, or really for any reason at all - It just shouldn't slow down.

At least you admit it's your own fault. Like I said earlier: EBKAC. Look it up.

 

[rama kandra]

you People dont even Deserve Computers.

somewhere, some guys rubbing two sticks together to make a fire and your bickering about whether steve or bill has a bigger load

 

[chessknt]

I own an old HP notebook, with which I spent the time to immunize from viruses and spyware. This was a monthly process that pissed the hell out of me, because of the detritus that build up in that month. As a current MacBook owner, this NEVER happens. Nor do I have to run the defrag. Among other things.

As for "boutique" Apple prices... what you are paying for is a fast processor, a large amount of memory, a compact system, and the most enjoyable notebook I've ever owned.

I paid 600 for my Dell laptop and it meets all of those requirements and has 6 hrs of battery life.

 

[niranjan162]

I never understood this argument. Sure, the front-end of Mac OS X is more minimalistic, but I doubt that anyone with a working knowledge of Unix would agree that you have less control over a Mac than a PC.

The $800 argument states that I challenge you to find a laptop that is windows based which offeres the same value that a macbook offers for the same price. Not hardware. Value. Value is defined as many things but here it could be said that value is in a computer that is rock stable meaning it rarely if ever crashes, is fairly secure against virus threats, is low maintenace, and offers ease of use. Find me a pc laptop that offers all of these at a price lower than $800.

Netbooks are an exciting prospect and I too look forward to getting a netbook, but I'm going to be waiting a while before I replace my primary laptop with a netbook, at the moment they just don't offer enough performance or useability for anything other than simple tasks. I hope companies start offering higher performance netbooks soon.

I define value as a good performance for good price. While i can appreciate a nice form, which macs have. But i would much rather get the best performance available for what i spend.

Netbooks are sufficient for the majority of the population. Aside from the occasional game or video encoding i do, a netbook can handle everything i do. They small computers at affordable prices for the majority of people. You can get some pretty powerful small computers, but they are expensive too.

What's interesting to me is that most people I've seen so far are saying that they'd use their netbooks as their mobile computer and use their primary machine at home.

The marketing from companies, however, say it's small enough to put in your pocket, in your clutch purse, etc. They seem to think that people want to augment their smart phones and not their primary computer.

Am I the only person who thinks that smart phones don't really need replacing? They meet the need of browsing the net when bored, checking email when bored, even watching some videos. Why would companies try to convince customers otherwise?

I dont think they are trying to market smartphones. I dont even have a laptop, i have a pretty good desktop. Netbooks fill a niche in the market that was waiting to explode and rightfully so. The only reason im getting a laptop at all is so i can take along power points and stuff for school anywhere, so i dont have to be crammed in a library or my room. Im not gonna need alot of power, but i need to be able to run some basic programs and portablility is huge. So a smart phone could fit this bill but it was be a huge pain to study of a 4 inch screen, but i can get something way more portable than a 15 inch screen. i.e. the netbook fills this perfectly.

 

[TMP-SMX]

I know students in my class that have a notebook and a netbook. I think the netbook is kind of a waste considering it is underpowered. If someone just gets a 4.5lb 13.3" MB with good battery life you can save yourself the trouble because it is very portable. Though I know many people long for the 12" Titanium PB of days old. Often on many PCs you lose performance or increase weight (larger battery) in order to improve battery life. Individuals that want a 7200 RPM HDD or more RAM on their Macs should buy their own upgrades and save money. Considering 2X2GB PC2-5300 RAM can be had now for under $40 shipped there is no excuse. Though the newest Apple notebooks use the much more expensive DDR3 RAM deals can be found around. Add the fact that Applecare can be found easily sub-100 on ebay (got mine for my MB for $79 with live.com cash back) it is a bullet-proof investment for medical school. I don't see any Dell Stores in the malls.

Let's just say fixing errors on a Mac requires less hair pulling than on a Windows computer. Half the battle is figuring out what the cryptic message even means. Host error? Come on. Macs are not perfect, but if something does go wrong there are simple steps you can do to figure out what it is and Leopard makes it very easy to use Time Machine and keep easy backups.

I paid 600 for my Dell laptop and it meets all of those requirements and has 6 hrs of battery life.

Nice. Could you provide a link? Is this a relatively new computer? I assume it would have integrated graphics at that kind of battery life. X4500?

 

[tdittyx2x3]

At least you admit it's your own fault. Like I said earlier: EBKAC. Look it up.

I don't want to change my computer habits for my computer. Ya dig? I like less stress. I enjoy having less problems and less maintenance. I like the solid metal case this guy comes in and the beautiful display and trackpad. I like the pretty look of the OS and the simplicity/intuitiveness of everything. If I wanted to "customize and control" my computer, I'm sure I'd be singing a different tune and I'd be singing it at a lower cost, but I have zero appreciation or desire for that.

This is my computer. Why would I trade my values for yours?

The difference is in the user: What they value and how much they are willing to pay for it. Macs are a better solution for some people. You can't really argue against that...

 

[niranjan162]

simple doesnt necessarily mean intuitive

 

[chessknt]

I know students in my class that have a notebook and a netbook. I think the netbook is kind of a waste considering it is underpowered. If someone just gets a 4.5lb 13.3" MB with good battery life you can save yourself the trouble because it is very portable. Though I know many people long for the 12" Titanium PB of days old. Often on many PCs you lose performance or increase weight (larger battery) in order to improve battery life. Individuals that want a 7200 RPM HDD or more RAM on their Macs should buy their own upgrades and save money. Considering 2X2GB PC2-5300 RAM can be had now for under $40 shipped there is no excuse. Though the newest Apple notebooks use the much more expensive DDR3 RAM deals can be found around. Add the fact that Applecare can be found easily sub-100 on ebay (got mine for my MB for $79 with live.com cash back) it is a bullet-proof investment for medical school. I don't see any Dell Stores in the malls.

Let's just say fixing errors on a Mac requires less hair pulling than on a Windows computer. Half the battle is figuring out what the cryptic message even means. Host error? Come on. Macs are not perfect, but if something does go wrong there are simple steps you can do to figure out what it is and Leopard makes it very easy to use Time Machine and keep easy backups.



Nice. Could you provide a link? Is this a relatively new computer? I assume it would have integrated graphics at that kind of battery life. X4500?

Dell vostro 1500, 2 gb ram, gforce 8300 (obviously bat life falls dramatically if playing a game, but it handles HL2 engine, WC3, and other perfectly fine), 6 cell battery etc etc. Got it during a black friday deal 2 yrs ago.

You can get mobos for PCs for <40 easily that last at least a few years.

These supposedly cryptic messages are easily resolved using ......... GOOGLE .........

Windows has perfectly functional analogs to Leopard and Time Machine.

I have never ONCE needed outside technical support in 12+ years of PC ownership unless it was to get a RMA for defective hardware.

 

[nick_carraway]

You can get mobos for PCs for <40 easily that last at least a few years.

A POS mobo. I don't necessarily think that people need to buy enthusiast gear, but I wouldn't trust a $40 mobo with anything. A faulty mobo is the largest hassle for a troubleshooter.

 

[nick_carraway]

This is my computer. Why would I trade my values for yours?

...

Macs are a better solution for some people. You can't really argue against that...

Wow. If you're hella tired like me and you're just skimming along, this PC/Mac debate resembles a theological debate.

 

[tncekm]

People are talking about "power" and PC's. Yes, you can buy a more powerful PC for less than you would pay for a Mac. But that added power won't help you when the next virus comes around (they always do) or when the operating system fails. Rebooting your computer constantly? Come on don't lie.. I've been using control alt delete since I was like seven. The mac loves to run. I rarely turn mine off. Close the lid. Done.

From Win XP to Windows 7 Beta I've had just as few crashes with my PC's (or less) than with my mac's. The only difference is instead of the Blue Screen of Death (BSOD) you get the Beach Ball of Death (BBOD). It doesn't look as ugly, but it's still crashed.

Virus issue is a legit one. There aren't a ton of Mac viruses, yet.

I've owned three apple laptops in the last 6 years and I can count on my left hand how many times they've frozen up - all three machines combined. They've always stayed pretty fast and have kept up with some pretty hefty software (prof recording programs).

OS X is really not that stable. The stability is a myth. Although, I have to admit... when a program crashes in OS X and it doesn't make a big stink about it like Windows does, it doesn't seem as serious But, the reality is the programs (and the OS) still crash when you start working the computer hard. Given the EXTREMELY limited hardware set that OS X runs on, that's unacceptable IMHO.

However, the one beauty of Mac laptop's is the boot/shutdown/sleep functions.

 

[tncekm]

Funny, my MIT engineer sister and her MIT computer scientist best friend both use Macs at home because they're more pleasant and stable for basic, home stuff. I'm gonna have to tell them it must be because they dont know wtf they're doing and can't use google.

MIT engineer doesn't mean "right". I've owned all types of hardware, run all kinds OS's in all different stages of development over my many years of being an amateur computer nerd (i.e. right now I'm running Windows 7 Beta) and it is an absolute myth that OS X is more stable. I'd get BBOD and program crashes more often on OS X than on Vista on the same Apple hardware!

OS X is a little more simple though, and it does come with better software for things like web development, etc. I also like the fact that it's *nix based and I can toy around with it, but that's not really part of the "simple" component.

I think it's funny that you criticize Apple for its pricing and then bring up Alienware.

Agreed... Alienware is ridiculous.

SIZE (the POS is massive--larger than server-grade cases from Lian Li).

Well, many people love big open cases so they can better dissipate heat from overclocked hardware. My case is huge, and it if weren't I wouldn't be able to keep my hardware cool while overclocking the crap out of it.

 

[tncekm]

A POS mobo. I don't necessarily think that people need to buy enthusiast gear, but I wouldn't trust a $40 mobo with anything. A faulty mobo is the largest hassle for a troubleshooter.

Nah, there are some great Gigabit Mobo's for ~$50. The biggest issue most users need to consider is purchasing a quality power supply because a crappy power supply can cause all kinds of irritating issues.

For $300-400 I can build a pretty powerful computer. Add an extra $150 on there and it'll handle most high end games with High settings.

 

[nick_carraway]

Well, many people love big open cases so they can better dissipate heat from overclocked hardware. My case is huge, and it if weren't I wouldn't be able to keep my hardware cool while overclocking the crap out of it.

You can get large, open, light cases from Lian Li that allow heat dissipation and easy access to components. Alienware's case (based on an old Antec case) is ridiculous. There's not even that much room in them when you start messing around inside, which is the irritating part. Antec's silent full tower is relatively roomy, however. Feels so cheapy though.

Nah, there are some great Gigabit Mobo's for ~$50. The biggest issue most users need to consider is purchasing a quality power supply because a crappy power supply can cause all kinds of irritating issues.

Gigabyte?! I'm sorry, but that falls under the POS I was referring to earlier. As for a quality power supply, I agree completely. One surprising thing about Alienware is that their power supply is from a no name vendor. The only thing worse than spending hours troubleshooting to end up at your mobo is to end up at your PSU... especially if your PSU kills something else (knock on wood).

 

[chessknt]

You can get large, open, light cases from Lian Li that allow heat dissipation and easy access to components. Alienware's case (based on an old Antec case) is ridiculous. There's not even that much room in them when you start messing around inside, which is the irritating part. Antec's silent full tower is relatively roomy, however. Feels so cheapy though.



Gigabyte?! I'm sorry, but that falls under the POS I was referring to earlier. As for a quality power supply, I agree completely. One surprising thing about Alienware is that their power supply is from a no name vendor. The only thing worse than spending hours troubleshooting to end up at your mobo is to end up at your PSU... especially if your PSU kills something else (knock on wood).

I have always had something else break long before my cheapy mobo has. Maybe for overclockers it sucks, but for default use, Gbit is just dandy.

 

[TMP-SMX]

Dell vostro 1500, 2 gb ram, gforce 8300 (obviously bat life falls dramatically if playing a game, but it handles HL2 engine, WC3, and other perfectly fine), 6 cell battery etc etc. Got it during a black friday deal 2 yrs ago.

You can get mobos for PCs for <40 easily that last at least a few years.

These supposedly cryptic messages are easily resolved using ......... GOOGLE .........

Windows has perfectly functional analogs to Leopard and Time Machine.

I have never ONCE needed outside technical support in 12+ years of PC ownership unless it was to get a RMA for defective hardware.

I don't know if I believe 6 hours on a 6 cell battery with that computer unless you shut of bluetooth, wireless, keep the CPU use to a minimum, and keep the brightness down. The 9 cell option? Maybe. 7.3 pounds? Ouch. Though for the price (especially two years ago) that was a good deal. It has F400 which is a plus. I do hope you upgraded the HDD to get some extra juice out of it. Unless you don't need it why not up it to 4GB? Limited to 3GB by the OS?

If only it was so easy fixing some errors. Host errors could mean hundreds of different things even while looking in the logs. Then you have to worry about drivers. I know Windows has analogs to Time Machine, but none are built into the system ready for someone that wants out of the box back ups. You know what good a program does if it isn't downloaded? Nothing.

 

[JJMrK]

Macs are a better solution for some people.

If you mean people who like to waste money, I'll give you that one.

 

[tdittyx2x3]

Why not respond to the whole post, JIMMY!?

Haha I'm kidding. Calm down.

I just did my laundry yesterday **applause**. As I hung up my favorite dress shirts, I realized they were all Jos. A. Bank's. I love these shirts, and any real man out there will certainly agree with me: they are classy looking, very comfortable and made of thick, durable material (they last FOREVER), and they are virtually wrinkle free. I am the king of wrinkles. I tend to toss my clothes on the ground all the time: before a shower, before sex, when I come home from work, anytime. Let's just say this no wrinkle business is pretty good "feature" for me.

Now to take a probably poor analogy further - can't wait to see that one quoted all on its own with some really weak one liner - I compared the Jos.A.Bank's shirts with my other dress shirts. Really they all look very similar. Like "power and function" between a Mac and PC, they all get the job done when it comes to attracting girls because they all look about the same. In other words, I can use any shirt in my wardrobe to get the job done.

But what about that comfy thick durable feeling I get from the Jos.A. Bank's material? What about the wrinkles that will certainly show up in cheaper brands after a long day of attracting beautiful women? ARGH. My non-wrinkle free dress shirts I have to iron in the morning - which is bad news bears because I barely wake up early enough to make it wherever I'm going on time anyway. The Jos.A.Bank's shirt saves me a hassle and time, plus I really prefer the way it feels when I'm wearing it. Not to mention, the Jos.A.Bank's shirts will last as long as they are still in style. They won't shrink, rip, wrinkle. It's just always my same shirt that I love no matter how many times I wear it or wash it.

Now of course, a Jos.A.Bank's shirt is going to cost you more than a typical collared shirt. It might cost you double. But you ask yourself if you are willing to pay that price for the aspects that you value as a buyer, not what JimmyJammer or whoever techie cares about. If I didn't care about the weight and feel and wrinkability of my dress shirts, I'd never pay 60 or 70 dollars again. BUT I DO CARE and I WILL PAY.

Don't make it like you are throwing away money when you actually appreciate what you are paying for. I love my Macs now and I hated my previous PC's because of all the frustrations. Yes I probably paid 30% more for this baby, but it was worth it and so are my nice dress shirts.

 

[nick_carraway]

Now of course, a Jos.A.Bank's shirt is going to cost you more than a typical collared shirt. It might cost you double. But you ask yourself if you are willing to pay that price for the aspects that you value as a buyer, not what JimmyJammer or whoever techie cares about. If I didn't care about the weight and feel and wrinkability of my dress shirts, I'd never pay 60 or 70 dollars again. BUT I DO CARE and I WILL PAY.

The funny thing is that, in my mind at least, the Jos A. Bank and the Apple demographic are not the same.

But yes, I agree that a nice European dress shirt feels fantastic. I try to get colors that match my Macbook too. That way, the women see that I'm a details oriented guy when they see me at the coffee shop.

 

[JJMrK]

Why not respond to the whole post, JIMMY!?

Haha I'm kidding. Calm down.

I just did my laundry yesterday **applause**. As I hung up my favorite dress shirts, I realized they were all Jos. A. Bank's. I love these shirts, and any real man out there will certainly agree with me: they are classy looking, very comfortable and made of thick, durable material (they last FOREVER), and they are virtually wrinkle free. I am the king of wrinkles. I tend to toss my clothes on the ground all the time: before a shower, before sex, when I come home from work, anytime. Let's just say this no wrinkle business is pretty good "feature" for me.

Now to take a probably poor analogy further - can't wait to see that one quoted all on its own with some really weak one liner - I compared the Jos.A.Bank's shirts with my other dress shirts. Really they all look very similar. Like "power and function" between a Mac and PC, they all get the job done when it comes to attracting girls because they all look about the same. In other words, I can use any shirt in my wardrobe to get the job done.

But what about that comfy thick durable feeling I get from the Jos.A. Bank's material? What about the wrinkles that will certainly show up in cheaper brands after a long day of attracting beautiful women? ARGH. My non-wrinkle free dress shirts I have to iron in the morning - which is bad news bears because I barely wake up early enough to make it wherever I'm going on time anyway. The Jos.A.Bank's shirt saves me a hassle and time, plus I really prefer the way it feels when I'm wearing it. Not to mention, the Jos.A.Bank's shirts will last as long as they are still in style. They won't shrink, rip, wrinkle. It's just always my same shirt that I love no matter how many times I wear it or wash it.

Now of course, a Jos.A.Bank's shirt is going to cost you more than a typical collared shirt. It might cost you double. But you ask yourself if you are willing to pay that price for the aspects that you value as a buyer, not what JimmyJammer or whoever techie cares about. If I didn't care about the weight and feel and wrinkability of my dress shirts, I'd never pay 60 or 70 dollars again. BUT I DO CARE and I WILL PAY.

Don't make it like you are throwing away money when you actually appreciate what you are paying for. I love my Macs now and I hated my previous PC's because of all the frustrations. Yes I probably paid 30% more for this baby, but it was worth it and so are my nice dress shirts.

I wouldn't know dude, I wear t-shirts.