Meaningful Volunteering Hours

[Silac]

I am currently a sophomore. Previous to this year I have done some clinical volunteering. However, I am concerned about my ability to get 'enough' hours by the time I graduate. Personally I do not feel as if I need to spend X amount of hours doing Y volunteer work in order to make a different or personally grow. That being said my goal is to attend a top 20 MD school. I set this goal on myself to push myself. I realize that any MD school will provide a quality education. I have started to volunteer at a Hospice organization this semester and I feel it is a very powerful and meaningful experience. I do not think that I will be able to get more than 150 hours max before applying to medical school. Similarly I am applying to volunteer at a children's shelter. I do not foresee being able to get more than 120 or so hours from that activity. I see both of these opportunities as way to grow personally and to make a real difference in another person's life. BUT I wont have 50000 hours. I would like to be competitive for a top 20 school. Will these limited hours become a bottle neck on my application?

To add a little more detail so that you guys are able to give a more informed response: I have also recently started an organization that is focused on outreach and education of an undeserved community. My current clinical volunteering is about 40 hours at a ED. This number will also continue to grow. Currently I have around 200 hours of shadowing across several specialties. My GPA as of this semester stands at a 4.0. I have been in a research lab since the beginning of my sophomore year. I also hold a job in my home town at a hospital as a clinical research intern working 40 hours a week during the summer and winter break. I have various other EC's that are less significant.

If those hours aren't my bottle neck then what is?

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[Ad2b]

you are a sophomore. you have plenty of time. find a cause (think you did) and donate yourself to it. That will be sufficient; simply checking a box is not.

I have 10,000+ hours volunteering because I've been doing so since I was about 13; I'm 52. Do the math on that one

 

[Matthew9Thirtyfive]

You have plenty of time. I got 300 hours in a year with minimal time spent each week. If you are consistent, the hours will rack up.

 

[westsidestoryz]

I am currently a sophomore. Previous to this year I have done some clinical volunteering. However, I am concerned about my ability to get 'enough' hours by the time I graduate. Personally I do not feel as if I need to spend X amount of hours doing Y volunteer work in order to make a different or personally grow. That being said my goal is to attend a top 20 MD school. I set this goal on myself to push myself. I realize that any MD school will provide a quality education. I have started to volunteer at a Hospice organization this semester and I feel it is a very powerful and meaningful experience. I do not think that I will be able to get more than 150 hours max before applying to medical school. Similarly I am applying to volunteer at a children's shelter. I do not foresee being able to get more than 120 or so hours from that activity. I see both of these opportunities as way to grow personally and to make a real difference in another person's life. BUT I wont have 50000 hours. I would like to be competitive for a top 20 school. Will these limited hours become a bottle neck on my application?

To add a little more detail so that you guys are able to give a more informed response: I have also recently started an organization that is focused on outreach and education of an undeserved community. My current clinical volunteering is about 40 hours at a ED. This number will also continue to grow. Currently I have around 200 hours of shadowing across several specialties. My GPA as of this semester stands at a 4.0. I have been in a research lab since the beginning of my sophomore year. I also hold a job in my home town at a hospital as a clinical research intern working 40 hours a week during the summer and winter break. I have various other EC's that are less significant.

If those hours aren't my bottle neck then what is?

I have 200 hours in two years. Just gotta be consistent. My hospital was nice enough to let me have couple weeks or months off to study for MCAT and finals.

 

[cloudstrife2054]

It's not the hours you spend is what you learn. I have done 100 hours of volunteer per site for several sites because I want to learn as much as possible. You also have to enter up to 3 meaningful experiences, which means you have an extra 1325 characters in addition to the 700 characters. If you cannot describe the experience well in an interview, all the hours in the world won't mean anything.

I volunteer 100 hours each across several areas because I want to see what's out there, plus I feel it shows well-roundedness.

It is NOT, I repeat, NOT a race. If you feel like you need more volunteering hours, take a gap year between applications. Besides, you're volunteering in ED, ask a doctor to shadow so you can shadow once you're done. Hold yourself to a high standard and feel like when you think your application is strong enough. If you are doubting your application's quality even the slightest, don't apply.

As for those doctors you've shadowed, unless you feel like you've stood out from other shadowers, don't ask them for a letter, unless you feel like you have no choice. If you don't feel like those doctors can write you a strong letter, get a scribe job. Then you'll be more memorable.

 

[Silac]

It's not the hours you spend is what you learn. I have done 100 hours of volunteer per site for several sites because I want to learn as much as possible. You also have to enter up to 3 meaningful experiences, which means you have an extra 1325 characters in addition to the 700 characters. If you cannot describe the experience well in an interview, all the hours in the world won't mean anything.

I volunteer 100 hours each across several areas because I want to see what's out there, plus I feel it shows well-roundedness.

It is NOT, I repeat, NOT a race. If you feel like you need more volunteering hours, take a gap year between applications. Besides, you're volunteering in ED, ask a doctor to shadow so you can shadow once you're done. Hold yourself to a high standard and feel like when you think your application is strong enough. If you are doubting your application's quality even the slightest, don't apply.

As for those doctors you've shadowed, unless you feel like you've stood out from other shadowers, don't ask them for a letter, unless you feel like you have no choice. If you don't feel like those doctors can write you a strong letter, get a scribe job. Then you'll be more memorable.

I think that I have stood out, in fact. I was invited to shadow the department chair of neurosurgery at the hospital I work at. After I shadowed him one day he invited me to shadow any of the neurosurgeons within the department and himself whenever I'd like. In addition the physician that I've shadowed the most is also my boss or the Director of Research at the hospital I work at. He allows me to shadow him in 24 hour shifts where I will sleep at the hospital while he sleeps and see patients all throughout the night when he's on call. I have not asked him for a recommendation yet. However, he told me point blank that he wants to write a letter of reccomendation for me. He also invited me to lunch while at work and has invited me to hunt with him etc. I believe I have an extremely strong relationship with him.

In addition to that physician my PI(He also was my professor for a course) has told me point blank that I am the most genuine undergraduate researcher he has worked with. So I don't know for a fact that he will give me a letter I feel that it is likely. I have a close relationship with the director of advising at my university. We are on a first name basis and we speak every day. I am concerned because I do not have two science professors who will give me a letter yet (only 1) and I do not have a humanities professor yet.

My concern is not that I will not be able to meaningfully speak about my expierences. Instead I am concerned that my expierences will be dismissed because I will not necessarily have a huge amount of hours.

I do hold myself to a high standard. I appreciate your input and criticism.

 

[cloudstrife2054]

Your personal statement needs to have a theme. The 15 activities should tie back to your theme (if possible). Your 3 meaningful experiences have to tie back to your theme. Your interview should be used to drive it home. Use this as a guideline for describing your meaningful experiences.

 

[cloudstrife2054]

Kiiiinda disagree. Yes, your PS/application should have a theme. But every single activity, even the most meaningful ones, don't have to be connected to your career goals. It's okay - even desirable - to do things just because they were fun or interesting and put them on your application.

Your PS theme is why you want to be a physician. Your meaningful experiences talk about why it solidified your decision to be a doctor. If your theme is not somewhere in there your application looks like a mess. I wouldn't say you have to directly state your theme, but hint at its there. They should be able to pick up its presence.

 

[Matthew9Thirtyfive]

I'm not saying you shouldn't have a theme related to your career goals. I'm just saying that it is okay to have a life outside those goals - and demonstrate it. Not only is it okay, but adcoms value it.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't believe the prompt for meaningful experiences says anything about your desire to be a doctor. If your three most meaningful experiences are genuinely healthcare related, awesome, that's fine. But if your other one is a non-clinical job or volunteering gig, or a hobby like music or sports, you shouldn't not choose that one just because it's not directly related to your career goals.

That is in line with everything the adcoms and faculty on this forum have said.

 

[Silac]

Your PS theme is why you want to be a physician. Your meaningful experiences talk about why it solidified your decision to be a doctor. If your theme is not somewhere in there your application looks like a mess. I wouldn't say you have to directly state your theme, but hint at its there. They should be able to pick up its presence.

What is an example of a theme? I do have personal themes in mind that have motivated me throughout my pursuit to be a physician. I'm not quite sure if it is the same sort of theme that is discussed across this forum.

 

[LizzyM]

@Silac, what you have looks good but 200 hours of shadowing might be too much. That's equivalent to 5 weeks of full-time employment. Either don't list all of your shadowing or stop doing it. Find some way to contribute (as a volunteer or employee) rather than just standing around watching.

 

[cloudstrife2054]

What is an example of a theme? I do have personal themes in mind that have motivated me throughout my pursuit to be a physician. I'm not quite sure if it is the same sort of theme that is discussed across this forum.

The volunteering experiences you enjoy the most have a common element. Kids, peers, older people, etc. That is your theme. If you enjoy working with kids, your statement should talk about kids. Your meaningful experiences should be the ones where you work with kids because they serve as the theme of your PS. Therefore your experiences with them solidified your decision to be a physician.

See how your meaningful experiences have to relate back to your PS?

Keep your theme broad. For example, if you enjoy working with old people who are disabled, it could be disabled people of all ages.

 

[cloudstrife2054]

Meaningful experiences don't have to be about clinical experience. They must be related to your theme. If for example you enjoy working with homeless people, working with them with homeless people will have more impact on your growth. Also, since your passion is in helping homeless, your personal statement will be at its strongest if you focus on that as your theme. But definitely apply medicine to that meaningful experience. Something like "my experience made me consider medicine to have a bigger impact on homeless people's well being."

Sorry for possible typos. Typing on phone

 

[cloudstrife2054]

Med students who are alumni from my school and health professions advisor. They said to mention how it helped prepare you for med school and definitely include your theme.

Opps. Sorry I meant "should" not "must". My phone change it. Sometimes my phone changes words so drastically and it's annoying.

 

[Silac]

@Silac, what you have looks good but 200 hours of shadowing might be too much. That's equivalent to 5 weeks of full-time employment. Either don't list all of your shadowing or stop doing it. Find some way to contribute (as a volunteer or employee) rather than just standing around watching.

Often my shadowing includes taking a day off from work (full time) and shadowing a physician who works at that same hospital. I enjoy it and the physicians take the time to explain aspects of medicine and being a physician that I also find interesting. I have quite a few because it usually includes a full day or around 24 hours which quickly adds up. Would you still consider the hours to be too much given the circumstance? At the same time I will also volunteer at a local ED after work a couple times a week.

 

[cloudstrife2054]

I NEVER said meaningful experiences must be clinical. I said you should put in a sentencing applying how their growth made you want to pursue medicine. Using my earlier example, if you volunteer helping homeless people and you loved it, it is a meaningful experience. You would talk about how you gained humility from it and in one sentence say something along the line of you thought about pursuing medicine so you can better aid the homeless people.

Using another example, if you enjoyed being a peer mentor (not at a hospital, at a high school, college, etc), you would briefly describe how you discovered you love mentoring others and could continue to mentor residents and/or fellows as an attending physician as well as mentoring them more effectively using your experience as a peer mentor. The experiences DO NOT have to be clinical, but you should apply them to medicine to showcase how you plan to utilize the skills from that experience into medicine.

Am I misreading something? Cause it feels like we're talking in circles.

 

[wizzed101]

It's not the hours you spend is what you learn. I have done 100 hours of volunteer per site for several sites because I want to learn as much as possible. You also have to enter up to 3 meaningful experiences, which means you have an extra 1325 characters in addition to the 700 characters. If you cannot describe the experience well in an interview, all the hours in the world won't mean anything.

I volunteer 100 hours each across several areas because I want to see what's out there, plus I feel it shows well-roundedness.

It is NOT, I repeat, NOT a race. If you feel like you need more volunteering hours, take a gap year between applications. Besides, you're volunteering in ED, ask a doctor to shadow so you can shadow once you're done. Hold yourself to a high standard and feel like when you think your application is strong enough. If you are doubting your application's quality even the slightest, don't apply.

As for those doctors you've shadowed, unless you feel like you've stood out from other shadowers, don't ask them for a letter, unless you feel like you have no choice. If you don't feel like those doctors can write you a strong letter, get a scribe job. Then you'll be more memorable.

k getting
......
Sorry to appear hostile but I hate this kind of advice. you are essentially saying that "You don't need many hours. I know! I have 1000000 hours myself teehee." And good luck getting an interview with a scant "quality" hours. People seem to be under the delusion that med schools must choose between quantity and quality. They can pick both and still have plenty to go around.

 

[Nalsjewels]

I think I get what you're trying to say...I'll give an example of what I did. I'm a current applicant and my theme was "refugees/displacement" and how my experiences working with refugees and intimately seeing the struggles they faced spurred my desire to see medicine as a means of working towards eliminating disparities and striving towards social justice for vulnerable and underserved communities. I also connected this to the personal hardships my family experienced and the capacity of medicine to help these communities work towards the health they need in order to pursue their dreams (job, education, etc), as health is such important part of having a "good" quality life. This was the crux of my personal statement.
The bulk of my AMCAS activities connected to this theme. My college major focused on displacement, health and conflict. My senior thesis research project explored the displacement experiences of Iraqi and Syrian refugees in Jordan in terms of health. My non-clinical volunteer experiences were mainly tutoring resettled refugees in the area in English as well as an interning with an NGO that advocates for the rights of the disabled in Egypt. My work experience included teaching high school science to refugees in the West Bank and interning at a human rights NGO. I even framed my clinical experiences of volunteering as an EMT to understanding the health challenges underserved communities face (undocumented immigrants, the homeless, people facing substance abuse issues, etc).
From experience, I can say that it is easier to write a personal statement when you have a motivation to pursue medicine that's illustrated by what you've done so far. I think your motivations might also come across as more genuine if there's stuff to back it up and it's a great starting point for the interviewer. And better yet, if you're passionate about your theme, the interview is so much more chill because you just end up mostly discussing your passion. Just some food for thought.

 

[cloudstrife2054]

k getting
......
Sorry to appear hostile but I hate this kind of advice. you are essentially saying that "You don't need many hours. I know! I have 1000000 hours myself teehee." And good luck getting an interview with a scant "quality" hours. People seem to be under the delusion that med schools must choose between quantity and quality. They can pick both and still have plenty to go around.

My apologies, I meant to say I don't have much hours in specific areas because my top priority is to learn and I like to explore. He said he didn't think he'd get more than 150 hours volunteering at ED I wanted to tell him it's fine. Just volunteer at other places and explore what's out there. I have 150 hours at a hospital myself and I am about to step down.

 

[Matthew9Thirtyfive]

I said you should put in a sentencing applying how their growth made you want to pursue medicine.

I've seen adcoms on this forum strongly advise against this multiple times. It seems like you have a one-track mind and looks like shoehorning.

 

[cloudstrife2054]

I think I get what you're trying to say...I'll give an example of what I did. I'm a current applicant and my theme was "refugees/displacement" and how my experiences working with refugees and intimately seeing the struggles they faced spurred my desire to see medicine as a means of working towards eliminating disparities and striving towards social justice for vulnerable and underserved communities. I also connected this to the personal hardships my family experienced and the capacity of medicine to help these communities work towards the health they need in order to pursue their dreams (job, education, etc), as health is such important part of having a "good" quality life. This was the crux of my personal statement.
The bulk of my AMCAS activities connected to this theme. My college major focused on displacement, health and conflict. My senior thesis research project explored the displacement experiences of Iraqi and Syrian refugees in Jordan in terms of health. My non-clinical volunteer experiences were mainly tutoring resettled refugees in the area in English as well as an interning with an NGO that advocates for the rights of the disabled in Egypt. My work experience included teaching high school science to refugees in the West Bank and interning at a human rights NGO. I even framed my clinical experiences of volunteering as an EMT to understanding the health challenges underserved communities face (undocumented immigrants, the homeless, people facing substance abuse issues, etc).
From experience, I can say that it is easier to write a personal statement when you have a motivation to pursue medicine that's illustrated by what you've done so far. I think your motivations might also come across as more genuine if there's stuff to back it up and it's a great starting point for the interviewer. And better yet, if you're passionate about your theme, the interview is so much more chill because you just end up mostly discussing your passion. Just some food for thought.

Exactly. If you are truly passionate about something, it'll manifest itself in anything you do. If you love mentoring your peers, you wouldn't hesitate to help your peers in areas they are struggling such as finding doctors to shadow. Just about everything I do I have an instinctive desire to do something. This something will be my PS and really, my entire application theme.

 

[cloudstrife2054]

I've seen adcoms on this forum strongly advise against this multiple times. It seems like you have a one-track mind and looks like shoehorning.

In one area it looks like shoehorning. But from another point of view, if you do not show how your meaningful experience can apply to medicine, they can think "Okay, but how will this help you become an effective physician?" You're applying to medical school, so you would want to include a sentence to how these skills will help you become a better physician. Ask the adcoms for samples to see how poorly those shoehorning applicants are applying. I can promise you they probably did it poorly. One sentence is not shoehorning.

Honestly, I think it's about balancing. Too much talk on medicine and it looks like shoehorning, but no talk about how the experience applies to medicine looks scattered. When you're talking about 700 characters (2,025 for meaningful), anything more than 1 sentence on application to medicine looks shoehorning.

 

[gallons]

powahfull and meaningful. Great combo. Ohhh to be 20 again and full it!!!

 

[LizzyM]

Often my shadowing includes taking a day off from work (full time) and shadowing a physician who works at that same hospital. I enjoy it and the physicians take the time to explain aspects of medicine and being a physician that I also find interesting. I have quite a few because it usually includes a full day or around 24 hours which quickly adds up. Would you still consider the hours to be too much given the circumstance? At the same time I will also volunteer at a local ED after work a couple times a week.

I've seen adcoms raise eyebrows over anything greater than 100 hours of shadowing. The point is to see what the life of a physician involves and to get a feel for the environments in which physicians work. Once you've accomplished that, there is diminishing returns. The point is not to be an apprentice to a physician and learn medicine... save that for medical school.

 

[Matthew9Thirtyfive]

In one area it looks like shoehorning. But from another point of view, if you do not show how your meaningful experience can apply to medicine, they can think "Okay, but how will this help you become an effective physician?" You're applying to medical school, so you would want to include a sentence to how these skills will help you become a better physician. Ask the adcoms for samples to see how poorly those shoehorning applicants are applying. I can promise you they probably did it poorly. One sentence is not shoehorning.

Honestly, I think it's about balancing. Too much talk on medicine and it looks like shoehorning, but no talk about how the experience applies to medicine looks scattered. When you're talking about 700 characters (2,025 for meaningful), anything more than 1 sentence on application to medicine looks shoehorning.

Except the adcoms on this site have specifically stated that they don't look at your descriptions and wonder why you don't have a sentence talking about medicine. They have said that doing that makes you seem like a premed robot. Throwing a sentence into every activity is shoehorning. That's forcing something in where it doesn't necessarily go. That's what that word means. If an activity directly relates to medicine, then yes you should include it. But you should definitely have activities that don't relate to medicine, because that shows you are a normal human with outside interests.

 

[dnm93]

Except the adcoms on this site have specifically stated that they don't look at your descriptions and wonder why you don't have a sentence talking about medicine. They have said that doing that makes you seem like a premed robot. Throwing a sentence into every activity is shoehorning. That's forcing something in where it doesn't necessarily go. That's what that word means. If an activity directly relates to medicine, then yes you should include it. But you should definitely have activities that don't relate to medicine, because that shows you are a normal human with outside interests.

My personal statement was about my involvement in pageantry and the disconnect I dealt with in my life being a walking paradox as a "smart pageant girl." I received several compliments from interviewers on my PS, specifically for stepping outside of the general "why do you want to be a doctor?" theme. I think adcoms (many, not all) are looking for you to speak about something that helped in your overall development as a person. I was aware I was taking somewhat of a risk by going in that direction, but it's worked for me. Point is, I think if you can write about something passionately and articulately, you can make it work.

 

[Matthew9Thirtyfive]

My personal statement was about my involvement in pageantry and the disconnect I dealt with in my life being a walking paradox as a "smart pageant girl." I received several compliments from interviewers on my PS, specifically for stepping outside of the general "why do you want to be a doctor?" theme. I think adcoms (many, not all) are looking for you to speak about something that helped in your overall development as a person. I was aware I was taking somewhat of a risk by going in that direction, but it's worked for me. Point is, I think if you can write about something passionately and articulately, you can make it work.

Right. That's exactly my point. You don't have to tie everything into medicine because if you are showing good qualities about yourself, it will be obvious.

As an aside, it's one thing to relate things in your personal statement to medicine and quite another to try to put in a line to every single line item.