MOCA

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pgg said:
It's OK, the questions are the same every quarter. I was as disgusted with Q3 as I was with Q2.
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I got completely new questions. They were pretty good, too, this time.
 
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All right, I don't want to fall victim to gross exaggeration and spread a falsehood with my bad attitude, so I just went into my question history and counted.

And it's not so bad as I thought. Of the 30 questions I just did for Q3, 18 were new and 12 were repeats. I owe the ABA a partial apology.


However, the repeats tend to be repeated multiple times. Worse, the repeats are mostly questions I'd answered correctly before. Getting repeats so often wouldn't irritate me so much, if I was getting them wrong. But there's no excuse for presenting the same question FIVE times in three blocks, when I'm getting it right.

Not factored into the verbatim repeats I detailed above, are the duplicate concept questions. For example, I think I've answered at least four, unique questions about renal protection for which the answer was essentially maintain euvolemia with crystalloid.

One improvement is that this time, all of my repeats were from previous quarters. I didn't get any Q3 repeats of questions I'd been asked 10 minutes earlier, which happened a lot in Q1 and Q2.

The quality of the questions isn't bad, subject to the 60-second limit on complexity. The bank just isn't big enough.


The actual counts for Q3:

Fundamental Topics: 3 (1 new, 1 repeat from Q1, 1 repeat from Q2*)
Pharmacology: 6 (2 new, 4 repeat from Q1)
Clinical Sciences, Procedures/Methods/Techniques: 4 (3 new, 1 repeat from Q1**)
Organ-Based Basic & Clinical Sciences: 13 (6 new, 3 repeat from Q1, 1 repeat from Q2,*** 3 repeat from Q1 AND Q2****)
Clinical Subspecialties: 1 new
Special Problems: 3 (2 new, 1 repeat from Q2)


*
got this question twice in Q2, again in Q3 ... missed first time, correct the next two

**
got this question twice in Q1, again in Q3 ... missed first time, correct the next two

***
got this question twice in Q2, again in Q3 ... correct all 3 times

****
got one question twice in Q1, twice in Q2, and again in Q3 ... correct all 5 times
got one question twice in Q1, once in Q2, and again in Q3 ... correct all 4 times
got one question once in Q1, Q2, and Q3 ... correct all 3 times
 
pgg said:
All right, I don't want to fall victim to gross exaggeration and spread a falsehood with my bad attitude, so I just went into my question history and counted.

And it's not so bad as I thought. Of the 30 questions I just did for Q3, 18 were new and 12 were repeats. I owe the ABA a partial apology.


However, the repeats tend to be repeated multiple times. Worse, the repeats are mostly questions I'd answered correctly before. Getting repeats so often wouldn't irritate me so much, if I was getting them wrong. But there's no excuse for presenting the same question FIVE times in three blocks, when I'm getting it right.

Not factored into the verbatim repeats I detailed above, are the duplicate concept questions. For example, I think I've answered at least four, unique questions about renal protection for which the answer was essentially maintain euvolemia with crystalloid.

One improvement is that this time, all of my repeats were from previous quarters. I didn't get any Q3 repeats of questions I'd been asked 10 minutes earlier, which happened a lot in Q1 and Q2.

The quality of the questions isn't bad, subject to the 60-second limit on complexity. The bank just isn't big enough.


The actual counts for Q3:

Fundamental Topics: 3 (1 new, 1 repeat from Q1, 1 repeat from Q2*)
Pharmacology: 6 (2 new, 4 repeat from Q1)
Clinical Sciences, Procedures/Methods/Techniques: 4 (3 new, 1 repeat from Q1**)
Organ-Based Basic & Clinical Sciences: 13 (6 new, 3 repeat from Q1, 1 repeat from Q2,*** 3 repeat from Q1 AND Q2****)
Clinical Subspecialties: 1 new
Special Problems: 3 (2 new, 1 repeat from Q2)


*
got this question twice in Q2, again in Q3 ... missed first time, correct the next two

**
got this question twice in Q1, again in Q3 ... missed first time, correct the next two

***
got this question twice in Q2, again in Q3 ... correct all 3 times

****
got one question twice in Q1, twice in Q2, and again in Q3 ... correct all 5 times
got one question twice in Q1, once in Q2, and again in Q3 ... correct all 4 times
got one question once in Q1, Q2, and Q3 ... correct all 3 times
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What are you complaining about? I do ACE questions to learn. I do MOCA questions because I have to do them to recertify. I'd do the same 30 questions every 3 months as long as I can tic the box for this b.s.
If MOCA was non-punative I'd go for harder questions to learn from, but when there is risk of losing board certification- the easier the better.
 
Several reasons.

Because it's dishonest and a waste of my time, and I shouldn't have to put up with it, especially from an organization that purports to represent me and my interests.

Because however easy the MOCA Minute thing is, at some point the ABA is going to set a pass/fail score on it. Some percentage of us are going to fail, and presumably be required to do more of this b.s. to recertify.

Because MOCA Minute was supposed to be an improvement over the q10year recertification exam. We collectively bitched and moaned about MOCA and the ABA came up with MOCA Minute, which is actually a good idea, except for the ongoing absurd cost it bears. We should keep bitching and moaning about it until they get it right.
 
pgg said:
Several reasons.

Because it's dishonest and a waste of my time, and I shouldn't have to put up with it, especially from an organization that purports to represent me and my interests.

Because however easy the MOCA Minute thing is, at some point the ABA is going to set a pass/fail score on it. Some percentage of us are going to fail, and presumably be required to do more of this b.s. to recertify.

Because MOCA Minute was supposed to be an improvement over the q10year recertification exam. We collectively bitched and moaned about MOCA and the ABA came up with MOCA Minute, which is actually a good idea, except for the ongoing absurd cost it bears. We should keep bitching and moaning about it until they get it right.
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I agree that it would be good if the goal was staying current and learning. With the ACE questions for example you have to get them all right. If you get it wrong, you read the explanation and change your answer. The goal is for you to learn. As long as MOCA has the intent to fail X percent of us, and as long as employment is dependent on maintaining certification, i don't view them as a valuable organization. I view them as a worthless threat to my ability to provide for my family. Should it be this way? No! But as long as it is, I just want to recertify as painlessly as possible.
 
You guys have fun with your MOCA. I'm not doing that bullcrud anymore. Complete waste of time and money.

Just say no.
 
pgg said:
Maybe next cycle.

It's a bunch of crap, yes, but I'm not going to burn that bridge just yet.
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What do you think a passing score is? 75% correct? I'm curious as to see what % of ABA certified Anesthesiologists score below the passing grade.

Those of you thinking about NOT doing MOCA are making a mistake. I'm voluntarily doing this crap until my next re-certification period (about 2-3 years) then I'll ride my career out using "lifetime certification" and CME from the ASA.

Most of you don't have lifetime certification so be aware of the risks vs benefits of no longer being Board Certified once your 10 year period expires.
 
I am board certified. By NBPAS.

More states are passing laws against requiring MOC for credentialing or insurance reimbursement.

MOC is a flagrant extortion scheme that I will not participate in. I have judged that MOCA activities do not make me a better doctor and do not benefit my patients in any way. I stay current on my own. I simply refuse to do this at nontrivial cost with no benefit.

I have zero fear of the consequences of letting my ABA cert lapse if it comes to that. Zero.
 
Hawaiian Bruin said:
I am board certified. By NBPAS.

More states are passing laws against requiring MOC for credentialing or insurance reimbursement.

MOC is a flagrant extortion scheme that I will not participate in. I have judged that MOCA activities do not make me a better doctor and do not benefit my patients in any way. I stay current on my own. I simply refuse to do this at nontrivial cost with no benefit.

I have zero fear of the consequences of letting my ABA cert lapse if it comes to that. Zero.
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Your choice. Your life and career. I recommend against that decision based on where things are right now. MOCA is WORTHLESS but a requirement for ABA certification.
 
BLADEMDA said:
What do you think a passing score is? 75% correct? I'm curious as to see what % of ABA certified Anesthesiologists score below the passing grade.
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It'll be less than 75%, surely

If you look at your own question history, you can see what % of other anesthesiologists got the question right. The average seems to be in the 70s. They'll probably make the cut a couple std dev below that mean.

But we don't even know what failing means. I doubt they'll decertify anyone as an automatic action. Surely that means the fails can be remediated ... surely with some more $ to the ABA.
 
pgg said:
It'll be less than 75%, surely

If you look at your own question history, you can see what % of other anesthesiologists got the question right. The average seems to be in the 70s. They'll probably make the cut a couple std dev below that mean.

But we don't even know what failing means. I doubt they'll decertify anyone as an automatic action. Surely that means the fails can be remediated ... surely with some more $ to the ABA.
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PGG, the worst decision you could make is NOT to retain you ABA certification. Someone willing to spend the next year as a lackey (admittedly at good military pay) at this point in his career should make certain he does everything possible to protect that career going forward.
 
Oh, I'm doing the MOCA dance. I'll be starting fresh in the job market in a few years with just my resume and references ... my board cert doesn't need to be a part of any of those interviews.
 
I just finished the MOCA minute for 2016. Overall, it was a waste of time and the ABA needs to change the format. The format should consist of the ACE questions which are completed for CME. Following completion of the ACE questions (200 of them) the ABA then allows you to sit for a 120 question exam (MOCA minute) based on those questions. The "exam" would take 2 hours (one minute per question) and the MOCA minute portion would be completed.

The ABA diplomate received CME for the ACE questions, obtained a nice review of the basics each year and the ABA got to test its diplomates for competency. It's a win-win all around.

I've completed all the requirements for re-certification this cycle except for a few more quarters of MOCA minutes so I'll put up with it.
 
gasorrad said:
Hello all,
I realized I forgot to do the MOCA for the last quarter. Anyone else in this situation? Anyway I can make that up?
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I skipped a whole quarter at the beginning of the year and my questions went to the last quarter. I'm not sure how long the grace period is, but at least a quarter. Probably the whole year.


--
Il Destriero
 
Look at it on the bright side.

Those who took the moca recertification between 2011-2015 had to answer 200 questions and take a day off from work/weekend (like me). Passing rate 88%

Those who took it moca recertification before 2011 (2007-2010?) got to cross off 50 questions they didn't know. Passing rate 97%. They got to be the guinea pigs so ABA let them cross off 50 questions.

Those certified after 2005 shouldn't be complaining. (2006 certification year). Low stress. No time off from work

Just do the moca questions. And move on. It's 30-60 minutes of your time per quarter. I'd rather do moca questions anytime of day rather than sit a formal exam 3-4 hours 200 questions.
 
aneftp said:
Just do the moca questions. And move on. It's 30-60 minutes of your time per quarter. I'd rather do moca questions anytime of day rather than sit a formal exam 3-4 hours 200 questions.
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No I am not gonna do the moca questions and just move on. That is exactly the mentality that got us in this mess in the first place. Moca makes no gd sense. So why should i go alon gwith it..... You go along with it and next thing you know you will be answering questions every month, every week... every day...... It is all non sense.
 
sorry i'm the dumb one here

seems to be two schools of thought on this thread. someone please explain the pros and cons of MOCA.....I'll do whatever keeps me certified so I can cash a check
 
Do MOCA to stay certified by the ABA or trust your "board certification" to some other new alternate group.
I'll just answer the questions and pay my $200/yr. For one cycle anyway. I won't be working beyond the end of that one.


--
Il Destriero
 
There is public perception. And there is reality. Public wants their docs "certified/recertifed " even if it means jack. We all know that.

Look at the AANA propaganda machine "our members are vigorously tested and up to date by getting "recertified every 2 years" we all know what a joke crna recertification (cough cough do their continuing education/attest they do clinical work). That's their recertification process.
 
aneftp said:
There is public perception. And there is reality. Public wants their docs "certified/recertifed " even if it means jack. We all know that.

Look at the AANA propaganda machine "our members are vigorously tested and up to date by getting "recertified every 2 years" we all know what a joke crna recertification (cough cough do their continuing education/attest they do clinical work). That's their recertification process.
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No they don't. Zero people know about moca and I doubt that many people even know what board certified means
 
Psai said:
No they don't. Zero people know about moca and I doubt that many people even know what board certified means
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The other day I was told by one of my pediatrician friends that the parents of a premie in the nicu were shocked to hear that an anesthesiologist was going to take care of their child during surgery. Their response was "there are doctors for that?, how hard can it be to put a baby to sleep?"

Granted, I doubt these parents are rocket scientists, but... they have a right to vote!
 
Twiggidy said:
sorry i'm the dumb one here

seems to be two schools of thought on this thread. someone please explain the pros and cons of MOCA.....I'll do whatever keeps me certified so I can cash a check
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I have long thought that only people with malpractice lawsuits 2 standard deviations higher than the norm should be the ones subject to recertification.

Why mess with somebody who is either very good at what they do, or perhaps not so good but they confine themselves to easier cases that they can manage safely?

It is the guys doing cases above their skill set who should be dealt with.

I understand that lawsuits are not a perfect evaluation tool due to frivolous allegations but I do believe they are the most sensitive. It is the ultimate patient evaluation saying you suck.
 
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